Could most modern translations be in error?

[JohnC2]

I find the discussion out of the Greek really interesting. There are many many Greek and Hebrew words that are not fully translated for brevity.... I have noticed that translators really try to translate 1 word as 1 word as often as they can.... And nobody wants 32 pages of preamble in the middle of a chapter explaining the difference between 2 Greek words which translate to the same English word but don’t mean the same thing in the original. This can lead to confusion as many Greek and Hebrew words don’t really translate cleanly...

In fact - I have been pondering many of the verses raised here as well as related passages to try to get a sense for what it actually says.

For example - Take Matt 24 where Jesus is asked about current and future guidance - and at the end of his exposition, he says “And then there will come the end”. How can there be an actual end if it’s forever and ever and ever? Then tie that to Isaiah 51 where Creation grows old and wears out like a garment... How can heaven and earth pass away (Matt 24) if they are eternal?

It makes more sense for these passages to work with eachother to infer that based on the Greek and Hebrew words used - that things exist for the time they exist. However long that is... But it also allows the possibility of God deciding to put a final end to the entire creation if and when it becomes old and worn out....

This becomes an act that shows the compassion of God - not chaining us “eternally” to a worn out, suffering, barren, and destitute creation.

 

[redleghunter]

Anyone can easily find a list of quotes of universalist church fathers in support of universalism by doing an internet search. You did the same (in post # 19) re alleged non universalists. In that post you copy/pasted from a biased site English language opinions (so-called translations) of what some early church fathers allegedly said in the original languages. Several of your quotes are probably mistranslations re the same issue raised in the OP of this thread. For example your post's first quote from Barnabas i've addressed here, providing the Greek text of Barnabas:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...alism-since-early-church-times.8042013/page-4

I did not list any quotes in post #19

 

[redleghunter]

For example your post's first quote from Barnabas i've addressed here, providing the Greek text of Barnabas:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...alism-since-early-church-times.8042013/page-4

Oh, I thought that link was going to take me to actual universalist quotes from the majority of church fathers. Still waiting for those....

 

[redleghunter]

That's what the links i provided are for:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...niversalism-since-early-church-times.8042013/

Only one opened and it did have quotes from some early theologians. However, they were just quotes without the source of the quote provided. That's what I am looking for to put such in the proper context.

Do you have at least one source which lists the quotes like this?

Justin Martyr (First Apology 12 [150 A.D]) ''No more is it possible for the evil doer, the avaricious, and the treacherous to hide from God than it is for the virtuous. Every man will receive the eternal punishment or reward which his actions deserve. Indeed, if all men recognized this, no one would choose evil even for a short time, knowing that he would incur the eternal sentence of Fire. On the contrary, he would take every means to control himself and to adorn himself in virtue, so that he might obtain the good gifts of God and escape the punishments.''
​

I highlighted in blue bold underlined the actual source document. Now taking that source document I can find the context here:

Chapter 12. Christians live as under God's eye
And more than all other men are we your helpers and allies in promoting peace, seeing that we hold this view, that it is alike impossible for the wicked, the covetous, the conspirator, and for the virtuous, to escape the notice of God, and that each man goes to everlasting punishment or salvation according to the value of his actions. For if all men knew this, no one would choose wickedness even for a little, knowing that he goes to the everlasting punishment of fire; but would by all means restrain himself, and adorn himself with virtue, that he might obtain the good gifts of God, and escape the punishments. For those who, on account of the laws and punishments you impose, endeavour to escape detection when they offend (and they offend, too, under the impression that it is quite possible to escape your detection, since you are but men), those persons, if they learned and were convinced that nothing, whether actually done or only intended, can escape the knowledge of God, would by all means live decently on account of the penalties threatened, as even you yourselves will admit. But you seem to fear lest all men become righteous, and you no longer have any to punish. Such would be the concern of public executioners, but not of good princes. But, as we before said, we are persuaded that these things are prompted by evil spirits, who demand sacrifices and service even from those who live unreasonably; but as for you, we presume that you who aim at [a reputation for] piety and philosophy will do nothing unreasonable. But if you also, like the foolish, prefer custom to truth, do what you have power to do. But just so much power have rulers who esteem opinion more than truth, as robbers have in a desert. And that you will not succeed is declared by the Word, than whom, after God who begot Him, we know there is no ruler more kingly and just. For as all shrink from succeeding to the poverty or sufferings or obscurity of their fathers, so whatever the Word forbids us to choose, the sensible man will not choose. That all these things should come to pass, I say, our Teacher foretold, He who is both Son and Apostle of God the Father of all and the Ruler, Jesus Christ; from whom also we have the name of Christians. Whence we become more assured of all the things He taught us, since whatever He beforehand foretold should come to pass, is seen in fact coming to pass; and this is the work of God, to tell of a thing before it happens, and as it was foretold so to show it happening. It were possible to pause here and add no more, reckoning that we demand what is just and true; but because we are well aware that it is not easy suddenly to change a mind possessed by ignorance, we intend to add a few things, for the sake of persuading those who love the truth, knowing that it is not impossible to put ignorance to flight by presenting the truth.​

Which is found at this website: http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm

​

As opposed to the endless hell majority view of Christendom of the dark ages (600 - 1600 AD & beyond) of Inquisitions, Crusades, burning of opposers & their writings, etc?

Red herring.

Do an internet search re universalism. See Ramelli's tome. It's full of references re universalism in the early church & early church fathers. Read other books re early church universalists that give the references & then look them up. Several books on the subject are posted on this site: http://www.tentmaker.org/ScholarsCorner.html

I'm not in the position to do the homework for you. See above my example of Justin Martyr's quote where the source document is cited and the further context provided. Every site you took me to either did not work, needed an account or had a general listing of quotes without footnoting or citing the source document. How can I take your assertions seriously if the actual source material of your links does not cite the original works?

If there is such a long list of church fathers catholic who espoused universalism, then quote me 2 or 3 here in the format I did for Justin Martyr. Then we can examine if the claim is true, false or inconclusive. St Irenaeus should be an easy example as his Against Heresies is all over the web. Convince me at least Irenaeus was a universalist. One of your sites linked claimed he was.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

Matthew 25:46 if you limit one, then you limit the other too.

 

[redleghunter]

Where are those children now? In Calvin's, Augustine's & Jonathan Edwards "hell" burning alive forever? You compare being "judged" to be burnt alive forever? The judgments of Love Omnipotent are always corrective, for the good of His created beings, not pointless, endless sadistic tortures.

More emotional sensationalism.

 

[redleghunter]

Matthew 25:46 if you limit one, then you limit the other too.

Yes according to the 'word study' isolated from context Lexical Lottery you are quite correct.

 

[redleghunter]

Don't you not believe your own source from your post #19 in this thread:

Not mine. I'm the rabbit....you are looking for the coyote @Uber Genius.

 

[redleghunter]

"Yet Basil has to confess that most ordinary Christians have been beguiled by the Devil into believing, against the manifest evidence of Scripture, that there will be a time-limit....The influence of Origen is clearly visible here, but by the fifth century the stern doctrine that sinners will have no second chance after this life and that the fir which will devour them will never be extinguished was everywhere paramount." (Early Christian Doctrines; pp.483-484)."

This is commentary. Where is the Basil quote?

 

[redleghunter]

The quote above is one of the arguments that kept me bound for 21 years.

This one?

"There are people who, although Christians at heart, have remained entangled in earthly loves, and it is natural that after this life they should undergo purification by 'purgatorial fire' " (p.485).

That was @ClementofA using Basil as a proponent for Universalism even though the above quote from the author cited is about Basil's view on Purgatory. The fact that Basil is speaking of Purgatory invalidates the UR claim.

 

[Der Alte]

Here are a few ECF speaking on eternal punishment.

Ignatius of Antioch
"Corrupters of families will not inherit the kingdom of God. And if they who do these things according to the flesh suffer death, how much more if a man corrupt by evil teaching the faith of God for the sake of which Jesus Christ was crucified? A man become so foul will depart into unquenchable fire: and so will anyone who listens to him" (Letter to the Ephesians 16:1–2 [A.D. 110]).
Second Clement
"If we do the will of Christ, we shall obtain rest; but if not, if we neglect his commandments, nothing will rescue us from eternal punishment" (Second Clement 5:5 [A.D. 150]).
"But when they see how those who have sinned and who have denied Jesus by their words or by their deeds are punished with terrible torture in unquenchable fire, the righteous, who have done good, and who have endured tortures and have hated the luxuries of life, will give glory to their God saying, ‘There shall be hope for him that has served God with all his heart!’" (ibid., 17:7).
Justin Martyr
"No more is it possible for the evildoer, the avaricious, and the treacherous to hide from God than it is for the virtuous. Every man will receive the eternal punishment or reward which his actions deserve. Indeed, if all men recognized this, no one would choose evil even for a short time, knowing that he would incur the eternal sentence of fire. On the contrary, he would take every means to control himself and to adorn himself in virtue, so that he might obtain the good gifts of God and escape the punishments" (First Apology 12 [A.D. 151]).
"We have been taught that only they may aim at immortality who have lived a holy and virtuous life near to God. We believe that they who live wickedly and do not repent will be punished in everlasting fire" (ibid., 21).
"[Jesus] shall come from the heavens in glory with his angelic host, when he shall raise the bodies of all the men who ever lived. Then he will clothe the worthy in immortality; but the wicked, clothed in eternal sensibility, he will commit to the eternal fire, along with the evil demons" (ibid., 52).
The Martyrdom of Polycarp
"Fixing their minds on the grace of Christ, [the martyrs] despised worldly tortures and purchased eternal life with but a single hour. To them, the fire of their cruel torturers was cold. They kept before their eyes their escape from the eternal and unquenchable fire" (Martyrdom of Polycarp 2:3 [A.D. 155]).
Mathetes
"When you know what is the true life, that of heaven; when you despise the merely apparent death, which is temporal; when you fear the death which is real, and which is reserved for those who will be condemned to the everlasting fire, the fire which will punish even to the end those who are delivered to it, then you will condemn the deceit and error of the world" (Letter to Diognetus 10:7 [A.D. 160]).
Athenagoras
"[W]e [Christians] are persuaded that when we are removed from this present life we shall live another life, better than the present one. . . . Then we shall abide near God and with God, changeless and free from suffering in the soul . . . or if we fall with the rest [of mankind], a worse one and in fire; for God has not made us as sheep or beasts of burden, a mere incidental work, that we should perish and be annihilated" (Plea for the Christians 31 [A.D. 177]).
Theophilus of Antioch
"Give studious attention to the prophetic writings [the Bible] and they will lead you on a clearer path to escape the eternal punishments and to obtain the eternal good things of God. . . . [God] will examine everything and will judge justly, granting recompense to each according to merit. To those who seek immortality by the patient exercise of good works, he will give everlasting life, joy, peace, rest, and all good things. . . . For the unbelievers and for the contemptuous, and for those who do not submit to the truth but assent to iniquity, when they have been involved in adulteries, and fornications, and homosexualities, and avarice, and in lawless idolatries, there will be wrath and indignation, tribulation and anguish; and in the end, such men as these will be detained in everlasting fire" (To Autolycus 1:14 [A.D. 181])
Irenaeus
"[God will] send the spiritual forces of wickedness, and the angels who transgressed and became apostates, and the impious, unjust, lawless, and blasphemous among men into everlasting fire" (Against Heresies 1:10:1 [A.D. 189]).
"The penalty increases for those who do not believe the Word of God and despise his coming. . . .it is not merely temporal, but eternal. To whomsoever the Lord shall say, ‘Depart from me, accursed ones, into the everlasting fire,’ they will be damned forever" (ibid., 4:28:2).
Tertullian
"After the present age is ended he will judge his worshipers for a reward of eternal life and the godless for a fire equally perpetual and unending" (Apology 18:3 [A.D. 197]).
"Then will the entire race of men be restored to receive its just deserts according to what it has merited in this period of good and evil, and thereafter to have these paid out in an immeasurable and unending eternity. Then there will be neither death again nor resurrection again, but we shall be always the same as we are now, without changing. The worshipers of God shall always be with God, clothed in the proper substance of eternity. But the godless and those who have not turned wholly to God will be punished in fire equally unending, and they shall have from the very nature of this fire, divine as it were, a supply of incorruptibility" (ibid., 44:12–13).
Hippolytus
"Standing before [Christ’s] judgment, all of them, men, angels, and demons, crying out in one voice, shall say: ‘Just is your judgment!’ And the righteousness of that cry will be apparent in the recompense made to each. To those who have done well, everlasting enjoyment shall be given; while to the lovers of evil shall be given eternal punishment. The unquenchable and unending fire awaits these latter, and a certain fiery worm which does not die and which does not waste the body but continually bursts forth from the body with unceasing pain. No sleep will give them rest; no night will soothe them; no death will deliver them from punishment; no appeal of interceding friends will profit them" (Against the Greeks 3 [A.D. 212]).
Minucius Felix
"I am not ignorant of the fact that many, in the consciousness of what they deserve, would rather hope than actually believe that there is nothing for them after death. They would prefer to be annihilated rather than be restored for punishment. . . . Nor is there either measure nor end to these torments. That clever fire burns the limbs and restores them, wears them away and yet sustains them, just as fiery thunderbolts strike bodies but do not consume them" (Octavius 34:12–5:3 [A.D. 226]).
Cyprian of Carthage
"An ever-burning Gehenna and the punishment of being devoured by living flames will consume the condemned; nor will there be any way in which the tormented can ever have respite or be at an end. Souls along with their bodies will be preserved for suffering in unlimited agonies. . . . The grief at punishment will then be without the fruit of repentance; weeping will be useless, and prayer ineffectual. Too late will they believe in eternal punishment, who would not believe in eternal life" (To Demetrian 24 [A.D. 252]).
Lactantius
"[T]he sacred writings inform us in what manner the wicked are to undergo punishment. For because they have committed sins in their bodies, they will again be clothed with flesh, that they may make atonement in their bodies; and yet it will not be that flesh with which God clothed man, like this our earthly body, but indestructible, and abiding forever, that it may be able to hold out against tortures and everlasting fire, the nature of which is different from this fire of ours, which we use for the necessary purposes of life, and which is extinguished unless it be sustained by the fuel of some material. But that divine fire always lives by itself, and flourishes without any nourishment. . . . The same divine fire, therefore, with one and the same force and power, will both burn the wicked and will form them again, and will replace as much as it shall consume of their bodies, and will supply itself with eternal nourishment. . . . Thus, without any wasting of bodies, which regain their substance, it will only burn and affect them with a sense of pain. But when [God] shall have judged the righteous, he will also try them with fire" (Divine Institutes 7:21 [A.D. 307]).
Cyril of Jerusalem
"We shall be raised therefore, all with our bodies eternal, but not all with bodies alike: for if a man is righteous, he will receive a heavenly body, that he may be able worthily to hold converse with angels; but if a man is a sinner, he shall receive an eternal body, fitted to endure the penalties of sins, that he may burn eternally in fire, nor ever be consumed. And righteously will God assign this portion to either company; for we do nothing without the body. We blaspheme with the mouth, and with the mouth we pray. With the body we commit fornication, and with the body we keep chastity. With the hand we rob, and by the hand we bestow alms; and the rest in like manner. Since then the body has been our minister in all things, it shall also share with us in the future the fruits of the past" (Catechetical Lectures 18:19 [A.D. 350]).​

 

[Hillsage]

This one?

No, actually i was referring to the quote in my post. The one which sounds like a lot of the rhetoric here. It was the answer I was given by the Catholic Church concerning how all the ‘Johnny come lately’ Protestant churches could All be wrong. I was informed that “WE were the one true holy Catholic and apostolic church whose roots go back to Peter.” I will admit that I don’t know if ‘they’ capitalized the c in Catholic like I just did though.

 

[redleghunter]

If the translators falsified their translation then all knowledge gained through revelation of the scriptures is suspect! That is why is see the approach of qouting passages whether they be Greek or Hebrew, Latin or Coptic, Syriac or english, if we say "I want the secondary, or tertiary meaning to be inserted in a text as a translator then what would keep me from doing the same about every text on every theological issue I didn't agree with?

And that is what is going on and not just Universalism.

 

[ClementofA]

I have tried to engage the OP on their false premise (that God can't be all-loving and there be a place of torment for the wicked). But Clement appears to be the artful dodger.

You've provided no reason or logic in support of your allegation. Why can't a loving God bring punishment that torments for the good & correction of people in hell, just as a loving father punishes his children who misbehave? It's not rocket science.

Furthermore what does your remark have to do with the OP? And such issues are fully addressed in this thread:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-torments-were-true-is-god-a-monster.8042349/

 

[ClementofA]

Only one opened and it did have quotes from some early theologians. However, they were just quotes without the source of the quote provided.

Didn't you see the context here, for example:

http://www.leaderu.com/cyber/books/augenchiridion/enchiridion97-122.html

and here:

https://www.ideals.illinois.edu/bitstream/handle/2142/46905/Amy_Oh.pdf?sequence=1

from the source i gave you:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...niversalism-since-early-church-times.8042013/

which also gave references to the other quotes.

 

[ClementofA]

Matthew 25:46 if you limit one, then you limit the other too.

See post #'s 4 & 8 in this thread. Never refuted & never will or can be.

 

[ClementofA]

God has judged entire cities and nations which included women and children.

I posted:

Where are those children now? In Calvin's, Augustine's & Jonathan Edwards "hell" burning alive forever? You compare being "judged" to be burnt alive forever? The judgments of Love Omnipotent are always corrective, for the good of His created beings, not pointless, endless sadistic tortures.

More emotional sensationalism.

No, but questions you are evading answering, for some reason.

 

[ClementofA]

This is commentary. Where is the Basil quote?

Am i your research slave? Do your own homework. References were already posted here, in post #2:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...niversalism-since-early-church-times.8042013/

 

[ClementofA]

That was @ClementofA using Basil as a proponent for Universalism even though the above quote from the author cited is about Basil's view on Purgatory. The fact that Basil is speaking of Purgatory invalidates the UR claim.

No, that was a reference to what Augustine, not Basil, believed. And, indeed it does refer to a belief in postmortem purgatory for sinning Christians. But why would a belief in purgatory for Christians necessarily rule out salvation for non Christians, e.g. after a while in hell? And do you have any idea why i included that in my post.

 

[redleghunter]

Didn't you see the context here, for example:

http://www.leaderu.com/cyber/books/augenchiridion/enchiridion97-122.html

and here:

https://www.ideals.illinois.edu/bitstream/handle/2142/46905/Amy_Oh.pdf?sequence=1

from the source i gave you:

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...niversalism-since-early-church-times.8042013/

which also gave references to the other quotes.

I'm not going on a hunting expedition. The first link I opened was a work by Augustine. If you are now claiming Augustine turned out a Universalist you are going to have to point me to the quote.

It should be easy enough to find a couple of quotes, the source and provide the context. If you can provide the source I will find the context. This is what I mean. One of your links provided these quotes:

The mass of men (Christians) say there is to be an end to punishment and to those who are punished.—St. Basil the Great

There are very many in our day, who though not denying the Holy Scriptures, do not believe in endless torments. -- Augustine (354-430 A.D.)

For the wicked there are punishments, not perpetural, however, lest the immortality prepared for them should be a disadvantage, but they are to be purified for a brief period according to the amount of malice in their works. They shall therefore suffer punishment for a short space, but immortal blessedness having no end awaits them...the penalties to be inflicted for their many and grave sins are very far surpassed by the magnitude of the mercy to be showed to them. --Diodore of Tarsus, 320-394 A.D.

And God showed great kindness to man, in this, that He did not suffer him to continue being in sin forever; but as it were, by a kind of banishement, cast him out of paradise in order that, having punishment expiated within an appointed time, and having been disciplined, he should afterwards be recalled...just as a vessel, when one being fashioned it has some flaw, is remoulded or remade that it may become new and entire; so also it happens to man by death. For he is broken up by force, that in the resurrection he may be found whole; I mean spotless, righteous and immortal. --Theophilus of Antioch (168 A.D.)

Wherefore also he drove him out of paradise and removed him far from the tree of life, not because He envied him the tree of life, as some dare assert, but because He pitied him and desired that he should not be immortal and the evil interminable and irremediable. --Iraneaus of Lyons (182 A.D.)

These, if they will, may go Christ's way, but if not let them go their way. In another place perhaps they shall be baptized with fire, that last baptism, which is not only painful, but enduring also; which eats up, as if it were hay, all defiled matter, and consumes all vanity and vice. --Gregory of Nazianzeu, Bishop of Constantinople. (330 to 390 A.D.) Oracles 39:19

The Word seems to me to lay down the doctrine of the perfect obliteration of wickedness, for if God shall be in all things that are, obviously wickedness shall not be in them. For it is necessary that at some time evil should be removed utterly and entirely from the realm of being.—St. Macrina the Blessed

In the end and consummation of the Universe all are to be restored into their original harmonious state, and we all shall be made one body and be united once more into a perfect man and the prayer of our Savior shall be fulfilled that all may be one. --St. Jerome, 331-420

For it is evident that God will in truth be all in all when there shall be no evil in existence, when every created being is at harmony with iteself and every tongue shall confess that Jesus Christ is Lord; when every creature shall have been made one body. --Gregory of Nyssa, 335-390

The wicked who have committed evil the whole period of their lives shall be punished till they learn that, by continuing in sin, they only continue in misery. And when, by this means, they shall have been brought to fear God, and to regard Him with good will, they shall obtain the enjoyment of His grace. --Theodore of Mopsuestia, 350-428

We can set no limits to the agency of the Redeemer to redeem, to rescue, to discipline in his work, and so will he continue to operate after this life. –Clement of Alexandria

Do not suppose that the soul is punished for endless eons (apeirou aionas) in Tartarus. Very properly, the soul is not punished to gratify the revenge of the divinity, but for the sake of healing. But we say that the soul is punished for an aionion period (aionios) calling its life and its allotted period of punishment, its aeon. --Olnmpiodorus (AD 550)

Wherefore, that at the same time liberty of free-will should be left to nature and yet the evil be purged away, the wisdom of God discovered this plan; to suffer man to do what he would, that having tasted the evil which he desired, and learning by experience for what wretchedness he had bartered away the blessings he had, he might of his own will hasten back with desire to the first blessedness ...either being purged in this life through prayer and discipline, or after his departure hence through the furnace of cleansing fire.--Gregory of Nyssa (332-398 A.D.)

That in the world to come, those who have done evil all their life long, will be made worthy of the sweetness of the Divine bounty. For never would Christ have said, "You will never get out until you hqave paid the last penny" unless it were possible for us to get cleansed when we paid the debt. --Peter Chrysologus, 435

I know that most persons understand by the story of Nineveh and its king, the ultimate forgiveness of the devil and all rational creatures. --St. Jerome

"In the end or consummation of things, all shall be restored to their original state, and be again united in one body. We cannot be ignorant that Christ's blood benefited the angels and those who are in hell; though we know not the manner in which it produced such effects. The apostate angels shall become such as they were created; and man, who has been cast out of paradise, shall be restored thither again. And this shall be accomplished in such a way, that all shall be united together by mutual charity, so that the members will delight in each other, and rejoice in each other's promotion. The apostate angels, and the prince of this world, though now ungovernable, plunging themselves into the depths of sin, shall, in the end, embrace the happy dominion of Christ and His saints." – COMMENTARY ON THE NEW TESTAMENT – Jerome (347-420 A.D.)

Our Lord is the One who delivers man [all men], and who heals the inventor of evil himself. -- Gregory of Nyssa (332-398 A.D.), leading theologian of the Eastern Church

While the devil thought to kill One [Christ], he is deprived of all those cast out of hades, and he [the devil] sitting by the gates, sees all fettered beings led forth by the courage of the Saviour.--Athanasius, the Great Father of Orthodoxy

Our Lord descends, and was shut up in the eternal bars, in order that He might set free all who had been shut up... The Lord descended to the place of punishment and torment, in which was the rich man, in order to liberate the prisoners. --Jerome

In the liberation of all no one remains a captive! At the time of the Lord's passion the devil alone was injured by losing all the of the captives he was keeping. --Didymus, 370 AD

While the devil imagined that he got a hold of Christ, he really lost all of those he was keeping. --St. Chrysostom, 398 AD

Stronger than all the evils in the soul is the Word, and the healing power that dwells in him, and this healing He applies, according to the will of God, to everyman. The consummation of all things is the destruction of evil…to quote Zephaniah: “My determination to gather the nations, that I am assemble the kings, to pour upon them mine indignation, even say all my fierce anger, for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy. For then will I turn to the people a pure language that they may all call upon the name of the Lord, to serve Him with one consent”…Consider carefully the promise, that all shall call upon the Name of the Lord, and serve him with one consent.—Origen (185 to 254 A.D.) He founded a school at Caesarea, and is considered by historians to be one of the great theologians and exegete of the Eastern Church.

The nations are gathered to the Judgment, that on them may be poured out the wrath of the fury of the Lord, and this in pity and with a design to heal. in order that every one may return to the confession of the Lord, that in Jesus' Name every knee may bow, and every tongue may confess that He is Lord. All God's enemies shall perish, not that they cease to exist, but cease to be enemies.—Jerome (340 to 420 A.D), commenting on Zephaniah 3:8-10

Mankind, being reclaimed from their sins, are to be subjected to Christ in he fullness of the dispensation instituted for the salvation of all. –Didymus the Blind

So then, when the end has been restored to the beginning, and the termination of things compared with their commencement, that condition of things will be re-established in which rational nature was placed, when it had no need to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; so that when all feeling of wickedness has been removed, and the individual has been purified and cleansed, He who alone is the one good God becomes to him "all," and that not in the case of a few individuals, or of a considerable number, but He Himself is "all in all." And when death shall no longer anywhere exist, nor the sting of death, nor any evil at all, then verily God will be "all in all" --Origen, De Prinicipiis, 3.6.3. (Origen founded a school at Caesarea, and is considered by historians to be one of the great theologians and exegete of the Eastern Church.)

The Son "breaking in pieces" His enemies is for the sake of remolding them, as a potter his own work; as Jeremiah 18;6 says: i.e., to restore them once again to their former state. --Eusebius of Caesarea (65 to 340 A.D). Bishop of Caesarea

Our Savior has appointed two kinds of resurrection in the Apocalypse. 'Blessed is he that hath part in the first resurrection,' for such come to grace without the judgment. As for those who do not come to the first, but are reserved unto the second resurrection, these shall be disciplined until their appointed times, between the first and the second resurrection.-- Ambrose, Bishop of Milan (340-397 A.D.)

We think, indeed, that the goodness of God, through His Christ, may recall all His creatures to one end, even His enemies being conquered and subdued.... for Christ must reign until He has put all enemies under His feet. --Origen (185 to 254 A.D.) He founded a school at Caesarea, and is considered by historians to be one of the great theologians and exegete of the Eastern Church.

For it is needful that evil should some day be wholly and absolutely removed out of the circle of being. --Gregory of Nyssa (332-398 A.D.), leading theologian of the Eastern Church

In the present life God is in all, for His nature is without limits, but he is not all in all. But in the coming life, when mortality is at an end and immortality granted, and sin has no longer any place, God will be all in all. For the Lord, who loves man, punishes medicinally, that He may check the course of impeity. --Theodoret the Blessed, 387-458

When death shall no longer exist, or the sting of death, nor any evil at all, then truly God will be all in all. --Origen

All men are Christ's, some by knowing Him, the rest not yet. He is the Savior, not of some and the rest not. For how is He Savior and Lord, if not the Savior and Lord of all?—Clement of Alexandria​

None of the above cite the source of the church father works. Unless we can look at the source material and look at the quotes in context, they are not useful for debate.

For example, this quote:

In the present life God is in all, for His nature is without limits, but he is not all in all. But in the coming life, when mortality is at an end and immortality granted, and sin has no longer any place, God will be all in all. For the Lord, who loves man, punishes medicinally, that He may check the course of impeity. --Theodoret the Blessed, 387-458 ​

I would argue this has absolutely nothing to do with universal salvation. It has to do with God's chastisement of His own elect. Prove me wrong. You can't without the context of the Theodoret's work.

Again, as I said if you can find the source document titles I will find the expanded text of the source.