Clarification of 3rd Christian Principle of Foru.ms: Satanism/ Satanic symbols

[Lindon Tinuviel]

Oh, I think we could have an all-day discussion on the psychology of horror movies.

 

[justanobserver]

Please let's not start addressing individual members in this thread, address the issue, or I will close the thread.

And I am not picking on anyone in particular, or defending anyone, this is a general reminder only.

Hey, this is my first mod hat post, though I don't moderate.

Erwin's first Mod hat!! WOOHOO! am gonna save this post! will be worth something someday! at least a blessing!

 

[Tenebrae]

Thank you Erwin for taking a balanced approach to this.

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

Thank you Erwin for taking a balanced approach to this.

I concur. Marvelous job on this issue.

Y.

 

[Tenebrae]

And the people that are struggling? The ones who aren't that strong in their faith? The ones who are escaping a history with the occult?

Buzz-words like "fascism" and "bigotry" don't impress me. Those are political insults; this is so much more important than that.

speaking as one who was formerly a witch, and who is majorly struggling right now, I am happy with this.

Christ never twisted my arm up my back or made me dump all my occult stuff, the choice was mine, what right to I have to force others to conform to my belief system?


It would be dishonest to allow myths and urban legends to be propagated without any ability to address the inaccuracies. Christians would not tolerate it, and I fail to see why it would have been acceptable to put non chrisians through the same thing. Either whats good for the goose is good for the gander or yea well

 

[pgp_protector]

Does private ownership supercede freedom of speech? (just asking rhetorically here)

Private ownership would supercede freedom of speach on that private property (I.E. The Web forum) as it doesn't prevent you from speaking out in your own forum.

Example on a Computer Graphics Forum they do not allow talk of salary , This App vs That App, Warez ect. Even though you can find all that all over the web.

Example 2 If you were to come to my house and start talking about how great Mac computers are, I could within all my rights ask you to stop or leave

And I also want to thank Erwin for this balanced approach to the issue.

 

[Mickey1953]

"In a debate, when you are defending Satanism you are effectively promoting it, so in that context, although it is no ideal, it is acceptable to prevent stifling debate."

I appreciate the response from Erwin, but - I have to ask if someone can explain this further to me....I don't quite understand...

Mickey

 

[GreenMunchkin]

speaking as one who was formerly a witch, and who is majorly struggling right now, I am happy with this.

Christ never twisted my arm up my back or made me dump all my occult stuff, the choice was mine, what right to I have to force others to conform to my belief system?


It would be dishonest to allow myths and urban legends to be propagated without any ability to address the inaccuracies. Christians would not tolerate it, and I fail to see why it would have been acceptable to put non chrisians through the same thing. Either whats good for the goose is good for the gander or yea well

The thing is, duck, while it's wonderful - and it really incredibly is wonderful - that you're able to see that without being tempted, I absolutely fundamentally believe we all of us have a duty of care to those who are susceptible.

Hypothetically: you're not susceptible, and I am. Does your ability to be faced with it somehow cancel out my vulnerability to it?

Am so not trying to be difficult, or trying to cause a fuss for no reason, and am so sorry if it's coming across like that. But we will have to answer to the Lord one day and I truly feel that this is letting Him down. If even one person is led astray - just one - we failed, and its occurring in GA won't mitigate that.

 

[icedtea]

And the stove gets turned up a little more, frog starts noticing.

 

[Lindon Tinuviel]

"In a debate, when you are defending Satanism you are effectively promoting it, so in that context, although it is no ideal, it is acceptable to prevent stifling debate."

I appreciate the response from Erwin, but - I have to ask if someone can explain this further to me....I don't quite understand...

Mickey

I think that, essentially, attempting to win a debate does not equal promotion. Otherwise, the topic could not even be discussed.

 

[Father Rick]

Erwin...

What is your intent/feelings regarding discussions of varioius aspects of the occult (not just satanism) that may come up that may be more of an educational (as opposed to persuasive) nature.

For instance, there are many myths propagated about the occult by (sometimes) well-meaning Christians. If someone who has come out of the occult speaks up to say, "your info is wrong... it is really like this instead", would that be considered acceptable?

And is this something that is left to the judgement call of the mods of a particular forum?

I ask this since I'm usually the one called in for a "pastoral opinion"...

 

[Erwin]

If someone who has come out of the occult speaks up to say, "your info is wrong... it is really like this instead", would that be considered acceptable?

I would think that that would be acceptable surely. I am hesistant to state something that is absolute here as I know I will be quoted, but something like that could be seen to be reasonable, depending on the context and how it is done.

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

The thing is, duck, while it's wonderful - and it really incredibly is wonderful - that you're able to see that without being tempted, I absolutely fundamentally believe we all of us have a duty of care to those who are susceptible.

Hypothetically: you're not susceptible, and I am. Does your ability to be faced with it somehow cancel out my vulnerability to it?

Am so not trying to be difficult, or trying to cause a fuss for no reason, and am so sorry if it's coming across like that. But we will have to answer to the Lord one day and I truly feel that this is letting Him down. If even one person is led astray - just one - we failed, and its occurring in GA won't mitigate that.

Honestly, I do not mean to allocate blame here or there. The purpose of my argument was that each person's salvation is their own to keep in check. I know I didn't really allude to that, but my mind doesn't always work right.

This really is the thing too! All of my life I have been told I would make a wonderful minister, or teacher of Christianity, but the fact of the matter is that I'm too cowardly to do it because I might end up leading someone astray unintentionally. I do not want to end up in front of Him explaining why countless souls were dropped into a firey chasm solely because I said something wrong, or misinterpreted something. I'm willing to take responsibility for my own soul and let that be that.

However, I am willing to participate in discussion on a wide range of topics with people who realize that I am not a teacher, I do not hold all of the answers, in fact - just the opposite - I'm merely a student who wants to share and partake of lively debate or constructive conversation. If they're willing to understand that, and to take responsibilty for themselves, then I don't see the problem.

This flows into the matter that by signing up on a forum, or any public discussion arena (i.e. chatroom), you are assumed to be taking responsibility of yourself, your actions, and your words.

Therefore, those willing to partake in discussion are considered to be taking responsibility of themselves, therefore, they are leading themselves into temptation by allowing themselves to be drawn back into the darkness.

Y.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

What is "GA"? I keep seeing this acronym on CF (or rather, 4U) but don't know what it means ... cluebrick please?

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

What is "GA"? I keep seeing this acronym on CF (or rather, 4U) but don't know what it means ... cluebrick please?

I thought it meant "General Apologetics".

Y.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

I would think that that would be acceptable surely. I am hesistant to state something that is absolute here as I know I will be quoted, but something like that could be seen to be reasonable, depending on the context and how it is done.

I think if it is done in an academic tone of objective research and correction of fallacy that pretty much speaks for itself. It does not sound "promotion-ish" in that particular tone, and pretty much everyone that I've seen respects that (except those who don't like having their misconceptions corrected, of course).

 

[icedtea]

There is general theology and christian apologetics. No ga I can find.

 

[Yyharssargyhaell]

There is general theology and christian apologetics. No ga I can find.

Near the bottom, under "Discussion and Debate", is a board called "General Apologetics".

Y.

 

[GreenMunchkin]

Honestly, I do not mean to allocate blame here or there. The purpose of my argument was that each person's salvation is their own to keep in check. I know I didn't really allude to that, but my mind doesn't always work right.

This really is the thing too! All of my life I have been told I would make a wonderful minister, or teacher of Christianity, but the fact of the matter is that I'm too cowardly to do it because I might end up leading someone astray unintentionally. I do not want to end up in front of Him explaining why countless souls were dropped into a firey chasm solely because I said something wrong, or misinterpreted something. I'm willing to take responsibility for my own soul and let that be that.

However, I am willing to participate in discussion on a wide range of topics with people who realize that I am not a teacher, I do not hold all of the answers, in fact - just the opposite - I'm merely a student who wants to share and partake of lively debate or constructive conversation. If they're willing to understand that, and to take responsibilty for themselves, then I don't see the problem.

This flows into the matter that by signing up on a forum, or any public discussion arena (i.e. chatroom), you are assumed to be taking responsibility of yourself, your actions, and your words.

Therefore, those willing to partake in discussion are considered to be taking responsibility of themselves, therefore, they are leading themselves into temptation by allowing themselves to be drawn back into the darkness.

Y.

I really do get what you're saying. However, the difference is, this is now a forum that's pivotal on Christian outreach. We can dillydally with semantics as much as we want to, but it's, to all intents and purposes, a Christian forum. A forum can't be saved, etc etc, but when we invite people, they will see the Bible verse on the front page, and the logo with the cross (I chose the green, myself ) and names like "LoveYouJesus" and signatures proclaiming Christ as Lord. This is a Christian website.

That comes with a whole heap of responsibility, and implicit promises - that it'll be a haven; that it'll be Christ-centred; that people can come here for support, or help, or respite.

So what happens if one of these, or two of these, or three of these stumble across a place where someone is witnessing for Satan. Or what if a new Christian who is as yet unable to acknowledge that there's a spiritual world we can't see, stumbles across a place where Satan is being lauded and described as an aces chap. If a single person returns to their old life in the dark, or if even one person runs screaming thinking the whole thing is frightening as the dickens, and turns their back on the whole thing, and on God, we did fail them, because the promises were still implicit, and we broke them. The verse I cannot shake:

"If you cause one of these little ones who trusts in me to fall into sin, it would be better for you to have a large millstone tied around your neck and be drowned in the depths of the sea. What sorrow awaits the world, because it tempts people to sin. Temptations are inevitable, but what sorrow awaits the person who does the tempting."

Regardless of how much I umm and ahh and consider the politically correct concepts of free speech and equality to all, that one verse won't go away because, literally, that one verse won't go away.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

*bites tongue so hard she draws blood*