Daniel 9 - Seventy sevens

[bsd058]

I have just finished reading chapter 13 in 'A Case for Amillenialism,' and would like to offer up a suggestion for the seventy sevens of Daniel which Dispensationalists agree is referring to the antichrist and to a deal he strikes with Israel and their enemies.

I just want to make sure that I understand this passage accurately, since I believe the dispensational view is not accurate. I want my reformed friends to correct me where I'm wrong.

Dan 9:24 - Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.

Seventy sevens are 490 years (seventy prophetic weeks) would occur between this particular prophecy and the moment of Christ's sacrifice, the prophecies about him and visions of him to be fulfilled (and possibly ceased?) and for the Lord to be born and proclaim his anointing.

Dan 9:25 - "Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One,the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.

From the time that the Jews would begin to rebuild Jerusalem, until Christ comes, there will be 483 years. The city would be rebuilt.

Dan 9:26 - After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.

Christ would be killed after 434 years from the prophecy.

I'm having difficulty with this. The ruler discussed is the Anointed one (Christ). The people of the ruler must be his congregation, therefore. But the thing is that the ruler in history were the Romans who came and literally destroyed the temple in 70 AD. Is this destruction a different kind of destruction? Like a destruction of the ways of the temple as opposed to the destruction of the temple itself? Because, though the Lord prophesied the temple's destruction, it didn't come about by the Christians.

Dan 9:27 - He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

Jesus gave us his new covenant. This new covenant was sealed with his blood and the Holy Spirit. He therefore made any new sacrifices an abomination to him, and he caused the temple to be desolate after his sacrifice. No other sacrifice was acceptable. Then he gave up his spirit.


My question is this: Could any of my reformed brothers give me a clearer interpretation, please? I feel like the outline is correct, in general, but that there are "iffy" things said in my interpretation that could use some refining.

Thanks to all who offer to help.

 

[JM]

Try this.

It is long but worth the read.

 

[bsd058]

Try this.

It is long but worth the read.

Thanks.

 

[Striver]

I'm having difficulty with this. The ruler discussed is the Anointed one (Christ). The people of the ruler must be his congregation, therefore. But the thing is that the ruler in history were the Romans who came and literally destroyed the temple in 70 AD. Is this destruction a different kind of destruction? Like a destruction of the ways of the temple as opposed to the destruction of the temple itself? Because, though the Lord prophesied the temple's destruction, it didn't come about by the Christians.

The details vary widely when one begins breaking down the dates, but the dispensationalism I am familiar with does not interpret the AD 70 destruction of the temple as "the" destruction Jesus speaks of in his discourse:

Matthew 24:1-2
Jesus left the temple and was going away, when his disciples came to point out to him the buildings of the temple. But he answered them, "You see all these, do you not? Truly, I say to you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down."

(Emphasis mine.)

Basically, the assertion I have seen (and this encompasses several different "flavors" of the camp) is that this is not yet fully literally fulfilled, as in the wailing wall still stands.

 

[bsd058]

The details vary widely when one begins breaking down the dates, but the dispensationalism I am familiar with does not interpret the AD 70 destruction of the temple as "the" destruction Jesus speaks of in his discourse:

Matthew 24:1-2
Jesus left the temple and was going away, when his disciples came to point out to him the buildings of the temple. But he answered them, "You see all these, do you not? Truly, I say to you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down."

(Emphasis mine.)

Basically, the assertion I have seen (and this encompasses several different "flavors" of the camp) is that this is not yet fully literally fulfilled, as in the wailing wall still stands.

Really...interesting. I'll have to look into that another time. I'm trying to figure out the Amillenial interpretation of the passage and what each thing in the prophecy of Daniel 9 actually represents. I've yet to read the above paper posted by JM. I look forward to it, though. If I have more questions I post them after I'm done reading that paper.

Also, I think sometimes we take prophecies a little too literally. For instance, "not be left here one stone upon another" I think is more of an expression that the temple will be destroyed, not that every single stone must come down.

It's like how people would use the expression "three days" to indicate a short amount of time, not usually three literal days.

Or when God told the Israelites that certain races or people will not be remembered, he certainly made it so they would be remembered since he stored their memory in the form of Scripture. It's an expression that indicates their destruction, though.

 

[Simon Peter]

Christ would be killed after 434 years from the prophecy.
...
My question is this: Could any of my reformed brothers give me a clearer interpretation, please? I feel like the outline is correct, in general, but that there are "iffy" things said in my interpretation that could use some refining.

Thanks to all who offer to help.

Daniel was told the Jewish people had 490 years, to atone for sin and fulfill God’s will.

The Anointed One (Christ) is cut off after 483 years, not 434, and then the temple will be destroyed. This ends their sacrificial ability to atone for sin.

You must add the 7 sevens to the 62 sevens, because the prophecy puts them in that order, and then says after the 62 Christ will be killed, or in other words after the 62 which is after the 7.

According to this, 483 of 490 years promised to Israel have been fulfilled, and there must still be a future 7 year period when Israel can fulfill God’s will.

The prophecy then talks about the final seven years when the temple is rebuilt, and the Antichrist puts a stop to sacrifice halfway through the seven years.

24 "Seventy 'sevens' are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy.
25 "Know and understand this: From the issuing of the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven 'sevens,' and sixty-two 'sevens.' It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.
26 After the sixty-two 'sevens,' the Anointed One will be cut off and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.
27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one 'seven.' In the middle of the 'seven' he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on a wing of the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him."
Daniel 9:24-27 NIV

Dispensationalists believe the last seven year period is the seven year tribulation that takes place as soon as the church is removed (raptured) from the world, returning to Israel the primary responsibility to represent God, and fulfill His will.

The 7 year tribulation is described in Matthew 24 and Revelation 11&12.

Hope this helps.
Simon

 

[bsd058]

Daniel was told the Jewish people had 490 years, to atone for sin and fulfill God’s will.

The Anointed One (Christ) is cut off after 483 years, not 434, and then the temple will be destroyed. This ends their sacrificial ability to atone for sin.

You must add the 7 sevens to the 62 sevens, because the prophecy puts them in that order, and then says after the 62 Christ will be killed, or in other words after the 62 which is after the 7.

According to this, 483 of 490 years promised to Israel have been fulfilled, and there must still be a future 7 year period when Israel can fulfill God’s will.

The prophecy then talks about the final seven years when the temple is rebuilt, and the Antichrist puts a stop to sacrifice halfway through the seven years.

24 "Seventy 'sevens' are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy.
25 "Know and understand this: From the issuing of the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven 'sevens,' and sixty-two 'sevens.' It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.
26 After the sixty-two 'sevens,' the Anointed One will be cut off and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.
27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one 'seven.' In the middle of the 'seven' he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on a wing of the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him."
Daniel 9:24-27 NIV

Dispensationalists believe the last seven year period is the seven year tribulation that takes place as soon as the church is removed (raptured) from the world, returning to Israel the primary responsibility to represent God, and fulfill His will.

The 7 year tribulation is described in Matthew 24 and Revelation 11&12.

Hope this helps.
Simon

I know this is what they believe. lol. I must not have been clear in my post. Sorry.

I'm looking for the Amillenial interpretation of the prophecy. Not the dispensationalist interpretation.

Thank you, though.