Clarification of 3rd Christian Principle of Foru.ms: Satanism/ Satanic symbols

[Tenebrae]

The thing is, duck, while it's wonderful - and it really incredibly is wonderful - that you're able to see that without being tempted, I absolutely fundamentally believe we all of us have a duty of care to those who are susceptible.

Hypothetically: you're not susceptible, and I am. Does your ability to be faced with it somehow cancel out my vulnerability to it?

Am so not trying to be difficult, or trying to cause a fuss for no reason, and am so sorry if it's coming across like that. But we will have to answer to the Lord one day and I truly feel that this is letting Him down. If even one person is led astray - just one - we failed, and its occurring in GA won't mitigate that.

Want me to tell you one of the biggest things at the moment that is leading Christians astray and creating a generation of inocculated and embittered people who are just anti the gospel message.

And its not satanism.

GM, again and a again, no one is for promoting satanism or giving satanists free reign on this board, what we are advocating for non censure of discussion.

No Christian would tolerate a non Christian speaking lies about Christianity, yet I fail to see why we should be allowed to do that non Christians. To not tolerate a non Christian speaking lies about Christianity, yet to deny a non Christian that same right is nothing but hypocritical IMO

You keep going on about vulnerable struggling people, and wanting to protect the vulnerable struggling Christians, but when you hear the opinion of this vulnerable struggling person, you dismiss it.

You say that you find pentegrams triggering. I find pentecostal and charismatic churches triggering.

Does that mean we can ban and delete the entire spirit filled forum.

Sorry Gm to be heartless, there are always things that are going to trigger us, and we have the choice of either building a bridge and getting over it, or we can let the fear of it dictate our lives. Pentecostal and charismatic churches absolutely terrify me right now, I tend to have an anxiety attack at the very thought of a spirit filled church so I have found a nice wee Eucharist church in the city. Its as formal a service as I can find, and God is blessing me heaps

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

I really do get what you're saying. However, the difference is, this is now a forum that's pivotal on Christian outreach. We can dillydally with semantics as much as we want to, but it's, to all intents and purposes, a Christian forum. A forum can't be saved, etc etc, but when we invite people, they will see the Bible verse on the front page, and the logo with the cross (I chose the green, myself ) and names like "LoveYouJesus" and signatures proclaiming Christ as Lord. This is a Christian website.

That comes with a whole heap of responsibility, and implicit promises - that it'll be a haven; that it'll be Christ-centred; that people can come here for support, or help, or respite.

So what happens if one of these, or two of these, or three of these stumble across a place where someone is witnessing for Satan. Or what if a new Christian who is as yet unable to acknowledge that there's a spiritual world we can't see stumbles across a place where Satan is being lauded and described as an aces chap. If a single person returns to their old life in the dark, or if even one person runs screaming thinking the whole thing is frightening as the dickens, and turns their back on the whole thing, and on God, we did fail them, because the promises were still implicit, and we broke them. The verse I cannot shake:
Regardless of how much I umm and ahh and consider the politically correct concepts of free speech and equality to all, that one verse won't go away because, literally, that one verse won't go away.

I do get your meaning, but you missed mine, I am afraid. I never said we SHOULD promote Satan, or allow it, as you just stated -

where someone is witnessing for Satan.

where Satan is being lauded and described as an aces chap.

Where the debate started:

In a debate, when you are defending Satanism you are effectively promoting it, so in that context, although it is no ideal, it is acceptable to prevent stifling debate.

How can a forum intended for Christian outreach allow that?

Stifle debate, if needs be, but you can't allow the promotion of Satanism in any context!

"- no anti-Christ messages or images "Either that means something or it doesn't. You've defined Satanism as anti-Christ. Does its being in GA stop it being anti-Christ?

My intention, and not to argue with Erwin, is that we are not inadvertantly promoting Satanism when we defend it. I do not love Satan, or Satanism, but I will defend it for truth's sake when I see someone post in error. If someone were to say "All Satanists sacrifice cats.", how can we allow that to stand? What about the 16th commandment?

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.

What happened to that one? If we allow this forum to go unchecked with Christian propaganda, how can we expect to provide a truthful outreach? Then we're no better than any other non-christian board; we're even worse!

How would you like to be a member of an all Satanist board that provided Satanic outreach that disallowed Christians to defend themselves?

Y.

 

[Tenebrae]

I do get your meaning, but you missed mine, I am afraid. I never said we SHOULD promote Satan, or allow it, as you just stated -




Where the debate started:





My intention, and not to argue with Erwin, is that we are not inadvertantly promoting Satanism when we defend it. I do not love Satan, or Satanism, but I will defend it for truth's sake when I see someone post in error. If someone were to say "All Satanists sacrifice cats.", how can we allow that to stand? What about the 16th commandment?

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.

Ding, ding, ding, he gets it

What happened to that one? If we allow this forum to go unchecked with Christian propaganda, how can we expect to provide a truthful outreach? Then we're no better than any other non-christian board; we're even worse!

How would you like to be a member of an all Satanist board that provided Satanic outreach that disallowed Christians to defend themselves?

Y.

Hey, I'm a member of several non christian board, and while they may not agree with my choice of path, they do however refrain from censoring

 

[icedtea]

No christian would want to join a satanist board, I would think.
Correcting errors about ones beleifs or former beliefs is one thing (a good one) but extraneous stuff like satan is sexy is just ;non edifying, if I may.

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

Want me to tell you one of the biggest things at the moment that is leading Christians astray and creating a generation of inocculated and embittered people who are just anti the gospel message.

And its not satanism.

GM, again and a again, no one is for promoting satanism or giving satanists free reign on this board, what we are advocating for non censure of discussion.

No Christian would tolerate a non Christian speaking lies about Christianity, yet I fail to see why we should be allowed to do that non Christians. To not tolerate a non Christian speaking lies about Christianity, yet to deny a non Christian that same right is nothing but hypocritical IMO

You keep going on about vulnerable struggling people, and wanting to protect the vulnerable struggling Christians, but when you hear the opinion of this vulnerable struggling person, you dismiss it.

This is exactly it too! I am a Christian. I do not want to lead others astray. I am not for allowing Satanists free reign. I just want to be able to straighten out rumor and myth, correct error, and even to debate and discuss without worry of censorship.

Y.

 

[GreenMunchkin]

My intention, and not to argue with Erwin, is that we are not inadvertantly promoting Satanism when we defend it. I do not love Satan, or Satanism, but I will defend it for truth's sake when I see someone post in error. If someone were to say "All Satanists sacrifice cats.", how can we allow that to stand? What about the 16th commandment?

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.

What happened to that one? If we allow this forum to go unchecked with Christian propaganda, how can we expect to provide a truthful outreach? Then we're no better than any other non-christian board; we're even worse!

How would you like to be a member of an all Satanist board that provided Satanic outreach that disallowed Christians to defend themselves?

Y.

Oh, no, I got you. Sorry if I didn't explain that enough. I get what you're saying

However, if someone is intentionally spreading misinformation, I don't think refuting it necessitates an indepth hermeneutical discussion about why the Bible is wrong, and why Satan actually is a decent bloke, but that's what will happen.

The line is too easy to cross, and I very much want for us to err on the side of caution.

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

No christian would want to join a satanist board, I would think.

It was hypothetical.

Correcting errors about ones beleifs or former beliefs is one thing (a good one) but extraneous stuff like satan is sexy is just ;non edifying, if I may.

No, I want to see stuff like that put down.

Y.

 

[icedtea]

It was hypothetical.




No, I want to see stuff like that put down.

Y.

thank you, kind sir.

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

Oh, no, I got you. Sorry if I didn't explain that enough. I get what you're saying

However, if someone is intentionally spreading misinformation, I don't think refuting it necessitates an indepth hermeneutical discussion about why the Bible is wrong, and why Satan actually is a decent bloke, but that's what will happen.

The line is too easy to cross, and I very much want for us to err on the side of caution.

If it comes to that it comes to that.

I am still at a loss as to why a new Christian, or someone who is considering converting, would be in such a discussion anyway. When I aim to learn about Christ I usually read stuff about Christ, not Satan.

Y.

 

[Jebediah]

No christian would want to join a satanist board, I would think.
Correcting errors about ones beleifs or former beliefs is one thing (a good one) but extraneous stuff like satan is sexy is just ;non edifying, if I may.

Actually, that's not true. We have several forums of varying kinds. Christians come on them all the time. Some times it is to flame and run, sometimes it is to stick around. We do not censor them.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

extraneous stuff like satan is sexy is just ;non edifying, if I may.

But he IS -- or could be perceived that way -- and while you may consider that "non edifying", you might want to consider that from a CHRISTIAN standpoint, some people might find it useful to their ministry and faith-walk to know what kinds of things they are up against. If stating that Satan has a "sexual appeal" for some people, or is capable of operating in that fashion to attract, seduce, etc., is to be censored -- because someone views it as 'promotional' -- are we not -- again from a strictly CHRISTIAN viewpoint -- preventing people from obtaining vital information that might make a difference in their own spiritual battles? Does not even Scripture state that there is value in "not being ignorant of his (Satan's) devices"? What if someone is assailed upon this very point and shipwrecked because they never saw it coming, where knowledge ahead of time might have alerted them and preserved them in the hour of temptation, assault or spiritual battle?

Understand, I am seeking to address this objectively here ... but still i have to ask myself, what better warning exists outside a live example?

 

[icedtea]

I see your point (objectively even!) but stating he can be preceived and experienced seductively that way is helpful. Stating Ooh hes a babe, is not.
Do you see the difference?
I am sure you can.

 

[icedtea]

Actually, that's not true. We have several forums of varying kinds. Christians come on them all the time. Some times it is to flame and run, sometimes it is to stick around. We do not censor them.

What do they discuss? Do they try and convert?

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

I do see the difference. But again, the question (which i shall rephrase): what better warning and testimony exists besides a live illustration of the point?
You see, even daimonizomai have our place in God's economy. Patron saints of bad example! If you cannot be an example, you can still be a warning. The Bible even speaks of this -- vessels of dishonor.
Nothing in this universe is EVER wasted.

 

[icedtea]

I do see your point (see how helpful it is to read everyones posts? )
There is a line of too graphic however...

I have always felt like the clay pot meant to be a toilet.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

yes but if it's not going on in detail or TMI porno, it doesn't cross that line. some ppl draw that line too closely because they don't realise they are projecting their own sexual repression onto others and turning things into "smut" when they aren't. case in point, my post elsewhere talking about being "ridden" -- someone took that as sexual innuendo and i had to edit. but it is a legitimate term for spirit possession -- just ask any Vodoun practitioner...........

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

from now on i am going to just use the Cajun term ... chevalier

 

[icedtea]

Huh. See, I knew what you meant by ridden as I'd read an earlier post by you Explaining what that meant.

 

[icedtea]

from now on i am going to just use the Cajun term ... chevalier

So Maurice is suspect?...

 

[Jebediah]

What do they discuss? Do they try and convert?

Mostly. Some drive-by flame that we are all damned. Some stay a bit longer and try to convert others and use poor arguments that are well known, so they get hit with a bunch of canned responses and can't rebut. A few can hold their own and stick around for a while.

I used to hang out on Lord Egan's board for while, and we had several resident Christians who hung out and chatted. Never had any Christians become Satanists. The main reason is that Satanists aren't generally the kind that gets convinced of a religious position based on anything anyone else could say. Anyone we could "convince" of Satanism would not be one of us, really. Even the symbolic Satanists say that...you don't "become" a Satanist, you realize you are one after becoming exposed to it.