Communion

[CrazyforYeshua]

God is the one who makes establishes the requirements. If you will please note, Jesus who is God, said that the wine that he blessed was His blood of the New, not the Old, Testament. He was the Passover Lamb who was officiating over a New Testament Passover feast which didn't just pass over your sin, but removed it. In like manner, he blessed the bread which no longer had to be unleavened because Jesus was the fulfillment of the law. Leavened bread is created from a living dough, not a dead dough. Jesus was a living sacrifice, not the dead sacrifice of the Old Covenant. He was giving them His blood which removes sin. This is a big difference between the Old and New Covenant.

I understand your point, I really do. But, this was before the arrest, before the trial, before the crucifiction. The Passover Feast was what it had been up until that point, with unleavened bread. Yeshua was saying He was making a new covenant, it hadn't been done yet. The Passover meal was made for them, they didn't make it themselves. There is no reason to believe, at that place, at that time, it was leavened bread, I can assure you it was not.


Exodus 12:8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it.


Exodus 12:15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.


Exodus 12:17 And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.Exodus 12:18 In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one and twentieth day of the month at even.Exodus 12:19 Seven days shall there be no leaven found in your houses: for whosoever eateth that which is leavened, even that soul shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he be a stranger, or born in the land.Exodus 12:20 Ye shall eat nothing leavened; in all your habitations shall ye eat unleavened bread.


Yeshua followed the Law of His Father, He would not have used anything except what His Father had set up. Yes, I know He fulfilled the Law, but He also followed it while He walked the earth. There was no reason for Him to use leavened bread, that's all I'm saying. So, if we were to be 100% scriptural, and take communion as He did with His disciples, we would all use Matzah.

 

[Prosperity]

Great post - exactly what I was thinking!

Then your thinking is wrong.

You think that it is legalistic to want to take communion it the way Jesus said to do tale it? Jesus tells you to do something and how to do it and you prefer to do it another way? You also seem to think that Jesus is so vane that he would tell you how and how often to take communion for no reason. It is not legalistic to do as the Lord has instructed. Why wouldn't want to do as Jesus instructed, the way He instructed you to do it. If you aren't taking communion the way Jesus gave us example to take it, then how do you call what you do taking communion?

 

[Prosperity]

I understand your point, I really do. But, this was before the arrest, before the trial, before the crucifixion. The Passover Feast was what it had been up until that point, with unleavened bread. Yeshua was saying He was making a new covenant, it hadn't been done yet. The Passover meal was made for them, they didn't make it themselves. There is no reason to believe, at that place, at that time, it was leavened bread, I can assure you it was not.

Exodus 12:8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it.

Exodus 12:15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.

Exodus 12:17 And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.Exodus 12:18 In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one and twentieth day of the month at even.Exodus 12:19 Seven days shall there be no leaven found in your houses: for whosoever eateth that which is leavened, even that soul shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he be a stranger, or born in the land.Exodus 12:20 Ye shall eat nothing leavened; in all your habitations shall ye eat unleavened bread.

Yeshua followed the Law of His Father, He would not have used anything except what His Father had set up. Yes, I know He fulfilled the Law, but He also followed it while He walked the earth. There was no reason for Him to use leavened bread, that's all I'm saying. So, if we were to be 100% scriptural, and take communion as He did with His disciples, we would all use Matzah.

Old Testament Passover

God gave instructions about the Passover to the Israelites so they could escape the judgment coming on the Egyptians. The element were unleavened bread and the blood of animals.

Exodus 12:7,13 NKJ

7 `And they shall take some of the blood and put it on the two doorposts and on the lintel of the houses where they eat it.
13 `Now the blood shall be a sign for you on the houses where you are. And when I see the blood, I will pass over you; and
the plague shall not be on you to destroy you when I strike the land of Egypt

The blood represented the Blood of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world -- Jesus Christ (Rev. 13:8). Judgment
was legally avoided because of it.

Did God ever call the unleavened bread His body in the Old Testament Passover? (This is not consistent with the New Testament Passover)

Where in the Old Testament Passover do you see God using wine, instead of the blood of animals, and calling the wine His blood? (This is not consistent with the New Testament Passover)


New Testament Passover

Christ Is Our Passover

Jesus called the bread he used His body in the New Testament Passover. (This is not consistent with the Old Testament Passover)

John 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Leavened bread is representative of life, while unleavened bread is representative death.

Jesus used wine, instead of the blood of animals, in the New Testament Passover and called the wine His blood. (This is not consistent with the Old Testament Passover)

1 Corinthians 5:7 NKJ . . . For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us.

Hebrews 8:6 NKJ He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.

New Covenant believers have the right to draw a faith Blood line the devil cannot cross. By speaking words of faith we
apply the Blood over the "doorposts" of our lives -- the outer edges of all that belongs to us.

With blood on the door of the Israelites in Egypt, no evil dared enter their dwelling. Likewise, we are kept safe through
the protection of the divine Blood of Jesus. No need for the blood of animals.

So one might conclude one of five possibilities that might explain the two different methods of celebrating Passover in the Old Testament as opposed to how Jesus celebrated it at the last supper.

1. Jesus wasn't celebrating the Passover at the last supper.
2. The God of the old Testament is a different God than the God in the New Testament.
3. Jesus was in error in how he celebrated the Passover at the last supper.
4. Jesus had lost his mind while celebrating the Passover at the Last Supper.
5. Jesus was celebrating Passover in a new way at the last supper.

If you chose answer # 5, then you are correct.

People have paid so little attention to communion, celebrating it any old way they choose, instead of how the Lord has instructed, that they fail to see the distinctions between the old and New Testament. In the Old Testament, it was a Passover of judgment. In the new Testament, the Passover becomes a communion with God that removes our sins and restores us to right standing with God.

The Old Testament Passover was and is legalistic as opposed to the New Testament Communion which exemplifies God's grace and mercy.

Wanting to follow Jesus' instructions and example as to how to take communion is hardly legalistic. It is an act of loving obedience.

 

[Prosperity]

In effect, what Jesus was doing at the last supper was demonstrating that He was ending the celebration of Passover as the Jews had previously known it by offering Himself as the Passover Lamb. He offered his disciples, and us, a better Covenant which was to consummate our oneness with Him through the eating of His flesh (leavened bread) and the drinking of His blood (wine).

We no longer need to celebrate Passover because Jesus fulfilled the Passover requirement of the Law. Jesus is our Passover Lamb. What we do now is to celebrate our oneness with the Father in Jesus by continuing in Jesus' love for us, and our love for Jesus, by taking communion.

 

[CrazyforYeshua]

I'm done.

 

[psalms 91]

In effect, what Jesus was doing at the last supper was demonstrating that He was ending the celebration of Passover as the Jews had previously known it by offering Himself as the Passover Lamb. He offered his disciples, and us, a better Covenant which was to consummate our oneness with Him through the eating of His flesh (leavened bread) and the drinking of His blood (wine).

We no longer need to celebrate Passover because Jesus fulfilled the Passover requirement of the Law. Jesus is our Passover Lamb. What we do now is to celebrate our oneness with the Father in Jesus by continuing in Jesus' love for us, and our love for Jesus, by taking communion.

While the passover was a type and shadow of Jesus it is still to be celebrated to bring to rememberance Gods goodness and mercy and the great things He did

 

[Prosperity]

While the Passover was a type and shadow of Jesus it is still to be celebrated to bring to remembrance Gods goodness and mercy and the great things He did...

If you aren't celebrating Passover with unleavened bread and the blood of animals, then you are not celebrating Passover. Jesus blood didn't pass over your sin. Jesus' blood removed it. Passover was God's best for Old Covenant people. What we call communion is God's best for New Covenant people.


What we call communion, is far superior to Passover.

Did Jesus never called the breaking of bread and drinking of wine Passover? He offered his blood (wine) and flesh (leavened bread) on the day of Passover to signify that He was the Passover Lamb and to offer us a communion with him which is far superior to Passover. The blood of the Lamb did not Passover me, it washed me clean. God never called the blood of animals His blood or unleavened bread His body which was broken.


While I agree with you that Passover was a type and shadow of Jesus, we are not instructed by the Lord to keep Passover because the Passover was only necessary until Jesus became our Passover Lamb. Now we celebrate our life eternal with God and strengthen our oneness in Him by eating the leavened bread (His body) and drinking the wine (His flesh).

 

[psalms 91]

If you aren't celebrating Passover with unleavened bread and the blood of animals, then you are not celebrating Passover. Jesus blood didn't pass over your sin. Jesus' blood removed it. Passover was God's best for Old Covenant people. What we call communion is God's best for New Covenant people.

What we call communion, is far superior to Passover.

Did Jesus never called the breaking of bread and drinking of wine Passover? He offered his blood (wine) and flesh (leavned bread) on the day of Passover to signify that He was the Passover Lamb and to offer us a cummionion with him which is far superior to Passover. The blood of the Lamb did not Passover me, it washed me clean. God never called the blood of animals His blood or unleavened bread His body which was broken.

While I agree with you that Passover was a type and shadow of Jesus, we are not instructed by the Lord to keep Passover because the Passover was only necessary until Jesus became our Passover Lsamb. Now we celebrate our life eternal with God and strengthen our oneness in Him by eating the leavened bread (His body) and drinking the wine (His flesh).

I have no problem with what you said regarding the New Covenant but there are many things contained within the passover that make it worth bringing to churchs. To many forget our Jewish roots and have no real understanding of it. Also there are three feasts which were to be kept forever, dont remember offhand which ones but it is there

 

[Prosperity]

I have no problem with what you said regarding the New Covenant but there are many things contained within the Passover that make it worth bringing to churches. To many forget our Jewish roots and have no real understanding of it. Also there are three feasts which were to be kept forever, don't remember offhand which ones but it is there

I have no problem with studying Passover to understand Jewish roots or to simply have a better depth and breadth of understating of God's Word. Even though I know that Passover is a forerunner of Jesus and how one relates to the other is interesting, I do believe it important for people to understand the difference between Passover and what we call communion.

Some here have thought me to be legalistic because I wish to celebrate communion as Jesus instructed and gave example. I don't sense that you think me legalistic. I think the problem others are having is that they have not discerned that just because Jesus fulfilled the law, Jesus did obviate our responsibility to be obedient to God. Obedience is not legalism. Obedience to God is love.

 

[psalms 91]

I have no problem with studying Passover to understand Jewish roots or to simply have a better depth and breadth of understating of God's Word. Even though I know that Passover is a forerunner of Jesus and how one relates to the other is interesting, I do believe it important for people to understand the difference between Passover and what we call communion.

Some here have thought me to be legalistic because I wish to celebrate communion as Jesus instructed and gave example. I don't sense that you think me legalistic. I think the problem others are having is that they have not discerned that just because Jesus fulfilled the law, Jesus did obviate our responsibility to be obedient to God. Obedience is not legalism. Obedience to God is love.

I also agree with that, to love me is to obey me and if one looks at the New Testament there are many commands contained in there

 

[psalms 91]

I thought passover was one that was to be kept forever, look at Exodus 12:17

 

[psalms 91]

I understand your point, I really do. But, this was before the arrest, before the trial, before the crucifiction. The Passover Feast was what it had been up until that point, with unleavened bread. Yeshua was saying He was making a new covenant, it hadn't been done yet. The Passover meal was made for them, they didn't make it themselves. There is no reason to believe, at that place, at that time, it was leavened bread, I can assure you it was not.


Exodus 12:8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it.


Exodus 12:15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.


Exodus 12:17 And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.Exodus 12:18 In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month at even, ye shall eat unleavened bread, until the one and twentieth day of the month at even.Exodus 12:19 Seven days shall there be no leaven found in your houses: for whosoever eateth that which is leavened, even that soul shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he be a stranger, or born in the land.Exodus 12:20 Ye shall eat nothing leavened; in all your habitations shall ye eat unleavened bread.


Yeshua followed the Law of His Father, He would not have used anything except what His Father had set up. Yes, I know He fulfilled the Law, but He also followed it while He walked the earth. There was no reason for Him to use leavened bread, that's all I'm saying. So, if we were to be 100% scriptural, and take communion as He did with His disciples, we would all use Matzah.

which I do lol

 

[KingZzub]

So Dr. Pepper and M&Ms is out then?

Aw shucks...

Cheers,
|ZZ|

P.S. I was once told off for having communion with a youth group when I put cheese on the bread.

 

[Prosperity]

I thought Passover was one that was to be kept forever, look at Exodus 12:17

Jesus gave himself as our Passover Lamb which fulfilled the law of the Passover for us for all eternity,

 

[Prosperity]

So Dr. Pepper and M&Ms is out then?

Aw shucks...

Try a honey Bunn. It is made of leavened bread.

 

[psalms 91]

Jesus gave himself as our Passover Lamb which fulfilled the law of the Passover for us for all eternity,

Again yes it fulfilled the Law but Gods word does not change, when He told us this He knew of Jesus, as I said before, there are other reasons to keep passover. If you study the feasts you can find some interesting things in them concerning end times and other things as well

 

[Prosperity]

Again yes it fulfilled the Law but Gods word does not change, when He told us this He knew of Jesus, as I said before, there are other reasons to keep passover. If you study the feasts you can find some interesting things in them concerning end times and other things as well

Now notice Exodus 12:17, 24. The Passover was instituted an ordinance forever. Some will say circumcision was not done away, but was changed - today it is the heart (Rom. 2:29). In both cases God meant forever, and so, as we have seen, at that last passover supper Jesus instituted a new covenant with a different manner of observance of this ordinance. No longer do we kill a lamb and eat it, since the Lamb of God has been sacrificed once for all. Instead, we take the bread, symbolizing His broken body, and the wine, symbolizing His shed blood.

We are warned in the New Testament against putting ourselves back under Old Testament Law.

We can lay claim to the benefits and blessings of the Old Testament because we are Abraham's seed, and if we are Abraham's seed, we are heirs to the promise, but we are no longer servants of the Law.

In either case, the Old Testament Passover was not given to the Gentiles. God was referring to a specific race's generations.

I do not believe that we are to mix the blood of animals with the blood of the New Covenant.

I firmly believe that Either you are under Old Testament law or you aren't. It is your choice.

 

[KingZzub]

So what you are saying is that due to the death and resurrection of the Lord, we have access to all the benefits of the Abrahamic covenant, but are not subject in any way to the Law of Moses?

Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful.

Cheers,
|ZZ|

 

[riverpastor]

Absolutely Zzub. This is the Gospel of Grace.


Prosperity,
Let me ask you this simple question.
What happens if we do not take Communion as you have described?

 

[psalms 91]

Now notice Exodus 12:17, 24. The Passover was instituted an ordinance forever. Some will say circumcision was not done away, but was changed - today it is the heart (Rom. 2:29). In both cases God meant forever, and so, as we have seen, at that last passover supper Jesus instituted a new covenant with a different manner of observance of this ordinance. No longer do we kill a lamb and eat it, since the Lamb of God has been sacrificed once for all. Instead, we take the bread, symbolizing His broken body, and the wine, symbolizing His shed blood.

We are warned in the New Testament against putting ourselves back under Old Testament Law.

We can lay claim to the benefits and blessings of the Old Testament because we are Abraham's seed, and if we are Abraham's seed, we are heirs to the promise, but we are no longer servants of the Law.

In either case, the Old Testament Passover was not given to the Gentiles. God was referring to a specific race's generations.

I do not believe that we are to mix the blood of animals with the blood of the New Covenant.

I firmly believe that Either you are under Old Testament law or you aren't. It is your choice.

We most defintiely are not under the Law and that is as born again believers our hearts will obey God. When God says forever I take it to mean that even though I am not under Law. There are many commands, most people look at the New Testament and dont think of commandments but there are many in there, over a 1,000 if I remember right.