Christian youth rally in S.F.

[Harpuia]

I don't think should be thought of being out of bounds for Christians to rally at City Hall in protest of gay marriage or abortion and at the same time share your faith in Christ. It seems like some want to demonize this activity.

Well, it's not like they were doing good, clean, wholesome fun.

But I think we can all agree that the city of San Francisco owes this group an apology. They may have been loud, obnoxious, drunk, and rude, but what party have you seen hasn't done such? I mean, it's not like their gay pride parades are good, clean, wholesome fun. (Well, depends on how you define "wholesome".)

 

[molder]

Well, it's not like they were doing good, clean, wholesome fun.

But I think we can all agree that the city of San Francisco owes this group an apology. They may have been loud, obnoxious, drunk, and rude, but what party have you seen hasn't done such? I mean, it's not like their gay pride parades are good, clean, wholesome fun. (Well, depends on how you define "wholesome".)

So the Christians at the City Hall rally were drunk and rude according to your own far out wild speculations of this event. Back up what you say with confirmable links or news articles.

 

[Harpuia]

So the Christians at the City Hall rally were drunk and rude according to your own far out wild speculations of this event. Back up what you say with confirmable links or news articles.

Apparently, you again assume that Christian teens have this magical "aura" around them that makes them all holy and great, and they can't do no wrong. I've never seen people so delusional in my life...

 

[Ginny]

Harpuia- You are trying to convince everyone to see Christian teenagers as you do, when in reality you are a teenager yourself with only a few bad experiences under your belt and some rumors that are often found amongst teenagers anyway.

Your generalizing is very harsh based only upon a few experiences with no links, no statistics.

 

[Harpuia]

Harpuia- You are trying to convince everyone to see Christian teenagers as you do, when in reality you are a teenager yourself with only a few bad experiences under your belt and some rumors that are often found amongst teenagers anyway.

Your generalizing is very harsh based only upon a few experiences with no links, no statistics.

The reason why I have no links/statistics to offer (except maybe links to a few reviews of ATF, but you would say it's just liberal hogwash anyway), is because there haven't been any real studies on them. So I have to go by personal testimony.

You may think that the claims are outlandish, but it's obvious why. You think that just because a teenager is a Christian, they're "changed" and anything they do is justified in the name of God.

That's the problem why Christians can't mix with the secular world today. If you can't identify a real Christian from a false one, how do you expect people to take you seriously?

 

[Ginny]

The reason why I have no links/statistics to offer (except maybe links to a few reviews of ATF, but you would say it's just liberal hogwash anyway), is because there haven't been any real studies on them. So I have to go by personal testimony.

That's the problem....you are making assumptions about Christian teenagers and all you have are a few personal testimonies and passing them off as golden fact.

You may think that the claims are outlandish, but it's obvious why. You think that just because a teenager is a Christian, they're "changed" and anything they do is justified in the name of God.

That's off-topic. You have been generalizing ALL Christians/Christian events.

 

[Harpuia]

That's the problem....you are making assumptions about Christian teenagers and all you have are a few personal testimonies and passing them off as golden fact.

That's off-topic. You have been generalizing ALL Christians/Christian events.

Well, what's to say they're not? You don't seem to be whipping out any links/statistics saying Christian events are better and what not. By the way, church links don't count. They're biased.

But now that you have told me, I'm gonna find ya a couple news links I did find that would support my position... sorta. But like I said, I don't know if any studies have been done on this. I'm riding on personal testimony and that alone solely because of that. If you say that's not enough, then it's obvious that you wouldn't change your mind even if all the evidence were against you.

And if you read my posts, I haven't generalized anything. I've said specifically that there are a few people there who are probably there for the right reasons.

 

[SimplyMe]

I don't think should be thought of being out of bounds for Christians to rally at City Hall in protest of gay marriage or abortion and at the same time share your faith in Christ. It seems like some want to demonize this activity.

It is not "out of bounds" for Christians to rally at City Hall. What US law does not allow is for religious organizations, Christian or any other, to organize political activities. As I pointed out in a previous post, when a religious organization (church or ministry) engages in politics the US typically reclassifies the organization as a political one, as opposed to being religious, and removes the special rights (tax-exempt status and exemption from some civil rights regulations) they have as a religious organization.

I don't agree with Mark Leno's comments, yet I find it interesting that those who take the most offense to his comments are those who would make nearly identical comments about gays protesting.

 

[Harpuia]

http://www.portlandmercury.com/portland/Content?oid=37734&category=34029

Here ya go. Here's the only link I could find on Google news. There are no studies for or against the claims I make except for this one.

The evangelical position is that their self-righteousness is a divine order, and that any time their faith or practices are questioned, they are somehow repaying Jesus for an eternal debt they can never fulfill. This creates a mindset of ultra-sensitive, self-righteous teens who are taught to reject self-reflection, and after an entire day with thousands of people following this mentality, I couldn't endure any more.

 

[Ginny]

Well, what's to say they're not?

Who's to say they are?

Let's put it this way...if I got up all over this thread and said every concert I have been to never had any of the things happen that happen to you and that everyone there had halos on their head...why should they believe me just b/c I say so?

This is exactly what you are more or less requesting of everyone else in regards to your own personal take. No one is in denial (as you keep repeating). You just need to take it a couple of notches down with your generalizations.

 

[Harpuia]

Who's to say they are?

Let's put it this way...if I got up all over this thread and said every concert I have been to never had any of the things happen that happen to you and that everyone there had halos on their head...why should they believe me just b/c I say so?

This is exactly what you are more or less requesting of everyone else in regards to your own personal take. No one is in denial (as you keep repeating). You just need to take it a couple of notches down with your generalizations.

Bleh.. well... I tend to get very uppity when it comes to thing related to my past memories.

It's kinda why I'll never have an elephant icon up on my membername. Again... past memories.

It may be a personal thing. But I also speak for the dozens of atheists I know turned away from Christianity for those same reasons, that's all. As a matter of fact, I bet you maybe a few of those transsexual quasi-religious clowns were doing that for those exact reasons. You never know.

 

[molder]

As I pointed out in a previous post, when a religious organization (church or ministry) engages in politics the US typically reclassifies the organization as a political one, as opposed to being religious, and removes the special rights (tax-exempt status and exemption from some civil rights regulations) they have as a religious organization.

I think a religious organization in order to claim tax exempt status can not endorse a particular political party or candidate. Coming out against gay marriage or abortion may be defined as political statements by some, but will not affect tax exempt status because no political party or candidate running for office is being endorsed.

 

[SimplyMe]

I think a religious organization in order to claim tax exempt status can not endorse a particular political party or candidate. Coming out against gay marriage or abortion may be defined as political statements by some, but will not affect tax exempt status because no political party or candidate running for office is being endorsed.

Coming out against gay marriage or abortion is not, organizing public protests is. As I said previously, there was no problem with the preaching and events inside the stadium, it is the organization of what -from the invitations- appeared to be a political event.

 

[Ginny]

I think a religious organization in order to claim tax exempt status can not endorse a particular political party or candidate.

Correct

Coming out against gay marriage or abortion may be defined as political statements by some,

Key word here "some". Standing up for what God says is not a political "thing" it's a God "thing".I do't know why in the world people call it a political statement.

 

[molder]

Coming out against gay marriage or abortion is not, organizing public protests is. As I said previously, there was no problem with the preaching and events inside the stadium, it is the organization of what -from the invitations- appeared to be a political event.

I don’t see anything wrong with Churches preaching in public or organizing public protests?
I have personally preached on a street corner in San Francisco and I think it is alright according to the Bible.

 

[Voegelin]

I don’t see anything wrong with Churches preaching in public or organizing public protests?

The men and women who founded America didn't. Without the churches, there would have been no American revolution . In 1774, the military governor of Boston wrote to the Crown and said he regretted to inform the King that minsters were the major problem as they preached sedition openly from the pulpit.

People of faith could speak freely in America without being taxed for the priviliage until Lyndon Baines Johnson, when he was Senate leader, rammed an amendment to the tax code which muzzled them.

 

[2LivIsChrist]

On the contrary my dear Watson, they urge those to take a political position without using religious text, yes? (Yeah, I know they use the Bible, but the guy isn't exactly giving sermons.)

It's a nice fine line that ATF is smart not to cross.

Look, maybe I didn't make myself clear enough. The only San Fran politician I agree with was Mark Leno on that quote. To condemn them is just flat out stupid, especially when S.F. has parties involving homosexuals that are FAR worse. Go ahead, condemn them, you'll only help FURTHER their cause, politicians can be such morons sometimes...

I'm just claiming that this event could not have been as "wholesome" or "perfect" as people like Servant4God claim it to be.

what are you talking about? What does politicians have to do with anything? It's all about Jesus!

 

[SimplyMe]

I don’t see anything wrong with Churches preaching in public or organizing public protests?
I have personally preached on a street corner in San Francisco and I think it is alright according to the Bible.

Where did I claim it isn't?

 

[molder]

Where did I claim it isn't?

.
I misinterpreted your previous post #113 where you said there was no problem with the preaching and events inside the stadium and it appeared the organization was political. I mistook this as your meaning it wasn't alright to have preaching and events outside the stadium.
I am sorry about that.

 

[SimplyMe]

.
I misinterpreted your previous post #113 where you said there was no problem with the preaching and events inside the stadium and it appeared the organization was political. I mistook this as your meaning it wasn't alright to have preaching and events outside the stadium.
I am sorry about that.

I've done that before; there's no need for an apology but thank you.