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  1. ByTheSpirit

    ByTheSpirit Pray always!!

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    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    Are there people who think they are saved while they continue to practice sin ? Yes the strong dilusion is here.
    Is the a false unity of denominations forming under an umbrella that allows every manner of demonic doctrine from golddust and feathers through to Mary worship and even Satanism to be included under the name of that false unity? Yes..the strong dellusion has come.
     
  3. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Gold dust and feathers sounds interesting.
     
  4. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    Lol
    Its a reference to “lakeland” or bethal Redding type moves.

    I speak critically of that because I was once involved but the Lord brought me out into true repentance and set me free from false spirits.
     
  5. Eryk

    Eryk Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The strong delusion takes place in the Tribulation period. However, the spirit of antichrist is active today. Bible Prophecy Answer Book by Ron Rhodes:

    What is the “spirit of antichrist”?
    Not only will there be a future person known as the antichrist who comes to power in the future seven-year tribulation period (2 Thessalonians 2: 1-9; Revelation 13), there is also a “spirit of the antichrist” that is already at work today, promoting heretical and cultic doctrine (1 John 4: 1-3). Based on John’s writings, we can conclude that the spirit of antichrist involves deception (2 John 7), denies that Christ came in the flesh (1 John 4: 2-3), denies the Father and the Son (1 John 2: 22), is already in the world (1 John 4: 3), was even prevalent in apostolic times (1 John 2: 18), and is closely related to false prophets (1 John 4: 1). Many theologians believe that the “spirit of the antichrist” refers to demonic spirits who promulgate anti-Christian teachings (1 John 4: 3). In keeping with this, 1 Timothy 4: 1 warns, “The Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons.”
     
  6. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    And that has already occured..and Many have already waxed cold.
     
  7. imsaneru

    imsaneru Member

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    Now hang on let's back up a little , Paul begins by talking about a man who sits in the temple of God claiming himself to be God , now I would have thought that that in it's self would be one of the biggest con jobs or delusions around. And it says that they will believe the lie , well of coarse they will because Revelation tells us about another man who performs a "SIGN" for them , he makes fire come down from heaven to the earth...Like HELLO!!!! , Elijah anyone.

    Let's not forget what they asked of Jesus , they said show us a sign from heaven and of coarse he wouldn't so they are still looking for it.
     
  8. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    One way to answer that would be to ask: Are most people already believing "the lie"? For:

    2 Thessalonians 2:11 . . . God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie. . .

    The future Antichrist will have a False Prophet who will work amazing miracles (2 Thessalonians 2:9b) by which people will be deceived (Revelation 13:12-14, Revelation 19:20, cf. Matthew 24:24). And God will send strong delusion on unrepentant people so they will believe "the" lie (2 Thessalonians 2:11-12; in the original Greek, there's a "the" before "lie"), which could be the antichrist lie which has been around since the 1st century AD (2 John 1:7; 1 John 4:3; 2 Thessalonians 2:7a), and which in our future will deceive the world into consciously and openly worshipping both Lucifer (Satan, the dragon) and the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9), the man of sin (2 Thessalonians 2:3-9), as God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36). The antichrist lie denies Jesus is the Christ (1 John 2:22), denies Jesus is the human/divine Son of God (1 John 2:22b), and denies Christ is in the flesh (2 John 1:7), which denial is one of the key doctrines of Gnosticism.
     
  9. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    Regarding "even Satanism", that will be true even within a so-called "Christian" religion.

    Also, Christians need to be aware that during the Antichrist's future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:4-18), even though the world will consciously and openly worship Lucifer (Satan, the dragon) and the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") (Revelation 13:4-8, Revelation 12:9), this won't require the Antichrist's one-world religion will say Jesus is evil, or will turn the world against Jesus. For almost the entire world reveres Jesus, at least as being a good man. The Antichrist could confirm this basic world belief, but simply (in his words) "clarify" that while Jesus is indeed a good man, he isn't the Christ or the Son of God (1 John 2:22). No doubt the Antichrist will also deny Jesus suffered and died on the Cross for our sins, as this, just as believing Jesus is the Christ and the Son of God (John 20:31, John 3:36), is one of the core beliefs of the Gospel by which people become saved (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).

    So what the Antichrist could do is keep the idea of a good Jesus, but strip it of everything by which Jesus saves people from hell. And this wouldn't require the Antichrist deny Jesus' second coming. Indeed, the Antichrist and his False Prophet (of Revelation 19:20) could even try to employ to their own ends the Biblical prophecy of Jesus' second coming, as well as the Muslim prophecy which says the miracle-working prophet Jesus will return bodily from heaven in the last days to bring the whole earth into the worship of the true God. For the False Prophet could claim he is Jesus returned (via reincarnation). And he could perform amazing miracles (Revelation 13:13) as purported proof of his claim (cf. John 3:2). This is one reason why it's important to know when and how the real Jesus' Second Coming will occur (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Zechariah 14:3-21).

    Once the False Prophet by his amazing miracles has brought the world under his spell (Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20), including many Muslims and Christians who may not care much for scriptural dogma, but could go wild over his signs and wonders, he could begin to (in his words) "restore to the world the real message which was spoken by me (Jesus) at my first coming, and by the great prophet Mohammed, but which message became corrupted by power-hungry men when they copied and changed the early manuscripts of the Bible and the Koran". He could then gradually initiate the world into the Antichrist's Gnostic Luciferianism (1 John 4:3, Revelation 13:4-6), a religion which could have existed since ancient times in some "mystery" cults, and still exists today in the highest degree of initiation of a worldwide secret society. The False Prophet could present his miraculously calling fire down from heaven (Revelation 13:13) as purported proof that Lucifer (the dragon, Satan) and the Antichrist are the true God (Revelation 13:4-8, Revelation 12:9), in an inversion of how back in Old Testament times, the prophet Elijah miraculously called fire down from heaven to prove YHWH is the true God (1 Kings 18:37-39).

    The person whom the Antichrist will revile is YHWH (Revelation 13:6, Daniel 11:36), whom many people mistakenly think of as being (in their words) "the God of only the Old Testament, that cruel and hateful God who commanded people to commit genocide and kill babies (1 Samuel 15:3), whereas Jesus came and preached love for everyone (Matthew 5:44)". The truth is Jesus Christ confirmed the God of the Old Testament, YHWH (Deuteronomy 6:4-5, Leviticus 19:18), is the same as the God of the New Testament (Mark 12:29-31), and that the Old Testament is true (Matthew 5:17-18, Luke 24:44-48). Jesus suffered and died for our sins in fulfillment of Old Testament prophecy from YHWH (Isaiah 53; 1 Peter 2:24). And He rose from the dead in fulfillment of Old Testament prophecy from YHWH (e.g. Psalms 16:10, Acts 2:31). Jesus died to establish the New Covenant (Matthew 26:28), which YHWH had foretold in the Old Testament (Jeremiah 31:31-34). And Jesus died to bring about the defeat of Satan (Hebrews 2:14), which YHWH had foretold from even the first book of the Old Testament (Genesis 3:15).

    Nonetheless, building on many people's misconceptions of YHWH as being (in their words) "the cruel God of the Old Testament", no doubt one of the Antichrist's chief blasphemies against YHWH (Revelation 13:6, Daniel 11:36) will be that YHWH is an evil god. This is one of the ancient blasphemies of Gnosticism, another being the antichrist lie that Christ isn't in the flesh (2 John 1:7). The world will be deceived into completely rejecting YHWH, and worshipping Satan and the Antichrist instead (Revelation 13:4-8, Revelation 12:9). But Satan might not be worshipped as "Satan", which almost everyone sees as a bad name (it means "Adversary"), but as "Lucifer" (Isaiah 14:12), which means "the morning star". The Antichrist could falsely say it's YHWH who is the true "Satan", the true "Adversary" of mankind. And he could claim even 2 Samuel 24:1 and 1 Chronicles 21:1 together prove this by showing it was the single entity of YHWH/Satan who moved David to number Israel. Of course, the truth is 2 Samuel 24:1 and 1 Chronicles 21:1 together simply mean YHWH used Satan to move David. YHWH elsewhere rebuked Satan (Zechariah 3:2), so they're in no way the same person.

    Because the Antichrist and his False Prophet (possibly masquerading as Jesus) will deny Jesus is the Christ (1 John 2:22), and will deny Christ is in the flesh (1 John 4:3), and because they will bring the unsaved world into the worship of Lucifer (Satan, the dragon) instead (Revelation 13:4, Revelation 12:9), they could falsely say (the non-mortal flesh) Lucifer is the Christ, that the new name of Christ (Revelation 3:12c) is "Lucifer Christ". For just as "Lucifer" means "the morning star", so Christ is the morning star (Revelation 22:16b). Also, Christ identified himself with the serpent (John 3:14), and Lucifer is the serpent (Revelation 12:9). Also, Christ said "Ye are gods" (John 10:34), and it was the serpent who said "ye shall be as gods" (Genesis 3:5).

    But the truth is Lucifer fell from his office of morning star (Isaiah 14:12) and became Satan (cf. Luke 10:18). Jesus Christ has taken over the office of morning star (Revelation 22:16). And Jesus Christ identified Himself only with the brass serpent on the pole in Numbers 21:8-9 (John 3:14), which typified Jesus Christ's crucifixion for our sins (John 19:16, Matthew 26:28). And in John 10:34, Jesus Christ (John 20:31) was quoting YHWH in Psalms 82:6-7, which shows that even though humans have knowledge of good and evil as gods do (Genesis 3:22), they will still die like humans (Psalms 82:7), contradicting the serpent's lie (Genesis 3:4). Nonetheless, the Antichrist could falsely say Lucifer is the Christ and the true and beneficent God of mankind, and that the False Prophet is the miracle-working prophet Jesus (cf. John 3:2, Acts 3:22-24), returned to point the world to the true Christ/God. The Antichrist could falsely say he (the Antichrist) is the human/divine "Son" of Lucifer, who must be worshipped as God along with Lucifer (Revelation 13:4,8). This would be similar to how Biblical Christians rightly worship the human/divine Jesus Christ (John 1:1,14) as YHWH God (the Son) along with YHWH God the Father (John 20:28, Hebrews 1:8).

    Near the end of the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, unclean spirits like frogs will come out of the mouths of Lucifer, the Antichrist and the False Prophet (Revelation 16:13). And these unclean spirits like frogs will go forth and perform amazing miracles to convince the world's armies to gather together at Armageddon (Har Megiddo: Mount Megiddo in northern Israel) (Revelation 16:16) in an attempt to fight and defeat YHWH Himself (Revelation 16:14, Revelation 19:19). After gathering together at Armageddon, the armies will travel south and pillage Jerusalem, right before the real Jesus (who is YHWH: John 10:30) returns from heaven and defeats them completely (Zechariah 14:2-21, Revelation 19:20 to 20:3).

    So the Second Coming of Jesus Christ will be a total shock to the world. The world will have been expecting to wage war against some evil Old Testament god named "YHWH" with the help of the good Jesus (played by the False Prophet) and with the help of the true and beneficent Christ/God (played by Lucifer) and with the help of the good Son of God (played by the Antichrist) and with the help of the good angels of God (played by the fallen angels of Lucifer: Revelation 12:9). But then instead of some evil god appearing in the sky, the world could see the glorious sign of the Cross (cf. Matthew 24:30), the symbol of the good YHWH suffering and dying for our sins (Acts 20:28b). And then the world will see the glorious appearance of the real Jesus, sitting on a white horse descending from the sky (Revelation 19:11-21).

    When the people of the world realize at that moment how thoroughly they have been duped, and see in the sky the huge angelic armies (2 Thessalonians 1:7, Matthew 25:31) of the true Jesus, the true Christ, the true Son of God, and the good YHWH, who are all the one and the same Jesus Christ of Nazareth, they could utterly mourn and wail for themselves (Matthew 24:30, Revelation 1:7), knowing in their spirits that Jesus has returned in wrath to destroy most of them for their unrepentant sins (2 Thessalonians 1:8-9, Revelation 19:15-21).
     
  10. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    Good point. For:

    Revelation 13:13 . . . he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
    14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do . . .

    Just as the Antichrist could make a worldwide television and internet spectacle out of his fulfilling of 2 Thessalonians 2:4 and Daniel 11:36, so his False Prophet could make a worldwide television and internet spectacle out of his fulfilling of Revelation 13:13, when he will miraculously call fire down from heaven in the sight of everyone. He could do this as a Luciferian inversion of 1 Kings 18:19-40. For example, he could first gather together the most prominent leaders of the Christian community worldwide to the Champ de Mars (Mars being the same as Marduk the dragon, the chief god of ancient Babylon), which is the large open space in front of the Eiffel Tower in Paris. And he could tell them during a ceremony televised and webcasted worldwide to pray to YHWH God to send fire down and destroy the Tower.

    And when the Christian leaders pray and YHWH doesn't do anything (by His own choice), the False Prophet could pray to Lucifer (the dragon, Satan: Revelation 12:9, Revelation 13:4) to send fire down and destroy the Tower. And Lucifer could do so (allowed to do so by YHWH), so that 1 Kings 18:38-40 will be turned on its head, so that news reporters could write (in their words) "Then the fire of Lucifer fell, and consumed the Eiffel Tower. And when all the people saw it, they fell on their faces. And they said, Lucifer is God, Lucifer is God. And the True Prophet said to them: 'Take these men of YHWH! Let not one of them escape!' And they took them. And the True Prophet brought them down to the river Seine, and slew them there" (as a Luciferian inversion of 1 Kings 18:38-40).

    But would YHWH God really let something like this happen? Would he let Christians pray to Him to send fire down from heaven, but refuse to do so, while allowing Lucifer to send fire down at the beck of the False Prophet? Yes, YHWH could let this happen, as a test to Christians, to see if they love signs and wonders more than YHWH (cf. Deuteronomy 13:1-3). Christians must always remember that not all signs and wonders are from the true God, that Lucifer/Satan can also give people the power to perform them (e.g. 2 Thessalonians 2:9), in order to deceive people (Matthew 24:24-25, Revelation 13:13-14, Revelation 19:20).

    The way not to be deceived is to continue to believe everything the Bible teaches is from God (John 8:31b, Matthew 4:4; 2 Timothy 3:15 to 4:4), no matter how amazing the miracles are of someone who teaches something which contradicts the Bible (Matthew 24:24; 1 Timothy 4:1). And the way to continue to believe everything the Bible teaches is from God is not to continue in any unrepentant sin. For otherwise our conscience could become seared as with a hot iron (1 Timothy 4:2), to where we could no longer endure the sound doctrine of the Bible, but after our own lusts heap to ourselves teachers who teach us fables which support us in our lusts (2 Timothy 4:3-4), to where we could even become willing to depart from the faith itself, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils (1 Timothy 4:1).
     
  11. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    Interesting take on the Elijah .

    But it's not the strong dilusion refered to.
     
  12. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    The problem here is...if the church leaders are church leaders then they already serve the false prophet.
    Jesus is the Sheppard of his church which He is the leader of.
     
  13. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    Exactly..the apostate church.
    -A unity of denominations under a false prophet.-
     
  14. imsaneru

    imsaneru Member

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    Why not?
     
  15. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    Oh .just because the delusion is a global dellusion which falls into apostasy long before the son of perdition is revealed.
    I'm of the personal opinion the false prophet will be a pope. But that's just opinion. But Rome is the center of the false unification of churches.
     
  16. imsaneru

    imsaneru Member

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    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
  17. imsaneru

    imsaneru Member

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    So when a man comes to sit in the temple of God and claims to be God , are you thinking that that might happen in Rome?
     
  18. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    That could be right.

    The beast which comes up out of the earth in Revelation 13:11-16 represents the individual man who will become the Antichrist's False Prophet (Revelation 19:20, Revelation 16:13). He could be a secretly-apostate pope who at some point during his tenure will make a great push for peace and unity between Christianity and Islam. He could say something like: "Why do we fight each other? Are we not all the spiritual children of Abraham and of his God, the one God? Can't we lay aside our foolish, man-made differences of theology, which have done us no good at all, but have only brought us hatred and violence, and unite into one religion of Abraham, one religion of peace, based on love for the one God and love for our fellow man? What is more important than this?"

    He could be so skillful in elucidating what the moderate Muslims could call "the true, peaceful, loving nature of Islam", that he could be hailed by them worldwide as (in their words) "a Great Imam, come to rescue our beloved Islam from the bad reputation falsely given to it by the terrorists". In this way, a pope could come to hold high positions of power in two religions at the same time, which could be symbolized by the two horns of the False Prophet lamb (Revelation 13:11). This would be similar to how the seven horns of the true-Jesus lamb in Revelation 5:6 could represent the true Jesus holding seven positions of power at the same time (compare Jesus wearing many crowns at the same time in Revelation 19:12). The False Prophet could even say he is Jesus. But he won't say he's Christ, for the False Prophet and the Antichrist will deny Jesus is the Christ, and will deny Christ is in the flesh (1 John 2:22; 2 John 1:7).

    --

    If a secretly apostate pope does become the Antichrist's False Prophet (of Revelation 13:11-16, Revelation 19:20 and Revelation 16:13), adherents of Catholicism will have to decide what their ultimate source of truth is: Is it the pope and the RCC, or God and the Bible? Many adherents of Catholicism who know God and the Bible well and hold to them as their ultimate source of truth will no doubt be utterly aghast at the false doctrines of a False Prophet pope. Such adherents of Catholicism could demand he be removed for heresy and apostasy, and that the cardinals elect a new pope. But other adherents of Catholicism, including many cardinals, bishops and priests, could be deceived (along with most of the rest of the world) into believing the False Prophet pope's false doctrines, because of his ability to perform the most amazing miracles (Revelation 13:13-14, Revelation 19:20; cf. Matthew 24:24).

    And so a great schism could arise within the RCC. Compare the Akita prophecy: "The work of the devil will infiltrate even into the Church in such a way that one will see cardinals opposing cardinals, bishops against bishops". Many adherents of Catholicism could follow the False Prophet pope, while other adherents of Catholicism could reject him and elect their own, new pope (or reinstall a former pope who's still alive), whom they could declare to be the "True Pope". But this new (or reinstated) "True Pope" could be murdered, along with many of his followers, by the False Prophet pope's soldiers. Compare the Third Secret of Fatima: "he [the pope] was killed by a group of soldiers who fired bullets and arrows at him, and in the same way there died one after another the other Bishops, Priests, men and women Religious, and various lay people of different ranks and positions". Could the soldiers firing "arrows" be the Vatican's Swiss Guards, whose weapons and colorful uniforms hark back to the Middle Ages?

    After this slaughter, the False Prophet pope could manage to retain the papacy and full control of the Vatican, and through his (deceived) cardinals, bishops and priests, retain full control of all RCC cathedrals, parishes, churches, etc., throughout the world. And when the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") obtains power over all nations, he and the False Prophet will make war against true, Biblical Christians (whether they're adherents of Catholicism or not) throughout the world, and will physically overcome them and kill them (by beheading) in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).

    It's only when the Antichrist has completely broken the physical power of the true Church (which consists of all true Christians, whether they're adherents of Catholicism or not: Ephesians 4:4-6) that the future Tribulation will end (Daniel 12:7b) and Jesus Christ's Second Coming will immediately occur, at which time He will physically resurrect and rapture (gather together) the Church (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6). And at His Second Coming, Jesus Christ will tread the winepress of God's wrath alone (Isaiah 63:3, Revelation 19:15-21), and so He/God will get all the glory for defeating the power of evil on the earth (Deuteronomy 32:39-43). For He/God won't share this glory with the Church (cf. Isaiah 42:8-14, Isaiah 26:18).
     
  19. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    Instead of in Rome, the Antichrist will fulfill 2 Thessalonians 2:4 after he by force takes control of a future, 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem, stops the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices which the ultra-Orthodox Jews will have restarted in front of it, and has the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the temple (Daniel 11:31,36, Matthew 24:15).

    The Antichrist could then make quite a show of his sitting himself in the temple and declaring himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36,31). In a television and internet spectacle which will be seen live by the world, he could first be shown entering the temple's most holy place in magnificent golden robes. He could then step up to the Ark of the Covenant (which could have been discovered, and placed in the temple by the Jews) and lift the Mercy Seat off the Ark, showing it to be empty. He could then look into the camera and say: "Where is YHWH? He is not here! He is a distant fraud! His power on this earth is as hollow as this empty Ark!" (The Antichrist will utterly revile YHWH: Revelation 13:6, Daniel 11:36.)

    Then the Antichrist could raise the Mercy Seat high above his head only to suddenly smash it down violently to the ground, breaking it into pieces. The piped-in sound of crowds roaring with approval could then be heard in the background. Then the Antichrist could place his hands on the Ark and stare into the camera: "WE can do better than this". He could then knock over the Ark and stamp it with his foot, bashing in its side. Two of the Antichrist's followers in robes could then quickly come in and clear away the rubble of the Mercy Seat and the Ark, while 4 strong men in robes carry into the temple's most holy place a magnificent golden throne and place it right where the Ark had been before. The men could then bow down and motion with their arms for the Antichrist to sit on the throne. He could then grandly take his seat upon it.

    Glorious symphonic music could then swell as the sound of crowds roaring with approval increases. Then the Antichrist's False Prophet (Revelation 19:20) (who could be an apostate pope) could enter the temple's most holy place and approach the Antichrist carrying a majestic golden crown encrusted with large diamonds and all kinds of precious stones. The Antichrist could take the crown from the pope's outstretched hands. And as the Antichrist is placing the crown on his own head, a camera could slowly zoom in on his face as he says in a deep voice: "I AM THAT I AM. I AM YOUR GOD. WORSHIP ME, ALL YE NATIONS OF THE EARTH!"

    (Compare Revelation 13:8, Daniel 11:36; 2 Thessalonians 2:4)
     
  20. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    ?? Nope lol ..the false prophet and the son of perdition are not the same..they just work together
     
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