Cult

[arj1981]

Hypothetically speaking, if someone were trying to pressure you into joining a cult, how could you guide that person into staying on the righteous path? Keep them from being led astray? Need advice.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

if someone were trying to pressure you into joining a cult

I would tell them nicely but firmly to stop asking me to join. If they didn't stop I would break off contact.

how could you guide that person into staying on the righteous path? Keep them from being led astray? Need advice.

The way you phrase the question seems to imply that the individual has already joined a cult (and therefore already led astray). Don't get the question...

 

[jehoiakim]

You could tell them everything that is wrong about the cult...

BUT I think it would be far more productive to ask rhetorical questions... questions like what do you do with this verse, or that verse, don't you see an inconsistency between this interpretation of scripture and that one? People in cults often shut their minds off to questioning, they merely follow. Just be prepared because they probable have semi scripted answers for common objections, so you might have to be a little bit more creative or personal to break through to them. If they have answers to the basic questions I would make them more and more complicated going as deep as you can. God's truth is truth so if you dig far enough eventually you hit it, it's just a matter of continuing to dig and sift.

 

[arj1981]

SoS, I knew I could count on you for advice! There's a very impressionable, gullible young girl (sweet as all get out) involved. I just wondered how do you reach someone in a situation like that? She's following someone that doesn't preach sound doctrine all the time and this person wants to be addressed as prophet elijah bc he's returned to prepare the way for Christ. So, yea...it is one of those. I've tried my hardest to reason with both of them (it has gone on for months now) but it all falls on deaf ears, so I really need some advice here. Never dealt with anything quite like this. He feels he has authority over me and is suppose to reign over me and she readily believes this to be true as well. I tried to explain to her that this is the makings of a cult and she replied no a cult is a group of people that come together to follow one man. I said exactly. That's what he's proposing here. I told her you should rely on someone who's read the bible 14 times or has gone to seminary, etc. Don't put all of your faith in someone who's recently saved and calling themselves prophet elijah while predicting the end times (wholly against scripture) and misquoting scripture a majority of the time. He's fixated on me and feels I should join his cult.

I guess he mistakes my kindness for weakness or something. Who knows why he thinks I would be a good candidate to serve him but this has been going on for months now. Today he told me none of my future abundance will come to pass if I don't give myself to him. I responded I have my own plans for my life and none of them include giving you authority over me. I know it won't end here so I need as much advice as I can get. He's already recruited a couple of followers and I guess that's what's given him steam. Now he desperately wants me to join his group but that is a no-go as far as I am concerned. Ultimately, I would like to see them all come to our Lord and Savior the right way. Through scripturally sound doctrine and an individual relationship with Jesus Christ. I mean before I exchanged numbers with the other members of his "cult", he jokingly said, I want you to join my cult. Really! I thought he was kidding. Being funny. He wasn't. And this isn't meds talking. This person knows exactly what he's doing. Another Jim Jones/Ricky Rodriguez in the making. I've gotten mad at this person and have blown him off so many times in the past but I can't stay angry with him bc I am genuinely forgiving and want to minister to this person out of love. However, nothing I say ever works and there is another young girl deeply involved already. So it would be irresponsible of me to dismiss this thing entirely simply because I'm wise enough to know better but she isn't. I need as much advice as I can get. I've never felt so helpless.

 

[Pal Handy]

Hypothetically speaking, if someone were trying to pressure you into joining a cult, how could you guide that person into staying on the righteous path? Keep them from being led astray? Need advice.

You cannot prevent a person from doing anything they want to do...

But....

We have weapons that we can use against the enemy...

The truth of the gospel...

I would sit down with my friend and if willing I would preach them the gospel again with the warnings of hell and the promises of eternal life.

I would give them the gospel in love but also with Christ's warnings
against those who reject Him and so reject His Father who sent Him.

I would also find some brief and concise information on the cult
that would expose the lies of that cult and I would give it to
them and ask that such an important decision requires some careful investigation.

Then I would tell them that I love them and that I will be praying that they for them to make the right choices.

THEN I WOULD PRAY...

Many say they will pray and then they drop their most powerful weapon and do nothing.

I would pray, I would ask my family to pray, I would ask the church to
pray, I would ask men and women of prayer to pray and I would
keep that person in the remembrance of the Lord.

God can do mighty things when we pray.

Many would use prayer as a last result but I think
it should be the first thing we should do.

Run to God in prayer for our loved ones, family and friends....
and even the total strangers who cut us off in traffic
or the unkind coworker and especially our enemies...

James 5:16 Confess your trespasses to one another, and pray for one another,
that you may be healed. The effective, fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.

2 Cor 5:21
For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us,
that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

 

[arj1981]

The way you phrase the question seems to imply that the individual has already joined a cult (and therefore already led astray). Don't get the question...

Good eye. That's basically what's happened.

 

[arj1981]

You cannot prevent a person from doing anything they want to do...

But....

We have weapons that we can use against the enemy...

The truth of the gospel...

I would sit down with my friend and if willing I would preach them the gospel again with the warnings of hell and the promises of eternal life.

I would give them the gospel in love but also with Christ's warnings
against those who reject Him and so reject His Father who sent Him.

I would also find some brief and concise information on the cult
that would expose the lies of that cult and I would give it to
them and ask that such an important decision requires some careful investigation.

Then I would tell them that I love them and that I will be praying that they for them to make the right choices.

THEN I WOULD PRAY...

Many say they will pray and then they drop their most powerful weapon and do nothing.

I would pray, I would ask my family to pray, I would ask the church to
pray, I would ask men and women of prayer to pray and I would
keep that person in the remembrance of the Lord.

God can do mighty things when we pray.

Many would use prayer as a last result but I think
it should be the first thing we should do.

Run to God in prayer for our loved ones, family and friends....
and even the total strangers who cut us off in traffic
or the unkind coworker and especially our enemies...

James 5:16 Confess your trespasses to one another, and pray for one another,
that you may be healed. The effective, fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.

2 Cor 5:21
For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us,
that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

Ok, PH, I'm going to pray.

 

[arj1981]

You could tell them everything that is wrong about the cult...

BUT I think it would be far more productive to ask rhetorical questions... questions like what do you do with this verse, or that verse, don't you see an inconsistency between this interpretation of scripture and that one? People in cults often shut their minds off to questioning, they merely follow. Just be prepared because they probable have semi scripted answers for common objections, so you might have to be a little bit more creative or personal to break through to them. If they have answers to the basic questions I would make them more and more complicated going as deep as you can. God's truth is truth so if you dig far enough eventually you hit it, it's just a matter of continuing to dig and sift.

You hit the nail on the head with that one. You also made some other good suggestions as well. That's basically how the conversation went. I spent quite a few hours questioning already. I questioned and the rebuttal was always the same...I know this person. I see them everyday. He's absolutely right about EVERYTHING was her exact words to me and in my mind I'm like oh no.... :o ... but I didn't reveal how paniced I was.

I even asked outright well what about the part in which he's saying he's suppose to rule over me? Without skipping a beat, she said he shared all of those words with her many times before and he's 100% right about all of it.

Do you get it? This situation is top-notch serious. It is on another level. I'm going to pray for both of them right now.

 

[arj1981]

Heavenly Father, right here and now, I pray for these two lost souls and ask that your will be done in both of their lives. Christ, please stage a miraculous intervention and call them back to you. Perverting the Word of GOD, desiring power and ruling authority over other individuals, leading others astray with heresy and false teachings is not a part of your Kingdom or the message that you preach. I know Satan played a part in this deception that is so prevalent in both of their lives; however, my GOD is greater than he who rules this earth. Therefore, by the blood of the Lamb I rebuke the stronghold Satan has over their lives and pray they are restored to their rightful owner, Jesus Christ.

I pray my brother, the prodigal son, returns to his Father’s house in humility and full of repentance. May he completely disown thoughts and desires of being Prophet Elijah PBUH and shout at the top of his lungs, Back behind me Satan!!! The devil will deceive me no more!!! anytime those thoughts try to creep back into his mind. May he remain subservient to Christ instead of ego. For scripture states, one cannot serve two masters. He will love one but hate the other. I pray he chooses GOD and Christ from now on.

I also pray for my sister in Christ as well. She has already fallen victim to this cult; however, I serve a mighty GOD and He can undo any scheme that Satan had in store for her. Heavenly Father, through the power of the blood of the Lamb, I rebuke the stronghold that Satan has over her life and I pray she is released from this bondage and finds solace and comfort in a true relationship with Jesus Christ and the Holy Bible. Jesus Christ, protect them both in their journey going forward. I pray you watch over them from here on out and bless them with humility, spiritual growth, wisdom and understanding. Amen.

If anyone wants to post any other prayers, please feel free.

 

[jehoiakim]

well it sounds more far more serious then I wanted to believe, but I cannot say I am surprised. How well does this person respect you and your opinion. As was suggested by someone else then it really seems like the point where you need to be far more direct, just make sure it is done in love. I think you need to tell them, look, I love you and respect you, I care about you, do you understand that what I am getting at is that I am quite convinced you are in a cult, being taught and spreading dangerous heresy. I know me telling you that probably makes you quite frustrated with me, but seriously has the thought ever occured to you that you might be in a cult? Have you asked yourself and allowed yourself to really evaluate the situation or are you following because you really want to believe. I think you need to say someting very clear and direct but in a loving way otherwise it is going to have the opposite effect and drive them closer to their cult

 

[arj1981]

Wow. Those are some good words. I might try that verbatim. Thanks.

 

[Pal Handy]

Heavenly Father, right here and now, I pray for these two lost souls and ask that your will be done in both of their lives. Christ, please stage a miraculous intervention and call them back to you. Perverting the Word of GOD, desiring power and ruling authority over other individuals, leading others astray with heresy and false teachings is not a part of your Kingdom or the message that you preach. I know Satan played a part in this deception that is so prevalent in both of their lives; however, my GOD is greater than he who rules this earth. Therefore, by the blood of the Lamb I rebuke the stronghold Satan has over their lives and pray they are restored to their rightful owner, Jesus Christ.

I pray my brother, the prodigal son, returns to his Father’s house in humility and full of repentance. May he completely disown thoughts and desires of being Prophet Elijah PBUH and shout at the top of his lungs, Back behind me Satan!!! The devil will deceive me no more!!! anytime those thoughts try to creep back into his mind. May he remain subservient to Christ instead of ego. For scripture states, one cannot serve two masters. He will love one but hate the other. I pray he chooses GOD and Christ from now on.

I also pray for my sister in Christ as well. She has already fallen victim to this cult; however, I serve a mighty GOD and He can undo any scheme that Satan had in store for her. Heavenly Father, through the power of the blood of the Lamb, I rebuke the stronghold that Satan has over her life and I pray she is released from this bondage and finds solace and comfort in a true relationship with Jesus Christ and the Holy Bible. Jesus Christ, protect them both in their journey going forward. I pray you watch over them from here on out and bless them with humility, spiritual growth, wisdom and understanding. Amen.

If anyone wants to post any other prayers, please feel free.

Great prayer...

I had a friend at work that was into Islam after being raised a Christian.

I witnessed to him and he only became angry (conviction).

I began to pray for him and I even called in to a late night
prayer ministry (Pastor Bogel at Night Vision) and had this
man of God pray for my friend.

The end result is that my friend believes once again in the gospel
and has turned his back on Islam.

Prayer is power and when we add a little faith, prayer is dynamite..

Keep your friends in your prayers whenever the Holy Spirit puts
them on your mind and enlist others to pray also.

Father I ask in Jesus name that you will destroy the works of the devil
in the lives of these two people. Father I ask that you would open their
eyes to see the deception and lies of the enemy. Father, I ask that
you would send others into their lives who know the truth about this false
prophet so that they can hear the truth and turn from the lies of the devil.

Father, keep them safe and bring loving Christians full of light and
your love into their lives to show them the difference between a man
who preaches deception and those that walk in the light as You
are in the light.

All this I ask in Jesus Holy name...

 

[arj1981]

Thank you so much for these kind words, Pal Handy! I feel the conviction and Spirit in your words and prayer. I've been talking with her today and for a 17 yr old this is one wise chick. Let me tell you. I took Jeh's advice and explained to her that I wasn't trying to offend her and I'm not coming from a place of jealousy, bitterness or strife and whatnot but he did tell me he wanted to make sure he kept her close so no one else could get inside her head...Get it? I told her. That's conscious manipulation, wanting to maintain power and control over you and she replied via text that she's receptive to everything I'm saying and she didn't get offended at all. She decided to pull back from the situation as well to reevaluate everything; however, there are still moments when she tries to defend his actions but she no longer believes he's prophet elijah. She outright said that today whereas it was a different story yesterday. Prayer works fast!!! I was relieved to hear that. I told her ALL cult leaders start out with rhetoric like that. Charles Mason, Jim Jones, Ricky Rodriquez, etc... All thought they were Jesus Christ the Messiah, John the Baptist, President Lincoln, or a combination of old souls, etc. That's called delusions of grandeur.

I revealed to her that his other "follower," just confessed to me that he had stated from the very beginning that he was suppose to have authority over me also. I said to her, who goes around talking about their friends like that? I certainly don't. This is abnormal behavior for sure. And if he's talking like this about me, he's saying these things about you for sure. Plus, he's stated time and time again he lusts for power and control over other people. That's nothing but the devil talking.

I continue to witness to her but I'll take all the advice I can get. This is a deeply troubling situation but I am not judging anyone involved and I strive to minister out of love, humility and forgiveness.

 

[Forealzchola]

Tell this person to leave you alone..if the cult leader is after you like this, dont take it lightly..if he doesn't leave you alone get a restraining order...and change your phone numbers...you don't want to get "caught up" trying to help someone else...cults often turn violent, physical and threatening..honestly I think you should break off contact with everyone involved.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

From the information you have told us, I would recommend that you call the police and let them in on the situation. If this guy is manipulating the women in some way for sex, money, or devotion it could be criminal to a certain extent. It wouldn't hurt to at least bring this nut-job to the attention of police, maybe they can monitor him a bit, cops have seen this thing before and it doesn't usually end well.

 

[arj1981]

Tell this person to leave you alone..if the cult leader is after you like this, dont take it lightly..if he doesn't leave you alone get a restraining order...and change your phone numbers...you don't want to get "caught up" trying to help someone else...cults often turn violent, physical and threatening..honestly I think you should break off contact with everyone involved.

See! ALL of this is too true. Every last word of it. He's already threatened me with a hex bc I wouldn't follow him or call him prophet elijah...

I have a plan for you. A role if you will, that will ultimately fulfill the dream that you are a great prophet to the world or whatever. But if you can't accept me for who I say I am then you will not find the future prophecies for yourself. The thing that makes my two so much is the fact that they follow the laws of the Bible as I teach them to. They listen to every one of the rules I give them. They are old, from the past, and this is good.

I responded: I also have a plan for my life and it doesn't include giving you authority over me.

Haven't heard from him since. I am not as feeble minded as the other two, so I will keep my phone lines open but I will back off this subject for now and remain prayerful. Thanks everyone for the advice and support and for speaking on this situation with love and kindness.

The girl in question has chosen to stand behind her leader and the other member involved even though I did point out that a lot of the things he's said and done are highly suspect. Again, that's the makings of a cult. So when you can do nothing else, stand. He's trying to appeal to my ego in this email and it isn't happening. I NEVER said I needed to be some great prophet for the world to see. Those were just words spoken onto me throughout the years way before I ever met him. So that's a big fat NO for all the world to see. I personally don't get down like that. PERIOD. First and foremost, I care about being a good Christian to my brothers and sisters in Christ and I hope to be a preacher one day upon graduation. That's about it. What GOD and Christ have in store for me after that is between me and Them. It doesn't concern anyone else, especially him. So I will keep all involved in my prayers.

 

[arj1981]

From the information you have told us, I would recommend that you call the police and let them in on the situation. If this guy is manipulating the women in some way for sex, money, or devotion it could be criminal to a certain extent. It wouldn't hurt to at least bring this nut-job to the attention of police, maybe they can monitor him a bit, cops have seen this thing before and it doesn't usually end well.

I have seen this scenario play out time and time again myself. You are right about that. Situations like this REALLY REALLY don't end well at all. I might email her this thread so she can get other people's perspectives on this issue and realize outside of those two people the avg person has an entirely different outlook on these events. It is not just me. I'll keep your other ideas in mind. Thanks SOS.

 

[pdudgeon]

one of the big differences betwen a cult and a church is that the cult leader will always point to himself and his ideas as the person to follow, while a minister of God always points us Christ.

in Christ we have freedom to be who God wants us to be, and we serve God with love. but in a cult there is no freedom but only bondage to the leader, and his followers serve him out of fear.

so ask your friend does she want to have a life of freedom and love, or does she want to live in bondage and fear.

p.s. also don't forget to give her Psalms 89:14
"Righteousness and justice are the foundation of your throne; love and faithfulness go before you."

ask her if she sees righteousness and justice in her leader, and if he exhibits love and faithfulness towards his followers.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

I might email her this thread

Good idea, this post is for your friend:

We should put our faith in NO man, they are ALL fallible, even the most charismatic and holiest are not without faults and sometimes are the worst in secret. It is fine to sit under a fallible man while in church or during some other form of teaching but where we err is when we place his (or her) word above God's. We must judge ever word that proceeds from a professed teachers mouth by the word of God. Our faith is in Christ and what He says and His word's trump everything any man will ever say.

Here are some reasons to trust in God over man:

(1) because man is weak - but God is Almighty;
(2) because man is selfish - but God is benevolent;
(3) because man is often faithless and deceitful - God never

And here are some biblical warnings and curses for those who trust in evil man over God:

"This is what the LORD says: "Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who depends on flesh for his strength and whose heart turns away from the LORD." (Jeremiah 17:5)

"It is better to take refuge in the LORD than to trust in man." (Psalm 118:8)

"Blessed is the man who makes the LORD his trust, who does not look to the proud, to those who turn aside to false gods." (Psalm 40:4)

"Do not put your trust in princes, in mortal men, who cannot save." (Psalms 146:3)

Jesus Christ must be received as Lord as well as Saviour, you are being deceived and you need Him NOW, this man will lead you into the path of destruction and eternal loss...you have been warned.

 

[arj1981]

Email I recently got from him which I am posting in hopes that she will see.

You are so sick and twisted its ridiculous! You pretend you don't have those deep down feelings and motives, but they are there and they are real. Take a look at your life. You are angry!

Of course none of this is true and he's saying that I desire power and to be in control of others simply bc he does. Basically he's projecting. But as a spiritual leader, is he proposing that I act on these thoughts and submit to them when Christ and scripture teaches us to do the exact opposite?

They seek the way of Christ and we simply talk to each other about our walk. But you couldn't handle my walk. I warned you it would be tough to handle, and you agreed to it, then bailed and tried to save me from what I need no saving.

His "walk" consists of me referring to him as prophet Elijah and submitting to him as the ultimate authority. But no. This isn't the makings of a cult.

I have a foot in Heaven, and a foot in Hell. It is not easy to be this way, but I will not release either for Good and Evil are black and white.

A Christian leader should not want to keep a "foot in hell" and associate with evil and the devil.

Christ has called to you soooooooooo many times, and he even sent me to help you.. But you will not listen to me. I have had patience with you and you have gradually seemed to get better, but you have assaulted my Lord.. You have made others to pray against my Savior.. You are now held responsible for their deaths. Go and correct the wrong you made, and I will go and confess to being a leader of a cult. Publicly repent for your wrong against Christ and tell them to repent for listening to you.

For some reason, I have wronged Christ bc I refused to acknowledge this person as prophet elijah. Then he issued orders for me to follow in order to win back my soul or else people will die. Is this not the makings of a cult? I might have to take Chola's advice on this one. These threats are getting serious. I hope she doesn't turn a blind eye to this stuff bc he will start talking this way to her next.