• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Christ did not fail in his mission.

Aaron112

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2022
5,480
1,365
TULSA
✟117,382.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Apparently, you do not know why God saved only Noah and his family. Here is precisely what the Bible says.

Genesis 6:
8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.

9 These are the records of the generations of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless in his time; Noah walked with God.
Interestingly, out of all the teeming multitudes of animals only two (male and female) of each unclean species entered the ark. Does that mean that only those two were somehow clever enough to enter the ark and the rest were unrepentant/ignorant/unwilling than those that did?
Why do you seem so concerned about the "teeming multitudes of animals" , any 'extra' getting in the ark,
but
not about the multitudes of humans , men, women and children and babies, who did not get in the ark ?

In any case, whoever or whatever got in the ark would be saved from the flood, right ?

p.s. the animals did not 'repent', they obeyed.
p.p.s. I don't remember it written that Noah or his family, those who got on the ark and were saved, repented ?
 
Upvote 0

bbbbbbb

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2015
30,438
13,967
73
✟424,284.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Why do you seem so concerned about the "teeming multitudes of animals" , any 'extra' getting in the ark,
but
not about the multitudes of humans , men, women and children and babies, who did not get in the ark ?

In any case, whoever or whatever got in the ark would be saved from the flood, right ?

p.s. the animals did not 'repent', they obeyed.
p.p.s. I don't remember it written that Noah or his family, those who got on the ark and were saved, repented ?
Is obedience a conscious or an unconscious process?
 
Upvote 0

bling

Regular Member
Site Supporter
Feb 27, 2008
16,816
1,925
✟993,205.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The Creator , before creating anything at all of the world, sun, moon, stars, trees, animals, or men,
knew perfectly all things
and knew perfectly who would be the elect, saved,
and knew perfectly who would be the non-elect, forever lost.
To be saved you have to at some time been lost even if that is at the beginning. of time. So what is the difference between the lost that will be saved and the lost that will remain lost when they were both lost?
 
  • Like
Reactions: BobRyan
Upvote 0

Aaron112

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2022
5,480
1,365
TULSA
✟117,382.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
To be saved you have to at some time been lost even if that is at the beginning. of time. So what is the difference between the lost that will be saved and the lost that will remain lost when they were both lost?
The Creator Decides. He Is In Charge.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Aaron112

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2022
5,480
1,365
TULSA
✟117,382.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Because you said, "the animals did not 'repent', they obeyed"

I am curious as to whether you believe that the animals consciously or unconsciously obeyed.
If your pet dog is watching eagerly your eyes, waiting for you to pet him or do something,
and you tell him to sit, is he conscious or unconscious ?

If you pet dog is drugged, unconscious, breathing and alive but not awake, not alert, not looking nor able to look at anything,
and you tell him to sit, he won't respond at all, will he ?
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
53,376
11,916
Georgia
✟1,095,436.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Christ did not fail in his mission. Christ's death on the cross has a 100% success rate. God saved his elect that he meant to save and not one will be lost. How do I know this? God said so and God is incapable of lying or failure.
God says -- "God is not partial" Rom 2:11 - and God is incapable of lying
God says - "God is not WILLING that any should perish" 2 Peter 3:9 - and God does not lie
God says -- Christ "is the atoning sacrifice for our sins and NOT for our sins only but for the sins of the whole world" 1 John 2:2 and God cannot lie
God never downsized the term "whole world" so that he can then say "the whole world will be saved" -- because God does not lie
God says "God sent His Son to be the Savior of the world" 1 John 4:14 - and God does not lie.
God says Jesus "came to His OWN and His OWN - received Him not" John 1:11 -- and God cannot lie
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
53,376
11,916
Georgia
✟1,095,436.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
From what you have said can we assume it is an arbitrary selection?
"Arbitrary selection" is the process of selecting one to be saved and another lost - having nothing at all to do with the person being selected.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bling
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
53,376
11,916
Georgia
✟1,095,436.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
To be saved you have to at some time been lost even if that is at the beginning. of time. So what is the difference between the lost that will be saved and the lost that will remain lost when they were both lost?
Exactly - both are lost -- one becomes saved and the other does not.

Is 5:4 "what MORE could I have done than that which I have already done?! - Why then when I expected good fruit did my people produce bad fruit?"

God says He is not to blame for the ones that reject His gospel

He sovereignly and supernaturally "Draws ALL MANKIND unto Him" John 12:32
 
  • Like
Reactions: bling
Upvote 0

bbbbbbb

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2015
30,438
13,967
73
✟424,284.00
Faith
Non-Denom
If your pet dog is watching eagerly your eyes, waiting for you to pet him or do something,
and you tell him to sit, is he conscious or unconscious ?

If you pet dog is drugged, unconscious, breathing and alive but not awake, not alert, not looking nor able to look at anything,
and you tell him to sit, he won't respond at all, will he ?
So, apparently only two of each unclean species of animals (male and female) decided to obey God and walk into the ark whereas all of the other multitudes of animals decided not to do it. Who asked them to obey? Assuredly it could not have been Noah as the vast majority of these animals were not his pets.
 
Upvote 0

Aaron112

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2022
5,480
1,365
TULSA
✟117,382.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
So, apparently only two of each unclean species of animals (male and female) decided to obey God and walk into the ark whereas all of the other multitudes of animals decided not to do it.
Look again in all Scripture. Is there any indication that the Creator told or asked or led any animals to the Ark besides the ones who arrived and got on the Ark? /p.s. no/
Is there any indication anywhere in Scripture that the animals sinned ? Again, no.
 
Upvote 0

bling

Regular Member
Site Supporter
Feb 27, 2008
16,816
1,925
✟993,205.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
From All that the Creator Always Has Said, do you think it is arbitrary ?
God saves the "whosoever" of their own very limited autonomous free will choose to humbly accept God's unconditional undeserved Love (in the form of forgiveness) as pure undeserved charity. If this is not the deciding factor to God salvation, then it is arbitrary, but I would consider your alternative.
 
Upvote 0

Aaron112

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2022
5,480
1,365
TULSA
✟117,382.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
God saves the "whosoever" of their own very limited autonomous free will choose to humbly accept God's unconditional undeserved Love (in the form of forgiveness) as pure undeserved charity. If this is not the deciding factor to God salvation, then it is arbitrary, but I would consider your alternative.
If there is this, any other, or any alternative that God Wishes you to know, He is Well Able, If He Pleases so to do.
 
Upvote 0

bbbbbbb

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2015
30,438
13,967
73
✟424,284.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Look again in all Scripture. Is there any indication that the Creator told or asked or led any animals to the Ark besides the ones who arrived and got on the Ark? /p.s. no/
Is there any indication anywhere in Scripture that the animals sinned ? Again, no.
Absolutely. However, the vast majority of animals were, and remain, unclean in God's sight. God is quite specific as to the reasons for their uncleanness and it does not have anything to do with sin on their part. These animals are born unclean and can never become clean. Thus, it is quite immaterial as to whether the pairs of animals on the ark ever had any ability to obey.
 
Upvote 0

bling

Regular Member
Site Supporter
Feb 27, 2008
16,816
1,925
✟993,205.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
If there is this, any other, or any alternative that God Wishes you to know, He is Well Able, If He Pleases so to do.
It is not a knowledge issue, it is a heart issue. In the parables of the banquets, are you willing to accept or reject the invitation which is a huge draw. In the parable of the prodigal son you are like the older son so will you attend the party. There is no knowledge issue for nothing more could be said to get you to go, but it is a heart issue.
 
Upvote 0