Christian Zionist "Replacement Theology"

[sovereigngrace]

You can't get around Zechariah 14:4-5, the mount of olives has not been split. And Jesus is returning in those verses to rescue the blood descended Jews in Jerusalem, to escape harm as they did in the days of forefathers when Uzziah was king of Judah.

So what does that chapter relate to in your opinion?

 

[Douggg]

Yes that happened in Jerusalem in AD 70, when the Jews swere led captive and dispersed amongst all kingdoms, fulfilling Deut 28, which says they would be made slaves with no one to buy them. Josephus tells that there were so many slaves that the price of slaves crashed throughout the empire. Some were sent to the mines in Egypt also fullfilling part of Deut 28.

Acts 2:5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.

Romans 16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

The end of what? The end of the Jewish economy.

The events of 1948 and 1967 has happened right before your very eyes.

The mount of olives still not split yet. Which Jesus returns to, to rescue the Jews, blood descendants, and they escape harm just like their forefathers in the days of Uzziah king of Judah.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

 

[sovereigngrace]

Chosen, not saved. Repackage your question to are the Jews saved? As a nation, not yet.

Ezekiel 39:7 So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel.

This is like watching the House Democrat’s kangaroo court Impeachment proceedings. It is all political double-speak. Reasonable Bible students can’t buy into such reasoning. This is why Dispensationalism is crumbling throughout the world.

Unregenerate Israel are rebels against God’s only provision for sin, and are consequently under the wrath of God.

 

[Douggg]

So what does that chapter relate to in your opinion?

It relates to the Jews, Israel, currently in unbelief in Jesus, will in the second half of the forthcoming 7 years 70th week of the 70 weeks, become believers in Jesus.

The Zechariah 14:4-5 events will take place the day that Jesus returns to earth.

There is no escape from the certainty of that passage, as the mt of Olives clearly has not been split in half.

thomas t is right in his fundamental point of view.

 

[sovereigngrace]

The events of 1948 and 1967 has happened right before your very eyes.

The mount of olives still not split yet. Which Jesus returns to, to rescue the Jews, blood descendants, and they escape harm just like their forefathers in the days of Uzziah king of Judah.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

This is not a biblical return to the land. They were artificially brought back by Zionist donors in a state of ongoing rebellion. They are still in stubborn rebellion against Christ - 2000 years after He defeated sin, death and Satan.

 

[sovereigngrace]

It relates to the Jews, Israel, currently in unbelief in Jesus, will in the second half of the forthcoming 7 years 70th week of the 70 weeks, become believers in Jesus.

The Zechariah 14:4-5 events will take place the day that Jesus returns to earth.

There is no escape from the certainty of that passage, as the mt of Olives clearly has not been split in half.

thomas t is right in his fundamental point of view.

Are you pretrib?

 

[Douggg]

This is like watching the House Democrat’s kangaroo court Impeachment proceedings. It is all political double-speak - reasonable Bible students don’t buy into such reading. This is why Dispensationalism is crumbling throughout the world.

Unregenerate Israel are rebels against God’s only provision for sin, and are consequently under the wrath of God.

In some ways, yes. Lack of evidence on and misleading attack. Making unsubstantiated statements.

The mt of olives has not been split in half - visible, verifiable, evidence against your position.

Misleading attack against futurism- by your side saying dispensationalism, which a subcategory to futurism - which all futurists don't subscribe to. I am a futurist, not a dispensationalist.

I had to change my screen-name details, years ago, because I have heard the misleading accusation, from your side, so many times, that I had to make it perfectly clear that I am a futurist but not a dispenstationalist.

 

[Douggg]

This is not a biblical return to the land. They were artificially brought back by Zionist donors in a state of ongoing rebellion. They are still in stubborn rebellion against Christ - 2000 years after He defeated sin, death and Satan.

The Mt. of Olives is not split. Can't you admit it? Your eschatology and point of view, disclaiming who Israel is and who the Jews are is disproved by the evidence. There is a mountain of evidence against your position starring you right in the face.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

 

[Douggg]

Are you pretrib?

look at my screen-name the details below. I am not pre-trib. I am anytime rapture view. Which that view is the rapture must happen before the beginning of the Day of the Lord, triggered by the 2Thessalonians2:4 act. That act is not possible to pinpoint the exact day on a timeline, except that it will happen during the first half of the 7 years, near the middle.

Anytime, between now and then. Could happen in the next few seconds, or it may not until after the 7 years begin.

It's annotated on my chart, in my following post, in blue.

 

[Douggg]

Are you pretrib?

 

[jgr]

You eschatology and point of view, disclaiming who Israel is and who the Jews are is disproved by the evidence. There is a mountain of evidence against your position starring you right in the face.

After 4,000 years of dispersion and diffusion, Abraham's physical DNA is ubiquitous in the human population of planet earth. The "Jews" themselves acknowledge and applaud this reality.

Example of the mathematical confirmation of ancestral genetic ubiquity

Abraham lineage
DNA Tests Could Fulfill God’s Promise to Abraham by Revealing Millions of Jews. But How Jewish is Jewish Enough?
Israel in all of Us? Research finds 'Jewish genes' in unusual places
Jewish-Roots Arabs in Israel
Tracing the lost tribes to Jewish communities in Africa
Nigeria's Igbo Jews: 'Lost tribe' of Israel? - CNN
http://www.worldjewishcongress.org/...-africa-has-jewish-roots-genetic-tests-reveal
https://www.jpost.com/Jewish-World/...her-claims-proof-of-tribe-of-Ephraim-in-India
https://www.jta.org/2013/05/23/life...bush-bani-israel-tribe-claims-jewish-heritage

But Abraham himself knew that his physical DNA was irrelevant.

Only his spiritual DNA counts. (Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:16,28,29)

Two genes.

Faith and obedience.

Nothing else.

 

[Douggg]

After 4,000 years of dispersion and diffusion, Abraham's physical DNA is ubiquitous in the human population of planet earth. The "Jews" themselves acknowledge and applaud this reality.

Example of the mathematical confirmation of ancestral genetic ubiquity

Abraham lineage
DNA Tests Could Fulfill God’s Promise to Abraham by Revealing Millions of Jews. But How Jewish is Jewish Enough?
Israel in all of Us? Research finds 'Jewish genes' in unusual places
Jewish-Roots Arabs in Israel
Tracing the lost tribes to Jewish communities in Africa
Nigeria's Igbo Jews: 'Lost tribe' of Israel? - CNN
http://www.worldjewishcongress.org/...-africa-has-jewish-roots-genetic-tests-reveal
https://www.jpost.com/Jewish-World/...her-claims-proof-of-tribe-of-Ephraim-in-India
https://www.jta.org/2013/05/23/life...bush-bani-israel-tribe-claims-jewish-heritage

But Abraham himself knew that his physical DNA was irrelevant.

Only his spiritual DNA counts. (Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:16,28,29)

Two genes.

Faith and obedience.

Nothing else.

Nowhere argument.

The mt of olives has not been split. Can't you admit it?

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

 

[jgr]

Nowhere argument.

The mt of olives has not been split. Can't you admit it?

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

See mkgal1's post 448.

Psalm 97
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Did the hills melt? If so, which ones and when?

Psalm 18
7 Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations also of the hills moved and were shaken, because he was wroth.
8 There went up a smoke out of his nostrils, and fire out of his mouth devoured: coals were kindled by it.
9 He bowed the heavens also, and came down: and darkness was under his feet.
10 And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly: yea, he did fly upon the wings of the wind.
11 He made darkness his secret place; his pavilion round about him were dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.
12 At the brightness that was before him his thick clouds passed, hail stones and coals of fire.

When?

Back to genetics.

We're all Jews.

We're all "blood descendants".

We're all genetically chosen.

But only true believers are spiritually chosen.

They are the true and only Chosen People.

 

[keras]

Psalm 18
7 Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations also of the hills moved and were shaken, because he was wroth.
8 There went up a smoke out of his nostrils, and fire out of his mouth devoured: coals were kindled by it.
9 He bowed the heavens also, and came down: and darkness was under his feet.
10 And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly: yea, he did fly upon the wings of the wind.
11 He made darkness his secret place; his pavilion round about him were dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.
12 At the brightness that was before him his thick clouds passed, hail stones and coals of fire.

When?

Prophecy awaiting fulfilment.
Psalms 18:11-15 is another description of the forthcoming Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.
You left off verse 13: The Lord thundered from the heavens...sending down hail and glowing coals.
This; and other verses, prove the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath is some time before the Return.

 

[jgr]

Prophecy awaiting fulfilment.
Psalms 18:11-15 is another description of the forthcoming Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.
You left off verse 13: The Lord thundered from the heavens...sending down hail and glowing coals.
This an other verses, prove the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath is some time before the Return.

All in past tense.

Fulfilled metaphorically.

 

[Douggg]

See mkgal1's post 448.

Psalm 97
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Did the hills melt? If so, which ones and when?

Psalm 18
7 Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations also of the hills moved and were shaken, because he was wroth.
8 There went up a smoke out of his nostrils, and fire out of his mouth devoured: coals were kindled by it.
9 He bowed the heavens also, and came down: and darkness was under his feet.
10 And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly: yea, he did fly upon the wings of the wind.
11 He made darkness his secret place; his pavilion round about him were dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.
12 At the brightness that was before him his thick clouds passed, hail stones and coals of fire.

When?

Back to genetics.

We're all Jews.

We're all "blood descendants".

We're all genetically chosen.

But only true believers are spiritually chosen.

They are the true and only Chosen People.

Only the true Jews, the ones Jesus returns to rescue in Jerusalem, forefathers escaped harm in the days of Uzziah King of Judah.

Can't you admit that the mt of olives has not been split?

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

 

[jgr]

Only the true Jews, the ones Jesus returns to rescue in Jerusalem, forefathers escaped harm in the days of Uzziah King of Judah.

Can't you admit that the mt of olives has not been split?

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

Can't you admit the fulfillments that I cited?

 

[sovereigngrace]

look at my screen-name the details below. I am not pre-trib. I am anytime rapture view. Which that view is the rapture must happen before the beginning of the Day of the Lord, triggered by the 2Thessalonians2:4 act. That act is not possible to pinpoint the exact day on a timeline, except that it will happen during the first half of the 7 years, near the middle.

Anytime, between now and then. Could happen in the next few seconds, or it may not until after the 7 years begin.

It's annotated on my chart, in my following post, in blue.

So Zachariah 14 occurs in a future millennium?

 

[sovereigngrace]

View attachment 268776

Where do you get your seven year tribulation in scripture? It is definitely not in Daniel 9. It is totally historic. Also, there are 5 3 1/2‘s in Revelation, not 2.

 

[Douggg]

So Zachariah 14 occurs in a future millennium?

Zachariah 14:4-5 occures at the end of the age. On day 2520 of my chart.