Can you prove that Santa Claus doesn't exist?

[Arc F1]

I've never looked at anyone and asked them to prove that God doesn't exist.

That's not my job. My job is to share my faith with those who ask me. I do that....

What others do or don't do or believe or don't believe is not my concern, in the end. It's between them and God.

In my experience when I hear posts asking for proof it's usually a cry for help. They are in need of something and blame God for not responding without understanding why.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

I'm interested in why you "don't" believe in God. What are you looking for? It can't be proof because you already believe other things without proof. I'm just curious as to what's going on.

(Ducking out of character for a moment)
Well, it's quite simple. Many of the arguments used to defend the existence of God can also be used to defend the existence of Santa. That's because many of the apologetics that Christians use are rationalisations:
"God isn't a subject in a test tube."
"You can't expect God to answer a prayer and be at your beck and whim."
"Many people have had personal encounters with Jesus."
"Your prayers weren't answered because you prayed wrong."
"I feel in my heart that God exists."

In using the same arguments that Christians use, I'm demonstrating their flaws, highlighting them by showing how such arguments can also be used to defend a ridiculous proposition - ie, that Santa Claus is actually real.

If you're interested, you can see it done in detail here:
Jesus and Santa: a Parable on How We Dismiss Evidence

(Back in character, for the purposes of this thread).
So, can you prove that Santa Claus does not exist? People have said they can prove it and, as a Santaist, I naturally want to know the truth. If anyone can prove that Santa doesn't exist, I'd be happy to see it.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

I've never looked at anyone and asked them to prove that God doesn't exist.

That's not my job. My job is to share my faith with those who ask me. I do that....

What others do or don't do or believe or don't believe is not my concern, in the end. It's between them and God.

Okay. So you're saying you don't believe in Santa Claus, that you don't care if I do, and that you are unable to prove that Santa doesn't exist, and that it's not your job to disprove that he exists anyway. Is that right?
If so, then thank you for your time. I don't suppose we'll be talking much more on this thread.

 

[Lost4words]

I've never received an answer to a prayer. Does this prove that God does not exist?

God can answer in a way that helps you but not in the way you think.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

God can answer in a way that helps you but not in the way you think.

You're so close to find the truth about Santa. Don't give up!

 

[Hazelelponi]

Okay. So you're saying you don't believe in Santa Claus, that you don't care if I do, and that you are unable to prove that Santa doesn't exist, and that it's not your job to disprove that he exists anyway. Is that right?
If so, then thank you for your time. I don't suppose we'll be talking much more on this thread.

One cannot prove negative and general claims. It can be possible to prove specific negative claims within well defined parameters, but not negative and general...

Prove Santa Clause doesn't exist is too general. I can provide the historicity of Jesus of Nazareth, but I can't prove to you He is the Son of God or God in Flesh outside of experiential evidence that has been experienced by countless people throughout history.

Whereas you may be able to prove a particular Turkish saint of Roman Catholic or Orthodox Christian origin (I forget which) actually existed in history and that he was known to be particularly charitable toward children, you've no one of mental stability beyond the age of 5 that has ever encountered the acts which modernity attributes to the character of Santa Clause (eating cookies, leaving gifts for poor children, etc.)

In fact, all the story of Santa Clause really does is prove the Spirit of Jesus lives in people who exist today, as they emulate the acts of charity espoused in the Christian faith.

Merry Christmas..

 

[Ophiolite]

In fact, all the story of Santa Clause really does is prove the Spirit of Jesus lives in people who exist today, as they emulate the acts of charity espoused in the Christian faith.

Which seems to me sufficient to prove that he does exist. Symbols and the concepts they promote are just as real concrete objects or actual people.

 

[JohnDB]

Thank you for those most interesting evidences for Christ. Since my evidences for Santa Claus are of a very similar calibre and kind, I suppose you're a Santaist too?

That would be a "no".
I firmly believe that God created this world by Agency of Jesus the Messiah and Jesus died on the cross for my sins and rose again on the third day.

I don't have enough faith to be an atheist or satanist.

Santa is a word in another language for a Saint of the Church of Jesus.

 

[NBB]

Thank you for those most interesting evidences for Christ. Since my evidences for Santa Claus are of a very similar calibre and kind, I suppose you're a Santaist too?


Well, you wouldn't hear of adults having gifts supernaturally appear, would you? The reason being, Santa delivers presents only to children.
You say that presents are only ever given to children by humans, and that cookies left out for Santa are only ever eaten by humans. Interesting. How do you propose to prove that this is so?


Well, exactly!


Well, it's the right time of year to revisit the question.


I couldn't say where Santa Claus came from. I suppose it's quite possible Saint Nicholas of Myra was somehow transformed into a magical (or miracle-working) distributor of presents.


Exactly how we Santaists see Father Christmas!

Not that way, the spirit of God can change people.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

That would be a "no".
I firmly believe that God created this world by Agency of Jesus the Messiah and Jesus died on the cross for my sins and rose again on the third day.

Cool. And I firmly believe that Santa delivers presents to children who are good. Can you give me any reason to think otherwiss?

I don't have enough faith to be an atheist or satanist.

Why do you need faith? Just believe, like you believe in Jesus.

Santa is a word in another language for a Saint of the Church of Jesus.

Sounds like you're pretty close to becoming a Santaist. Good for you!

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Not that way, the spirit of God can change people.

Yes? Well, Santa changes people too, in many, many different ways.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

In fact, all the story of Santa Claus really does is prove the Spirit of Jesus lives in people who exist today, as they emulate the acts of charity espoused in the Christian faith.

Seriously, you're not saying that Christianity invented kindness and charity, are you?

Merry Christmas..

And to you!

 

[InterestedAtheist]

One cannot prove negative and general claims. It can be possible to prove specific negative claims within well defined parameters, but not negative and general...

Okay. So what I'm hearing is, you are unable to disprove Santa's existence?
Many eleven-year-old children would be surprised at you.

I can provide the historicity of Jesus of Nazareth, but I can't prove to you He is the Son of God or God in Flesh outside of experiential evidence that has been experienced by countless people throughout history.

So...can you prove that He is the Son of God, or can't you?
Because apparently you believe it, based on nothing more than experiential evidence, ie stories that people have told you.
If that's what it took for you to believe in Jesus, then why won't you believe in Santa? I have lots and lots of stories of people encountering Santa, as well as plenty of evidence - cookies and milk going missing, presents appearing, photographic and video evidence, etc.
And if you're saying you can't provide evidence of Jesus' current existence - well, that's quite an interesting admission, since we're on a Christian Apologetics forum where Christians come to defend their faith.

you've no one of mental stability beyond the age of 5 that has ever encountered the acts which modernity attributes to the character of Santa Clause (eating cookies, leaving gifts for poor children, etc.)

I think you've set your bar rather low there. You're saying that no children at all above the age of five believe in Santa?
Still, if we change your rather derogatory "no one of mental stability beyond the age of five" to a more respectful "nobody except for children," - well, what would you expect? That's Santa's job - to deliver presents to children.

 

[JohnDB]

Cool. And I firmly believe that Santa delivers presents to children who are good. Can you give me any reason to think otherwiss?

Why do you need faith? Just believe, like you believe in Jesus.

Sounds like you're pretty close to becoming a Santaist. Good for you!

Where you might like to play games with what you despise...
Whatcha gonna do when you meet Him?

 

[mama2one]

And I firmly believe that Santa delivers presents to children who are good. Can you give me any reason to think otherwiss?

1) our child is good and kind
2) therefore, our child would be on Santa's list
3) Santa delivers to ALL good children
4) Santa has NEVER delivered to our house
5) we even have a chimney...so no excuse
6) there's your reason...failure to deliver to a good child year after year....NO Santa

 

[InterestedAtheist]

1) our child is good and kind
2) therefore, our child would be on Santa's list
3) Santa delivers to ALL good children
4) Santa has NEVER delivered to our house
5) we even have a chimney...so no excuse
6) there's your reason...failure to deliver to a good child year after year....NO Santa

a. Maybe your child isn't as good as you think he or she is? Just a possibility to consider as part of a logical puzzle, and no offence meant.
b. Maybe it was Santa who inspired you to buy presents for your child?
c. I understand that Santa delivers presents to good children, but I was not aware he was obliged to ensure that every good child receives presents.
d. Maybe you have the wrong type of chimney.
e. Did your child write a letter to Santa?
f. There are strong parallels between your question and my answers, and the rationalizations frequently given on this forum for why God hasn't answered a prayer.

 

[mama2one]

you can't dispute what I said in post #35 as I quoted you & you said Santa delivers presents to children who are good

my child has never got a gift from Santa so there's your reason....NO Santa


I was good, also & didn't get gifts from Santa
my mom showed me the presents hidden in her closet when I was little
yep...she couldn't keep the secret of a fake Santa

ask current Pres...he'll tell you Santa is Fake


Santa is fake and can't be compared to God

 

[InterestedAtheist]

you can't dispute what I said in post #35 as I quoted you & you said Santa delivers presents to children who are good

my child has never got a gift from Santa so there's your reason....NO Santa


I was good, also & didn't get gifts from Santa
my mom showed me the presents hidden in her closet when I was little
yep...she couldn't keep the secret of a fake Santa

Thank you very much for engaging with this. I think we're doing a great job of showing how Christian Apologetics is based on rationalisation and fallacies. Because these are exactly the kinds of things that Christians say when atheists ask why their prayers weren't answered.

To answer you, in character as a Santaist:
Well, obviously when your mother showed you the presents she was going to give you, you stopped believing in Santa, which is why he didn't give you any presents.

And any decent Christian apologist would have no trouble dealing with someone who said, as you (almost) did "I prayed and never received an answer, therefore God does not exist." To answer why your child never received presents from Santa:
How do you know s/he didnt? Maybe Santa have your child special presents, not just tinsel-wrapped packages.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Where you might like to play games with what you despise...
Whatcha gonna do when you meet Him?

Have you heard Bertrand Russell's answer when he was asked that question?
Unless by "him" you mean Santa, in which case, I will say thank you.

 

[mama2one]

How do you know s/he didnt? .

no delivery from Santa to poor run down orphanage
we were told there were no toys there