Created to Be His Help-Meet

[rosalind110]

Point well taken. It certainly does sound like submission, but, knowing the lifestyle involved, I'm of the opinion that it's not biblical submission when a wife in this type of marriage who did not complete an expectation might receive a spanking or corner time. And! That is not biblical no matter on what side of the submission discussion one finds herself or himself.

See, we can pull out all the Bible verses we choose, compare translation after translation, discuss all we want, but we won't find any verse, telling, inferring, or implying that a husband is to physically punish his wife.

We could go to the Debate Forum and debate the practice, but to me, we can't compare a submission that includes spanking an adult for disobedience, no matter if it's consensual, to any kind of submission in the Bible whether unilateral or mutual.

End of opinion.

Since this seems me to be a somewhat judgemental and argumentative post, for a forum on which debate is not supposed to be a feature, I hope that the moderators will forgive me if I, in the spirit of defence, address the controversial subject that has been resurrected and dragged into an unrelated discussion.

The point of my post is very simple. While both luvsmyhubby and I have openly stated that we are in DD marriages and have tried to explain how they work for us, neither we nor any other CF poster who practises DD, have at any point claimed that it is 'biblical'. The reason for this is that none of us believe that it is. Each of us has asserted repeatedly and politely on the forums that we are loving Christian couples who happen to practise DD and that we are in full knowledge and agreement that there is nothing in the scriptures that comes close to advocating physical discipline for wives.

Despite this, and despite the fact that we are not interested in trying to indoctrinate other people in favour of a DD lifestyle and are perfectly willing to keep to the subjects currently under discussion, poster after poster dredges the up the question of DD and drags it into new and unrelated discussions and poster after poster resurrects the 'not biblical' precept as if we were arguing against it.

If people would just stop doing this, then perhaps we could conduct a real and relevant discussion about the subjects in hand and stay away from the rude remarks and personal insults that inevitably follow these anti DD tirades.

My apologies to anyone who is upset by this, and, moderators, I will unsubscribe from both this thread and from CF as a whole if that is what you wish, but I think that this needed to be said.

Edit to the above:- ProfessorMom has referred me to luvsmyhubby's initial post to the forum, in which she in fact did refer to her way of life as 'Christian Domestic Discipline'. I am not sure whether this was meant to imply that it was a biblical precept, or whether she simply meant it as a way of saying that she and her husband are a couple in a Christian marriage who practise DD, and I will leave luvsmyhubby herself to address this point. However out of fairness and respect to ProfessorMom, I retract my accusation that she 'misrepresented' the position of DD practioners with respect to biblical endorsement, and also my claim that no CF forum poster has ever said that DD is biblical. My apologies to her on both counts.

With regard to rest of my post, I stand by the points that I made on the grounds that in my opinion, and I stress mine alone the matter of DD wasunnecessarily raised in an unrelated discussion, and this did seem claculated to redirect the thread into a less than positive area.

 

[LiberatedChick]

That was so nice to read. So, would you say there more of a mutual submission, or do I misunderstand.

Yep.

 

[luvmyhubby]

Point taken that you did not mention DD in this particular post, but you have discussed it on this thread, and defended its practice here as well as in the Debate Forum.


Point well taken. It certainly does sound like submission, but, knowing the lifestyle involved, I'm of the opinion that it's not biblical submission when a wife in this type of marriage who did not complete an expectation might receive a spanking or corner time. And! That is not biblical no matter on what side of the submission discussion one finds herself or himself.

See, we can pull out all the Bible verses we choose, compare translation after translation, discuss all we want, but we won't find any verse, telling, inferring, or implying that a husband is to physically punish his wife.

We could go to the Debate Forum and debate the practice, but to me, we can't compare a submission that includes spanking an adult for disobedience, no matter if it's consensual, to any kind of submission in the Bible whether unilateral or mutual.

I intentionally did not bring up DD in my original post because I did not want to start a debate. And once more, words have been put in my mouth. I have NEVER said that the lifestyle my husband and I have chosen is Biblical submission. Nor has any other poster in this discussion. It appears that an argument wants to be had here, and I am sorry, but I am not going to bite. I have throughout this thread intentionally made statements like "I am not going to discuss that" because frankly I am not interested in "debating" it. I have never said that all wives who submit should practice DD, nor have I even hinted at such a thing. I made NO references whatsoever to DD and Biblical submission. And my original post has absolutely NOTHING to do with how my husband and I choose to live in the privacy of our own homes. It was a post in which I was discussing the possiblitly of mutual submission and explaining how I believe submission can go deeper than mutual respect. Just because I practice DD does not mean that my entire being centers around it - I do have opinions that have nothing to do with DD, and this is one of them. It appears some will discount everything I say simply because it is known how I live. That is sad.

 

[luvmyhubby]

Edit to the above:- ProfessorMom has referred me to luvsmyhubby's initial post to the forum, in which she in fact did refer to her way of life as 'Christian Domestic Discipline'. I am not sure whether this was meant to imply that it was a biblical precept, or whether she simply meant it as a way of saying that she and her husband are a couple in a Christian marriage who practise DD, and I will leave luvsmyhubby herself to address this point. However out of fairness and respect to ProfessorMom, I retract my accusation that she 'misrepresented' the position of DD practioners with respect to biblical endorsement, and also my claim that no CF forum poster has ever said that DD is biblical. My apologies to her on both counts.

I am pasting part of a post I made on the Ethics and Morality thread entitled "Submission not DD". It should clear up my stand on Biblical submission as it relates (or rather does not relate) to DD. I would also like to point out once again that at no time in this discussion did I initiate the subject of DD. Had I posted the same things under a different name, no one would have made the connection between me and the fact that I live in a DD relationship. I make no apologies for what I have stated, because I do not believe that my DD relationship should have been an issue in the post that I made regarding the meaning of submission. I also maintain that at NO TIME did I EVER state that DD is Biblical. My reference to Christian DD, which was taken from another thread altogether and not this one, simply refers to the fact that I am a Christian who practices DD, not that I practice DD because I am a Christian. Here is what I said in my other post:

I think there may be some confusion in terminology here. My husband and I practice DD. And we are Christians. We do not practice DD because we are Christians. We just happen to be Christians who practice DD. When people use the term "Christian DD" I think it is referring to Christians who practice DD, not to a beilief that the Bible says a man should use physical punishment on his wife. Some people would say that there are verses supporting the use of physical punishment. I am not familiar enough with these verses to support that belief. There are a number of people who practice DD who say they are not Christians, too. So it is not a "Christian lifestyle".

If anyone would like to see the post in its entirety, it is post # 75/ Ethics and Morality; "Submission not DD".

 

[suzybeezy]

Closing thread pending staff review and to give everyone some time to cool off.