Devils are "right with God?"

[JaneHenry]

I'm new to Christianity, and I'm trying to figure this stuff out. I was raised in an agnostic home and now as an adult I've been trying to figure out what Christianity is all about. I'm also a musician and had noticed that an old school hip hop artist, Rev Run, was promoting a church, so I checked it out online. Actually, I never really liked his rap music, but I had seen him on TV, and he seemed like a pretty affable guy? Turns out it was a "prosperity gospel" church where the whole thing is about money, money, money, that's all they talk about.

Anyway, the guy that runs that place, one bishop Jordan, is a real arrogant guy with a really despicable attitude, was preaching all kinds of stuff that actually CONTRADICTS what Jesus himself said in the Bible. Basically, he was making up his own gospel, because most of what he said isn't even in the gospels nor actually supported by the gospels. For example:

!) According to the gospel of bishop Jordan, God doesn't care if you're a good person, all God cares about when deciding if He is going to bless you is how much money you give to a church, and it better be at ;east 10%. According to him, that is all God cares about. He doesn't even talk about sin in his church, because he says all God cares about is how much money, tithes and offerings, you give to church.

According to him, it does not matter if you're a good person, if you want to "get right with God" you just have to give 10% to church, and then you'll be "right with God" and God will also make you rich.

A) is that correct theology? Like I said, I'm new to this Christianity thing and trying to figure it out. Reading what Jesus
said, that theology seem to be a direct contradiction of Jesus.

B) Is that what most Christian churches are like today, just making up their own theology, more concerned with following
what the preacher says, even over and above what Jesus himself said? Is that really what Christianity has devolved into?

2) Here is another gem this guy bernard jordan was preaching out of his church: That Christians should do mean, immoral things to people who don't tithe to a church. Is that what Christian ministers are teaching their congregations in church?
I tell you what, even coming from being an agnostic I have a lot of empathy for the poor, and wanted to do as much as
I could to assist poor people, but hearing that kind of vile, and frankly irresponsible, and reprehensible, rhetoric coming from the pulpit makes me feel like I should never give a penny to a church again, because I don't want to support that
kind of immoral behavior.

A) is that the kind of reprehensible morality that is being taught in Christian churches today?

3) That guy jordan literally preaches that all you have to do "to be right with God: is tithe money to church, then he'll try to
verbally twist your arm to tithe to HIS church. I seem to remember that the Pharisees in the Bible tithed 10% and also loved to brag and boast about their tithing, and do it in public to be seen, etc. Bishop Jordan and his followers at
his church would be taking phone calls during church, and when someone called with a big donation all the ministers
would start hooting and hollering, and shouting hallelujah real loud, making a big scene out of it, and suddenly shouting nonsense syllables, (speaking in tongues?) Yet the gospels say:

“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. 2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly, I tell you, they have received their reward in full."

Again, what they are doing and preaching in that church completely CONTRADICTS what Jesus taught.

As a good, loving, moral person coming from being an agnostic and actually trying to give Christianity a chance, I'm here asking, Is this normal for Christian churches? I s it normal and acceptable for churches to contradict the teachings of the Bible and try to pass it off as gospel? Is it normal for churches to teach that it's okay to sin, and even to condone doing evil? Is it normal and acceptable Christian doctrine for a preacher to teach that God doesn't care about how good of a person you are, that He only cares about how much money you give to church?

Just saying, because that is teaching people that you can be the biggest devil ever, immoral as you want to be, with no redeeming qualities to your character whatsoever, but as long as you're greasing preachers palm, "You're alright with God" and God will make you rich too.

Is this what they teach in churches today?

As a pertinent interesting note,"Rev Run" Simmons and his brother, Russel, are both involved in that church, but I heard Rev Run say himself that he was already rich from being a rapper long BEFORE he found and joined that church.

 

[d taylor]

I'm new to Christianity, and I'm trying to figure this stuff out. I was raised in an agnostic home and now as an adult I've been trying to figure out what Christianity is all about. I'm also a musician and had noticed that an old school hip hop artist, Rev Run, was promoting a church, so I checked it out online. Actually, I never really liked his rap music, but I had seen him on TV, and he seemed like a pretty affable guy? Turns out it was a "prosperity gospel" church where the whole thing is about money, money, money, that's all they talk about.

Anyway, the guy that runs that place, one bishop Jordan, is a real arrogant guy with a really despicable attitude, was preaching all kinds of stuff that actually CONTRADICTS what Jesus himself said in the Bible. Basically, he was making up his own gospel, because most of what he said isn't even in the gospels nor actually supported by the gospels. For example:

!) According to the gospel of bishop Jordan, God doesn't care if you're a good person, all God cares about when deciding if He is going to bless you is how much money you give to a church, and it better be at ;east 10%. According to him, that is all God cares about. He doesn't even talk about sin in his church, because he says all God cares about is how much money, tithes and offerings, you give to church.

According to him, it does not matter if you're a good person, if you want to "get right with God" you just have to give 10% to church, and then you'll be "right with God" and God will also make you rich.

A) is that correct theology? Like I said, I'm new to this Christianity thing and trying to figure it out. Reading what Jesus
said, that theology seem to be a direct contradiction of Jesus.

B) Is that what most Christian churches are like today, just making up their own theology, more concerned with following
what the preacher says, even over and above what Jesus himself said? Is that really what Christianity has devolved into?

2) Here is another gem this guy bernard jordan was preaching out of his church: That Christians should do mean, immoral things to people who don't tithe to a church. Is that what Christian ministers are teaching their congregations in church?
I tell you what, even coming from being an agnostic I have a lot of empathy for the poor, and wanted to do as much as
I could to assist poor people, but hearing that kind of vile, and frankly irresponsible, and reprehensible, rhetoric coming from the pulpit makes me feel like I should never give a penny to a church again, because I don't want to support that
kind of immoral behavior.

A) is that the kind of reprehensible morality that is being taught in Christian churches today?

3) That guy jordan literally preaches that all you have to do "to be right with God: is tithe money to church, then he'll try to
verbally twist your arm to tithe to HIS church. I seem to remember that the Pharisees in the Bible tithed 10% and also loved to brag and boast about their tithing, and do it in public to be seen, etc. Bishop Jordan and his followers at
his church would be taking phone calls during church, and when someone called with a big donation all the ministers
would start hooting and hollering, and shouting hallelujah real loud, making a big scene out of it, and suddenly shouting nonsense syllables, (speaking in tongues?) Yet the gospels say:

“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. 2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly, I tell you, they have received their reward in full."

Again, what they are doing and preaching in that church completely CONTRADICTS what Jesus taught.

As a good, loving, moral person coming from being an agnostic and actually trying to give Christianity a chance, I'm here asking, Is this normal for Christian churches? I s it normal and acceptable for churches to contradict the teachings of the Bible and try to pass it off as gospel? Is it normal for churches to teach that it's okay to sin, and even to condone doing evil? Is it normal and acceptable Christian doctrine for a preacher to teach that God doesn't care about how good of a person you are, that He only cares about how much money you give to church?

Just saying, because that is teaching people that you can be the biggest devil ever, the most despicable SOB around, immoral as you want to be, with no redeeming qualities to your character whatsoever, but as long as you're greasing preachers palm, "You're alright with God" and God will make you rich too.

Is this what they teach in churches today?

As a pertinent interesting note,"Rev Run" Simmons and his brother, Russel, are both involved in that church, but I heard Rev Run say himself that he was already rich from being a rapper long BEFORE he found and joined that church.

I would stay away from junk religion like the above in your post.

A good solid place to learn and grow in the faith is Grace Evangelical Society their website has a lot of online resources articles and youtube videos.

Grace Evangelical Society

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I'm new to Christianity, and I'm trying to figure this stuff out. I was raised in an agnostic home and now as an adult I've been trying to figure out what Christianity is all about. I'm also a musician and had noticed that an old school hip hop artist, Rev Run, was promoting a church, so I checked it out online. Actually, I never really liked his rap music, but I had seen him on TV, and he seemed like a pretty affable guy? Turns out it was a "prosperity gospel" church where the whole thing is about money, money, money, that's all they talk about.

Anyway, the guy that runs that place, one bishop Jordan, is a real arrogant guy with a really despicable attitude, was preaching all kinds of stuff that actually CONTRADICTS what Jesus himself said in the Bible. Basically, he was making up his own gospel, because most of what he said isn't even in the gospels nor actually supported by the gospels. For example:

!) According to the gospel of bishop Jordan, God doesn't care if you're a good person, all God cares about when deciding if He is going to bless you is how much money you give to a church, and it better be at ;east 10%. According to him, that is all God cares about. He doesn't even talk about sin in his church, because he says all God cares about is how much money, tithes and offerings, you give to church.

According to him, it does not matter if you're a good person, if you want to "get right with God" you just have to give 10% to church, and then you'll be "right with God" and God will also make you rich.

A) is that correct theology? Like I said, I'm new to this Christianity thing and trying to figure it out. Reading what Jesus
said, that theology seem to be a direct contradiction of Jesus.

B) Is that what most Christian churches are like today, just making up their own theology, more concerned with following
what the preacher says, even over and above what Jesus himself said? Is that really what Christianity has devolved into?

2) Here is another gem this guy bernard jordan was preaching out of his church: That Christians should do mean, immoral things to people who don't tithe to a church. Is that what Christian ministers are teaching their congregations in church?
I tell you what, even coming from being an agnostic I have a lot of empathy for the poor, and wanted to do as much as
I could to assist poor people, but hearing that kind of vile, and frankly irresponsible, and reprehensible, rhetoric coming from the pulpit makes me feel like I should never give a penny to a church again, because I don't want to support that
kind of immoral behavior.

A) is that the kind of reprehensible morality that is being taught in Christian churches today?

3) That guy jordan literally preaches that all you have to do "to be right with God: is tithe money to church, then he'll try to
verbally twist your arm to tithe to HIS church. I seem to remember that the Pharisees in the Bible tithed 10% and also loved to brag and boast about their tithing, and do it in public to be seen, etc. Bishop Jordan and his followers at
his church would be taking phone calls during church, and when someone called with a big donation all the ministers
would start hooting and hollering, and shouting hallelujah real loud, making a big scene out of it, and suddenly shouting nonsense syllables, (speaking in tongues?) Yet the gospels say:

“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. 2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly, I tell you, they have received their reward in full."

Again, what they are doing and preaching in that church completely CONTRADICTS what Jesus taught.

As a good, loving, moral person coming from being an agnostic and actually trying to give Christianity a chance, I'm here asking, Is this normal for Christian churches? I s it normal and acceptable for churches to contradict the teachings of the Bible and try to pass it off as gospel? Is it normal for churches to teach that it's okay to sin, and even to condone doing evil? Is it normal and acceptable Christian doctrine for a preacher to teach that God doesn't care about how good of a person you are, that He only cares about how much money you give to church?

Just saying, because that is teaching people that you can be the biggest devil ever, the most despicable SOB around, immoral as you want to be, with no redeeming qualities to your character whatsoever, but as long as you're greasing preachers palm, "You're alright with God" and God will make you rich too.

Is this what they teach in churches today?

As a pertinent interesting note,"Rev Run" Simmons and his brother, Russel, are both involved in that church, but I heard Rev Run say himself that he was already rich from being a rapper long BEFORE he found and joined that church.

" My sheep hear My Voice".

This is what Jesus Christ of Nazareth said to those who follow Him. It sounds like you know His Voice and have discerned these preachers as false. Good for you ! Now continue to find truth. His Holy Spirit will lead you into all Truth. This is His promise to us. Be blessed.

 

[Der Alte]

@JaneHenry You have received some good advice in this thread. I have been a Christian since the mid '60s. I have been preaching and teaching for more than 40 years. I think I can safely say that most of the mainline denominations, e.g. Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian etc. teach the truth. I belong to one and my 2 brother's-in-law are pastors in the other 2. I appears that your heart is leading you in the right direction.

 

[JaneHenry]

" My sheep hear My Voice".

This is what Jesus Christ of Nazareth said to those who follow Him. It sounds like you know this Voice and have discerned these preachers as false. Good for you ! Now continue to find truth. His Holy Spirit will lead you into all Truth. This is His promise to us. Be blessed.

Huh? What does that mean?

I'm coming from an agnostic background checking out the Christian stuff to see if it's good and this is the kind of absolutely not helpful advice I get from you people? Those statements you made are saying a whole bunch of words that have no meaning, or the meaning is so nebulous that it could be interpreted many different ways. This seems to be the kind of inane claptrap I get from you people claiming to believe in Jesus.

I came to see if Christianity was legit, but I'm beginning to think my parents were right by not giving you people any respect. The stuff I witnessed coming out of a church and wrote here is nothing short of despicable, immoral behavior. What about that is supposed to make me want to continue going to any Christina church, so that I can be indoctrinated with immorality? MY parents were agnostic, but they donated a commendable;e amount of their time to charities that raised money for underprivileged people, but not through any church, through completely secular. NON PROFIT charities.

Then I go to a church and the preacher says in church to his congregation that he would not be a minister if he could not get rich from doing it. Then he preaches, in church, that it's okay to do evil things if it's for the purpose of getting money. WHAT?????? So love your neighbor as yourself, just gets thrown out the door because preacher man says so, and all the idiots in church just sat there applauding and shouting "amen" and "hallelujah" like the scene in Star Wars when the Sith Palatine took over the Republic.

That is despicable, and no person ho has any common decency would cosign anyone saying those despicable, immoral things. Let's just say that I’m less than impressed with religion thus far.

You all do realize, don't you, that the whole tsar Wars sags was actually about religion? It has some good things in the book, but it can also cause people to get brainwashed / mind controlled into doing evil things, things that aren't good while somehow believing they are doing good. That's really what it is about.

 

[Aaron112]

Then I go to a church and the preacher says in church to his congregation that he would not be a minister if he could not get rich from doing it.

i.e. a false teacher, maybe a false prophet, in a false church (if they follow him),
thus
the blind leading the blind and they both fall into the pit, and take as many as they can with them !

 

[Aaron112]

Huh? What does that mean?

I'm not sure what all you saw and were exposed to in various churches , groups and forums,
but simply
the one you or anyone can trust, the one who is trustworthy without any failure, is Jesus.

Jesus Himself.

 

[JaneHenry]

@JaneHenry You have received some good advice in this thread. I have been a Christian since the mid '60s. I have been preaching and teaching for more than 40 years. I think I can safely say that most of the mainline denominations, e.g. Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian etc. teach the truth. I belong to one and my 2 brother's-in-law are pastors in the other 2. I appears that your heart is leading you in the right direction.

Yet no repudiation or indignation about the totally despicable and immoral things I heard being preached from the pulpit, just continuing to try and goad me into religion. That to me in itself is quite troubling.

That is EXACTLY what many of us who don't ascribe to religion find problematic about it, that people indoctrinated into religions just keep believing in it even when the things its teaching are immoral and repugnant. That, is actually a very bad thing, not a good thing at all.

 

[Aaron112]

That is EXACTLY what many of us who don't ascribe to religion find problematic about it, that people indoctrinated into religions just keep believing in it even when the things its teaching are immoral and repugnant. That, is actually a very bad thing, not a good thing at all.

Similarly in science, technology, commerce, sales, corporations, as well as religion -
when a system is producing enough money,
it often protects itself against any change (unless they can control it and make the same or more money) ....
even if it is a corrupt system.

 

[Der Alte]

Yet no repudiation or indignation about the totally despicable and immoral things I heard being preached from the pulpit, just continuing to try and goad me into religion. That to me in itself is quite troubling.
That is EXACTLY what many of us who don't ascribe to religion find problematic about it, that people indoctrinated into religions just keep believing in it even when the things its teaching are immoral and repugnant. That, is actually a very bad thing, not a good thing at all.

I like how you attacked me for trying to encourage you. I didn't hear it I only have your word for what you claim to have heard therefore it is not incumbent on me comment on it. If what you said is correct, then you appear to be taking the correct action. If you want more than that, sorry I ain't your guy. Don't bother responding.

 

[JSRG]

I'm new to Christianity, and I'm trying to figure this stuff out. I was raised in an agnostic home and now as an adult I've been trying to figure out what Christianity is all about. I'm also a musician and had noticed that an old school hip hop artist, Rev Run, was promoting a church, so I checked it out online. Actually, I never really liked his rap music, but I had seen him on TV, and he seemed like a pretty affable guy? Turns out it was a "prosperity gospel" church where the whole thing is about money, money, money, that's all they talk about.

Anyway, the guy that runs that place, one bishop Jordan, is a real arrogant guy with a really despicable attitude, was preaching all kinds of stuff that actually CONTRADICTS what Jesus himself said in the Bible. Basically, he was making up his own gospel, because most of what he said isn't even in the gospels nor actually supported by the gospels. For example:

!) According to the gospel of bishop Jordan, God doesn't care if you're a good person, all God cares about when deciding if He is going to bless you is how much money you give to a church, and it better be at ;east 10%. According to him, that is all God cares about. He doesn't even talk about sin in his church, because he says all God cares about is how much money, tithes and offerings, you give to church.

According to him, it does not matter if you're a good person, if you want to "get right with God" you just have to give 10% to church, and then you'll be "right with God" and God will also make you rich.

A) is that correct theology? Like I said, I'm new to this Christianity thing and trying to figure it out. Reading what Jesus
said, that theology seem to be a direct contradiction of Jesus.

B) Is that what most Christian churches are like today, just making up their own theology, more concerned with following
what the preacher says, even over and above what Jesus himself said? Is that really what Christianity has devolved into?

2) Here is another gem this guy bernard jordan was preaching out of his church: That Christians should do mean, immoral things to people who don't tithe to a church. Is that what Christian ministers are teaching their congregations in church?
I tell you what, even coming from being an agnostic I have a lot of empathy for the poor, and wanted to do as much as
I could to assist poor people, but hearing that kind of vile, and frankly irresponsible, and reprehensible, rhetoric coming from the pulpit makes me feel like I should never give a penny to a church again, because I don't want to support that
kind of immoral behavior.

A) is that the kind of reprehensible morality that is being taught in Christian churches today?

3) That guy jordan literally preaches that all you have to do "to be right with God: is tithe money to church, then he'll try to
verbally twist your arm to tithe to HIS church. I seem to remember that the Pharisees in the Bible tithed 10% and also loved to brag and boast about their tithing, and do it in public to be seen, etc. Bishop Jordan and his followers at
his church would be taking phone calls during church, and when someone called with a big donation all the ministers
would start hooting and hollering, and shouting hallelujah real loud, making a big scene out of it, and suddenly shouting nonsense syllables, (speaking in tongues?) Yet the gospels say:

“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. 2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly, I tell you, they have received their reward in full."

Again, what they are doing and preaching in that church completely CONTRADICTS what Jesus taught.

As a good, loving, moral person coming from being an agnostic and actually trying to give Christianity a chance, I'm here asking, Is this normal for Christian churches? I s it normal and acceptable for churches to contradict the teachings of the Bible and try to pass it off as gospel? Is it normal for churches to teach that it's okay to sin, and even to condone doing evil? Is it normal and acceptable Christian doctrine for a preacher to teach that God doesn't care about how good of a person you are, that He only cares about how much money you give to church?

Just saying, because that is teaching people that you can be the biggest devil ever, the most despicable SOB around, immoral as you want to be, with no redeeming qualities to your character whatsoever, but as long as you're greasing preachers palm, "You're alright with God" and God will make you rich too.

Is this what they teach in churches today?

As a pertinent interesting note,"Rev Run" Simmons and his brother, Russel, are both involved in that church, but I heard Rev Run say himself that he was already rich from being a rapper long BEFORE he found and joined that church.

So, I don't know anything at all about the people you're talking about here beyond what you've said, but if what you are describing is an accurate description of their theology, this is not at all what a typical church will teach. Many (probably most) churches do urge donations, with some more explicitly asking for tithes, which makes sense enough because they have to pay their expenses somehow. But the kind of tithe obsession you describe goes well beyond what any normal church will teach in my experience. You identify it as a "prosperity gospel" church (which based on what I know of the "prosperity gospel" seems correct), but the "prosperity gospel" is a minority and has received a lot of criticism from other Christians.

All that said, this question sounds like something that would fit better on the General Theology subforum than this one.

 

[JSRG]

Yet no repudiation or indignation about the totally despicable and immoral things I heard being preached from the pulpit, just continuing to try and goad me into religion. That to me in itself is quite troubling.

That is EXACTLY what many of us who don't ascribe to religion find problematic about it, that people indoctrinated into religions just keep believing in it even when the things its teaching are immoral and repugnant. That, is actually a very bad thing, not a good thing at all.

The second post (or first reply) said "I would stay away from junk religion like the above in your post." Referring to something as "junk religion" certainly sounds to me like repudiation.

The third post said "This is what Jesus Christ of Nazareth said to those who follow Him. It sounds like you know this Voice and have discerned these preachers as false. Good for you !" This is explicitly referring to the preachers you refer to as "false". Again, repudiation.

The fourth post said "You have received some good advice in this thread" thereby showing agreement with the previous two posts and their repudiation.

The fifth post was your own, and then the sixth refers to the kind of preacher you were talking about as "a false teacher, maybe a false prophet, in a false church (if they follow him)". The seventh post, by the same poster as the sixth, didn't explicitly give any repudiation but of course they had in the previous post.

After the above, you gave the quoted post (the eighth post in the topic). So I'm a little confused as to how you're saying there wasn't any repudiation when every single other poster gave clear repudiation.

 

[Terri Dactyl]

Huh? What does that mean?

I'm coming from an agnostic background checking out the Christian stuff to see if it's good and this is the kind of absolutely not helpful advice I get from you people? Those statements you made are saying a whole bunch of words that have no meaning, or the meaning is so nebulous that it could be interpreted many different ways. This seems to be the kind of inane claptrap I get from you people claiming to believe in Jesus.

I came to see if Christianity was legit, but I'm beginning to think my parents were right by not giving you people any respect. The stuff I witnessed coming out of a church and wrote here is nothing short of despicable, immoral behavior. What about that is supposed to make me want to continue going to any Christina church, so that I can be indoctrinated with immorality? MY parents were agnostic, but they donated a commendable;e amount of their time to charities that raised money for underprivileged people, but not through any church, through completely secular. NON PROFIT charities.

Then I go to a church and the preacher says in church to his congregation that he would not be a minister if he could not get rich from doing it. Then he preaches, in church, that it's okay to do evil things if it's for the purpose of getting money. WHAT?????? So love your neighbor as yourself, just gets thrown out the door because preacher man says so, and all the idiots in church just sat there applauding and shouting "amen" and "hallelujah" like the scene in Star Wars when the Sith Palatine took over the Republic.

That is despicable, and no person ho has any common decency would cosign anyone saying those despicable, immoral things. Let's just say that I’m less than impressed with religion thus far.

You all do realize, don't you, that the whole tsar Wars sags was actually about religion? It has some good things in the book, but it can also cause people to get brainwashed / mind controlled into doing evil things, things that aren't good while somehow believing they are doing good. That's really what it is about.

My sheep hear my voice means that you heard the voice of Jesus in knowing that the pastor who just wants money is no representative of Christ.

One of the gifts given is discernment: the ability to tell is something is good or not. You have used it in what you say about the pastor.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Huh? What does that mean?

I'm coming from an agnostic background checking out the Christian stuff to see if it's good and this is the kind of absolutely not helpful advice I get from you people? Those statements you made are saying a whole bunch of words that have no meaning, or the meaning is so nebulous that it could be interpreted many different ways. This seems to be the kind of inane claptrap I get from you people claiming to believe in Jesus.

I came to see if Christianity was legit, but I'm beginning to think my parents were right by not giving you people any respect. The stuff I witnessed coming out of a church and wrote here is nothing short of despicable, immoral behavior. What about that is supposed to make me want to continue going to any Christina church, so that I can be indoctrinated with immorality? MY parents were agnostic, but they donated a commendable;e amount of their time to charities that raised money for underprivileged people, but not through any church, through completely secular. NON PROFIT charities.

Then I go to a church and the preacher says in church to his congregation that he would not be a minister if he could not get rich from doing it. Then he preaches, in church, that it's okay to do evil things if it's for the purpose of getting money. WHAT?????? So love your neighbor as yourself, just gets thrown out the door because preacher man says so, and all the idiots in church just sat there applauding and shouting "amen" and "hallelujah" like the scene in Star Wars when the Sith Palatine took over the Republic.

That is despicable, and no person ho has any common decency would cosign anyone saying those despicable, immoral things. Let's just say that I’m less than impressed with religion thus far.

You all do realize, don't you, that the whole tsar Wars sags was actually about religion? It has some good things in the book, but it can also cause people to get brainwashed / mind controlled into doing evil things, things that aren't good while somehow believing they are doing good. That's really what it is about.

I gave you a compliment for recognizing false teaching. Sorry. Be blessed

 

[anetazo]

The fake shepherds are serving satan.
1 Timothy chapter 4 , warns us of false brethren. Seducing spirits and doctrine of devil's.
It's either ego or money. Pride is pattern of satan. We see the connection between false preachers and satan.

Ezekiel chapter 13. False brethren are condemned. They are spirtual murderers and liars. Fake shepherds go into pit with satan. The hammer will drop on false preachers on judgement day.

Deuteronomy chapter 13 . Warns us iof false prophet's. They make distortions to Gods word. These fake preachers follow the satan. Who is father of lies??
Obviously satan.
These fake Christian are heathen.
Zephniah chapter 1 . THE CHERMARIMS are black robed priests. They dress in black.
KEMARIM = these are priest's of baal.
Many churches/denominations, have allowed heathen traditions and customs to infiltrate their places. They teach tradition of men and false doctrine.

These fake preachers teach contrary to Gods word. They contaminate God's word. Get the picture.
Some priests practice absolution. This is boothes set up for confession. They make money off people's sins. Only Jesus can forgive sins by repentance.

I recommend shepherds chapel, on YouTube. They teach sound doctrine.

 

[Aaron112]

I recommend shepherds chapel, on YouTube. They teach sound doctrine.

I remember that being exposed by its teachings as false one or more decades ago. Haven't watched it since then. Test everything before believing it.

 

[anetazo]

I remember that being exposed by its teachings as false one or more decades ago. Haven't watched it since then. Test everything before believing it.

Shepherds chapel tesch verse by verse. Chapter by chapter. Pastor murray is one of God's Elect. I'm one of God's Elect.
Many hirelings today teach tradition of men and false doctrine. Amos chapter 8. Were in time of famine, it's hearing God's truth.
I've studied 23 years with shepherds chapel. Pastor always tells the truth.

I believe you have spirit of stupor, second thessalonians chapter 2 and romans chapter 11.

Many churches and pastors don't have holy spirit, they cant teach meat of God's word, the mystery of God.
You don't have holy spirit. You can't discern.
Respectively speaking. You lack knowledge of Gods word and your spirtualty blind. Spirtual discernment is needed to to decide who to study with.
You have Spirit of Stupor.
Documentation, first Corinthians chapter 2
Isaiah chapter 29
Isaiah chapter 6
Romans chapter 11
God's election have holy spirit and it will never go against God's word.
I hope you understand?

 

[Aaron112]

Shepherds chapel tesch verse by verse. Chapter by chapter.

So did the Scribes and Phaisees who opposed Jesus. i.e. not helpful.

 

[Aaron112]

B) Is that what most Christian churches are like today, just making up their own theology, more concerned with following
what the preacher says, even over and above what Jesus himself said? Is that really what Christianity has devolved into?

Very much has.
Even to the point of saying killing is okay... if someone does not believe 'right' it's okay to kill them!?

Yet God Knows those who are really His, and everyone will see in the light one day that God's Vengeance is right at the right time, and His Mercy is Perfect always, and His Judgment is true and without any flaw.

 

[JaneHenry]

I gave you a compliment for recognizing false teaching. Sorry. Be blessed

The fake shepherds are serving satan.
1 Timothy chapter 4 , warns us of false brethren. Seducing spirits and doctrine of devil's.
It's either ego or money. Pride is pattern of satan. We see the connection between false preachers and satan.

Ezekiel chapter 13. False brethren are condemned. They are spirtual murderers and liars. Fake shepherds go into pit with satan. The hammer will drop on false preachers on judgement day.

Deuteronomy chapter 13 . Warns us iof false prophet's. They make distortions to Gods word. These fake preachers follow the satan. Who is father of lies??
Obviously satan.
These fake Christian are heathen.
Zephniah chapter 1 . THE CHERMARIMS are black robed priests. They dress in black.
KEMARIM = these are priest's of baal.
Many churches/denominations, have allowed heathen traditions and customs to infiltrate their places. They teach tradition of men and false doctrine.

These fake preachers teach contrary to Gods word. They contaminate God's word. Get the picture.
Some priests practice absolution. This is boothes set up for confession. They make money off people's sins. Only Jesus can forgive sins by repentance.

I recommend shepherds chapel, on YouTube. They teach sound doctrine.

I remember that being exposed by its teachings as false one or more decades ago. Haven't watched it since then. Test everything before believing it.

Shepherds chapel tesch verse by verse. Chapter by chapter. Pastor murray is one of God's Elect. I'm one of God's Elect.
Many hirelings today teach tradition of men and false doctrine. Amos chapter 8. Were in time of famine, it's hearing God's truth.
I've studied 23 years with shepherds chapel. Pastor always tells the truth.

I believe you have spirit of stupor, second thessalonians chapter 2 and romans chapter 11.

Many churches and pastors don't have holy spirit, they cant teach meat of God's word, the mystery of God.
You don't have holy spirit. You can't discern.
Respectively speaking. You lack knowledge of Gods word and your spirtualty blind. Spirtual discernment is needed to to decide who to study with.
You have Spirit of Stupor.
Documentation, first Corinthians chapter 2
Isaiah chapter 29
Isaiah chapter 6
Romans chapter 11
God's election have holy spirit and it will never go against God's word.
I hope you understand?

So did the Scribes and Phaisees who opposed Jesus. i.e. not helpful.

I'm realizing that the truth is, you can;'t depend on the Bible. There are so many interpretations of the book, that is why there have come to be so many different denominations of Christianity. If you look at the history, you'll find that most denominations started because of some kind of disagreement over doctrine that resulted in a denomination splitting and a new denomination being formed with different religious dogma, it's just ridiculous.

I was debating some religious things with a guy on another forum, then he wrote words to the effect of,' "you can't go by a literal interpretation of the Bible, because it was written by man, not by God, so it's not perfect, so you have to apply some interpretation to it." I'm reading that, about to pop my top because that is the most ridiculous, dog chasing its tail, circular logic argument I've ever heard. That's because, if what he said is true, then whoever else interprets it and applies that interpretation to it, IS ALSO A MAN (or woman), and therefore their interpretation is just as fallible as the "interpretation" of the original authors who wrote it. So, if you apply his logic, you're still no better off than when you started, LOL. You're still relying on an "interpretation" of a man, a man who was not even there when the events in the Bible allegedly took place, and never had the honor of talking directly to Jesus or an apostle, about it. Just a man 2000 years after the fact, trying to divine the meaning of something based on a shoddy interpretation that isn't correct somehow and needs to be re-interpreted. That's the ridiculous, circular logic place, you arrive at, if you follow that illogical thought process that the Bible needs to be re-interpreted by people who weren't' even there.

All the debate and discussion I've been having about it has really made me appreciate the scientific method for discerning the truth a lot more. In the scientific method, the results have to be repeatable, so no matter who conducts the experiment, no matter when, if it was 5000 years in the past or today, or even in the future, if the same things was or is done the results will be exactly the same, for everyone, no matter when, where, or by whom. AND if the person(s) conducting the trial are somehow influencing the results, then the results are considered counterfeit, and invalid, not a truth.