Creation Date

[AV1611VET]

indeed.
And more than feet.

That's not the way Christianity works.

Maybe that's the way the world wants you think, but it's not God's way.

 

[Mr Laurier]

That's not the way Christianity works.

Its the way it worked for over 1400 years

Maybe that's the way the world wants you think, but it's not God's way.

The world has never suggested anything to me.
A plain reading of the bible however, led me to try to justify the horrors of the Holy Inquisition.

 

[AV1611VET]

Its the way it worked for over 1400 years.

Ya? then what happened?

Did real Christians show up and put an end to it?

The world has never suggested anything to me.

Don't kid yourself.

A plain reading of the bible however, led me to try to justify the horrors of the Holy Inquisition.

And you couldn't justify it, could you?

I can't either.

 

[Mr Laurier]

Ya? then what happened?

The west turned secular, and the power of religion was revolked

Did real Christians show up and put an end to it?

No. Real atheists put an end to it, and slapped the real christians... who were howling with rage at their right to burn people being taken away.

Don't kid yourself.

I never do

And you couldn't justify it, could you?

BINGO.
And guess why that is.

I can't either.

And yet you try

 

[AV1611VET]

And yet you try.

Don't kid yourself.

Maybe if you posted here more often -- like I wish you would -- you'd get to know me better?

Instead of your post-and-run nonsense.

 

[Mr Laurier]

Don't kid yourself.

Maybe if you posted here more often -- like I wish you would -- you'd get to know me better?

Instead of your post-and-run nonsense.

Wow, So now you are making me up from scratch.

 

[Paul4JC]

Hi, nice to meet you.

Indulge me a full minute (all the way through). Have a look:

From Strong's (your link):
" râqîyaʻ, raw-kee'-ah; from H7554; properly, an expanse, i.e. the firmament or (apparently) visible arch of the sky:—firmament."

Firmament:
noun
the heavens or the sky

Sky:
noun
the region of the atmosphere and outer space seen from the earth

As also from the Pulpit Commentary at Bible Hub for
Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

"The heavens and the earth (i.e. mundus universus - Gesenius, Kalisch, etc. Cf. Genesis 2:1; Genesis 14:19, 22; Psalm 115:15; Jeremiah 23:24. The earth and the heavens always mean the terrestrial globe with its aerial firmament. Cf. Genesis 2:4; Psalm 148:13; Zechariah 5:9). The earth here alluded to is manifestly not the dry land (ver. 10), which was not separated from the waters till the third day, but the entire mass of which our planet is composed, including the superincumbent atmosphere..."

You skipped one part...

STRONGS H7549:
† רָקִיעַ noun masculineGenesis 1:6 extended surface, (solid) expanse (as if beaten out; compare Job 37:18); — absolute ר׳

 

[Paul4JC]

What story of Babel?

Is Genesis 11 missing in your Bible?

 

[Paul4JC]

What was that original language?

I guess you have no interest in etymology.

 

[AV1611VET]

I guess you have no interest in etymology.

Genesis 11:1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

I don't need an interest in etymology to ascertain it was Jacobean English.

If you need an interest though, would you please tell me what language that interest has led you?

Thanks.

 

[AV1611VET]

Is Genesis 11 missing in your Bible?

No.

 

[Halbhh]

You skipped one part...

STRONGS H7549:
† רָקִיעַ noun masculineGenesis 1:6 extended surface, (solid) expanse (as if beaten out; compare Job 37:18); — absolute ר׳

Indeed, the firmament, I learned almost 45 years ago now, can be either a) the ground, which is firm, or b) the sky, the stars...

That's always been the meaning for me since I learned in youth from probably a Webster's dictionary. So, for a very long time, very long, in English usage, it has meant those, so that translators, having a choice of words to translate into, choose firmament in English as the prime choice, and the typical understanding of anyone I ever talked to is that verse 1 is describing the creation of all the entirety of the cosmos, not merely Earth alone. So, instead of pointing to say a given viewpoint some had at some given moment in time as representing the only understanding we can have -- which would be like saying that since some believed in flat Earth that would mean flat Earth is the only valid understanding... we can instead recognize that believers very often few or none understand something in scripture, just as for instance the disciples did not understand some things in Isaiah for example, so that Christ had to explain the scripture to them and make them begin to understand the words they had always know since their youths no doubt, but did not understand until He taught them.

 

[Halbhh]

No.
I know it is a plagiarized myth.

Funny thing about claiming various flood stories are plagiarized myths is it tends to remind us that giant floods actually happen....

Just as we read in the news in recent years of "100 year flood" or "500 year flood", there is statistically a 5,000 or 10,000 year level, of course.
.

So many stories that are similar suggest not a myth, but a real event.

 

[Paul4JC]

Genesis 11:1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

I don't need an interest in etymology to ascertain it was Jacobean English.

If you need an interest though, would you please tell me what language that interest has led you?

Thanks.

An event of Biblical proportion and you skip over it? One word "was" the way of life for all. Imagine that! No translation was needed. So, "was" whatever that language was, it was no more. [Gen 11:6-9 NIV] The LORD said, "If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them. 7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other." 8 So the LORD scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city. 9 That is why it was called Babel--because there the LORD confused the language of the whole world. From there the LORD scattered them over the face of the whole earth. This was a "global" or "universal" event. Yet you keep trivializing it. Why did God do this? Just to mess with us? What was the result? Mass communication breakdown. Starting all over for many. Everywhere new cultures, traditions, and mythologies (true stories) emerged.

Take the Noah's Ark myth. How many are there? Are they all false or do they have some truth in them? About 80 are here... List of flood myths - Wikipedia They were not making money from this, since plagiarism probably didn't exist. Yet there is total confusion. Don't you think it's important what a word meant when the writer wrote it, or do you prefer to pick and choose what it meant? It's not about interest in language (though I know 5) its about the meaning of words. It's about what they meant when they wrote those words. If you don't care, you will fall into error and false doctrines. Words are very important.

[1Ti 4:16 NIV] Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers.

Jesus said, [Mat 12:36-37 NIV] But I tell you that everyone will have to give account on the day of judgment for every empty word they have spoken. 37 For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

[Heb 4:12 NIV] For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

Have you ever read Peace Child? How the gospel was embraced by former headhunting, cannibal tribes, through communication in their own cultural, and linguistic setting. Language and etymology were critically important.
Sawi people - Wikipedia

The endless Babel of this world has to be undone for people of whatever background culture, tradition, and language are to understand the glory of Christ Jesus. His Gospel is the only hope and answer.

 

[AV1611VET]

Genesis 11:1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

I don't need an interest in etymology to ascertain it was Jacobean English.

If you need an interest though, would you please tell me what language that interest has led you?

Thanks.

An event of Biblical proportion and you skip over it? One word "was" the way of life for all. Imagine that! No translation was needed. So, "was" whatever that language was, it was no more. [Gen 11:6-9 NIV] The LORD said, "If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them. 7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other." 8 So the LORD scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city. 9 That is why it was called Babel--because there the LORD confused the language of the whole world. From there the LORD scattered them over the face of the whole earth. This was a "global" or "universal" event. Yet you keep trivializing it. Why did God do this? Just to mess with us? What was the result? Mass communication breakdown. Starting all over for many. Everywhere new cultures, traditions, and mythologies (true stories) emerged.

Take the Noah's Ark myth. How many are there? Are they all false or do they have some truth in them? About 80 are here... List of flood myths - Wikipedia They were not making money from this, since plagiarism probably didn't exist. Yet there is total confusion. Don't you think it's important what a word meant when the writer wrote it, or do you prefer to pick and choose what it meant? It's not about interest in language (though I know 5) its about the meaning of words. It's about what they meant when they wrote those words. If you don't care, you will fall into error and false doctrines. Words are very important.

[1Ti 4:16 NIV] Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers.

Jesus said, [Mat 12:36-37 NIV] But I tell you that everyone will have to give account on the day of judgment for every empty word they have spoken. 37 For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

[Heb 4:12 NIV] For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

Have you ever read Peace Child? How the gospel was embraced by former headhunting, cannibal tribes, through communication in their own cultural, and linguistic setting. Language and etymology were critically important.
Sawi people - Wikipedia

The endless Babel of this world has to be undone for people of whatever background culture, tradition, and language are to understand the glory of Christ Jesus. His Gospel is the only hope and answer.

I'm going to assume you don't have an answer and move on.

 

[Paul4JC]

I'm going to assume you don't have an answer and move on.

Is this the way to dialogue that am I just supposed to answer your questions and follow your narrative? Your attempt to reduce a whole chapter of the Bible to one verse is a totally improper way of interpreting scripture. If you had a point to make, you failed to do it.

 

[AV1611VET]

Is this the way to dialogue that am I just supposed to answer your questions and follow your narrative? Your attempt to reduce a whole chapter of the Bible to one verse is a totally improper way of interpreting scripture. If you had a point to make, you failed to do it.

Don't just tell me what they didn't speak; tell me what they did speak.

Or I'll just assume you're saying I'm wrong on principle.

At least speculate -- give me SOMETHING that I can respect.

 

[Astrid]

Funny thing about claiming various flood stories are plagiarized myths is it tends to remind us that giant floods actually happen....

Just as we read in the news in recent years of "100 year flood" or "500 year flood", there is statistically a 5,000 or 10,000 year level, of course.
.

So many stories that are similar suggest not a myth, but a real event.

Suggest, sure.
There are many many accounts of mermaids. Etc.

Now while you cannot really prove that there are no mermaids, it is clearly not a reasonable belief.

In the case of "flood", it's fine to investigate a bit. Not because it is a reasonable belief, but, why not.
"Suggests" is a weak reed against proof.
Are you aware of the many and simple ways to disprove the flood story?

 

[AV1611VET]

Are you aware of the many and simple ways to disprove the flood story?

Ya -- just say it didn't happen and be done with it.

You know? on paper.

Easy peasy.

But don't come crying to us, when you find out later you were wrong.

 

[Paul4JC]

Don't just tell me what they didn't speak; tell me what they did speak.

Or I'll just assume you're saying I'm wrong on principle.

At least speculate -- give me SOMETHING that I can respect.

Which principle? Is it plagiarism? What is your method of Bible interpretation?