I have a ways to go myself, but by the grace of God i do have the advantage of having time to write thousands of posts dealing with Catholics and their assertions (mostly on another forum with judicious moderators), and to do research in such, plus having been a weekly mass-going Catholic for years, including after being born again and realizing its profound basic changes in heart and in life, and with a hunger to know how to please God from the Scriptures. To whom God is to get all credit for what is good.
As for Staples, he would not show up here (invite him!) since hat risks being exposed as the propagandist and sophist that he is, which "Catholic Answers" with its zealous censorious mods works to prevent. I have taken the time to
refute some of his stuff which was posted by others, and
debated his comrade Dave Armstrong on his own web site, who deleted my responses without any notice. Your error apparently is uncritically relying on them for your arguments.
Part of what makes on a weaker debater is the rookie mistake is that of continually engaging in "argument by assertion," as if stating the same things that you believed made them true, and not substantively and reasonably interacting with that which challenges them.
The error here is, as told you
before,
"the uninspired post-scriptural selected writings of so-called church "father" are not determinitive of what the early church believed in the only wholly inspired record of what the NT church believed (including how they understood the gospels). And when in conflict with Scripture the writings of ECFs reveal the degree of accretion of traditions of men, which you cannot anachronistically impose upon the NT church."
But that than dealing with my response, you just reiterate standard Catholic apologetics.
Likewise regarding John 6, to which I said,
"while Caths assert they take this literal, but if they do then they must exclude Christians who disagree with Catholicism on this from having spiritual life in them, and eternal life, since a literal understanding of
John 6:53 requires believing and taking part in the Lord's supper to have both, but which is never what the NT church preached.
And as told you before and ignored, I do not have to agree with the symbolic [metaphorical] viw, "except that is the only interpretation is easily conflated with the rest of Scripture. . See
here by God's grace."
Thus rather than invoking what non-inspired men as determinitive of what John 6 means, and v. 53,54 in particular, you need to show in the inspired record of what the NT church believed where taking part in the Lord's suppers is how one obtains spiritual life in them, and eternal life.
Which is simply reliance upon non-inspired men as determinitive of what wholly inspired Scripture teaches, which is the only wholly inspired and substantive historical documented facts of what the NT church believed, which Catholic distinctives stand in
the most manifest contrast to.
Historical precedence is thus on NOT on the side of The Orthodox and Catholic faith regarding distinctives beliefs i listed, while the many beliefs that we hold together in common with you are due to the Scriptural warrant for them.
It is not propaganda since it it not provided as evidence of which side is correct, but only that disagreements and division exists. And which extends to within your own church, btwn those she considers and treats as members in life and in death.
Thus it remains that you can only claim a limited degree of unity along with substantial irreconcilable difference. Which simply means that as I basically said the difference btwn the unity of "Bible Christians" and Catholics is a matter of scope and degrees. Which means that if unity is the basis for validity, then if we find even one denomination whose members testify to a great unity of scope and degrees then they would win the validity contest, which would not be Rome. And the unity that matters most if that of unity in salvific Truths, in which there is unity in Truths as well as unity in error.
However, your unity argument is also in vain since unlike you, I am not promoting any one denomination as uniquely or comprehensively correct, but am defending a faith as Scripturally substantiated. Thus rather than which church is correct, the debate must be what faith is correct.
Your church enters into this since Catholic faith rests upon the premise that your church is the supreme authority, as possessing ensured perpetual magisterial infallibility, which itself is a novel and unScriptural premise.
In contrast, my premise is that Scripture is that only wholly inspired and substantive standard, that as written, Scripture became the transcendent supreme standard for obedience and testing and establishing truth claims as the wholly Divinely inspired and assured, Word of God. As
abundantly evidenced
Which is the same argumentum ad antiquitatem (argument from antiquity) fallacy as before, which is only valid if the antiquity referenced is assuredly totally correct, which Scripture uniquely is as concerns Truth and what the NT church manifestly believed.
In the light of which your assertion that "our Churches that can go back to the first 400 years of Christianity" is false, since Catholic distinctives are what is missing from the the only wholly inspired and substantive record of what the NT church believed. For one, show me where a most basic common Catholic practice, that of praying to created beings in Heaven, is seen in the life of the NT church or anyplace else in Scripture by believers, despite the Spirit inspiring the recording of over 200 prayers, and of this being a most basic practice, and despite there always being plenty of created beings to pray to, and occasions for it since the Fall. Instead, the only prayers or offerings in Scripture to anyone else in the spiritual world is by pagans, including to the only Queen of Heaven see therein.
And note that the attempts to justify this tradition from Scripture have already been refuted.
The best i can do is show that these Churches were NOT the only Churches around for 1500 years since they were not the NT church, and rather than have a definite beginning, Catholicism was a matter or progressive deformation. And yet this was not to the degree that they ceased to hold to salvific Truths among her vain traditions whereby some penitent pious souls could cast all their faith on the Lord Jesus to save them on His merits, not their own, and thus the body of Christ, which is the only one true church, could continue against the gates of Hell. Yet overall she has become as the gates of Hell for multitudes, as has liberal Protestantism.
I do not think church has all their doctrine 100% correct, nor do any exclusively have the Biblical "corner" on salvation, but some are closer in overall in heart and word to the NT church was when obedient to Scriptural preaching under the uniquely manifest apostle of God. (2 Corinthians 6:4-10) And no, I do not go future and oppose denominationalism of any kind since separation is necessary (1 Corinthians 11:19; 2 Corinthians 6:14-18) However, to be further Scriptural there should be a central magisterium of wise and mature holy men of God, who are as close to the apostles in word and in power as we can find.
But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God. (2 Corinthians 4:2)
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