conversion

[travisbaptist12]

Hello, my name is Travis. I'm currently a baptist, but for the past week or so I've been considering the idea of switching to the Catholic Church. It seems my views have been more and more lining up with the Catholic Church. Views like the importance of works, hwo the end times will truly play out, etc. It's a tough decsion, and I wanted consult you guys for your opinion, what should I do? Your comments will be greatly apprciated.

 

[BjBarnett]

hey travis! welcome to CF and OBOB

Im a recent convert from being a Baptist. I think you should pray about it greatly. no doubt though that you should be in the Catholic church if you are in line with its teachings. the Catholic church is the church that Jesus founded in 33AD and there is nothing like being in the church as Jesus intended it.

 

[PeterPaul]

Thank you for your sincerity. I would consider asking more questions about the Church, and attempting to understand it as well not just as a viewpoint, but as truth and validity.

For example, the RCC came directly from Christ and continues on with apostolic succession. What we as Christians must above all is consider what is true and apply it even when we disagree with it, otherwise what happens is what is called "church hopping" where our views do not conform but rather are the principal catalyst for conversion.

Ask questions here at OBOB. We are always here to help.

God bless you!

 

[faerieevaH]

Greetings, Travis, and welcome to OBOB. Well, the first important thing you seem to have already done: hear a calling in your heart and listen to it.

What you should do now is ask any question you want! People here will strive to answer and help you however they can, no matter what your decision. You could also always go talk to a Catholic priest about the ideas and questions you have, and don't forget to stop into a Church for some quiet time and adoration.

Be loved and blessed,
Eva

 

[faerieevaH]

*mutters to PP and BJ* You guys are just too quick for me!

 

[Benedicta00]

Hello, my name is Travis. I'm currently a baptist, but for the past week or so I've been considering the idea of switching to the Catholic Church. It seems my views have been more and more lining up with the Catholic Church. Views like the importance of works, hwo the end times will truly play out, etc. It's a tough decsion, and I wanted consult you guys for your opinion, what should I do? Your comments will be greatly apprciated.

My first advice to you is we should never ever convert because our belief lines up, because what a faith teaches agrees with us.

You should convert to Catholicism because you, and you will if you search enough, come to find that the Catholic Church is the Church that Jesus gave to us and since it is His Church it is under His control and it will/can’t, it wold be impossible to teach us anything false.

So we assent to what she teaches even if we personally don’t agree but we know she can never teach us a lie so we humble submit. Usually when we do, God give us the grace of understanding and then we come to know and believe what she teaches is true.

 

[JeffreyLloyd]

I come from the Southern Baptist Church too. Here is my testimony.

Please, the smart us thing you can do is ask questions.

http://www.christianforums.com/t66768-jeffreylloyds-testimony.html

 

[travisbaptist12]

I come from the Southern Baptist Church too. Here is my testimony.

Please, the smart us thing you can do is ask questions.

Thank you Jeffery, your testimony was powerful. It did raise one issue I've never really know about though, do you guys pray to Mary, and believe she was sinless? If so, why? And what about purgatory? Do Catholics believe that, if so, why? And what about the Apocrypha? I've heard from my pastor that it's bunk. Do you guys use it, and what exactly is it? I've never really know what it was, I just took my pastor's word for it. These are questions I've always wondered, and hope you can answer for me.

 

[Dream]

My first advice to you is we should never ever convert because our belief lines up, because what a faith teaches agrees with us.

Yes, this is very important Travis. You must remember that no man is perfect in his beliefs. That is why it essential to search for the Truth and then conform your beliefs accordingly. When people choose a religion that matches up with their beliefs, they are assuming that they know better than everybody else.

Fortunately, if your beliefs do align with the Catholic Church, than you are one step ahead. I will admit that many of my beliefs are not the same as the Catholic Church's teachings, but I admit to myself that I am subject to error. I surrender my will to the Church's teachings and try to educate myself to understand the Truth.

I'm not telling you not to convert to Catholicism, I'm just saying that you shouldn't do so because your current beliefs align. You should do so in order to become one with Jesus and the Church that He established on Earth. You should do so because you accept the Holy Spirit which has guided the Church for 2000 years. You should do so because you understand that the Catholic Church was not created by man, but by God Himself.

But like I said, if many of your beliefs are already aligned, you are already advantaged, because you already have a good understanding of the Truth.

God bless.

 

[Knee V]

The doctrine of purgatory is not a very elaborate doctrine. The catechism only defines 3 main points concerning purgatory: 1)There is a state of purification after death, 2) That state of purification is not hell, 3)Our prayers can affect those in that state of purification.

People often have a hard time with purgatory, claiming that if purgatory is necessary, then Christ's death and resurrection weren't good enough to pay for all of our sins. That is a misconception of what purgatory is. Purgatory has nothing to do with "paying for our sins". The Church teaches that Christ paid the full penalty for our sins. What purgatory deals with is what is often called "temporal punishment". But don't let the word "punishment" throw you off. "Temporal punishment" is referring to the temporal consequences of our sins, distinct from the actual punishment that Christ took upon himself.

In this life we sin. Even those in Christ still commit sins. The reason for that is we still have traces of our old nature hanging on to us. On the other hand, we believe that in Heaven there will be no sin. That is because we will not have a sinful nature. So somewhere in there our sinful nature has to be removed. THAT is purgatory.

In this lifetime the process of dying to sin is often painful. The Father chastens those whom He loves. That chastening is not pleasant, but it is necessary to drive us away from sin. That pain is not punishment for our sin, but it is still a consequence for our sin, a "temporal punishment". Just as the process of sanctification is painful here, so it will be when we experience the final phase of our sanctification. Purgatory is the completion of what God began in this life. It is painful now, and it will be painful there.

Also, purgatory is not a "place" where one spends "time". It is an act of God, not a place.

 

[Dream]

I've heard from my pastor that it's bunk.

Yes, Catholics believe in Purgatory and the Immaculate Conecption. Of course, we are always able to cite a basis for these beliefs.

Remember, Travis, that your pastor is just a man. He can make mistakes and is subject to error. The Catholic Church was created and guided by God Himself and is without error. No matter how many Catholic beliefs your pastor thinks are "wrong" or "stupid," it still does not have any effect on the Truth.

 

[JeffreyLloyd]

Thank you Jeffery, your testimony was powerful. It did raise one issue I've never really know about though, do you guys pray to Mary,

We don't pray to her, we ask her to pray for us. We believe the in something called the "Communion of Saints." Those in heaven are alive and praying for us here on earth.

and believe she was sinless? If so, why?

Because she gave birth to God. We believe she is the new Ark of the Covenant. Take a look at some of these scriptures:

http://www.scripturecatholic.com/blessed_virgin_mary.html#the_bvm-II

And read the book "Hail, Holy Queen: The Mother of God, in the Word of God" - By Scott Hahn. If you can't find a copy of the book, let us know here in OBOB, and someone will lend you a copy.

And what about purgatory? Do Catholics believe that, if so, why?

When we die, we are immediately judged by God. He may send us to three different places. Heaven. Once we get to heaven, we are there forever, and we can never leave. Hell. Once we get to hell, there is no leaving. You are in hell forever. Or you can go to Purgatory. If you made it to purgatory, this is a good thing, because the only place to go from here is Heaven.

The Bible tells us that nothing unclean can enter heaven. Nothing! When we sin, we damage our relationship with God. Every little lie, every time we do something we know we shouldn't, we are building up a wall between us and God.

God, being loving sent Jesus Christ to die for those sins. And because of his perfect sacrifice, we now have the power to overcome sin and come into a saving relationship with God.

Now once we become a Christian, and are "saved" that doesn't give us the right to sin all we went, because we know Jesus saved us on the cross. We are still responsible for what we do.

So when we die as a Christian, and still have sin in our life, we have a problem. The bible has told us we must be in a perfect state of grace to enter heaven. Nothing unclean -Rev. 21:27- The word “unclean” comes from the Greek word “koinon” which refers to a spiritual corruption. Even the propensity to sin is spiritually corrupt, or considered unclean, and must be purified before entering heaven. It is amazing how many Protestants do not want to believe in purgatory. Purgatory exists because of the mercy of God. If there were no purgatory, this would also likely mean no salvation for most people. This shows us how merciful God really is to us!

One of my favorite Protestant writer, C.S. Lewis, says:

Of course I pray for the dead. At our age the majority of those we love best are dead. What sort of intercourse with God could I have if what I love best were unmentionable to Him? I believe in purgatory. Our souls demand purgatory, don't they? My favourite image on this matter comes from the dentist's chair. I hope that when the tooth of life is drawn, a voice will say, 'Rinse your mouth out with this.' This will be purgatory. (Letters to Malcolm: Chiefly on Prayer, 107-109)

Some other scripture to think about is:

Matthew 12:31-3231 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Jesus says, “And anyone who says a word against the Son of man will be forgiven; but no one who speaks against the Holy Spirit will be forgiven either in this world or in the next.” Jesus thus clearly provides that there is forgiveness after death. The phrase “in the next” (from the Greek “en to mellonti”) generally refers to the afterlife (see, for example, Mark 10.30; Luke 18.30; 20.34-35; Eph. 1.21 for similar language). Forgiveness is not necessary in heaven, and there is no forgiveness in hell. This proves that there is another state after death, and the Church for 2,000 years has called this state purgatory.

Look at 2 Tim. 1:16-18 - Onesiphorus is dead but Paul asks for mercy on him “on that day.” Paul’s use of “that day” demonstrates its eschatological usage (see, for example, Rom. 2.5,16; 1 Cor. 1.8; 3.13; 5.5; 2 Cor. 1.14; Phil. 1.6,10; 2.16; 1 Thess. 5.2,4,5,8; 2 Thess. 2.2,3; 2 Tim. 4.8). Of course, there is no need for mercy in heaven, and there is no mercy given in hell. Where is Onesiphorus? He is in purgatory.

Open to 1 Peter 3:19; 4:6 We are told Jesus preached to the spirits in the "prison." These are the righteous souls being purified in purgatory.

Rev. 21:4 - God shall wipe away their tears, and there will be no mourning or pain, but only after the coming of the new heaven and the passing away of the current heaven and earth. Note the elimination of tears and pain only occurs at the end of time. But there is no morning or pain in heaven, and God will not wipe away their tears in hell. These are the souls experiencing purgatory.

Another leading Protestant Jerry L. Walls, also believes in purgatory, and read why he does here:

Purgatory for Everyone

And what about the Apocrypha? I've heard from my pastor that it's bunk. Do you guys use it, and what exactly is it? I've never really know what it was, I just took my pastor's word for it. These are questions I've always wondered, and hope you can answer for me.

http://www.cin.org/users/james/files/deuteros.htm

 

[Dream]

We don't pray to her, we ask her to pray for us.

Actually, we do pray to her. To pray is to make a request. We make a request to Mary to make a request to God on our behalf.

 

[JeffreyLloyd]

same thing

 

[Dream]

same thing

Yea, I know what you meant. I'm just in a nit-picky mood today.

 

[JeffreyLloyd]

 

[travisbaptist12]

Thanks for all of your help, it's been great. I've still got a lot of soul searching, researching, and praying to do. I will let you know though, that I'm likely to switch though.

 

[Dream]

Thanks for all of your help, it's been great. I've still got a lot of soul searching, researching, and praying to do. I will let you know though, that I'm likely to switch though.

Great! When you feel the Holy Spirit tugging at your soul, don't ignore it. Let it lead you in the right direction.

 

[Veritas]

Just wanted to welcome you to OBOB! Feel free to start individual threads about issues that you are questioning.

 

[Michelina]

This will come in handy:

http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc.htm

Bon Voyage!