Could Native Americans back then be saved?

DevinCamary

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My mind has been going over this question from time to time. In the Americas, Natives probably haven't heard of Christ at all until settlers came around 1490. And after that, other conquests that weren't... the best... ANYWAYS, I was wondering if Jesus would have an impact on those who were in the Americas. Would they be judged based off action? Did any of them have a theology similar to Christianity or Judaism? Did God have an impact over in the Americas before?
 

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If the answer were yes, then there would be evidence of Christianity among the tribes before the settlers landed. The best hope anyone has if they hadn't heard the Gospel in this life is that they will hear it and have a fair chance to accept or reject it before beginning the next one. But we don't know that they even have that.

In any case, the dead are dead, and we cannot change their fate. No reason to stress over what cannot be changed. If this is a concern, get qualified to be a missionary, and share the Gospel with those who have never heard it.
 
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HTacianas

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My mind has been going over this question from time to time. In the Americas, Natives probably haven't heard of Christ at all until settlers came around 1490. And after that, other conquests that weren't... the best... ANYWAYS, I was wondering if Jesus would have an impact on those who were in the Americas. Would they be judged based off action? Did any of them have a theology similar to Christianity or Judaism? Did God have an impact over in the Americas before?

See Romans 2:12-16
 
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Dave-W

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They could have been saved- everyone who has never heard of Christ can be saved by their ignorance, assuming that they live rather morally and seek God with an honest heart.
There is absolutely no scripture to support that opinion.
 
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sdowney717

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They could have been saved- everyone who has never heard of Christ can be saved by their ignorance, assuming that they live rather morally and seek God with an honest heart.
Not in this New Covenant.

Support this antichrist stand with scripture, and lets see why you think this way.
An antichrist says Christ is not needed as the way truth life to get to the Father.
'No one comes to the Father except by Me' is what Christ said.
People who try to enter into the sheepfold by another way are thieves and robbers, basically satanically inspired. Christ is the DOOR. If anyone enters by Him they shall be saved. Christ is the door of the sheep.

But an antichrist will deny the Father and the Son, both.
John 10:1
[ Jesus the True Shepherd ] “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who does not enter the sheepfold by the door, but climbs up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

John 10:7
[ Jesus the Good Shepherd ] Then Jesus said to them again, “Most assuredly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
John 10:9
I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
 
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Chinchilla

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They could have been saved- everyone who has never heard of Christ can be saved by their ignorance, assuming that they live rather morally and seek God with an honest heart.

That would mean sending missionaries is worst thing you can do , we should build walls around them so they can be kept in ignorance .

God said they are without excuse because of creation
 
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Small Fish

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I believe that would be decided on Judgment day. God is a righteous judge after all. The problem however is that no person has a default right to Eternal Life. Eternal Life is given by God's Sovereign Grace. So nobody really has a foot to stand on. God would not be wrong if all of humanity is lost. So who are we to complain or judge?

But, If we recognize and come by God's provided way, then yes, you have a right to Eternal Life merely because God designed it to be that way and invited us to it.

Even so, those tribes might find some form of grace by God even though they never heard the Gospel.

John 3:17
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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The Lakota concept of the Great Spirit or Wakan Tanka, was conceived as compatible with Catholicism by the Jesuits that first visited them. There is some debate, as some anthropologists see them as animistic, others as monotheistic, but the fact that Jesuits were willing to incorporate the concept, going so far as to argue the Lakota were the equivalent of the centurion Cornelius, is telling.
 
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sdowney717

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I believe that would be decided on Judgment day. God is a righteous judge after all. The problem however is that no person has a default right to Eternal Life. Eternal Life is given by God's Sovereign Grace. So nobody really has a foot to stand on. God would not be wrong if all of humanity is lost. So who are we to complain or judge?

But, If we recognize and come by God's provided way, then yes, you have a right to Eternal Life merely because God designed it to be that way and invited us to it.

Even so, those tribes might find some form of grace by God even though they never heard the Gospel.

John 3:17
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
It is right there in v17, it is only through Christ that people might be saved.
 
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sdowney717

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The Lakota concept of the Great Spirit or Wakan Tanka, was conceived as compatible with Catholicism by the Jesuits that first visited them. There is some debate, as some anthropologists see them as animistic, others as monotheistic, but the fact that Jesuits were willing to incorporate the concept, going so far as to argue the Lakota were the equivalent of the centurion Cornelius, is telling.
And what happens with Cornelius??
God sent to them Peter who preached what exactly?
Well they go to hear about Christ.

Are you an also an antichrist?
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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And what happens with Cornelius??
God sent to them Peter who preached what exactly?
Well they go to hear about Christ.

Are you an also an antichrist?
What are you going on about? I was merely sharing an historical anecdote about Jesuit views of Wakan Tanka of the Lekota. They saw the same relation as Cornelius, a Metuentes or God-fearer, that the Lekota were uniquely prepared to receive the Gospel.
 
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My mind has been going over this question from time to time. In the Americas, Natives probably haven't heard of Christ at all until settlers came around 1490. And after that, other conquests that weren't... the best... ANYWAYS, I was wondering if Jesus would have an impact on those who were in the Americas. Would they be judged based off action? Did any of them have a theology similar to Christianity or Judaism? Did God have an impact over in the Americas before?
The Native Americans in Massachusetts taught the Pilgrims in Plymouth how to plant corn. They did not have the Gospels until after European settlers arrived.
 
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sdowney717

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What are you going on about? I was merely sharing an historical anecdote about Jesuit views of Wakan Tanka of the Lekota. They saw the same relation as Cornelius, a Metuentes or God-fearer, that the Lekota were uniquely prepared to receive the Gospel.
What are you going on about? Your post said these Indians were like Cornelius and used the jesuit commentary as support of that view. Anyone reading it would assume that is your view also, or why bring it up at all!

So are you also an antichrist?
 
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JoeP222w

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My mind has been going over this question from time to time. In the Americas, Natives probably haven't heard of Christ at all until settlers came around 1490. And after that, other conquests that weren't... the best... ANYWAYS, I was wondering if Jesus would have an impact on those who were in the Americas. Would they be judged based off action? Did any of them have a theology similar to Christianity or Judaism? Did God have an impact over in the Americas before?

The Native American (what does "Native" American even mean?) is accountable before God, just as all mankind is. They are without excuse.

Romans 1:18-25 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. (19) For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. (20) For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. (21) For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. (22) Claiming to be wise, they became fools, (23) and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. (24) Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, (25) because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.
 
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Shiloh Raven

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First question: Is anyone here an actual Native American?

Second question: Did you know that there's a low percentage of NDNs who are Christian?

Third question: Did you know that there is a deep feeling of animosity among many NDNs toward (European descent) Christians and many NDNs actually despise the Christian religion?

Fourth question: Has anyone here even considered the residual effects of cultural genocide that still exist among many NDNs because of the Christian based American Indian Boarding Schools?

Historical trauma and International trauma are the perpetual results of the once "Kill the Indian, Save the Man" (European descent) Christian crusade and the horrific cultural genocide still effects many NDNs today. I can provide numerous well documented articles to fully substantiate this fact.

My advise to you, as a direct descendant of the Cherokee and Choctaw of Oklahoma, tread lightly here and have compassion and understanding toward what I shared with you above. I will also ask you not talk about the ancient spirituality of my NDN ancestors if you know absolutely nothing about the spiritual beliefs of any of the tribes. You should also be aware that the spiritual beliefs from each of the tribes varies. NDN spirituality is very sacred and its beliefs are not usually shared with strangers, meaning anyone outside of that particular tribe. NDN spirtuality doesn't evangelize like Christianity.

If you have a calling to evangelize NDNs and share the gospel with them, I suggest you also tread lightly because it is possible that you will be met with some deep animosity and hostility. There are many NDN circles that I'm a part of where talking about anything having to do with Christianity is not allowed or even remotely tolerated. Christianity is called the "white man's religion" and it is deeply despised. There is also a derogatory name that some NDNs have given to other NDNs who have accepted the Christian religion and that name is "white man's apple," which means red on the outside, but white on the inside. I have heard this name used to insult NDNs who are considered too friendly with white people. I know how terrible all of this sounds, but it is a result of more than 500 years of cultural genocide NDNs have had to deal with concerning white people and their Christian religion.

Once again, I can provide numerous articles about the Historical trauma and Intergenerational trauma among NDNs, if it is necessary to substantiate the existence of these traumas. I'm sharing this song to give you a sense of what cultural genocide has done to NDNs and how the residual effects of that cultural genocide still haunts NDNs today. Please listen to the song and take its words to heart.

 
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sdowney717

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The Native American (what does "Native" American even mean?) is accountable before God, just as all mankind is. They are without excuse.

Romans 1:18-25 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. (19) For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. (20) For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. (21) For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. (22) Claiming to be wise, they became fools, (23) and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. (24) Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, (25) because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

Yes, all have sinned, and only in Christ is preached forgiveness of sins.

There are many many many many antichrists today, more than in the first days of the church.

It is interesting to note Paul the apostle in Romans 1 says the gentiles are without excuse and then for the antichrist people (false teachers) to say Romans 2 allows unbelievers to enter heaven because their conscience (thoughts) excuses them for their ignorance about Christ.

I did not know we are saved by our thoughts!
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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What are you going on about? Your post said these Indians were like Cornelius and used the jesuit commentary as support of that view. Anyone reading it would assume that is your view also, or why bring it up at all!

So are you also an antichrist?
I nowhere gave my own view, but mentioned the Jesuits' views in reference to the debate over animism vs monotheism for the Great Spirit of the Lakota. I brought it up as an interesting position taken by a major Christian religious order as to a native religious tradition.

I do not know enough about it myself to comment further thereon. Please stop casting aspersions.
 
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sdowney717

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I nowhere gave my own view, but mentioned the Jesuits' views in reference to the debate over animism vs monotheism for the Great Spirit of the Lakota. I brought it up as an interesting position taken by a major Christian religious order as to a native religious tradition.

I do not know enough about it myself to comment further thereon. Please stop casting aspersions.
That's funny now you sound like me, I also used that 'casting aspersions' phrase to another poster.
 
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First question: Is anyone here an actual Native American?

In terms of tribal belonging, no.

Third question: Did you know that there is a deep feeling of animosity among many NDNs toward (European descent) Christians and many NDNs actually despise the Christian religion?

LGBT Christians also feel hurt by Christendom. But some identify as Christians anyways, because sometimes spiritual needs transcends grievances. Sometimes it is necessary to develop contextual theology unique to particular groups of people whose experiences different from the dominant perspective of Christians.

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2013/11/13/arts/native-spirituality-christianity
 
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