Darkness falls ...

[Tomk80]

Racial discrimination is illegal but please don't try to convince me it doesn't happen.

But it sure is less accepted now as it was 50 to 100 years ago. I would posit that it happens less now than it did during my grandparent's time. Back than, it was the norm.

Women & blacks can vote, I'll give you that.

Domestic violence is illegal. Does that mean it never happens anymore? Try switching on a police scanner on a friday or saturday evening after a warm day.

No, it doesn't mean it doesn't happen anymore. But again, it does mean that it is less accepted nowadays. 'Back in the old days', domestic violence was largely an accepted premise. Nowadays, few consider it 'normal'. Which is the better standard?

 

[TheListener]

Can you show that crime is caused by “godlessness?”

And you keep ignoring my point. I can leave my door wide open if I choose. Yet, I live in a bastion of what you consider sin. If crime is related to “sinfulness,” why is crime relatively nonexistent in my area?

The Bible tells us to flee from greed, sexual immoralty & drunkenness. Atheists seem to be ok with them as has been my experience especially in this particular thread.

Crime usually stems from these things.

 

[Tomk80]

Have a read of the book "To protect & serve" by Richard Basham & Tim Priest. Gives you a good insight into what crime numbers really are.

It is pointless quoting crime numbers. What are they based on? Conviction rates? Charges? Calls to 000? I can tell you this, none of those numbers will ever reflect the real crime rates. Thus it is a pointless exercise to quote statistics if we want to be realistic. Crime might be low in some parts of Canberra. It certainly isn't in the vast majority of Sydney.

It isn't pointless. The numbers aren't perfect, but at least they give an indication.

 

[David Gould]

Have a read of the book "To protect & serve" by Richard Basham & Tim Priest. Gives you a good insight into what crime numbers really are.

Uh huh. So all those criminologists have it completely wrong - just not these two guys.

It is pointless quoting crime numbers. What are they based on? Conviction rates? Charges? Calls to 000? I can tell you this, none of those numbers will ever reflect the real crime rates. Thus it is a pointless exercise to quote statistics if we want to be realistic. Crime might be low in some parts of Canberra. It certainly isn't in the vast majority of Sydney.

If it is pointless quoting these numbers, on what basis are you making the claim that crime is on the rise? After all, these are the only numbers we have.

 

[TheListener]

It isn't pointless. The numbers aren't perfect, but at least they give an indication.

The numbers are usually an indication on what the police commissioner wants the public to know.

 

[David Gould]

The Bible tells us to flee from greed, sexual immoralty & drunkenness. Atheists seem to be ok with them as has been my experience especially in this particular thread.

Can you demonstrate that atheists commit more crime than Christians?

Crime usually stems from these things.

Can you demonstrate this? In my experience, crime usually stems from stupidity.

 

[nvxplorer]

Have a read of the book "To protect & serve" by Richard Basham & Tim Priest. Gives you a good insight into what crime numbers really are.

It is pointless quoting crime numbers. What are they based on? Conviction rates? Charges? Calls to 000? I can tell you this, none of those numbers will ever reflect the real crime rates. Thus it is a pointless exercise to quote statistics if we want to be realistic. Crime might be low in some parts of Canberra. It certainly isn't in the vast majority of Sydney.

Good one. You can’t support your claims because the statistics are wrong. You remind me of an ex-acquaintance who was prolific with this type of rationalization and denial. He would get drunk and scratch his CD collection. Of course, it wasn’t his fault. It was because CD technology was faulty. He was a good ol’ boy, creationist Christisan as well. Can I use your tactic of citing anecdotes to make a broad statement about creationists, alcohol and denial of responsibility?

 

[TheListener]

If it is pointless quoting these numbers, on what basis are you making the claim that crime is on the rise? After all, these are the only numbers we have.

Drugs are on the rise, although heroin has gone down in the last 5 years other drugs have increased.

You want percentages then, look up the drug statistics. Have they gone up or down? What percentage of prisoners are in for drug related crimes?

 

[David Gould]

The numbers are usually an indication on what the police commissioner wants the public to know.

What a complete load of nonsense. The numbers are not that easy to hide. Many, many academics and private researchers investigate these things. They check them by taking surveys of the public in certain areas. They actually research them. The police commissioner does not have the kind of control you think they do. And further, a police commissioner is just as likely to inflate crime statistics so as to attract more funding as to deflate them to make themselves look good.

 

[David Gould]

Drugs are on the rise, although heroin has gone down in the last 5 years other drugs have increased.

You want percentages then, look up the drug statistics. Have they gone up or down? What percentage of prisoners are in for drug related crimes?

Drug crime is up, I agree. However, why should I trust these dodgy statistics that you think show nothing?

 

[Tomk80]

The Bible tells us to flee from greed, sexual immoralty & drunkenness. Atheists seem to be ok with them as has been my experience especially in this particular thread.

Crime usually stems from these things.

But you still haven't shown that atheists are more criminally inclined. You'll need to do that first. How contradictory it may seem to you, the relationship you imply here may not exist. You'll need to support that it exists first.

Sexual immorality: How many children from atheists homes end up in prostitution when compared to children from religious homes?

Greed: Why was the contribution of Americans (per capita) for aid after the tsunami in Asia so low when compared to the per capita contribution of largely secular countries like Sweden and the Netherlands?

Drunkenness: Where is binge drinking and alcohol addiction highest? In states/countries with strict regulations on them or in states/countries with a loose policy on them?

Those are the questions that need answering to support your assertions. You have yet to answer them.

 

[TheListener]

Can you demonstrate that atheists commit more crime than Christians?

If a Christian follows the Bible theoretically he should commit no crime. Atheists moral standards on the other hand are whatever media, parental influence, peer pressure, social norm etc dictates.

Can you demonstrate this? In my experience, crime usually stems from stupidity.

Sure, the prisons are full of retarded people. Ok...

 

[nvxplorer]

The Bible tells us to flee from greed, sexual immoralty & drunkenness. Atheists seem to be ok with them as has been my experience especially in this particular thread.

Crime usually stems from these things.

Pardon the caps lock, but...

THEN WHY IS CRIME VIRTUALLY NON-EXISTENT IN RENO?

Hint: Check the unemployment rate.

 

[Tomk80]

The numbers are usually an indication on what the police commissioner wants the public to know.

If that is the case in America, I pity your country even more than I already do.

 

[Electric Sceptic]

Drugs are on the rise, although heroin has gone down in the last 5 years other drugs have increased.

You want percentages then, look up the drug statistics. Have they gone up or down? What percentage of prisoners are in for drug related crimes?

No, YOU look them up. You don't seem to understand this. You are making all sorts of claims - you are being asked to support them. That's not unusual. It's up to you to support them by showing facts that we can all see...crime statistics, statistics on divorce, prostitute use, substance abuse...whichever is applicable.

The problem is you refuse to even try to do so. You just want to make all sorts of claims, not support any of them, and have us all believe you instantly.

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. And attempting to slur those who disagree with you only makes your argument look even weaker.

 

[TheListener]

What a complete load of nonsense. The numbers are not that easy to hide. Many, many academics and private researchers investigate these things. They check them by taking surveys of the public in certain areas. They actually research them. The police commissioner does not have the kind of control you think they do. And further, a police commissioner is just as likely to inflate crime statistics so as to attract more funding as to deflate them to make themselves look good.

One name & 3 letters for you to look up: Peter J. Ryan and PAL.

 

[Tomk80]

If a Christian follows the Bible theoretically he should commit no crime. Atheists moral standards on the other hand are whatever media, parental influence, peer pressure, social norm etc dictates.

But can you demonstrate it? Come on, give us some numbers in stead of dodging.

Sure, the prisons are full of retarded people. Ok...

That's not what he said.

 

[TheListener]

If that is the case in America, I pity your country even more than I already do.

The American flag has stars & stripes. My one under my name is an Australian flag.

 

[TheListener]

Pardon the caps lock, but...

THEN WHY IS CRIME VIRTUALLY NON-EXISTENT IN RENO?

Hint: Check the unemployment rate.

I told you before I've never been to reno nor do I ever intend to visit.

 

[nvxplorer]

The numbers are usually an indication on what the police commissioner wants the public to know.

Cynicism is fine, but I’ll restate my opinion that you seem paranoid. Where do you get this information?