Could God be the most emotional being in the universe????

[DennisTate]

Anonymous reply regarding the Rapture:

Perhaps the "Rapture" occurs exactly as many "fundamentalist" "Christians" believe, the mainstream manner in which
this heresy is taught. You know--Jesus physically appears in person, either before or during a worldwide nuclear war,
and the true believers float upwards, defying gravity, and somehow are so overjoyed at being with Jesus that their
hearts aren't saddened by billions of people suffering through miserable deaths. Perhaps such an outcome occurs in
in another warped timeline/alternate dimension/on another branch of quantum physics--the one where every blade of grass
in the entire world is literally burned up...

Revelation 8:7, apostle John;
7 The first angel sounded his trumpet, and there came hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down upon the earth.
A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up."

and the one where everything living in the oceans is made extinct

...

Revelation 16:3-7, apostle John;
3 The second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it turned into blood like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died."

[...and not only made extinct, but blamed for their demise--every jellyfish, mollusk and fish right on down to amoebic life-forms, all of
them blamed for their sin by the angel God left in charge of the waters...]

"5 Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say:
“You are just in these judgments, you who are and who were, the Holy One, because you have so judged;
6 for they have shed the blood of your saints and prophets, and you have given them blood to drink as they deserve.”

[...Yep, read it literally, without the spirit, and the lobsters shed the blood of Gods saints and prophets...]

7 And I heard the altar respond:
“Yes, Lord God Almighty, true and just are your judgments.”"

(If the literalists without the spirit are correct, the heavenly altar itself declares the saint-killing octopi had to die. Or perhaps it could mean
something entirely different, something consistent with Christ's deeds and gospel, if we choose to read the account using a bit of saintly,
allegorical language--you know, the kind Jesus was known for using...)

John 16:25, Jesus;
“Though I have been speaking figuratively,
a time is coming when I will no longer use this kind of language but will tell you plainly about my Father."

Matthew 13:34-35;
Jesus spoke all these things to the crowd in parables; he did not say anything to them without using a parable.
So was fulfilled what was spoken through the prophet:
“I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter things hidden since the creation of the world.”

Matthew 13:13, Jesus;
This is why I speak to them in parables:“Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand."

Back to John 16, expanded for greater clarity and context...Jesus speaking;

25 “Though I have been speaking figuratively, a time is coming when I will no longer use this kind of language
but will tell you plainly about my Father..."

29 Then Jesus’ disciples said, “Now you are speaking clearly and without figures of speech.
30 Now we can see that you know all things and that you do not even need to have anyone ask you questions.
This makes us believe that you came from God.”

And this...

Luke 8:10;
[Jesus] said, “The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God has been given to you,
but to others I speak in parables, so that,“‘though seeing, they may not see;though hearing, they may not understand.’"

(Why did I say "literalists without the spirit" just preceding the accounts of Jesus' use of figurative language above? Paul...your turn...

)

1 Corinthians 2:13-14, Paul;
13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.
14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him,
and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned."

[

i.e., one must read the scriptures using the same spirit of love Jesus personifies to have the proper context for determining whether
something is meant literally, or figuratively. Literalists without the spirit butcher the gospel and make it appear that God is righteously
accusing mollusks of killing the saints and prophets. (Perhaps mollusks are the reincarnated spirits of the saints & prophets killers?) ]

Trust me, Dennis, God is not holding lobsters accountable for killing the saints and prophets. Paul was a good servant.
He used the same allegorical language Jesus used. Peter even said so...

2 Peter 3:15-16;
15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation,
just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him.
16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters.
His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort,
as they do the other Scriptures,
to their own destruction."

Why speak in riddles and allegorical language? We're being tested. Do we have the spirit of love in our hearts, or selfishness and
death wishes for others? How we choose to read the scriptures tells a lot about who we are. As for the literalist Rapture heresy...
Pete, your turn again...

2 Peter 2:1, Peter;
1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you.
They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—
bringing swift destruction on themselves."

Why do I use the term, "Rapture heresy"? Because the way the Rapture is commonly taught denies "the sovereign Lord who
bought them". There's a true "Rapture" (and we'll examine this later), but the way the "Rapture", as commonly taught, it's part of
a heresy that denies Christ. It denies his spirit and the intent of his words. It goes like this: Mankind comes to end of the age time.
If at any time prior to then one has mouthed the words, "I accept Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior", one is "in". Doesn't matter
if one murders and rapes afterwards. We all do bad things, don't we? But these folks claim God's grace because they said their mantra.

No further responsibility required. Their words can be devoid of meaning and sincerity as long as they're vocalized. That alone is a
perverse heresy. It denies Matthew 25, for one. Or a favorite of mine, Matthew 7:21

...

Matthew 7:21, Jesus;
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven,
but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven."

[Love him or hate him, but Jesus aimed this one specifically to and directly at Christians, the only ones who call Jesus, "Lord".
That is, unless Jesus has other names in other religions. If that were the case, they'd be liable, too.]

But now, here we are at the "End Times"--time for God to punish the sinners and damn them eternally in a linear time sense.
Anyone who failed to mouth the mantra--doesn't matter how much they followed the Golden Rule, doesn't matter if they couldn't say
it because so-called "Christians" relying solely on grace massacred their people--none of that matters now. Doesn't matter if they're
little children like the ones Jesus was so fond of in the Gospels. Doesn't matter that he's so bursting with love for us that he'd sacrifice
his life for us. Nope, the perfect person has had enough. Jesus has reached his love limit. Heart of gold has turned to heart of stone.

You didn't say the magic words--well, nukes to you and billions of others, and then burn in Hell for all linear eternity. But the "Rapture"--
yes, the "Rapture". Those who mouthed the magic words like "abracadabra" are whisked off the ground and taken up into the upper
atmosphere safely out of harm's way while Jesus and his servant angels totally trash the planet and all still remaining on it.

This heresy completely stands Jesus' gospel upside down and turns him into Satan himself--which was the point to the heresy
to begin with. Isaiah?

Isaiah 5:20-21;
20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil,
who put darkness for light and light for darkness,
who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
21 Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight."

By twisting allegorical language around until they have Jesus and the Father accusing sea urchins of saint-tricide. That's how Satan
is supposed to win the game--present an image of himself clothed with Jesus' skin and have all his followers praise him as God Himself,
praise him and thank him while he leads humanity astray by committing mass murder in the name of God. Now, if the "Rapture" heresy's
narrative took into account mitigating circumstances, if there was a glimmer of Christ's undying love for us present in this heresy, well
then, perhaps floating off into the air would be acceptable. But under circumstances in which Satan is substituted for Christ, that is simply
and totally unacceptable.

Then, there's another way in which the "Rapture" heresy denies Christ. Whenever a close-minded missionary or believer (and note,
I'm applying this only to the close-minded ones, not everyone) tells someone else the Message their people heard came from the Devil--
whenever that happens, they've denied the Source of that Message, too. If someone accurately relays a message of yours to a third
party, and that third party calls it a pack of lies, they may or may not be calling the messenger a liar, but they surely are calling the
originator of the message a liar. Doesn't matter if the same Source has also spoken to the third party, and the third party accepts
the Message given directly to them as truth, the third party is still calling the Source of the Message relayed through an intermediary
a liar. There's likely even more ways this "fundamentalist", heartless, Rapture heresy denies Christ. But we'll stop here. Point made.

(Anonymous)

 

[DennisTate]

Before getting back to the "Rapture", let's first clean up Revelation 8 and 16 a bit.

Rev. 8:7;
7 The first angel sounded his trumpet, and there came hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down upon the earth.
A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up."

Anyone ever tell you something or do something to you that got you "burned up"? Seeing "red"? Ya think maybe a third of the
world's people are following their religions in a self-righteous manner that denies the spirit of love of their sovereign Lord?

"Trees?" Check out "oaks" and such in all the prophecies. The account of Nebuchadnezzar's dream in Daniel 4:9-22 is perfect for
setting the precedent.

Daniel 4:20-22, Daniel;
20 The tree you saw, which grew large and strong, with its top touching the sky, visible to the whole earth,
21 with beautiful leaves and abundant fruit, providing food for all, giving shelter to the beasts of the field,
and having nesting places in its branches for the birds of the air— 22 you, O king, are that tree!"

So, king Nebuchadnezzar was an allegorical tree. People can be allegorical "trees", according to the Word.

Grass?

Isaiah 40:6-8;
6 A voice says, "Cry out."
And I said, "What shall I cry?"
"All men are like grass,
and all their glory is like the flowers of the field.
7 The grass withers and the flowers fall,
because the breath of the LORD blows on them.
Surely the people are grass.
8 The grass withers and the flowers fall, but the word of our God stands forever."
"Surely the people are grass."

The word of our God says that in prophecy, "grass" is allegorical language for "people". Same as "sea" in Rev. 16:

Revelation 17:15;
Then the angel said to me, “The waters you saw, where the prostitute sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages."

The color used to represent Islam is green. Virtually every Muslim will find it uncomfortable to apply figurative language to
much of the harsher sounding prophecies, because as a whole, the Muslim Ummah believes in a Muslim counterpart fulfillment
to what the "Christian" Rapture Cult believes. Shia, in particular, generally have disdain for allegorical interpretations. That's one
reason they reject many of the prophecies found in hadith collections held sacred by the Sunni. Sunni, in general, accept the
prophecies as true, but read them literally, turning Allah into a nasty Person just like most "fundamentalist" Christians. (That's only
a part of where their anger will come from. They'll find other aspects of this process distasteful, but that distaste will be based
on sin, not righteousness. That's written in Islam's prophecies, btw.) Trust me, any solution that upholds the Bible as being valid
will allegorically "burn" most Muslims up. Consequently, worldwide destruction of natural habitat is not a requirement for godly
fulfillment of either Revelation 8 or 16, or for that matter, most other prophecies.

Back to the Rapture, 1 Thessalonians 4, verse 16, and the phrase "the dead in Christ"..

.
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, Paul;
16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command,
with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.
And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Who are these "dead in Christ"? Let's take a look at Daniel 12.

Daniel 12:2. Gabriel;
2 Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt."

Many people see these "dead in Christ" as being the same as those in Daniel 12 who "sleep in the dust". That would appear to jive
with literally dead believers rising from their literal graves. But--is there an allegorical interpretation, and if there is, does it necessarily
follow that one or the other is the sole correct version?

Let's begin with a few questions: Is God alive today or did He die permanently awhile ago? Assuming He's still alive, does He listen
to what we say? If so, would He have ever heard the phrase "dead to the world", or do you think this is the first time He's run across
this bit of allegorical language? Or how about "asleep at the wheel"? We all know that allegorically we can be "asleep" or even "dead"
and yet literally be alive, breathing, and awake. We're just pre-occupied! "Asleep" and "dead" in these instances are simply allegorical
terms describing a state of being while we're alive. Remember, God is the Inventor and Master of allegorical language. It's impossible
that God didn't already hear modern day slang before the world itself was created. Now, if the primary purpose of giving us prophecies
is so that people who are alive at the time they're being fulfilled are filled with wonder at their accuracy and return to God, then it's even
more likely many--if not most--of the prophecies contain figures of speech that people today are already familiar with.

(Btw, a Church that uses allegorical language only when it suits them, but uses other allegorical language in a literalist manner that
denies Christ's spirit as it depicts God being cruel and unfair for sensationalist and fear-control purposes--that Church is included
among those Peter condemned in 2 Peter 2.)

Back to Daniel 12:2. Daniel 12:2. Gabriel;
2 Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt

"Dirt" and "filth" are words commonly used to allegorically describe a lot of what's on TV & the movies these days, as well as a
general decline in morals. We've become more "worldly". We can be alive and breathing, consumed in materialism and the
perversities of our media and perfectly fulfill Daniel 2:12's words, "sleep in the dust of the earth".

Back to 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 and the Rapture, This time we'll look at "clouds":
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, Paul;
16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command,
with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.
And so we will be with the Lord forever."

Well, "clouds" connects 1 Thessalonians 4 with Matthew 24:30-31

, Jesus speaking;
30 “At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn.
They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory.
31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds,
from one end of the heavens to the other."

"Clouds" also connects with this...

Jude 1:12;
These men are blemishes at your love feasts, eating with you without the slightest qualm—shepherds who feed only themselves.
They are clouds without rain, blown along by the wind; autumn trees, without fruit and uprooted—twice dead."

1 Thessalonians & Matthew 24 are talking about the "clouds" of heaven, whereas Jude 1 is talking about the "clouds" of hell.
But in both cases, "clouds" is allegorically meant as people, not misty droplets of suspended rain.

"meet the Lord in the air".
Meet the Lord in the atmosphere. Where have I seen the word "atmosphere" before. Oh, yeah. Ambiance, like in a restaurant.
A prevailing mood or emotion. People putting on "airs". "Love is in the air". An effect. A prevalent mood among the "clouds"
of people.

What 1 Thessalonians 4 is saying is that when Christ "returns" through his servants, the Holy Spirit will be on the loose,
gathering the poor and the meek and the righteous together, and excitement and joy will lift their spirits. Nothing at all evil,
corrupt, or heretical about that kind of Rapture. That definition is downright godly.

Apologies to Dr. Richard Eby

(Anonymous)

 

[Raimi Stranger]

This would seem to correspond with the Creator actually having thought up and choreographed an infinite number of Big Events over infinite time in the past as some physicists seem to believe has been the case!

Physics is only a combination of God's inspirations and of mankind looking BACKWARD to see the future on basis of what has gone before and listening to God when we get stumped for new ideas [as the 'greats' have many acknowledged in their autobiographies] ... Physics is NOT a worthy God nor any sort of way to know what is beyond current fashions of thought in men [look at the past to UNDERSTAND that all thought is JUST fashion, not Truth - that God CONTROLS thought in men]

God has said that He has no time and we even KNOW time is only a local variable of space , NOT fundamental ... God does not change , simply is perfect and creates that which changes and thus ENDS ... God however is endless ,endlessly creating ... that is NOT the same as infinite... infinity is BY DEFINITION incomplete , NOTHING can be infinite BY DEFINITION , not even God can be so absurd as men using words they don't understand like this [about God] ... if one stops being self-contradictory in word usage then one can learn at least what we have words about ... there never was, nor can be an infinity of time then, Newton made a self-contradicting assumption because of the mistake in Mathematics of his time, because of fashion...

Investing infinite time in the creation....would certainly tend to give the Creator a greater emotional attachment to all of us than we can begin to imagine...considering how young we are.

God is not a man , we are made in God's image, spirit, not God in man's image , flesh... that is an ages-old religious mistake ... God can become man by creation/manifestation, and even show man Love through the man Jesus, which is how man can RELATE to God, know God ... and God can communicate thus that man is not created in vain simply because most men follow their short-sighted lusts and sin all their lives instead of following god's example in Christ and being Loving to all instead of sinning against one another and against God's advice/instructions to saints...

and since few men even understand their emotions , let alone allow conscience , heart, spirit, mind to guide their lives to happiness of being loving now , there is little point in the analogy that God is Love except for saints and potential saints with enough sense to understand that by love one can be baptised of the spirit and by sin one will NOT know God at all in this life

1 John 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

“When My Father moves His little finger, the whole universe trembles. To shake the nations with words does not impress anyone who dwells here. But when even the least of My brethren on earth shows love, it brings joy to My Father’s heart. When even the most humble church sings to My Father with true love in their hearts, He silences all of heaven to listen to them. He knows that one cannot help but to worship when they are beholding His glory here,but when those who are living in such darkness and difficulty sing with true hearts to Him, it touches Him more than all of the myriads of heaven can.

and by a single sin one shuts God out by within refusing His Truth

“Many times, the broken notes from earth caused all of heaven to weep with joy as they beheld My Father being touched. A few holy ones struggling to express their adoration for Him has many times caused Him to weep.Every time I see My brethren touch Him with true worship, it makes the pain and grief I knew on the cross seem like a small price to pay. Nothing brings Me more joy than when you worship My Father. I went to the cross so that you could worship Him through Me. It is in this worship that you, the Father and I are all one.”

It is a simple Truth almost all men ignore , One can either obey God and Jesus and love all men all the time, or obey Satan and sin all one's life away in conflict even with the voice of God within... to one's eventual shame with oneself... for me it is sadness that so few believe in Love that is God enough to stop sinning, to truly repent and CHANGE from sin in water baptism as they say but few do ... Matt 7:13-14 ... and so teh many are destroyed to free them from sin [Romans 6:7] because they will not stop sinning to accept grace ...

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid

to underline what almost all men find impossible to believe, grace is forgiveness of ONLY PAST sins , if one sins after spirit baptism only death can save one from this will to defy God and follow Satan...

Romans 3:25 [Jesus] whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

repentance is not the joke all sinners make of it , confessing without any intent to actually STOP sinning all their lives... God will not be fooled as men fool themselves that they can sin and still be accepted by Jesus ... Jesus says it EXPLICITLY , no sinners will be taken at his return ,only TRIED saints, baptised of fire in trial of LOVE as pure as his :-

Luke 13:27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

1 John 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.


I find it IMPOSSIBLE that anyone who reads teh words of God with INTEGRITY can moss these scriptures explicitly pointing out what is OBVIOUS: God requires but SAINTS to run Jesus' kingdom come under Jesus , not sinners as run religion of this world for Satan -Rev 13:3-4

Love is NOT sin, sin is unloving ABUSE of fellow man and DISOBEDIENCE to God so that Jesus is not Lord of any sinner , Satan is lord of all sinners ...

1 John 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him...
1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

 

[DennisTate]

Wow!!!!!!!! In my opinion Anonymous has covered the subject of the Rapture from an angle that I had never read before in my entire life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DennisTate]

Physics is only a combination of God's inspirations and of mankind looking BACKWARD to see the future on basis of what has gone before and listening to God when we get stumped for new ideas [as the 'greats' have many acknowledged in their autobiographies] ... Physics is NOT a worthy God nor any sort of way to know what is beyond current fashions of thought in men [look at the past to UNDERSTAND that all thought is JUST fashion, not Truth - that God CONTROLS thought in men]

God has said that He has no time and we even KNOW time is only a local variable of space , NOT fundamental ... God does not change , simply is perfect and creates that which changes and thus ENDS ... God however is endless ,endlessly creating ... that is NOT the same as infinite... infinity is BY DEFINITION incomplete , NOTHING can be infinite BY DEFINITION , not even God can be so absurd as men using words they don't understand like this [about God] ... if one stops being self-contradictory in word usage then one can learn at least what we have words about ... there never was, nor can be an infinity of time then, Newton made a self-contradicting assumption because of the mistake in Mathematics of his time, because of fashion...


........

Raimi Stranger....Wow!!!! I truly love your comment that nothing by definition can truly be infinite!!!!! That is so true....even God is just getting started at creating as far as I can see!!!!!

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Raimi Stranger....Wow!!!! I truly love your comment that nothing by definition can truly be infinite!!!!! That is so true....even God is just getting started at creating as far as I can see!!!!!

I know most folks find it hard to realise, but time really is only a local variable , a phenomenon only local at every point in space , there is no fundamental time, it is simply a 'convenient' lie we live by that different clocks agree on earth, they do not ... God knows nothing of time, even with God's supreme power to persuade mankind in the end to be happy by Loving one another, and His power to create at will anything He can imagine existing, God cannot change from being perfect, cannot change at all because He has no time to change in, time is mankind's idea and mostly it is a false idea... just a bad habit because theidea has been in fashion in science for a long time... but some are now formulating a better Physics without it... it always has been a disastrous simplification that spawned many lies even about God...

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Phantasman....I think that you are onto something HUGE when you refer to the sense of HUMOUR that God almost certainly must have!

Hell as a place of only the negative emotions also seems to be a highly insightful idea!

Hell [hades, sheol] is specifically not a place ... and no-one knows anything at all in death, it is NOT a conscious state of being , one is not located anywhere, just as-it-were formless spirit 'with God' with the proviso that all who died sinners still have to return to humanity to be persuaded to try Love and see God is right, Love of all really is a better way to live for everyone ...

Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

the spirit then is the essence of a man which ensures no-one can ever get killed permanently , all are resurrected from hell and death -as Jesus points out [Rev 20:13]

God is not subject to destruction so the spirit is the [only] immortality of mankind ... it is simply that sinners are bot ready to stay with God in 'translation', all who sin to death are resurrected to the new earth until they Love by trying it and finding God is right, it WORKS! ... after two deaths death is denied , so one is left with one's shame until one relents and tries Love , Love being always TRIALLED in baptism of fire as even John the baptist pointed out , the final time of trial of Love being baptism in the lake of fire...

anyway, there can be no emotions in death, the daed are not conscious, the spirit is not a consciousness but is timeless perfection, conciousness is like a stream in time... not possible in death or in the perfect unchanging spirit ...

 

[Raimi Stranger]

So would that mean that God listens to our prayers out of a sense of duty but not because He actually enjoys our prayers?

One prays for one's own sake... if one makes words out of 'inspiration' of the holy spirit in spirit baptism , that is only for sake of communicating with those not yet convinced to stop sinning and receive God ... God does not deal in any way with physicality except through Jesus to provide sufficient information to move beyond it through becoming one, or as Jesus puts it to love all without thought or exception.... because God is undivided that is how one can know God ... so prayer is going very wrong if it does not evry rapidly become meditation, listening to God with one's whole being [spirit] , not spouting words about one's empty fleshly troubles in the world or moments of bliss imagining one knows what is beyond life and Love before translation to spirit...

 

[Raimi Stranger]

What do you think of the idea that there are a certain segment of the population who...in a sense graduate from their experiences on earth much as a certain percentage of the population graduate from university.....or should I say Bible college???!!

The remnant of Israel is tens of thousands of saints [Jude 1:14, Matt 7:13-14, Rev 7:3-8] who are as he is in this world , truly Loving of all and trialled [mostly to death] in their freely given long-suffering all-forgiving non-judgemental Love of all folks... they are spoken of throughout the scripture from beginning to end as the kings and priests [e.g. Exodus 19:6, 1Peter 2:9-10, Revelation 1:6 ]of the king of kings, high priest not of mortal orders, but of the immortal order of Melchizedek with high priest Jesus the Messiah of Israel...

that is about one in three million alive today follow Jesus as the saints he requires to build and run his kingdom come in the righteous [to love] new earth...

2 Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world

Revelation 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

 

[DennisTate]

One prays for one's own sake... if one makes words out of 'inspiration' of the holy spirit in spirit baptism , that is only for sake of communicating with those not yet convinced to stop sinning and receive God ... God does not deal in any way with physicality except through Jesus to provide sufficient information to move beyond it through becoming one, or as Jesus puts it to love all without thought or exception.... because God is undivided that is how one can know God ... so prayer is going very wrong if it does not evry rapidly become meditation, listening to God with one's whole being [spirit] , not spouting words about one's empty fleshly troubles in the world or moments of bliss imagining one knows what is beyond life and Love before translation to spirit...

Yesterday I saw an episode of Sid Roth on speaking in tongues that in my opinion was the best that I had ever heard! I've seen and heard my wife speak in tongues often. The first time it ever happened to her was in Quito, Ecuador and a women there told her afterward that she was praising God in a dialect from India....that she knew because she was from India!!!!! I have never spoken in tongues myself but Sid's telecast sure does make me want to find out more about this phenomena!


Sid Roth - Sid Roth - It's Supernatural

Guest: Sid Roth
February 4-10, 2013

Sid Roth shares that the most significant supernatural tool has been hijacked from the Church! Learn how this gift of the Spirit can change your life. Sid wants to help you pray in supernatural languages. Increase in the supernatural of God every day of your life!

 

[Raimi Stranger]

...what do you think of this verse in the Catholic Bible that says that a time is coming when the wrath of God is somehow pacified?????

I suspect that the appeasing of the wrath of the Lord happens as we get closer and closer to that time when everybody knows God....from the least to the greatest.
[Hebrews 8:11]

God makes it crystal clear in scripture that the destructiveness of sin will destroy itself by destroying this earth [a system visible as both the capitalist rat-race man-mangling machine, and its fully integrated religion of sinners under Satan's rule destroying ability of man to know God by the ONLY means possible to hide God from man, sin]

God's 'wrath' as man sees it , is simply to allow mankind to destroy itself whilst God take the very few [Jude 1:14] saints who Love as He commands, as Jesus commands, to build and run the kingdom come so that after the Millennium countless many can be saved by the EXAMPLE of a society run by perfect Love of all where any sin brings a second death to any of teh many who were destroyed for sin in this earth -Matt 7:13- but are all resurrected [Rev 20:13] free of sin [Rom 6:7] and at last baptised of the spirit -Joel 2:28- to have the very best chance of being saved by works of Love after death [Rev 20:13] simply by following the norm in Jesus' kingdom and resisting Satan resurrected for the purpose of trialling them...

thus God's 'wrath' is just a figure of speech, a way of portraying god as if the spirit were human with human reactions... it is simply poetry [and poetry does not translate ]

 

[DennisTate]

God makes it crystal clear in scripture that the destructiveness of sin will destroy itself by destroying this earth [a system visible as both the capitalist rat-race man-mangling machine, and its fully integrated religion of sinners under Satan's rule destroying ability of man to know God by the ONLY means possible to hide God from man, sin]

......]

Raimi, do you believe as I do that the literal earth will NOT be destroyed, but instead will be saved and it will be the evil society of the earth that willl fall??

I do believe that the time is coming when the deserts of the earth will blossom like a rose and springs will break forth in the deserts!

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Artistically inclined people seem to be somewhat more emotional than average.

I would love to see some of you artistically inclined Christians join in this discussion that is already on the third page....and I just began the topic this morning!

I am a poet , deeply upset beyond measure at the lack of Love between folks that God and Jesus command of all who follow Jesus... so few clearly do...

I am thus very aware that much of scripture is poetry in the original... it was never meant to be taken literally ... God is in no way capable of emotions yet is portrayed that way for sake of using language specialised to THIS world to convey ideas way beyond it of its creator being, NOT a human being... it is POETIC LICENCE to give God emotions, nothing more, but it is a very useful poetic technique ... our language did NOT evolve to talk about God , it HAS to be abused every time it is used to describe about God ... live with it...

WHEN one stops sinning and actually Loves everyone as God and Jesus command then [and only then] will god communicate as he does by his spirit DIRECTLY, no words except what one PUTS on it ... then you will know the bane of poets, that our words are NOT ENOUGH for the Truth , one cannot express what God communicates with our sad vocabulary of this life...

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Raimi, do you believe as I do that the literal earth will NOT be destroyed, but instead will be saved and it will be the evil society of the earth that willl fall??

the bible seems clear that this whole universe will be destroyed once God has the FEW saints He requires from this earth to build the kingdom come in the new earth and NEW HEAVENS ,but I'm not sure how important a point that is excepting that Jesus' assurance of the resurrection of all souls that ever lived [Rev 20:13] will require a larger new earth than this one , and it does take the whole universe to generate even one earth ... the stability required in an earth is phenomenally unusual , unlikely...

Isaiah 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

2 Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.[to Love! ]

Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

I do believe that the time is coming when the deserts of the earth will blossom like a rose and springs will break forth in the deserts!

climate change could well do that, but at the same time part of the Amazon rain forest is already turning to desert too... we have upset the stability of the climate and weather ... that was beyond stupid because nature is vastly more powerful than mankind and used to be our friend, now becomes an enemy of greater power than us... our problem being that growing food depends absolutely on predictable and benign weather which we have now lost for ourselves, we shall starve in billions as the bible says , but also men will fight over every resource,not learning that sharing works better by far...
and the diseases we made for biological warfare already broke out in worldwide plagues [e.g. AIDS is caused by a Mycoplasma developed under CIA funding for decimating world population problems ... turned out to be less effective than expected ,but there is far worse to come according to the bible ,even escape of flesh eating bacteria in world plague that can only occur through bio-engineering by man-un-kind ... and finally we have destabilised the earth's crust and the vulcanism that results will blot out the sun , no more plant food, animals to die, then us ... see Matthew 24 for instance, this is how we destroy the viability of earth... God however will destroy the heavens once we have seen the consequences of man-un-kind's insanity of greed for power to enslave mankind by lies in politics, religion, even manipulated mock-science and of course the 'news' and sadly the web too ... evil knows no bounds except the physical ones that God will allow to destroy all evil with this earth... so man can start again from teh Loving kingdom of Jesus Christ and the few saints redeemed first from this earth...

 

[Raimi Stranger]

....because it is logical for somebody who is getting themselves into ridicule and persecution to ask, what am I doing all this work for if everybody is eventually saved anyway?

Not so... the common idea that salvation is all or nothing now is bery obviously counter to Jesus teaching that the salvation of the kingdom is a power process, progressive...

so the Love of the very few saints of this world has benefits in an early redemption to spirit avoiding the very worst time mankind has or will ever know... the biblical fact that the many are saved later [e.g. Rev 7:9-10] does not save the many from being destroyed [Matt 7:13] in the wrath of God against all still sinners, not Loving, by Jesus' return ...

so to say that it makes no difference is simply to have not bothered reading and understanding the scripture of God, the commonplace mistake of thinking one can learn from sinners about God when Jesus died specifically to bring the Truth DIRECT FROM GOD to all who trouble to follow him and Love all folks in THIS life , not sin like the masses [even the masses of mass religion of sinners taught the lies of religion by sinners for their livelihoods]

Jesus CANNOT take any sinners , has said so :-

Luke 13:27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

2 Timothy 2:19 ... the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

the commandment to Love all means NO SINS after spirit baptism... few make it - Matt 7:13-14, Rev 7:3-8, Jude 1:14 grace depends on CEASING to sin :-

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

sinners teach otherwise, but Jesus warned us where mass religion leads -Rev 13:3-4-

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Anonymous reply regarding the Rapture:
Revelation 8:7, apostle John;
7 The first angel sounded his trumpet, and there came hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down upon the earth.
A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up."

this is more-than-possible with climate change, all ecosystems depend completely upon the local weather and when it cahnges too quickl they just die off... mankind has changed the weather worldwide already, it will get much worse now... we know that 2C was the limit for only 'minor disruption, a 4C rise is now the minimum predicted , major destruction worldwide caused by man's sins of greed in capitalism and uncaring for the planet's stability on which life completely depends, now sure to be lost ... already we are in mass extinction rates of species loss caused by mankind directly

Revelation 16:3-7, apostle John;
3 The second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it turned into blood like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died."

the sea is dying from BOTH the CO2 from cars and industry acidifying the oceans and from rampant over-fishing... but the death of plankton and corals from acidification means no food for any sea animals , death of all living things in the sea by starvation because we drivr cars and like the 'easy life' of mass industry ... the cost though will kill us all, the land cannot survive without life in the sea, the web of life is broken already, life is dying, mankind will starve and be taken down with plagues , those who are not killed in the insane wars of man for everything remaining, and finally teh unstable earth's vulcanism blots out the sun and litle life can live without the sun , mankind ends because of our sin, just as the bible says, predominantly wars, pestilence, starvation and vulcanism... e.g jesus predictions -Matt 24

"5 Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say:
“You are just in these judgments, you who are and who were, the Holy One, because you have so judged;
6 for they have shed the blood of your saints and prophets, and you have given them blood to drink as they deserve.”

instead of listening to the saints they were killed as heretics to apostate religion of sinners ...that is Satan's way in religion and he will rule almost all men -Rev 13:3-4

7 And I heard the altar respond:
“Yes, Lord God Almighty, true and just are your judgments.”"

God needs a solution to worldwide sin of the masses worshipping a false god -Rev 13:3-4- evil does the job for God, death of all sinners, God has only to take the few saints and start with the Loving to build the Loving kingdom of Jesus Christ in the new earth... simple and straightforward for the creator...

John 16:25, Jesus;
“Though I have been speaking figuratively,
a time is coming when I will no longer use this kind of language but will tell you plainly about my Father."

Jesus indeed spoke clearly later on

Matthew 13:34-35;
Jesus spoke all these things to the crowd in parables; he did not say anything to them without using a parable.
So was fulfilled what was spoken through the prophet:
“I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter things hidden since the creation of the world.”

Matthew 13:13, Jesus;
This is why I speak to them in parables:“Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand."

the many do not even trouble to read what Jesus really said, they believe the false gospel of modern apostate mass religion of sinners led by sinners led by Satan towards Rev 13:3-4 ... most have no idea of Jesus warnings rthat religious tadition is NOT about God but about Satan as false god of men pretending he is Christ returned...

25 “Though I have been speaking figuratively, a time is coming when I will no longer use this kind of language
but will tell you plainly about my Father..."

Jesus did this to the saints as also the holy spirit taught vteh saints by God directly

1 Corinthians 2:13-14, Paul;
13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.
14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him,
and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned."

the holy spirit [John 16:13] does not communicate in words as such... but directly spirit to spirit...

2 Peter 3:15-16;
15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation,
just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him.
16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters.
His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort,
as they do the other Scriptures,
to their own destruction."

the masses of mass religion of sinners will worship the wrong god [Rev 13:3-4 and be destroyed for sin [Matt 7:13] because they refuse to stop sinning and obey Jesus by Loving all...

2 Peter 2:1, Peter;
1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you.
They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—
bringing swift destruction on themselves."

the web abounds with false teachers easily exposed by simply reading the whole scripture , let alone by ceasing sinning to be baptised of the spirit to know all Truth from God [John 16:13] as Jesus promised and died to bring mankind

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Perhaps you see why Jesus never had anything written down that he taught the saints ... God Himself will teach all His few NOT MEN ... beware men who teach any more than scripture to show one all one needs to do is stop sinning SO THAT God can teach one Himself as Jesus said...

Matthew 7:21, Jesus;
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven,
but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven."

all one need do is STOP sinning and Love all instead... God will do the rest, all of it...

Isaiah 5:20-21;
20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil,
who put darkness for light and light for darkness,
who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
21 Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight."

sinners who teach sinners worldwide in fake churches of sinners buy for themselves the greatest tribulation mankind ever knew or will know... it is unbearable that men WILL not listen to the words of scripture and destroy mankind so terribly for nothing but greed for power over other men who accept authority of man over man and ignore God's words, god's holy spirit offered free to anyone whop prepares by ceasing from sin to be able to bear the truth about themselves and later all things... even the death of billions for sin of mankind as a whole in both politics and religion...

 

[DennisTate]

Not so... the common idea that salvation is all or nothing now is bery obviously counter to Jesus teaching that the salvation of the kingdom is a power process, progressive...

so the Love of the very few saints of this world has benefits in an early redemption to spirit avoiding the very worst time mankind has or will ever know... the biblical fact that the many are saved later [e.g. Rev 7:9-10] does not save the many from being destroyed [Matt 7:13] in the wrath of God against all still sinners, not Loving, by Jesus' return ...

so to say that it makes no difference is simply to have not bothered reading and understanding the scripture of God, the commonplace mistake of thinking one can learn from sinners about God when Jesus died specifically to bring the Truth DIRECT FROM GOD to all who trouble to follow him and Love all folks in THIS life , not sin like the masses [even the masses of mass religion of sinners taught the lies of religion by sinners for their livelihoods]

Jesus CANNOT take any sinners , has said so :-

Luke 13:27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

2 Timothy 2:19 ... the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

the commandment to Love all means NO SINS after spirit baptism... few make it - Matt 7:13-14, Rev 7:3-8, Jude 1:14 grace depends on CEASING to sin :-

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

sinners teach otherwise, but Jesus warned us where mass religion leads -Rev 13:3-4-

I am glad that you stress that salvation is a process that is progressive!

This is a truly important concept Raimi Stranger!

 

[Eman in spirit]

I love your quotes

“When My Father moves His little finger, the whole universe trembles. To shake the nations with words does not impress anyone who dwells here. But when even the least of My brethren on earth shows love, it brings joy to My Father’s heart. When even the most humble church sings to My Father with true love in their hearts, He silences all of heaven to listen to them. He knows that one cannot help but to worship when they are beholding His glory here,but when those who are living in such darkness and difficulty sing with true hearts to Him, it touches Him more than all of the myriads of heaven can.

“Many times, the broken notes from earth caused all of heaven to weep with joy as they beheld My Father being touched. A few holy ones struggling to express their adoration for Him has many times caused Him to weep.Every time I see My brethren touch Him with true worship, it makes the pain and grief I knew on the cross seem like a small price to pay. Nothing brings Me more joy than when you worship My Father. I went to the cross so that you could worship Him through Me. It is in this worship that you, the Father and I are all one.” (Pastor Rick Joyner, chapter 15, page 85, The Vision)

Yes I think God is very emotional, you may like to hear of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu of India an advent of the Lord 500 years ago as a devotee of Krishna. He would laugh and cry and dance and sing, he was very emotional I think this shows us that God is emotional but we have to understand the difference between material emotions and spiritual emotions, spiritual emotions make the feeling of material emotions look like mud, they are an endless ocean of Love for God one is simultaneously in his body and in the spiritual world at the same time, nothing can compare and what little taste we can get of it may show us the ecstatic love The Lord God feels.

 

[DennisTate]

I love your quotes

Yes I think God is very emotional, you may like to hear of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu of India an advent of the Lord 500 years ago as a devotee of Krishna. He would laugh and cry and dance and sing, he was very emotional I think this shows us that God is emotional but we have to understand the difference between material emotions and spiritual emotions, spiritual emotions make the feeling of material emotions look like mud, they are an endless ocean of Love for God one is simultaneously in his body and in the spiritual world at the same time, nothing can compare and what little taste we can get of it may show us the ecstatic love The Lord God feels.

So true! The people who report meeting God in a near death experience say that it is utterly impossible for them to convey in English what their experience was really like!!!!

My wife is from Quito, Ecuador and she observed "dancing in the Holy Spirit" in the Gypsy church there. She says it was astonishing......it was as if the women were almost defying gravity by what they could do when they were in that state of mind!!!!!

 

[DennisTate]

I would say "no". Most emotions come from survival instincts wired into our physical bodies. God is spirit and not subject to natural desire.

Soulgazer..........let's imagine for a moment that those scary NDE accounts are real.............if you were the Creator..........and if you had made that hellish/guilt/shame/despair environment possible.........would you feel some responsibility to arrange for a way to get people out of there?????!!!


http://www.christianforums.com/t7759564/
Why such a seeming contrast in NDE accounts where people saw hell... and heaven?

My wife gave me a truly shockingly scary near death experience account to watch yesterday. I have already watched 48 minutes and I think that this would make a good discussion:

Angelica Zambrano (23 Hours Dead) Visits Heaven & Hell (with English voice-over) - GNLi:Christian Videos