Creationist Arguments Against ERV's

[Aman777]

Mutations aren't evil at all. They are a necessary part of a species survival and they are entirely natural and happen in your body all the time and every time reproduction occurs. Mutation doesn't mean imperfection, it just means when the DNA is changed. If you still think mutations are evil, that means that either you believe God created something evil, or you credit Satan with an incredible amount of power being able to changed the biochemistry of all life on Earth - a change which actually helps life!

Evolutionists CLAIM that mutations produced Human intelligence in prehistoric people ONE TIME and can never be repeated. Can you show us that mutations produced Adam's superior intelligence? Of course not, since Adam was made with an intelligence like God's. Gen 3:22

Adam was formed on the 3rd Day and lived some 13.8 Billion years, in man's time, since the Big Bang of our cosmos was on the SAME Day. Adam didn't have any mutations since he was made to live forever. In Heaven we will have perfect bodies, like Adam had, and we will live FOREVER with NO mutations. Mutations are of this Earth and satan is responsible. Amen?

 

[Loudmouth]

It is not the creationists that base their whole theory on mutations and virus. We know God does not create mutations and virus so this has to be evidence for the fallen condition of Creation.

Please, show us the evidence that led to that knowledge. Or are you saying that it is based solely on faith?

So the bottom line is that Evolutionary theory has more holes in it that swiss cheeze and it is the evolutionists themselves poking the holes in their own theory.

You haven't presented anything that pokes holes in the ERV evidence.

 

[Loudmouth]

Evolutionists CLAIM that mutations produced Human intelligence in prehistoric people ONE TIME and can never be repeated. Can you show us that mutations produced Adam's superior intelligence? Of course not, since Adam was made with an intelligence like God's. Gen 3:22

Adam was formed on the 3rd Day and lived some 13.8 Billion years, in man's time, since the Big Bang of our cosmos was on the SAME Day. Adam didn't have any mutations since he was made to live forever. In Heaven we will have perfect bodies, like Adam had, and we will live FOREVER with NO mutations. Mutations are of this Earth and satan is responsible. Amen?

ERV's are the topic.

 

[Loudmouth]

We are not talking about apologetics, we are talking about why the theory of evolution has a lot of nonsense in it.

With reference to the argument based on ERV evidence, what exactly is nonsense?

 

[lasthero]

We know God does not create mutations and virus

'We' know no such thing. You don't either, for that matter. Who are you to say what God does and does not do?

 

[Loudmouth]

So we are on the same page, could you tell me what chapter you are referring to in the Biology book so I can look it up and see what your talking about. I do not want a random reference on the internet, I want something that has found it's way into the text books. Right now I need to see what your talking about that mutations are the driving force behind evolution. From what I understand the retro virus are just markers and now shown to be a cause of evolution.

With reference to ERV's, we can make some predictions about mutations. Since the distribution of a specific orthologous ERV can be used to predict when it entered a specific lineage, we can also predict relative divergence of ERV sequences.

"Third, sequence divergence between the LTRs at the ends of a given provirus provides an important and unique source of phylogenetic information. The LTRs are created during reverse transcription to regenerate cis-acting elements required for integration and transcription. Because of the mechanism of reverse transcription, the two LTRs must be identical at the time of integration, even if they differed in the precursor provirus (Fig. 1A). Over time, they will diverge in sequence because of substitutions, insertions, and deletions acquired during cellular DNA replication."
http://www.pnas.org/content/96/18/10254.full

The LTRs (Long Tandem Repeats) are like bookends for the viral genome.

One LTR is copied to make the other LTR when the virus inserts into the host genome. This means that the LTRs have identical sequence when the ERV is brand new. If the theory of evolution is true, then there should be no selective pressure that would try to keep those LTRs the same over time since there is no known function for doing so. Therefore, the longer an ERV is in a genome the more differences there should be between the LTRs.

What do we see? Exactly that, as these phylogenies based on orthologous ERV's demonstrate:

http://www.pnas.org/content/96/18/10254.full

When we use LTR divergence to create phylogenies they match the phylogenies based on morphology. This is yet another powerful piece of ERV evidence demonstrating common ancestry and the accumulation of mutations over time.

 

[Aman777]

ERV's are the topic.

My point is that Evolutionists are obviously WRONG about magical mutations changing prehistoric people into Humans. Since they CANNOT support their views nor repeat the process, WHY should we believe anything else they Falsely ASSUME, including ERVs? The only people who would swallow such foolishness are the little children Evolutionists are poisoning with their views in the Public Schools. It's a shame. Amen?

 

[Loudmouth]

I believe that mutations are the work of Satan. I think science does not know enough about ervs to pass judgement on them yet. The jury is still out on this one.

This is a thread about scientific evidence, not beliefs. Do you have any scientific evidence?

 

[Loudmouth]

I have NO problem with evolution or the changes in the allele frequency in a population over time. I get a flu shot every year. My problem is with the False Teaching of Evolution which claims that Humans evolved from the common ancestor of Apes. That is the biggest Lie ever told in the History of Human civilization since Humans were made Billions of years BEFORE any other living creature. Amen?

Please show me a single thing that I have said about ERV's that isn't true.

 

[joshua 1 9]

'We' know no such thing. You don't either, for that matter. Who are you to say what God does and does not do?

I am someone that read the Bible. It does not matter because a lot of what they call mutations are not mutations at all. For example frameshift are clearly not mutations, but evolutions try to claim they are in an attempt to substantiate their theory. It seems fairly universal that everyone believes in evolution and yet no one seems to know what it is or agree on how evolution works.

 

[Loudmouth]

Since they CANNOT support their views nor repeat the process, WHY should we believe anything else they Falsely ASSUME, including ERVs?

I have shown how the process of creating ERV's is readily observable and repeatable. All of the evidence I have presented is observable and repeatable.

 

[joshua 1 9]

This is a thread about scientific evidence, not beliefs. Do you have any scientific evidence?

I am still waiting for you to tell me what chapter we are on in the Biology book. I do not want to discuss all the unedited nonsense that we find on the internet, I want to stick to the book.

 

[bhsmte]

I am someone that read the Bible. It does not matter because a lot of what they call mutations are not mutations at all. For example frameshift are clearly not mutations, but evolutions try to claim they are in an attempt to substantiate their theory. It seems fairly universal that everyone believes in evolution and yet no one seems to know what it is or agree on how evolution works.

You keep making blanket statements, with no evidence to support them.

 

[Loudmouth]

It does not matter because a lot of what they call mutations are not mutations at all. For example frameshift are clearly not mutations, but evolutions try to claim they are in an attempt to substantiate their theory.

A frameshift mutation is an insertion or deletion of DNA. That results in a change in DNA sequence which is a mutation by definition.

"In biology, a mutation is a permanent change of the nucleotide sequence of the genome of an organism, virus, or extrachromosomal DNA or other genetic elements."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation

It seems fairly universal that everyone believes in evolution and yet no one seems to know what it is or agree on how evolution works.

The only one who seems confused is you.

 

[bhsmte]

I am still waiting for you to tell me what chapter we are on in the Biology book. I do not want to discuss all the unedited nonsense that we find on the internet, I want to stick to the book.

He has provided you evidence, but it appears, you have a habit of ignoring this evidence.

 

[joshua 1 9]

You keep making blanket statements, with no evidence to support them.

I am still waiting for someone to tell me what chapter we read about mutations in the Biology book so that we are on the same page. Then I can present evidence to support my claims.

 

[Loudmouth]

I am still waiting for you to tell me what chapter we are on in the Biology book. I do not want to discuss all the unedited nonsense that we find on the internet, I want to stick to the book.

I am citing peer reviewed primary research papers which is the "book" of biology.

 

[joshua 1 9]

The only one who seems confused is you.

You seem to be confused, all I am asking is what Chapter we are on in the Biology book.

 

[bhsmte]

I am still waiting for someone to tell me what chapter we read about mutations in the Biology book so that we are on the same page. Then I can present evidence to support my claims.

The evidence has been provided to you. Do you know what evidence is?

And why would you be dependent on what someone else does, to provide evidence for your own claims?

 

[joshua 1 9]

I am citing peer reviewed primary research papers which is the "book" of biology.

I do not care about peer reviewed anything. I want to know what is in the text book. I want to know what is required reading to get a degree.