Caution! Rick Joyner is coming with more "revelations"!

[Frogster]

This is all a part of the first video that I posted. Joyner said that he asked Elijah why Enoch had more joy than Elijah and Joyner says that Elijah answered that they got locked into that pattern by choices that they made while upon the earth. His point was to choose joy now. This was not some silly and foolish conversation as you have portrayed it. Joyner was very sober and serious about it.

The part about being happy was said in the context of speaking about the dark and stressful times that we are living in and what was said was that the world will not understand the joy that Christians who are walking close to the Lord will have in the coming days. They will stand out. They will not make sense to the world to the point that the world will see them as stupid because they don't know enough to be sad and stressed like everyone else. This is already taking place. People at my wife's workplace already say something similar to that now. They don't understand her peace and joy. Why doesn't she chain smoke and stress the way most of them do ?

The fact that you have attempted to spin such petty details into some scandal is your opinion. My judgment is quite different. As I said , these people are a hoot. With their accents and their expressions and ways of putting things , it is very southern United States in flavor. They crack jokes in a typical American way. That stuff is high humor to watch for many Canadians.

But that is cultural and not a negative thing.

As for the word [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] , I don't use that word myself. But the context that it was used in was not to mock special needs people. It was used as a word to describe how the world would see " out of touch " Christians. They would see them as stupid to the point of brain damage.

Again , this seems like over pressing petty points. I suggest people watch the video themselves.

wouldn't it be easier to not defend the retar--ded word, he says, they said, they used?

i mean really....

 

[Frogster]

nighty nighty, I am going to get raptured tonight. please believe everything I say, then the lord will put me back in my bed by 7 am..

oh, the gabriel is going to cook me breakfast, 2 egggs with salt pepper, and glory dust, sounds yummy...tee hee..


see ya tomorrow....

 

[Faulty]

So, Joyner goes to heaven and sins by chatting with the dead? Interesting.

 

[Andrea411]

No. But Jesus does have an angry side. The scripture records that he got angry a few times. So there is a place for godly correction and hatred for sin.

Jesus saw things with 100% clarity and that did not require cynicism. As a matter of fact , a cynical attitude actually makes a person less discerning. These past few threads are examples of that. No evidence is given , and assumptions are made. Cynicism leads to false accusations and Jesus loves what is true , not railroading someone and/or bearing false witness against someone. Cynicism exalts someone's suspicions to the level of truth. A dangerous proposition , indeed.

Just imagine if our criminal justice systems were run this way. A cynical judge would declare you guilty with no evidence. His logic would be that crime exists and therefore you must be guilty. A police officer would pull you over and give you a ticket even though there was no evidence of you doing anything wrong. his logic would be that criminals exist and police give tickets , and so therefore you must be guilty. His cynical attitude would justify his unrighteous behavior in his own mind.

I am grateful that the justice system in America sets a higher standard than cynicism and I am thankful that God sets a higher standard. True discernment is based on truth , not suspicions.

my point was that as we are being conformed into the image of Christ… I don't think there is a place in our hearts for cynicism. It is not a Christ-like attribute and should not be something a person is proud of. It might be true and something we need to deal with but not something we try to achieve, but rather repent of….
I have found myself cynical at times, then I have to go through my own heart and clean it up…. sharing honestly with the Lord. Cynicism is just more pride, they don't do it my way, or they hurt me etc etc. Christ has already told us what to do about that….. pray and forgive. Only then can we see clearly, discern clearly and be as Christ told us as little children. Wise but not cynical.
I find it better if I can't be open to someone to at least be kind. So for those I don't agree with, I try not to force them into a confrontation but to share my own struggle with my own issues. I am no better then they, just at a different place in a different time.
God bless, andrea

 

[Yitzchak]

red above, if you don"t want the office of apostle, and joyner is nar, that sounds kind of part of the self proclaimed super apostle crowd..

well...do you want super apostles, who are going to reform everything with their 'revelations and visions", or don't you? people can't have it both ways.

if one wants rick, one gets the whole package....


Paul fought this stuff in Corinth, big time.

Thank you. Now we are getting into the actual substance of what Joyner teaches.

First , I want to clarify something. I have never seen Joyner brag or treat his role as an Apostle in a frivolous way. He treats it as a serious responsibility and calling.

With that said , that does not absolve him from being accountable for that kind of claim. Claiming to be an Apostle is a bold claim to make.


I have some concerns about the distinctive teachings of NAR. I believe that they are sound on the basic truth of the Christan faith and the Gospel. But they do seem to have a tendency towards some exaggeration and drama , in my opinion. And their distinctive doctrines such as apostolic authority trouble me.

Where I agree with NAR is in the fact that the church has a serious problem. It is in decline and we do need a serious revival or reformation that will restore the church. But where I disagree is what their role is in being the solution.

I don't have problems with Joyner having visions and personal revelations provided that he maintains an attitude that those revelations are to be submitted to the authority of scripture. And provided that he reconizes the liberty of conscience of each Christian to test and decide for themselves.

To my knowledge , he has not pressed his Apostolic role as his authority for these revelations . Rather he has laid claim to the same thing as any Spirit filled Christian. The ability to hear messages from God.

As for some of the extras such as conversations with Elijah.To be blunt , that to me is Charismatic fluff. That does not matter to me one way or the other.

If I had a dollar for every one of those that I have heard from almost every Charismatic that I have ever met. I have heard some pretty mediocre sermons preached by pastors who claimed divine unction just prior to their preaching which told them specifically what to say. I usually dismiss that as fluff. Personal sentiment.

I can do the translation and understand that frequently the conversations that Charismatics relate are not verbal , actual conversations. They are impressions within their mind and thus fallible. I have met many sincere Charismatics who think God told them something and it does not pan out. It does not mean that they lied. It means they made a mistake and misinterpreted their own thoughts as an impression in their spirit. The same could eb said about a check in the spirit , by the way.

What matters is the substance of his message. Thankfully he wrote a book so we all get a chance to read it and see for ourselves what he is saying. God may be in it , or perhaps Joyner has an over active imagination and dreamed it up. Time will tell. So far I see very little of substance to be overly critical of.

Bottom line. Joyner has a a large following. It is no surprise to me if God chooses to use him to deliver a message to the church. He is fallible , but in my opinion a true Christian brother.

 

[Yitzchak]

So, Joyner goes to heaven and sins by chatting with the dead? Interesting.

Elijah and Enoch never died.


Also I am not clear as to whether Joyner claims a literal visit to heaven or if he had a vision with inner mental impressions of these conversations. Often , that is what a Charismatic means when they relate these experiences.

 

[Yitzchak]

my point was that as we are being conformed into the image of Christ… I don't think there is a place in our hearts for cynicism. It is not a Christ-like attribute and should not be something a person is proud of. It might be true and something we need to deal with but not something we try to achieve, but rather repent of….
I have found myself cynical at times, then I have to go through my own heart and clean it up…. sharing honestly with the Lord. Cynicism is just more pride, they don't do it my way, or they hurt me etc etc. Christ has already told us what to do about that….. pray and forgive. Only then can we see clearly, discern clearly and be as Christ told us as little children. Wise but not cynical.
I find it better if I can't be open to someone to at least be kind. So for those I don't agree with, I try not to force them into a confrontation but to share my own struggle with my own issues. I am no better then they, just at a different place in a different time.
God bless, andrea

I have struggled with bitterness recently. I think being bitter and being cynical are similar and kind of go together. I can be very cynical of those who hurt me deeply and betrayed my trust. But like you , I see it as something to be overcome and not as something to be embraced.

Psa 1:1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
Psa 1:2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.

Php 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

 

[Yitzchak]

wouldn't it be easier to not defend the retar--ded word, he says, they said, they used?

i mean really....

Since you are asking , If I were his PR guy , I would advise him to use a different word choice.

But personally , I am not that concerned about his insensitive word choice and lack of political correctness. I am more concerned with content and intent of heart. it doesn't bother me.

 

[Frogster]

Since you are asking , If I were his PR guy , I would advise him to use a different word choice.

But personally , I am not that concerned about his insensitive word choice and lack of political correctness. I am more concerned with content and intent of heart. it doesn't bother me.

so you actually beleive that enoch said, we will look hapilly retar--ded to the world? And he said it like enoch said it was great!

amazing...

 

[Frogster]

Thank you. Now we are getting into the actual substance of what Joyner teaches.

First , I want to clarify something. I have never seen Joyner brag or treat his role as an Apostle in a frivolous way. He treats it as a serious responsibility and calling.

With that said , that does not absolve him from being accountable for that kind of claim. Claiming to be an Apostle is a bold claim to make.


I have some concerns about the distinctive teachings of NAR. I believe that they are sound on the basic truth of the Christan faith and the Gospel. But they do seem to have a tendency towards some exaggeration and drama , in my opinion. And their distinctive doctrines such as apostolic authority trouble me.

Where I agree with NAR is in the fact that the church has a serious problem. It is in decline and we do need a serious revival or reformation that will restore the church. But where I disagree is what their role is in being the solution.

I don't have problems with Joyner having visions and personal revelations provided that he maintains an attitude that those revelations are to be submitted to the authority of scripture. And provided that he reconizes the liberty of conscience of each Christian to test and decide for themselves.

To my knowledge , he has not pressed his Apostolic role as his authority for these revelations . Rather he has laid claim to the same thing as any Spirit filled Christian. The ability to hear messages from God.

As for some of the extras such as conversations with Elijah.To be blunt , that to me is Charismatic fluff. That does not matter to me one way or the other.

If I had a dollar for every one of those that I have heard from almost every Charismatic that I have ever met. I have heard some pretty mediocre sermons preached by pastors who claimed divine unction just prior to their preaching which told them specifically what to say. I usually dismiss that as fluff. Personal sentiment.

I can do the translation and understand that frequently the conversations that Charismatics relate are not verbal , actual conversations. They are impressions within their mind and thus fallible. I have met many sincere Charismatics who think God told them something and it does not pan out. It does not mean that they lied. It means they made a mistake and misinterpreted their own thoughts as an impression in their spirit. The same could eb said about a check in the spirit , by the way.

What matters is the substance of his message. Thankfully he wrote a book so we all get a chance to read it and see for ourselves what he is saying. God may be in it , or perhaps Joyner has an over active imagination and dreamed it up. Time will tell. So far I see very little of substance to be overly critical of.

Bottom line. Joyner has a a large following. It is no surprise to me if God chooses to use him to deliver a message to the church. He is fallible , but in my opinion a true Christian brother.

red abive, joyner is part of the serious problem though, you can slice it and dice it, but you can't get around it, if there is a serious problem in a movement, and he is in it, then he must have a serious problem!

i can't wait to hear about his next revelation, that he brings down to us..


"happy retar--ded"!


If he says next he chatted with peter and paul, will you believe him? yes or no?

 

[Frogster]

Elijah and Enoch never died.


Also I am not clear as to whether Joyner claims a literal visit to heaven or if he had a vision with inner mental impressions of these conversations. Often , that is what a Charismatic means when they relate these experiences.

wha? it sure sounded like more than a "mental impression", it was dialog...these guys were hanging out, in full chat mode.

 

[jsimms615]

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