Creationists: can you explain post-Flood repopulation?

[AV1611VET]

If a map shows a mountain range where there is no mountain range, which is wrong? The map or the territory?

The map reader.

2 Kings 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, LORD, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the LORD opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

This verse is a classic.

It demonstrates the difference between science and reality better than anyone can imagine.

 

[Loudmouth]

The map reader.

Then you need to learn how to read the map, because your interpretation directly contradicts what is found in the territory.

 

[lifepsyop]

I think we would also be curious as to how mutation rates slowed down in all species so that the human mutation rate matched those of other modern species. What is the mechanism?

I would be curious how a human lived over 600 years as according to Genesis. I have no idea but that is one of my starting presuppositions.

As far as criticism for lacking a known mechanism, you're going to run into major double-standards with conventional scientific positions. For example, the commonly held 'nebular hypothesis', a model for the "evolution" of the solar system, is riddled with invented ad-hoc devices in order attempt to explain the origin of things by proposing mechanisms we don't see any actual evidence of today.

 

[dad]

Then you need to learn how to read the map, because your interpretation directly contradicts what is found in the territory.

There are maps of heaven maps of hell, maps of sewer plants, maps of buildings, and I guess we could even make a fishbowl map. However, referring to some little map of your limited ability to chose does not mean it is a map of all universe and time! Do you see the problem with offering a sewer map in the creation debate?

 

[AV1611VET]

Then you need to learn how to read the map, because your interpretation directly contradicts what is found in the territory.

Then keep looking.

Until you can draw a map with everything on it that is supposed to be on it, you have no point about the map not being the territory.

 

[AV1611VET]

I would be curious how a human lived over 600 years as according to Genesis.

Had the Fall not occurred, those humans would still be alive today.

 

[Loudmouth]

Then keep looking.

Until you can draw a map with everything on it that is supposed to be on it, you have no point about the map not being the territory.

You are the one whose map contradicts the territory. My map agrees with the territory.

 

[AV1611VET]

You are the one whose map contradicts the territory.

It should.

My map agrees with the territory.

Is that why Pluto was demoted and the map redrawn?

 

[Loudmouth]

It should.

What good is a map if it doesn't match the territory?

Is that why Pluto was demoted and the map redrawn?

Nothing about Pluto was redrawn. It still has the same mass, same size, same orbit, same everything.

 

[AV1611VET]

What good is a map if it doesn't match the territory?

Good question.

Your map can take a hike.

Nothing about Pluto was redrawn.

Except now the sun is where the earth used to be drawn ... right?

It still has the same mass, same size, same orbit, same everything.

Different legend though ... right?

 

[Aman777]

Do we have to assume that, per evolutionary assumptions, the genotype/phenotype of humans 4500 years ago was more or less exactly like a modern human?

*edit - also do we have to assume mutation rates were the same then as they are now?

Dear life, The first humans arrived on our planet some 10k years ago. Noah's grandsons married and produced today's humans with the prehistoric people who were already here when Noah arrived. Gen 6:4 Humans are the descendants of Adam, the common ancestor of ALL Humans. God Bless you

 

[Mr Strawberry]

It should.

Is that why Pluto was demoted and the map redrawn?

He mentioned Pluto. That means he knows he's lost.

 

[AV1611VET]

He mentioned Pluto. That means he knows he's lost.

Speaking of that, do you know why no [planetary] aliens have found us yet?

It's because we sent a faulty map into space in 1974.

The Aricebo map shows the earth as being the third planet from the sun, in a solar system consisting of nine planets.

 

[SLP]

Suit yourself.

You're the one who believes this:

... not I.

Employing the No True Scotsman Fallacy to eliminate valid responses is your bane, not mine.

I don't think you know what the No True Scotsman fallacy is.

Beyond that, a bible verse is still not an explanation, it is not evidence.

 

[SLP]

Are you kidding?

Faith in these verses is not only what starts these debates, but keeps them going.

Not kidding at all.

In a discussion in which tangible evidence and testable explanations are being discussed, spewing a bible verse when you cannot present anything valid is a clear demonstration of failure. It is like bringing a knife to a gun fight.

 

[SLP]

Do we have to assume that, per evolutionary assumptions, the genotype/phenotype of humans 4500 years ago was more or less exactly like a modern human?

No, we have to assume that any actual attempts at genetics-based explanations for biological phenomena have supporting evidence in their favor.

*edit - also do we have to assume mutation rates were the same then as they are now?

If one is going to posit drastically different mutation rates, then one will need to provide a rationale and corroborating evidence, not mere 'what ifs' or assertions.

 

[AV1611VET]

Not kidding at all.

In a discussion in which tangible evidence and testable explanations are being discussed, spewing a bible verse when you cannot present anything valid is a clear demonstration of failure. It is like bringing a knife to a gun fight.

Then you haven't seen my apple challenge, have you?

What "tangible evidence and testable explanation" would you present to explain creatio ex nihilo?

As I have said before, evidence would just make things worse.

Did you know that when Moses died, God buried him, not man?

Deuteronomy 30:5 So Moses the servant of the LORD died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the LORD.
Deuteronomy 30:6 And he buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, over against Bethpeor: but no man knoweth of his sepulchre unto this day.

Later, when Satan tried to get to it, Michael wouldn't contend with him, but called on God to do so.

Jude 9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

 

[SLP]

Then you haven't seen my apple challenge, have you?

What "tangible evidence and testable explanation" would you present to explain creatio ex nihilo?

As I have said before, evidence would just make things worse.

Did you know that when Moses died, God buried him, not man?

No, I do not know that. Neither do you. There is no corroboration but a story of dubious origin.

You are correct that evidence makes it worse. For you.

 

[SLP]

I would be curious how a human lived over 600 years as according to Genesis. I have no idea but that is one of my starting presuppositions.

How telling.

My presuppositions are:

The universe exists

It is amenable to being understood

We have the ability to understand




Isn't it weird? I do not presuppose that ancient middle eastern tall tales are correct and then try to find ways to support that presupposition. I must be the devil.

 

[AV1611VET]

No, I do not know that.

Then let me spell it out for you.

There is no scientific evidence for the claims in the Bible -- none.

But that certainly won't stop you guys from demanding it, will it?

I saw a kid the other day in the store screaming for a Johnny Seven OMA at the top of his lungs, while his mother told him the store doesn't have those; and it reminded me of how scientists act.