Conversions to Orthodoxy

the answer is easy ... disasm couldnt accept it, well, because he's crazy (winking eye)

Part III - Campus Fellowships and Finding Orthodoxy

At this time I got involved with NAV's, CNA, CRUX, and Veritas, and remained involved in Wesley to a certain extent. I was really searching for where the truth was, and they all held different beliefs. Some were Calvinist, others Arminian. My friend Josh started leading a mens bible study, which going to I made a really good friend Jesse. We got to know each other really well and I found out he really liked to debate. He introduced me to the Willard Preacher, of which at the time he was debating against constantly. I got involved in a number of debates, but for the most part, I agreed with this guy except when he was arguing that there were problems in protestantism. I couldn't let go of my strong beliefs in opposition to the Tradition to listen to this guy. I didn't know what "denomination" he was, but I knew I didn't like him at the time.

Over the summer I went with a group of friends to Creation, a Christian Rock festival an hour away from State College. Jesse was there and we spent a good amount of time together. It was an uplifting experience, but at the end I felt like I was in a serious spiritual slump, so I turned to the Internet and came across some sites that negatively critiqued many different aspects of Christianity, and especially the NIV. Well I was drawn to some of this because I was starting to not like the NIV anymore already, and I read and read and read. At this same time Josh's men's group was going through Romans, and Jesse told me he was inquiring into Orthodoxy. We got into some heated debates about sola scriptura with each other; ironically though, most of the time during bible study it was me and him vs. everyone else. Well, Jesse sadly stopped coming and the bible studies seemed to lose the aspect of a good debate in searching for the truth. Many people were getting fed up with the translation differences I brought up on every verse we studied.

I met a girl in January. At the same time I was getting very fed up with organized religion, and she was an atheist, so I held to being a Christian but apruptly stopped going to church and other campus fellowships. She broke up with me in the summer, and I took it hard and really started searching, but everywhere I went I couldn't find any answers, so I casually went to church, and spent a lot of time with my Wesley friends, but that was about it. At this same time I started going to a Wesley Bible study on Corinthians and I brought my KJV to everyone and debated with others. There was a girl with a KJV bible as well, but she always came to the opposite conclusions I did. At this time I started to question how so many people could read the bible and all come up with different answers. My friend Josh tried to convince me that multiple opinions could be correct as long as none of them diminished the message of the gift of salvation. I didn't really accept that view though.

Then came this last semester. Josh and I continued to talk a lot, as well as argue about doctrinal points, but still my spiritual slump was not ending. I returned to my music and started playing guitar a lot. I got involved in a Friday night worship time with my wesley friends that was unofficial because Tyson didn't approve of it. Singing made me feel better, but things just still didn't seem to fit in place. I pretended like everything was okay, but deep down I knew things were wrong and I didn't know the answer.

With all this guitar playing, I decided to go to a Veritas coffee house and play a couple of my old band songs my friend Josh wrote. I ran into Jesse here as well as some other Orthodox friends of his. I found my friend Rachel from NAV's had just converted to Orthodoxy, and I was really intrigued. They sang Christ is Risen a capella and it was the most invigorating song I had heard. I talked to Army Matt, another Orthodox friend of which I had argued with and against at Willard. He explained some things to me regarding the Trinity and the sign of the cross, and I decided I would go to OCF that week, so I did.

OCF was rather strange at first. The prayers they did were different but yet intriging. Fr. Alexander Atty was filling in for Fr. John that day, and he was speaking of repentance in ways I had never known before. That night I hanged out with the OCF members at Alex's house, and I decided I wanted to check out Vespers on Saturday night. I went and the only way I can describe it is like heaven on earth. I dug into every book I could, not because I was trying to find a flaw in Orthodoxy, but to fix the flaws in my thinking. I first read a book rebuking sola scriptura, then I read The Orthodox Way. I read the writing of St. John of Damascus to get over my fear of veneration of icons. I then read the Orthodox Church, and absolutely loved learning the history. around this time I started attending Orthodoxy 101 in addition to Vespers on Wednesday and Saturday, Matins and Liturgy on Sunday, as well as an Akathist every Monday.

Well, that's my story up to this point. I still have a long road ahead of me but I've found the path I need to be on in life. Please keep my journey in your prayers. I'm in the process of becoming a catechumen and will eventually be baptized and chrismated.

Whoa,what a great story!
My prayers for your journey!
Keep up the good work!

vanshan said:

I wrote this post in another section, but as it gives a little insight into why I became Orthodox I thought I'd paste it here too:

When did the one Church become two, then two dozen, then a thousand, then tens of thousands? If fragmentation is such a good thing, why didn't Christ start planting independent Churches immediately when He walked among us? Why didn't he establish denominations, with each having autonomy to interpret the gospel independently from the other denominations or even each congregation? Why did Paul exhort the early Christians to hold fast to the oral and written traditions that they passed down to them, if every congregation was meant to have autonomy to read and interpret scripture for themselves?

Christ didn't establish multiple denominations! To say so would be complete nonsense, which only an ahistorical bafoon could defend. Christ came to create a new covenant with God's people. He came to rescue the captives by conquering death. He came to reveal God to us. This revelation is no secret, although through the foggy filter of years of historical divisions, corruptions, and fragmentation the truth has been hidden from many of us.

I grew up protestant, but after beginning a very basic study of what happened from the Ascension of Christ through the first 11 centuries, I could no longer be protestant. I could no longer sit through another Oral Roberts University chapel, which was carefully orchestrated by men and women to lead us students through various planned emotional experiences. It became clear that all of this was so contrived, so man-made, and really man-centered, regardless of how many times they shouted out the name, Jesus. It was nothing like the intensity and powerful witness of the early church I was just discovering. I could not longer attend services centered on a preacher getting up on stage and strutting around for 1/2 an hour or more, wiping sweat from his brow, working hard to get the attention and amens from the audience. These things were nothing like the life in Christ our Fathers of the Faith had experienced and written about.

The early church was more than intellectually stimulating sermons and emotionally titilating worship, it was participation in the reality of life in Christ. Life as One Body, with Christ as it's head. A miraculous union of heaven and earth was experienced in each worship service, where men mystically were united to Christ, through communion. These men weren't sitting around trying to come up with clever, gimmicky sermons, or planning praise and worship services to create emotional responses, they simply believed the revelation of Christ, as it had been passed-down by the Apostles, they held services in the way that they were taught by Christ, and they worked hard to defend the truth from error and pass down the Church without man-made ideas and changes seeping in. What about your particular churches? What have they done? Where did they begin? Are their teachings those passed down by Christ? None are completely absent from some truth, but none have preserved the fullness of the faith.

The Roman Catholic Church departed from the Ancient Universal Church in 1054 A.D., and never returned for many reasons, including the creations of the modern Papacy, with the Bishop in Rome claiming universal authority over all Christians. Errant doctrines arose, such as original sin, immaculate conception of Mary (suggesting that this is different than the way all men are born--without sin), infallibility of the Pope, Mary as Co-Mediatrix, purgatory and indulgences, a very legalistic system of penence, substitionary atonement (suggesting that God required the death of His Son to forgive us), and more.

The Protestants had every reason to break communion with Rome, but did they return home to the Universal Church preserved in east? The Patriarchs of Antioch, Jerusalem, Constantinople, Alexandria, and bishoprics across the growing eastern Church were there, although geographically, linguistically, and politically divided from the west. No, they didn't come home. The began working hard to correct the corruption in Rome, but instead of preserving the truth passed down through the ages, they started to reinvent the wheel, so to speak. They didn't return to the apostolic faith given by Christ, but instead, arrogantly, or foolishly, began creating churches for themselves, based on their ahistorical interpretations of scripture and limited intellects. The intellect of man is finite, unable to see God fully.

We must not imagine doctrine, from independent readings of scripture, but instead, we must accept the revelation of Christ and His Church as He established it. We must accept, by faith, those things which are larger than our minds can wrap themselves around. For example, must accept that Christ wants us to mystically consume His Blood and Body, so that He really can abide in us and we in Him. We must accept that the Holy Spirit comes down on the bread and wine offered and miraculously transforms them into the Blood and Body of Christ. Protestants trie to lay down doctrines which made sense to their finite minds, and in so doing, they lose Christ. They say, "Christ really means this is a symbolic communion." Or they say, "the bread and wine remain as such, since they still taste like bread and wine, but somehow spiritually Christ is present in them." Why all the pandeing to our finite intellect? Why explain how the miracle Christ gave us happens? We are in communion with the God who created the Universe, the God who cannot be contained, especially in our little minds.

Faith is what we must have. Then maybe we won't be so scared to look deeper into Christ's Church and humbly kneel before Christ, becoming part of His Body, not these various man-made entities. The Church may not be what you were hoping it would be, or what you've thought it was your whole life, but it is the Church of Christ. If you love the Lord God, you will earnestly seek the truth. If you don't then you will reap the penalty for eating only of the corrupted fruit scattered by men over the last few centuries.

If any of you have made it this far, sorry so long. Forgive me. I think it's so essential to tear down the false gods we have unintentionally created by creating a gospel we could intellectually make sense of, rather than accepting the revelation of Christ, and His One Holy Apostolic Church, which is Universal, in that it is for all of us and completely fulfills the real needs of us all, if we come home to it. Be one in the Church, even as God is one in Heaven, not divided into disagreeing sects, removed from Christs historic body, whch has been preserved, but often hidden from our eyes by our cunning enemy.

Basil

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If anything this story would sum up my reasons for converting to Orthodoxy if ever I decide to do so, I definitely agree with this.
I plan on reading this whole thread I love to read, it keeps me occupied at work too, and these stories are so interesting!

Hello all,

This is my first post. I was received into the Orthodox Church on Lazarus Saturday of 2005. I could not live without the Divine Liturgy in my life. Christ and his saints are present in my life because of His grace and my participation in His holy mystery.

I was raised and educated as a Roman Catholic. It was the example of my Russian Orthodox grandmother and her prayers which led me to the truth of Orthodoxy. It took me some time to get where I am but the journey was worth it.

Good to be among you!

J.Sokol

Yay! More good news! Welcome to TAW!

Sam

DavidBryan said:

My story is here.

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I'm going to show that to a Pentecostal friend of mine

By request. Please note that some of the events in my story may only be mentioned in a particular phase but in reality they happened over a longer period of time and that some of this is a blurr to me now.



I’ll start this story by talking a bit about what my life was like before I became lost. I was baptized into the Lutheran church as an infant. Growing up, I stayed relatively active in the church starting with Sunday school, children’s choir, acolyte, and during high school, ushering.
My time in the church, I never really learned to question anything and I never payed attention to the other denominations (or religions for that matter). I knew of them, but I did not know of the various other beliefs. I followed God and Christ and there were many at my church I looked up to as examples of what is good in Christianity.
The only time I went to another church was for a year in Arizona (Catholic, very few memories) and one of the megachurches in high school. There the preacher talked about an error in the KJV bible about how something that was added on. This was the first question of ‘What can I trust.’
Another thing that would have a ramification on me was becoming a volunteer Sheriff’s Deputy. I learned to question everything and to always doubt things at face glance.


It was during my third year of high school that I joined Campus Crusade, a Christian outreach group. At first, it wasn’t a very deep joining, just going to weekly meetings. But during the last year of school, I began to go to the night events and this would be the beginning of story.
It was there that new beliefs were introduced into to me for the first time. Things I wasn’t taught at church but that I did not know to be careful of. Once Saved, Always Saved, Symbolic Pressence, new concepts of Revelations, the invisible church, and many others that come as a blurr now that I am older.
It was the OSAS though that really hit hard. It caused doubt at first until one of the Campus Crusade guys gave some advice. There were signs from the beginning that this doctrine wasn’t sound (that I continued to sin) but I followed what they said.
Things went somewhat smoothly from then. Some events in my life dealing with the drama of the other students hit me, and this would lead to me leaving the group. Unbeknownst to me, I was drifting from my church. After graduation, I stopped going (usually I only missed summer but after summer ended, I never went back) and this was partially due to the idea of an invisible church. Why worry about going to a visible church when there was an invisible one?
Over the next year, God and church became less and less important. I didn’t notice the loss, nor did I notice that sins I’d never faced before began to creep in. I don’t know exactly what caused the damn to break, but sometime near the beginning of fall ’98, I just lost it. Somewhere in this, my cousin and his talks about his church and God just upset me and added to the confusion, though I am not sure where it fits in here.
Three things about the time that stick out is the constant religious antics at college (SWAT for Christ comes to mind though this was later) and just a pure confusion of who God was anymore in my mind. Another was my new girlfriend (my first gf and I had ended our relationship during the summer). She wasn’t a bad girl, but she introduced some massive mixture of New Age stuff into my life. Something of a mix between shamanism and Wiccan.
The last thing, was a search for myself. The sins were beginning to press and I was dealing with the beginnings of some new spiritual problems. Years later, I started calling them howlers (demons if you will) as they found some of my sins and constantly howled for me commit the sins, something I refused though I would feed them a bone now and then and so it went and internal war was joined.


All of this new stuff really caused me to struggle. I became Christian in name only. I toyed with shamanism and runes for a while. The constant infighting of the Christian sects, the bad doctrines, and the self-righteous of so many popular Christians pushed me farther from Christ. I still prayed sometimes but I wasn’t sure if God really existed.
So I turned to the one stable thing in my life, science. I have always been good at looking at the big picture of things and I decided to put that to good use to find the Truth. I had no idea what the Truth was, but it was out there somewhere.
I began to take science class after science class, trying to expand my understanding of the big picture. Biology, archaeaology, sociology, psychology, astrophysics, anthropology, and others as well as religious cult class, philosiphy, and history.
Three things here really touched me and I remember them well. First was the Big Bang theory. I remembered Genesis and how similar the theory was to this event. The second was history of the rise of the RCC and some of their historical events. The last was a lecture by my Biology professor when he was talking about the first cells and how they were formed. His comment still rings with me, ‘We just don’t know how this happened.’
God had given me a taste of the Truth. I realized that no matter how big of a picture I had, it would never be big enough, but there was a pattern that I could see that hit like a wall. That creation was not random and that it was perfect. That small revelation would change my path. I backed away from the runes and shamanism. I knew that the Truth was there but that it wasn’t pantheistic.
On and off, I began to look for a church to go to. Sadly, I kept finding things that just didn’t add up. Some groups theology, I could poke holes in it big enough to sail and aircraft carrier through. Naturally I avoided OSAS groups and the RCC. Strangely I never felt the need to go back to my old church.
After a good search, I felt that whatever the Truth in Christianity had at first, it’d been lost under the many groups.


But first, it was time to go to Japan. I had gotten two internships that would send me halfway around the world for a year. Here there was silence of faith that I hadn’t seen before. No Christian churches in my town and the low level of Shinto shrines and Buddhist temples didn’t really affect me much. My time in Japan also let me get ride of my old girlfriend which I’d been unable to do, having boxed myself in so very perfectly. I did meet some Christians, but they didn’t really affect my faith because I kept my search to myself.
September 11th was the only thing that affected me. It brought a lot of thought into my life, what with Republicans running up the nationalism and the constant talk of God put faith back on my radar. Coming back though was rough. It was like some sort of insanity had taken ahold of America.


Coming back wasn’t easy. It was like some sort of low level insanity had permeatted the US. Maybe the British military song ‘The World Turned Upside Down’ would work here. It was a rough few months at first.
Through the internet, I looked for a church a bit. It was half hearted to say the least. I did find a Greek Orthodox Church in my city, but never followed through with my curiousity. Something else had come my way. I met a girl in Korea who simply blew my mind and captured my heart. She was Anglican and so she added a bit of Christianity into my life. I knew that if we were together, I’d be willing to go to church with her and the denomination didn’t matter. After that no further thought was put in. I was also introduced to Islam and was curious, but once again I didn’t pursue. I didn’t check into Judaism much for many reasons.
We did plan to get married. She came to the US for a month to be with me for graduation. After that it was off to Japan for me again where our relationship would last for another year and she would visit twice.
My new place in Japan was rural to say the least. The only foriegners were a Pakistani woman and a Phillipino man. Once again no church, the Board of Education at my place was a pain, and the junior high school had lots and lots of problems (elementary school was great though). But things were looking up. I had a plan for the future that included my Korean girlfriend and after two years I’d go back to America for grad school and on to a PhD. Things couldn’t have been better and all I had to do was wait. But God had other plans.


This is probably the hardest thing to write about. It began with my girlfriend and I breaking up in a very spectacular way (I still have the engagement ring I was to give her) because I listened to my Pakistani friend on what to do with our problems. At about this time, my howlers became super vocal (and got their names).
I finally started looking for God again in ernest, though in all the wrong places. Surprisingly though, it was checking into Islam more that would help guide me more to the Orthodox Church. I spent many hours talking about faith with a friend of mine from Yemen and we never debated but tried to understand each other. This self examination of Christianity and what I held dear in Christianity that I did would come in handy.
At first I took being single again as a new challenge and everything was wide open for me. However it was soon followed with a financial crunch that said no graduate school in the forseeable future. My attempts at finding a new girlfriend met in disaster as well. Swallowing my pride, I asked the BoE to stay an extra year. At first they said yes, but then they came up with a reason not to employ me (I did some investigating and found their resons to be a big lie).

So, the crunch was on and a massive job hunt began. I didn’t care if it was in America or if it was in Japan, just as long as I had a job. I got a job here and began preparing to move. Hopefully this would be the change of my luck.

How low can you go?

While the schools were much better, other things weren’t. My apartment was mold infested and my chances to build new friendships or meet new women ended in bitter failure. One of the worst parts was the girl my friends wanted to set me up with. Talk about demoralizing. I made a few friends, the most important being my Baptist friend who would help me along at a later date.
After a series of set backs and futally trying to get people to stop trying to set me up with that girl, I gave up and settled into a half life. Teaching was fine, but at night, the struggles increased. My howlers would howl all night long and side comments from my friends about unrelated things would cause tempation to blare in my face. By this point I gave up trying to pray to God (I prayed once and though drunk it did come from the heart). In fact I had given up on trying to find the truth as all avenues seemed closed. I still believed in the Truth I had found in college, but that was it.

After the first year, my boss’ wife introduced me to her best friend and set us up. On the surface, it looked like a perfect match. Underneath, it was anything but. She was completely selfish and didn’t even like me. The only reason she was with me was because I was American and she wanted to get married. While I had lost a lot over the years, the loss of my Korean girlfriend and what values that remained from being a Christian gave me the endurance and patience to deal with her (I felt like I deserved it as a punishment from on high).
She did one thing though that woke me up from my despair, though not what she wanted. She pushed for marriage and pointed out that I had to get my act together if I was to have enough money and make it happen. While she got her agreement for us to move in together (I’d buy the apartment and she the furniture) she also triggered a soul searching that made me realize that I had to have my faith. I was falling further and further and I had lost so much over the years. It was now or never for me. But what?
It happened in a rather strange way. After reading the Da Vinci Code, I knew that it wasn’t real, but there were all of these texts that I’d never heard of. So off I went to read them and learn more about the ancient church and the early church history. It started by opening up Gnosticism and the troubles with that group. From there, I learned about the 1st Ecumenical Council.
But that wasn’t the true discovery. The Ecumenical Council opened up information on the Orthodox Church. Here was a church that was claiming to be the ancient church that wasn’t Roman. Around the same time I found Zoroastrianism. I would read about both at the same time.
Zoroastrianism didn’t last long as it just didn’t hold much water. Orthodoxy however, now that held. I would try to poke holes in the theology and beliefs only to have my attempts rebuffed and get a major dose of humilty (this would become standard throughout the rest of my journey). I also learned about things I’d never thought of before as a wholer picture began to form.
Four months of this and some soul searching told me that I had found the Truth. It was as if some burden had been released. But there was more. Looking at myself, I knew one other thing. If I didn’t make it here, there’d be nowhere else to go for me.


Of course, finding the Truth and making anything out of it are two different things. First, how could a learn about Orthodoxy in person if it was all in Japanese? Seconds, ummm what about my gf? God had this already thought out.
I contacted an OCA priest from their website and asked him for advice. He said find the closest Japanese Orthodox Church and contact the priest. He was sure that something could be worked out. I also began to lurk in TAW and other Orthodox forums.
It took a few days to muster up the courage and to find all the right words, but I contacted Father George. At first I was wishy washy and non-commital about when I’d make it. However, the way he replied made it not an option to delay (divine order?).
That Saturday night, I made my first prayer in over a year and a half. It wasn’t big, but just saying the first word took great courage for I now knew the full implications of what I was saying, ‘Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, Have mercy on me a sinner.’
The next day, I made the two hour train ride (I took all locals ouch!) to the church. I was surprised that Father George’s wife Maria could speak English and so could Father George to a degree (he can listen much better). Divine Liturgy was an experience. It didn’t really surprise me, but to be at church for the first time in almost ten years was a sensation.
During this and the next trip, I would meet three important people who helped on my road to Orthodoxy. My sponsor, Dr. Mori, who had become Orthodox in America, Strahil, my Bulgarian friend and the one who helped me early on with a few extra books and suggestions, and Slobadan, my Serbian friend who showed me through his words and his actions a warmth and welcoming that caught me completely off guard. His sister in Greece would later help me even further with books and icons for the beginning of my journey after Chrismation.
It was during my third visit that I talked to Father George. We sat down and talked about my conversion in a bit more detail (mix of English and Japanese). I’m not sure why he decided what he did, but he allowed me to be a catechumen starting that day and set my Christmation on Holy Saturday, only six weeks later. I left that day with about six or eight books to read before my next visit (in two weeks).
Now came a problem. I knew what the church placed on marriage and I knew what would be said about living with my girlfriend as well as knowing that she’d never be able to accept the faith. I wasn’t even sure I wanted to deal with it but I had to decide on what to do. I wanted to talk to Father George about it, but he was too busy after the good news of my catachumen announcement. While waiting for the first train home, I got an email from her. She was breaking up with me. She’d been so selfish to me that she got what she wanted and walked all over me to the point that guilt had finally overwhelmed her, so she was fleeing the guilt.
The next six weeks were the hardest six weeks I’ve ever faced. It was like the devil had declared open season on me, doing everything he could to keep me from being Chrismated. Financial problems from the new apartment and going it alone without the second help, my howlers went on overtime constantly scream for attention, and other bad news. I knew that if I walked away from becoming apart of the Orthodox Church, it would disappear.
Finally Holy Saturday came. I was late for my own Christmation (train mix up) and it was a very long day. My Christmation went smoothly enough being in a mixture of Japanese and English. It was Pascha service though that something special really happened.
I was sick with bronchitus (I have it chronic) and I had been given the honor of reading the Gospel in English (there were others that would read in Russian, Bulgarian, Greek, and other languages). However, throughout the service, I could barely whisper. When it came time, I was totally surprised at how strong my voice was.
Finally, at the end of service when the blessing was done for me, something wonderful happened. As the singing began, I felt lifted and I cannot say whether I was on Earth or in Heaven.
I got home at seven in the morning and as I got ready to go to bed, I found one other blessing from God, my howlers were gone and for the first time in ages I was free of the struggle.

Wow that's a beautiful story! Thank you for telling it

Coming back though was rough. It was like some sort of insanity had taken ahold of America.

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I was in Spain when 9/11 happened and felt the same way when I came back. In some important ways I experienced more culture shock coming back home than I did going a second time to spain.

That was an amazing story. thanks so much for sharing it. It it was too much of anything, it was too short!

Thanks a lot for that.

God bless you brother and welcome home,

Xpy

Thank you for sharing your story, Hoakan!

There's always more to tell. Sadly, I am not good at expressing myself and some of this has blurred (for example all of the protestant groups and their messages and theology) that it's really hard to try to write more detail. I'd like to, but words just keep failing me.

Xypcoctomos, I understand what you mean. Coming back to the US and the shock was worse than the shock of either trip to Japan.

Thanks Hoankan.

Hoankan said:

There's always more to tell. Sadly, I am not good at expressing myself and some of this has blurred (for example all of the protestant groups and their messages and theology) that it's really hard to try to write more detail. I'd like to, but words just keep failing me.

Xypcoctomos, I understand what you mean. Coming back to the US and the shock was worse than the shock of either trip to Japan.

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Every time I visit a town from my childhood, I am shocked. The last time I visited San Francisco, all the freeways really scared me. It is so changed with the BART system and the 1989 earthquake they had.

I guess what really is shocking is all the buildings -- and less parks and open space.

Then I read about the monasteries and how they are supposed to be duplicates of heaven.

Kyriakos Markides mentions that in his book Gifts of the Desert. Yes, parts of that book cause you to wonder, but on the other hand, it is not so preachy that I can recommend it to a non-Orthodox who is not really conservative. I do think that conservative protestants might react unfavorably to Markides' book due to some of the New Age references in it, so my priest told me to be careful whenever recommending any book to an inquirer or catechumen. I usually tell them to contact the priest.

Barky said:

I just read all 62 pages of this thread (took me two days). It was incredible guys, I thank God He showed this to me.

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Wow, you are incredibly brave!

Barky said:

I just read all 62 pages of this thread (took me two days). It was incredible guys, I thank God He showed this to me.

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Wow, you are incredibly brave!

Michael the Iconographer said:

Wow, you are incredibly brave!

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Doubly wow!