Clarification on the Creation

[JacksBratt]

I agree the Godhead is plural, God the Father and God the Son.

"Jesus Christ is Creator WITH The Father"
Do you think that ◄ Colossians 1:15-16 ► NIV should read?
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For in him, with his Father, all things were created:

Yes there is the plural usage in Genesis 1:26. However in the second creation of man Genesis 2 15-19, there is no "us" or "our." Genesis 1:26 is the only place in the Bible that "us" and "our" is used.

"Humans are made in the "image of God" And the heavenly hosts are not?
Were Angels Created in the Image of God?

Do you think that Genesis 1:1 should read:
1In the beginning the Holy Trinity created the heavens and the earth.

I think that Genesis is perfectly fine the way it is.

 

[honey badger]

because you cannot accpe the Truth, probably a Jehovah's Witness, who reject the Trinity, or one of those "sects", that also do so!

the Truth i have come to has no need to be defended, where you have clearly unsheathed your sword ...

 

[eleos1954]

◄ Colossians 1:15-16 ► NIV
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.

This being true, then the creation in Genesis should read:

◄ Genesis 1 ► NIV

The Beginning

1In the beginning God the Son created the heavens and the earth. 2Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God the Son was hovering over the waters.

3And God the Son said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4God the Son saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5God the Son called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

6And God the Son said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.” 7So God the Son made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8God the Son called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

9And God the Son said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so. 10God the Son called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God the Son saw that it was good.


26Then God the Son said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, a and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27So God the Son created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God the Son he created them;
male and female he created them.

28God the Son blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

This being true, then the creation in Genesis should read:

Best to go with what His Word does say rather than what one might think it "should" say ;o)

They are one.

John 1 :1
The Beginning
(Genesis 1:1–2; Hebrews 11:1–3)

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. 4In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5 The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

 

[Nevada Smith]

Jesus ONLY "christian"

so says your theology! You have not responded to my question if you are a Jesus ONLY "christian"? Simple question, just a yes or no will do

It is not a simple yes or no. Since I don't following the teaching of man, I had no idea what up were talking about. I've never heard of "Jesus ONLY "christian"
I'm guessing this is what you are referring to.

Oneness Pentecostalism - Wikipedia
This answer is on. I am not Pentencostal.

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

I am not Pentencostal

but are you "Oneness" as per the article?

 

[Nevada Smith]

Best to go with what His Word does say rather than what one might think it "should" say ;o)

They are one.

John 1 :1
The Beginning
(Genesis 1:1–2; Hebrews 11:1–3)

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. 4In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5 The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

So you don't think it was the Son of God that did the creation?

 

[Nevada Smith]

but are you "Oneness" as per the article?

How's that? You seem to be the one that is hung up on the teachings of man and coming up with things that aren't in the Bible.

I believe in the Father and Son as two separate entities.

◄ John 14:28 ► NIV
"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.

If the Father is greater than the Son, how could you believe in Oneness?

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

How's that? You seem to be the one that is hung up on the teachings of man and coming up with things that aren't in the Bible.

I believe in the Father and Son as two separate entities.

◄ John 14:28 ► NIV
"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.

If the Father is greater than the Son, how could you believe in Oneness?

Jesus also said, "I am the Father are ONE" (John 10:30), that is, in the context, of EQUAL Power, Authority, and Protection! See verses 27-30.

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

the Father is greater than the Son

ONLY while Jesus was on earth. See Philippians 2:5-11; Hebrews 2:7-9

 

[klutedavid]

◄ Colossians 1:15-16 ► NIV
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.

This being true, then the creation in Genesis should read:

◄ Genesis 1 ► NIV

The Beginning

1In the beginning God the Son created the heavens and the earth. 2Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God the Son was hovering over the waters.

3And God the Son said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4God the Son saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5God the Son called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

6And God the Son said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.” 7So God the Son made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8God the Son called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

9And God the Son said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so. 10God the Son called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God the Son saw that it was good.


26Then God the Son said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, a and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27So God the Son created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God the Son he created them;
male and female he created them.

28God the Son blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

This is an interesting topic with some depth. The identity of YHWH?

 

[chad kincham]

Genesis 1:1 begins by the words, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth". The word "God" in Hebrew, is "Elohim", which is masculine in gender, and plural in number. This means that The Godhead is NOT singular. Genesis 1:26 says. "Then God said, “Let US make man in our image, after OUR likeness...". This does NOT mean as some suppose, that God was here speaking to His angels, or any other heavenly being. Humans are made in the "image of God" (1 Corinthians 11:7).

Jesus Christ is Creator WITH The Father, Who also created, "For it was fitting that He (The Father), for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the founder of their salvation perfect through suffering" (Hebrews 2:10). And, WITH The Holy Spirit, ""The Spirit has made (ʻâsâh, same word used for the whole of Creation in Genesis 2:4) me and the breath of the Almighty gives me life." (Job 33:4). The Three Persons of the Holy Trinity were TOGETHER active in the Creation of the entire universe.

That’s entirely true.
John 1:1 is extremely relevant to this point.
In the beginning (Genesis 1:1) was the word, and the word was WITH God, and the word WAS God.
God was with God, at the beginning - John 1:1 is specifically about Genesis 1:1.
In fact the Hebrew in Genesis 1 says, in the beginning ELOHIM (plural word for God) created the heavens and earth, and said let US create man in OUR image.

 

[chad kincham]

Genesis 1:1 begins by the words, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth". The word "God" in Hebrew, is "Elohim", which is masculine in gender, and plural in number. This means that The Godhead is NOT singular. Genesis 1:26 says. "Then God said, “Let US make man in our image, after OUR likeness...". This does NOT mean as some suppose, that God was here speaking to His angels, or any other heavenly being. Humans are made in the "image of God" (1 Corinthians 11:7).

Jesus Christ is Creator WITH The Father, Who also created, "For it was fitting that He (The Father), for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the founder of their salvation perfect through suffering" (Hebrews 2:10). And, WITH The Holy Spirit, ""The Spirit has made (ʻâsâh, same word used for the whole of Creation in Genesis 2:4) me and the breath of the Almighty gives me life." (Job 33:4). The Three Persons of the Holy Trinity were TOGETHER active in the Creation of the entire universe.

Correct. I just made a similar post about Elohim, and John 1:1 saying that :
Joh 1:1 In the beginning (creation) was the Word, and the Word was WITH God, and the Word WAS God.
God was with God, in the beginning, at creation.
Modalism is simply wrong.
The trinity is found at Jesus’ baptism : the Father spoke from heaven; the Son was on earth, in the water, with the Holy Spirit in between them, descending to earth, simultaneously.

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

Joh 1:1 In the beginning (creation)

However, this beginning that John speaks of here, is not to the Creation, which is mentioned in verse 3, but to "eternity past"

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

John 1:1 is specifically about Genesis 1:1.

John 1:3 is, but not 1:1

 

[chad kincham]

John 5:7 was added to some translations in the early fifteen hundreds ... in some earlier translation it appears at the bottom of the page but not in the text ... the Codex Sinaiticus which is one of the earliest hand written Greek copies does not have the "Johannine Coma" .... thing is the foundation of the doctrine of the trinity is based on this verse and yet it is an an interpolation

We don’t need that to see the trinity - at Jesus’ baptism, the Father spoke from Heaven, the Son was in the water on earth, with the Holy Spirit in the middle, descending to earth - simultaneously.
Add to that Matthew 28:29 , baptize into the NAME, singular, of the THREE - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

 

[chad kincham]

Genesis 1:1 begins by the words, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth". The word "God" in Hebrew, is "Elohim", which is masculine in gender, and plural in number. This means that The Godhead is NOT singular. Genesis 1:26 says. "Then God said, “Let US make man in our image, after OUR likeness...". This does NOT mean as some suppose, that God was here speaking to His angels, or any other heavenly being. Humans are made in the "image of God" (1 Corinthians 11:7).

Jesus Christ is Creator WITH The Father, Who also created, "For it was fitting that He (The Father), for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the founder of their salvation perfect through suffering" (Hebrews 2:10). And, WITH The Holy Spirit, ""The Spirit has made (ʻâsâh, same word used for the whole of Creation in Genesis 2:4) me and the breath of the Almighty gives me life." (Job 33:4). The Three Persons of the Holy Trinity were TOGETHER active in the Creation of the entire universe.

Correct. I just made a similar post about Elohim, and John 1:1 saying that :

so are you saying that God the Father did not Create? you have misread and misunderstood the Teachings of the Holy Bible!

Read again Hebrews 2:10, "For it was fitting that He (This is God the Father), for whom and by whom all things exist (This is CREATION!), in bringing many sons to glory, should make the founder of their salvation perfect through suffering"

VERY clear to me!

Modalism in a nutshell: there is Jesus, only, and Jesus wears three hats - sometimes He puts on the Father hat, other times, the Son hat, and the Holy Spirit hat as well.
When He’s wearing one hat, he speaks to the other hats, as if they were separate persons.
(Hats = offices - 3 separate offices, but only one person, Jesus).
Needless to say, I reject that doctrine, completely.

 

[chad kincham]

John 1:3 is, but not 1:1

Are you serious?
John 1:1 says IN THE BEGINNING the word was WITH God, and WAS God...
What beginning do you THINK it means?
It means as in Genesis1:1 IN THE BEGINNING Elohim (plural form of God, literally meaning GODS) created the heavens and the earth.
That is not just obviously about Genesis 1 - it’s incredibly, blatantly obviously concerning that.

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

Correct. I just made a similar post about Elohim, and John 1:1 saying that :

Modalism in a nutshell: there is Jesus, only, and Jesus wears three hats - sometimes He puts on the Father hat, other times, the Son hat, and the Holy Spirit hat as well.
When He’s wearing one hat, he speaks to the other hats, as if they were separate persons.
(Hats = offices. 3 separate offices, but only one person, Jesus.
Needless to say, I reject that doctrine, completely.

these days passing off as "Oneness Pentecostalism", and other heretical groups!

 

[Bond-servant of Christ]

Are you serious?

very! John 1:1, is speaking of the "eternal" relationship between the First and Second Persons in the Holy Trinity. Nothing about actual Creation is mentioned till verse 3, "all things were made by Him..."

 

[chad kincham]

I agree the Godhead is plural, God the Father and God the Son.

"Jesus Christ is Creator WITH The Father"
Do you think that ◄ Colossians 1:15-16 ► NIV should read?
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For in him, with his Father, all things were created:

Yes there is the plural usage in Genesis 1:26. However in the second creation of man Genesis 2 15-19, there is no "us" or "our." Genesis 1:26 is the only place in the Bible that "us" and "our" is used.

"Humans are made in the "image of God" And the heavenly hosts are not?
Were Angels Created in the Image of God?

Do you think that Genesis 1:1 should read:
1In the beginning the Holy Trinity created the heavens and the earth.

There is no second creation. Genesis 2:4, the word translated GENERATIONS means HISTORY in the Hebrew - chapter 2 is a historical account of Ch. 1.
Gen 2:4 These H428  are the generations H8435  of the heavens H8064  and of the earth H776  when they were created, H1254  in the day H3117  that the LORD H3068  God H430  made H6213  the earth H776  and the heavens, H806
Generations is H8435 in the Strongs:

H8435 (Strong)

תֹּלְדָה תּוֹלְדָה

tôledâh tôledâh

to-led-aw', to-led-aw'

From H3205; (plural only) descent, that is, family; (figuratively) HISTORY: - birth, generations.

Total KJV occurrences: 39

There is no second creation account in Genesis 2.