Caution! Rick Joyner is coming with more "revelations"!

[Ajax 777]

I can't stop laughing sorry guys

 

[Frogster]

Just stop doing it. You can if you try.

actually this over compensation proves my point, no text debate, just alter my posts, by the way, you are in vilolation of forum rules, the law....

 

[Frogster]

I can't stop laughing sorry guys

well...i gotta say, i never saw one actually alter a post, and then respond to it!

at least i offer a text debate...but i never get one....

 

[Yitzchak]

I want to make some more personal attacks on you. It seems to distract from the fact that I am wrong and don"t make sense You're an idiot and a homosexual...

Dude, how dare you call me an idiot and a homosexual. How rude !!

 

[Ajax 777]

Lol

 

[Frogster]

Lol

no, it's tee hee....

 

[Yitzchak]

Speaking of Rick Warren (for a moment). I don't agree with what I've heard of his program (at least how it's administered). I heard one testimony of how a large church was "taken over" and elders dismissed. The more I heard, the more I wept.

But Rick was on TV last night on one of those news-talk shows. I can't think of his name right off, but he's a very well known, British guy who interviews many famous people (Pierce?). Anyway, he seems to be gay (judging by the way he's insinuation how the church needs to revise itself on the gay issue). Anyway, he cornered Rick about it (no doubt thinking they'll pry something controversial out of him). He said something like, "I don't believe that God changes what He thinks to make certain people happy (I'm sure this is far from exact.)." "...Yet you keep inviting me on your show."

The audience applauded and I was really surprised for the stance that Warren took, when many cave on the issue as man-pleasers.

He has his good moments. But I think it is an act. My main objection to him is his involvement in ecumenical services with Muslims. He signed a document that says that Christians and Muslims worship the same god and really have the same basic principles which is to love god and love our neighbor. He has spearheaded joint projects together with Muslims and spoken at Muslim conferences.

This is the short version , of course.

 

[Alive_Again]

I strongly object to Islam. It's a bad mix. This kind of reminds me of John Paul II, when he hosted an ecumenical counsel of sorts in Assisi a few years ago or so. He invited religious leaders from a dozen or so of the world's religions. They were given rooms where they were urged to pray. There are pictures of Karol having some kind of shaman waving a smoking maize plant (I think it was). He was literally putting a curse on him and Karol just thought it was some show of unity. There was a statue of a Boddha put on the altar and I aw it as the lowest point in the history of the Catholic Church. There was an earthquake in that church within a year.

Anyway, I know John Paul was a believer, even though he was greatly deceived on this and a number of other important issues. He ended up dying with a debilitating disease and it wouldn't surprise me if it were not related to the event he hosted.

I'm sure some Catholics would think that extreme, but you can pick up all kinds of destructive curses by joining in unity with various streams of darkness.

 

[Yitzchak]

Here is a link for the Jim Baker show interviewing Joyner. Thank you to the person who private messaged me the link.


A Prophetic Word for America | Jim Bakker Show


What the interview is about is Joyner wrote a new book in his prophetic series. The name of the book is "The Path ".

This is definitely fun stuff. I don't celebrate Christmas but if I were to make an exception and were to accept an invitation to spend Christmas dinner somewhere , it would be with these people. They are lots of fun to watch.


The connection with Elijah and Enoch is because they are the forerunners for the end times and this revelation is about the end times preparing the way for the second coming of Christ.


It is a very serious and sober word from Joyner and definitely not the silliness that was falsely portrayed. The style is funny though especially Jim Baker's new wife.

The survival kits made me laugh. Complete with a canteen. The flashlight from the survival kit says on the side of it "Jesus is my light" . I guess if you have to go through tough times , you can survive in style. That was Jim Baker. Only in America. This is fun to watch.


Joyner treats the vision with respect and there is no glorying in the flesh as has been falsely reported. I watched the video and enjoyed it. I encourage people to watch it for yourself and weigh it out as a berean. Don't listen to these false reports which are mocking and taking potshots over innuendos and the like. This is a Christian leader giving a sober message to the church. Lets be mature enough to listen carefully and discern what is being said. Not stumble over silly distractions.

There are actually three videos. This one is just the first , but the other two can be found on the same website.

The substance of the message is what really matters. How about we discuss that ??

 

[Zugzwang]

On this thread and on the other threads about Haggee and Roth , there are not links provided and no evidence is presented.

no evidence against Hagee? what?!

John Haggee False Prophet Denies Jesus As Messiah! - YouTube

I don't understand those that refuse to acknowledge the times we live in.

In 2nd thess. 2 it says the falling away happens before the A/C is revealed.

In Matt. 24 it says the AGAPE love of many will wax cold. (That's US btw folks) Only a Christian can have Agape love.

1 world religion
1 world economy
1 world govt (announced already officially @ the g20 in 09)
1 world dictator.

Honestly, how did you expect all of this to go down without some kind of major prep?

It isn't the world or satan winning, it's us redefining what Christ has called Holy; what do you ppl expect?

NIV has 80 THOUSAND greek characters missing, why is it even in our churches?

All of this seems so obvious to me, i genuinely don't understand how hard any of this is to grasp.

respectfully.

 

[Yitzchak]

no evidence against Hagee? what?!

John Haggee False Prophet Denies Jesus As Messiah! - YouTube

I don't understand those that refuse to acknowledge the times we live in.

In 2nd thess. 2 it says the falling away happens before the A/C is revealed.

In Matt. 24 it says the AGAPE love of many will wax cold. (That's US btw folks) Only a Christian can have Agape love.

1 world religion
1 world economy
1 world govt (announced already officially @ the g20 in 09)
1 world dictator.

Honestly, how did you expect all of this to go down without some kind of major prep?

It isn't the world or satan winning, it's us redefining what Christ has called Holy; what do you ppl expect?

NIV has 80 THOUSAND greek characters missing, why is it even in our churches?

All of this seems so obvious to me, i genuinely don't understand how hard any of this is to grasp.

respectfully.

What I am responding to is posts which provided general statements without any links or specific and measurable accusations. Just a general bashing of someone with petty issues and innuendos. Saying that someone looked silly. That sort of thing.

I am open to discussions about specific charges where there is some source of information that we can all access and see first hand for ourselves. It is the issue of no evidence being provided as a basis for discussion. Whether or not that evidence is sound is the subject to discuss. But when none is provided and the only thing said is that the person looked silly based on someone's subjective opinion and a few vague statments , then there is no basis to discuss.

As I remember the thread I mentioned , the charge made against Hagee was that he was pro Israel. To my thinking , being pro Israel is a good thing.


I know I brought it up , but I am not looking to discuss Hagee in depth on this thread. I was simply listing it as an example of where the poster in question made vague statements about someone without any evidence or sources. But thank you for providing a link and a basis for discussion. I suggest a separate thread to discuss Hagee in depth. I think that this type of subject is worthy of it's own thread since it is likely to result in dozens and perhaps hundreds of posts.



Anyway , I watched the video just now.

Have you taken the time to read the book and get the context of the statements which Hagee made ?

In Defense of Israel - John Hagee - Google Books



Chapter ten is where Hagee discusses Jesus as Messiah and defines the term as a political Messiah sent to free Israel from Roman oppression. His meaning was that Jesus did not come the first time to restore Israel in that way. That type of restoration happens later in the future. He came to die as the savior , the first time.

Here is an interesting article that gets into this issue.

http://carm.org/john-hagee-denies-jesus-claimed-to-be-the-messiah

Anyway , you just helped make my point that this is what it looks like when there is an attempt made to discuss specifics and a link provided. There is room for discussion. There is actual evidence of what was said. Thank you.

 

[Zugzwang]

What I am responding to is posts which provided general statements without any links or specific and measurable accusations. Just a general bashing of someone with petty issues and innuendos. Saying that someone looked silly. That sort of thing.

I am open to discussions about specific charges where there is some source of information that we can all access and see first hand for ourselves. It is the issue of no evidence being provided as a basis for discussion. Whether or not that evidence is sound is the subject to discuss. But when none is provided and the only thing said is that the person looked silly based on someone's subjective opinion and a few vague statments , then there is no basis to discuss.

As I remember the thread I mentioned , the charge made against Hagee was that he was pro Israel. To my thinking , being pro Israel is a good thing.


I know I brought it up , but I am not looking to discuss Hagee in depth on this thread. I was simply listing it as an example of where the poster in question made vague statements about someone without any evidence or sources. But thank you for providing a link and a basis for discussion. I suggest a separate thread to discuss Hagee in depth. I think that this type of subject is worthy of it's own thread since it is likely to result in dozens and perhaps hundreds of posts.



Anyway , I watched the video just now.

Have you taken the time to read the book and get the context of the statements which Hagee made ?

In Defense of Israel - John Hagee - Google Books



You just helped make my point that this is what it looks like when there is an attempt made to discuss specifics and a link provided. There is room for discussion. Thank you.

which version of his book do you want to discuss, he recalled the first edition.

John Hagee says he believes Jesus IS Messiah | the expositor

i mentioned hagee obviously b/c you brought him up. I am NOT interested however, in making a bash hagee thread.

My point, which i think was lost on you, was what scripture says. There's ALOT of disinfo, preached by "men of god" that the bible doesn't agree with, yet most christians believe this nonsense BECAUSE they are ignorant of the word of God.

How many talking pundits say for example that Iran wants to push Israel into the sea? Yet in Ez 38-39 it mentions Persia wants to "plunder" Israel.

That's steal from, not genocide.

And seeing how it's in the word, I think God knows the hearts and minds, where we don't. (I read for example, that it was the shaw, not Ahmindinjed, that made that statement that the talking pundits keep saying about Iran, and that it was a mistranslation from the get go. (And since we are now living in the "if you like your insurance, you can keep it era, I'll believe the media outside of the US, tyvm.

My ONLY point here, totally, is that what we KNOW, what we are taught in Church, and what the bible says, word for word, is sadly, very often, not the same thing, that is all. and i refuse to argue what men THINK vs. what the bible SAYS, period.

btw how any preacher can say he "miscommunicated" that he believes Jesus is the messiah when he said the exact opposite WORD FOR WORD, and yet ppl can still believe him...well we live in the age of which shade of grey you prefer, now don't we?

I choose not to.

 

[Yitzchak]

The next video has Joyner getting into a discussion about Marshall law being declared in America. A very frightening prospect. Joyner refers back to his start of speaking about Marshall law in America back in the 80's.

Again , this is not silliness. This is a serious word and warrants a serious consideration and response.

There is also some discussion about health care reform.




A Prophetic Word for America | Jim Bakker Show



One of the main themes is persecution of Christians on the rise. Especially in America. I would say that Joyner is one voice of many saying this.


Watch the video and judge for yourself. The opening post is a gross mis-characterization of what took place on the show.

 

[Frogster]

who declared joyner my christian leader? many do not like the NAr movement, somone here on the thread, even doubts the apostolic office now, and a sister said she is not into nar, joyner is nar!

Who said this on the thread? Wow...


His particiapation with NAR is one of those. Even aside from some radical beliefs and a desire to radically reform the church , there is the concern of such a huge and powerful man made organization corrupting even good people with pride.[/I]

 

[Frogster]

Good advice. Rick Joyner is mainstream enough to have a lot of good and edifying teaching. On the basics , he is solidly Christian. He also has his own distinctive teachings which are debatable. generally speaking it is the distinctive teachings where we find the trouble , but as you mentioned we also find a lot of good. the churches which only give the milk and the basics are safe but very limited.

I don't give my approval or disapproval of Joyner's ministry. Except to say that he is good on the basics and questionable on some of his distinctive beliefs.

His particiapation with NAR is one of those. Even aside from some radical beliefs and a desire to radically reform the church , there is the concern of such a huge and powerful man made organization corrupting even good people with pride. Of course , one can say this about the church as a while and any person who aspires to a position of authority and popularity. Whether the Pope or Billy Graham or Benny Hinn , these platforms can lead to pride and living in a bubble that is out of touch with the average person. I don't say that Joyner has fallen into error , just that there is cause for concern. Another area of concern is the re establishment of the role of the Apostle and the prophet. These are both risky endeavors and worthy of concern.

But even in saying that , I think that being on the cutting edge and being a risk taker makes things exciting. Lots of Biblical heroes played similar roles.

As for visions and personal revelations , it is difficult to find a Charismatic believer , whether a leader or laity that does not lay claim to a personal relationship with the Lord and some level of supernatural personal revelation. I hear people say things like God led me to move or to take this job or to marry this person or a pastor might say God led them to preach that specific sermon. I find nothing extraordinary about a Christian leader claiming to have heard from God. Since Joyner keeps his personal revelations within the confines of the orthodox Christian faith , they are fairly safe. There is no reason for alarm bells and paranoia.

In the red, right here, unedited, just highlighted. "his partipipation with nar", "corrupting good people with pride", "radical beliefs", all said about Joyner, and yes, just as froggy said, I go after the bizarre, and extreme..

So i was right, hey, if my opponent on the thread says this above in red, i must be...

gee, questionable, good! The frog questioned...tee hee.

 

[Frogster]

The next video has Joyner getting into a discussion about Marshall law being declared in America. A very frightening prospect. Joyner refers back to his start of speaking about Marshall law in America back in the 80's.

Again , this is not silliness. This is a serious word and warrants a serious consideration and response.

There is also some discussion about health care reform.




A Prophetic Word for America | Jim Bakker Show



One of the main themes is persecution of Christians on the rise. Especially in America. I would say that Joyner is one voice of many saying this.


Watch the video and judge for yourself. The opening post is a gross mis-characterization of what took place on the show.

post the part about elijah being sad about his life, while enoch was happy, happy, and how we will all be happy like retar--ds, as joyner said, they said, we will be..

The retar--ded word was offenssive also, lets post that part too....

 

[Frogster]

again, this 3 way conversation sounded silly with joyner, enoch, and elijah, and again, many question Nar, even one on this thread, while at the same time, argues for joyner, the inter galatic chatter, with elijah, and enoch.

 

[Frogster]

This is sound advice.

Joyner preaches to follow the scriptures , he teaches to be born again. He is sound on all the cardinal doctrines of the Christian faith.

Where I find issues of concern and disagreement are on some of his distinctive beliefs where he goes beyond just the basics of the faith.

I have mixed feelings about the restoration of the fivefold ministry which includes the office of Apostle. This is a complicated issue and can mean a lot of things.
In short , Joyner is a button pusher and a risk taker. He is not a stick with the status quo type of guy. He takes a lot of controversial stands.

That does not mean that he is a false prophet. It means that he has some areas where he gets it wrong , as we all do. It also could mean there are some areas where he gets it right and I am the one who does not understand correctly.

I like the saying ,



What I am saying is that I disagree with Joyner on some non essentials. But I am convinced that he is a christian brother.

red above, if you don"t want the office of apostle, and joyner is nar, that sounds kind of part of the self proclaimed super apostle crowd..

well...do you want super apostles, who are going to reform everything with their 'revelations and visions", or don't you? people can't have it both ways.

if one wants rick, one gets the whole package....


Paul fought this stuff in Corinth, big time.

 

[Yitzchak]

post the part about elijah being sad about his life, while enoch was happy, happy, and how we will all be happy like retar--ds, as joyner said, they said, we will be..

The retar--ded word was offenssive also, lets post that part too....

This is all a part of the first video that I posted. Joyner said that he asked Elijah why Enoch had more joy than Elijah and Joyner says that Elijah answered that they got locked into that pattern by choices that they made while upon the earth. His point was to choose joy now. This was not some silly and foolish conversation as you have portrayed it. Joyner was very sober and serious about it.

The part about being happy was said in the context of speaking about the dark and stressful times that we are living in and what was said was that the world will not understand the joy that Christians who are walking close to the Lord will have in the coming days. They will stand out. They will not make sense to the world to the point that the world will see them as stupid because they don't know enough to be sad and stressed like everyone else. This is already taking place. People at my wife's workplace already say something similar to that now. They don't understand her peace and joy. Why doesn't she chain smoke and stress the way most of them do ?

The fact that you have attempted to spin such petty details into some scandal is your opinion. My judgment is quite different. As I said , these people are a hoot. With their accents and their expressions and ways of putting things , it is very southern United States in flavor. They crack jokes in a typical American way. That stuff is high humor to watch for many Canadians.

But that is cultural and not a negative thing.

As for the word [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] , I don't use that word myself. But the context that it was used in was not to mock special needs people. It was used as a word to describe how the world would see " out of touch " Christians. They would see them as stupid to the point of brain damage.

Again , this seems like over pressing petty points. I suggest people watch the video themselves.

 

[Frogster]

This is all a part of the first video that I posted. Joyner said that he asked Elijah why Enoch had more joy than Elijah and Joyner says that Elijah answered that they got locked into that pattern by choices that they made while upon the earth. His point was to choose joy now. This was not some silly and foolish conversation as you have portrayed it. Joyner was very sober and serious about it.

The part about being happy was said in the context of speaking about the dark and stressful times that we are living in and what was said was that the world will not understand the joy that Christians who are walking close to the Lord will have in the coming days. They will stand out. They will not make sense to the world to the point that the world will see them as stupid because they don't know enough to be sad and stressed like everyone else. This is already taking place. People at my wife's workplace already say something similar to that now. They don't understand her peace and joy. Why doesn't she chain smoke and stress the way most of them do ?

The fact that you have attempted to spin such petty details into some scandal is your opinion. My judgment is quite different. As I said , these people are a hoot. With their accents and their expressions and ways of putting things , it is very southern United States in flavor. They crack jokes in a typical American way. That stuff is high humor to watch for many Canadians.

But that is cultural and not a negative thing.

As for the word [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] , I don't use that word myself. But the context that it was used in was not to mock special needs people. It was used as a word to describe how the world would see " out of touch " Christians. They would see them as stupid to the point of brain damage.

Again , this seems like over pressing petty points. I suggest people watch the video themselves.

lemee ask ya this...

if next, joyner chats with moses, and Paul, will you believe that too?:o

well, lets chuck in peter too, ther seems to be no lmit, like sid Roth, i guess we just introject everything, and behave, and say nothing.