Christian Homophobia

Dave01 · May 22, 2007

Word studies are good to do at times,..

9 ¶ (LIT) Or do you not know that unjust ones will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be led astray, neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor abusers, nor homosexuals,

10 (LIT) nor thieves, nor covetous ones, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor plunderers shall inherit the kingdom of God.

This is a very literal translation from the greek. First, let's get a basic definition of it from the most current strong's definition of the greek,..

G733
ἀρσενοκοίτης
arsenokoitēs
ar-sen-ok-oy'-tace
From G730 and G2845; a sodomite: - abuser of (that defile) self with mankind.

Ok, now let's look at a word study and see how the word is used through the NT or even related to the OT,..

G733

ἀρσενοκοίτης

arsenokoítēs; gen. arsenokoítou, masc. noun, from ársēn (G730), a male, and koítē (G2845), a bed. A man who lies in bed with another male, a homosexual (1Co_6:9; 1Ti_1:10 [cf. Lev_18:22; Rom_1:27]).

We can go into scholar commentaries if needed, but I think the basic definition of a homosexual in the bible is spelled out here quite easily for all to see.

IamRedeemed · May 22, 2007

Quote:
The Bible tells us that sexual immorality is sin against our own bodies unlike other sin.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body.

And why do you have any reason to suggest that sexual immorality amongst homosexuals is any worse than sexual immorality amongst heterosexuals?

Why do homosexuals need to be specifically targeted?

My post quoted above, does not indicate one sexual sin being worse than others. God said that all sexual immorality is sin, but what makes sexual sin worse than other sins is that they are sins against one's own body, as 1 Corinthians 6:18 clearly indicates.

The STD statistics you have quoted are evidence that the Scripture is absolutely true.

And let no one be deceived.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10

9Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God

EnemyPartyII said:
And why do you have any reason to suggest that sexual immorality amongst homosexuals is any worse than sexual immorality amongst heterosexuals?

Why do homosexuals need to be specifically targeted?

LoG · May 22, 2007

EnemyPartyII said:
Oh... and lets also rmember that homosexual women have the lowest incidence of HIV out of any sexual group

Lol, that stands to reason since they do not have the "parts" needed to effect seminal interchange.
Well.....

dawnsday · May 22, 2007

You know what though, I find a lot of the homophobia that comes from men to be very egotistical. I hear things like "i'll be cool as long as he doesn't hit on me" or "he probably wants me" or something along those lines. So, the fear is in another man making a pass at him.

Well, gosh, that's pretty much saying that you are soooooo hot that every gay guy in the whole wide world wants to be with you. OR it's saying that Gay people can't control themselves and every time they are near another man they become attracted to them.

Is this because so many straight men always look at women as potential mates, of some sort?

It seems to me that the phobia itself, though it may be due to extreme ego, is derived from the weaknesses and insecurities of the person with the phobia.

*not that this is all men, it's just a trend I have noticed.

Jase · May 22, 2007

IamRedeemed said:
That is absolutely true GrinningDwarf. Lovers and defenders of sin, just as satan did, look to misinterpret, misquote, malign and pervert the Scriptures, in attempts to change the perception of the truth.

And yes, that is also true, there is no one lobbying to make any cases for gluttony or greed. And yes, the homosexual agenda is about calling what is perverted "normal" and trying to force everyone to call it normal also, and even think they can control and change what God has already judged and is not changing His mind about, as He knows the plans and purposes of His creation, and He has called homosexuality detestable in His sight, and there is nothing anyone can do about it. He isn't going to change, and even if they win the battle, in the ever darkening society, they will ultimately lose the war with God almighty.

You sure he isn't going to change? He was quite fond of supporting people stoning children to death for back talking to their parents, or not allowing us to mix fabrics, but do you see us doing that anymore?

This argument has nothing to do with scripture, it has to do with fundamentalist Christians being bigots who can't look in the mirror and see their own sin so they take it out on people born with something they have no control over. Gluttony, Greed, and Corruption are FAR FAR more destructive than homosexuality, yet ironically the most fundamentalist Christian nation on Earth has the highest rate of both Gluttony and Greed. Again, can we say hypocrites?

Dave01 · May 22, 2007

When someone flames groups of people, make sure you report them.

Jase · May 22, 2007

Dave01 said:
When someone flames groups of people, make sure you report them.

This coming from the guy that condemns all theistic evolutionists to hell for accepting Evolution.

GrinningDwarf · May 22, 2007

EnemyPartyII said:
yep... LOTS of things are abomination to the lord... what makes you think that the abomination in question is homosexuality? It could be women wearing pants... thats just as much abomination.

Because Scripture explicitly tells us what abomination those in Sodom had committed:

Gen 19:4 Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom--both young and old--surrounded the house. 5 They called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them."

Sheesh...the extent some people will go to wriggle out of clear teachings of Scripture...

Maynard Keenan · May 22, 2007

IamRedeemed said:
The Bible tells us that sexual immorality (of any kind) is sin against our own bodies unlike other sin.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body.

Gluttony, while a sin against others, is also a sin against your own body. It is not healthy and doesn't preserve the temple. Abuse of drugs and alcohol are sins against your body. They are destructive to yourself and don't preserved the temple.

MelissaShae · May 22, 2007

All sexual sins are equal to God. He doesn't rank the sins in order from worst to least, a sin is a sin to God. Having pre-martial sex is just as much of a sin as having homosexual intercourse.

It is not a matter of which sin is worse, they are all bad and everyone needs to repent for their sins and pray for those sinners they come into contact with.

Now as far as homophobia goes....it is not just Christians who are homophobic. Infact many peple get the definition of homophobia wrong. It means having fear of homosexuals and I myself do not have fear of homosexuals. Aracnaphobia is the fear of spiders so if you say oh I think spiders are bad for eating those little flies, that does not make you an aracnophobic, it just means that you don't like the actions of the spider.

Maynard Keenan · May 22, 2007

The problem, Melissa, is that many people's obsession with homosexuality, and their treating it as if it is the worst of all sins, seems to indeed indicate some sort of fear. If someone accepts that it is a sin like all others, they wouldn't spend an inordinate amount of time campaigning against gay rights and for the "right" to fire someone for the simple fact that they are gay. People don't treat other sinners this way; they are singling gays out. It is either hatred or fear when this sort of disproportionate response is so easily observed.

ContentInHim · May 22, 2007

EnemyPartyII said:
So... is anyone going to explain why sexual immorality amongst homosexuals is worse than sexual immorality among heterosexuals, or what?

It isn't. Actually God is merciful and just calls homosexual sex an abomination whereas he calls for the deaths of adulterers.

ContentInHim · May 22, 2007

Jase said:
You sure he isn't going to change? He was quite fond of supporting people stoning children to death for back talking to their parents, or not allowing us to mix fabrics, but do you see us doing that anymore?

This argument has nothing to do with scripture, it has to do with fundamentalist Christians being bigots who can't look in the mirror and see their own sin so they take it out on people born with something they have no control over. Gluttony, Greed, and Corruption are FAR FAR more destructive than homosexuality, yet ironically the most fundamentalist Christian nation on Earth has the highest rate of both Gluttony and Greed. Again, can we say hypocrites?

Not according to scriptures.

ContentInHim · May 22, 2007

Maynard Keenan said:
Gluttony, while a sin against others, is also a sin against your own body. It is not healthy and doesn't preserve the temple. Abuse of drugs and alcohol are sins against your body. They are destructive to yourself and don't preserved the temple.

I do agree with this, but while scriptures says don't do that and some who did were punished with death, it also says the most destructive is sexual sin. Of all kinds!

MelissaShae · May 22, 2007

ContentInHim said:
It isn't. Actually God is merciful and just calls homosexual sex an abomination whereas he calls for the deaths of adulterers.

actually God also talks about death to homosexuals

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

dawnsday · May 22, 2007

MelissaShae said:
actually God also talks about death to homosexuals

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

8But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liarstheir place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death." NIV

8But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. KJV

8and to fearful, and unstedfast, and abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all the liars, their part [is] in the lake that is burning with fire and brimstone, which is a second death.' YLT

Seems to me this defends the point that homosexuality, if a sin, is a sin equal among other sins and shouldn't be "picked on" when the others are dismissed.

(I used different translation, just in case someone dismisses a certain translation)

MelissaShae · May 22, 2007

dawnsday said:
8But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liarstheir place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death." NIV

8But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. KJV

8and to fearful, and unstedfast, and abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all the liars, their part [is] in the lake that is burning with fire and brimstone, which is a second death.' YLT

Seems to me this defends the point that homosexuality, if a sin, is a sin equal among other sins and shouldn't be "picked on" when the others are dismissed.

(I used different translation, just in case someone dismisses a certain translation)

I agree with you!!

Our sins are all equal and none are greater than the other and we will be punished for them if we do not repent.

Homosexuality is quite often picked on when it is no greater than any other sin.

LoG · May 22, 2007

MelissaShae said:
I agree with you!!

Our sins are all equal and none are greater than the other and we will be punished for them if we do not repent.

Homosexuality is quite often picked on when it is no greater than any other sin.

Tell that to the thousands if not 10's of thousands of boys who led a lifetime of shame and guilt because of abuse suffered at the hands of priests, teachers, and others.
It has been said here that "homophobic" is the fear of homosexuals. Well guess who fears the homosexual the most, the ones who have been victimized by them. Try to remember what some of these kids went through. There are books written by them. Reading them or hearing their stories first-hand like I have, might give you a little different perspective on the true nature of the damaging effects of what God considers to be an abominable sin. I realize that there are some of you that see homosexuality and pedophiles as being two different things but it isn't the case. There is a strong parallel between the two as even Roman Catholic studies have proven.

Maybe the next time some of you want to throw around accusations of "homophobia" you may first want to ask yourself if that person has earned that right to be afraid because he learned the value of it at the tender age of 10, 11, 12 years of age at the hands of those who were supposed be trustworthy.

dawnsday · May 22, 2007

Lion of God said:
Tell that to the thousands if not 10's of thousands of boys who led a lifetime of shame and guilt because of abuse suffered at the hands of priests, teachers, and others.
It has been said here that "homophobic" is the fear of homosexuals. Well guess who fears the homosexual the most, the ones who have been victimized by them. Try to remember what some of these kids went through. There are books written by them. Reading them or hearing their stories first-hand like I have, might give you a little different perspective on the true nature of the damaging effects of what God considers to be an abominable sin. I realize that there are some of you that see homosexuality and pedophiles as being two different things but it isn't the case. There is a strong parallel between the two as even Roman Catholic studies have proven.

Maybe the next time some of you want to throw around accusations of "homophobia" you may first want to ask yourself if that person has earned that right to be afraid because he learned the value of it at the tender age of 10, 11, 12 years of age at the hands of those who were supposed be trustworthy.

Lord I pray you let me keep my outrage inside and express myself in a calm and clear way.**

Being gay does NOT mean you are a pedophile. Being gay does NOT make you a predetor.
Being gay does NOT make you violent.

Plenty more straight men rape women every single day. LOTS of straight men in traditional marriages ABUSE their sons and daughters.

SEXUAL ORIENTATION does NOT precipitate violence. NOT NOT NOT.

Here are some stats for you:

1871 women over 18 are raped by STRAIGHT men every day.

54& of all victims of sexual assault are under the age of 18. (83% under 25)

77% of rapes are committed by people the victim knows.

13% of rapes are committed against gay/lesbians.

What you just said is the equivilent of a person getting robbed by a black man or knowing someone who was robbed by a black men and calling all black men robbers.

Which is the equivilent of a person stubbing their toe from looking at a bunny rabbit and deeming all bunny rabbits are out to cause them pain.

Jase · May 22, 2007

GrinningDwarf said:
Sheesh...the extent some people will go to wriggle out of clear teachings of Scripture...

If scripture were clear, there wouldn't be 35,000 different Christian sects in the world.

Christian Homophobia

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