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Featured Can you be SINLESS?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by boxman144, Mar 22, 2020.

  1. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    At this point with your posts, I cannot tell where it is you stand on this issue.
     
  2. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes.
     
  3. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    J, he believes that 1 John 1:8 describes a Christian, even though it is in context with 1 John 1:9

    8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and there is no truth in us. 9 But if we confess our sins to God, he will keep his promise and do what is right: he will forgive us our sins and purify us from all our wrongdoing.

    How much is left? None. We are children of God. Are we still a slave to sin, called a sinner? No!

    1 John 2:1 Even John knows it is possible to be without sin.
    I am writing this to you, my children, so that you will not sin
     
  4. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    If you mean obeying Christ's literal commands in the Gospels. In decades of going to various churches, including charismatic churches, I have never found one person who has even tried to obey each and every command of Christ when he walked this earth. But the internet is occasionally different
     
  5. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It is rare in my circle of believers to find someone who does sin. Maybe try another body of believers.
     
  6. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    Yes, I know in some charismatic churches they like to give the air of sinlessness.
     
  7. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    No, the issue of Can you be SINLESS?

    Putting it into it's proper perspective.

    As a Born Again Believer in Christ Jesus, "Can you be SINLESS?"
     
  8. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    No! You have to discern scripture, and especially regarding this subject. There is two very different types of sinning
    1) a person wants in their heart to follow after Christ, and their general lifestyle is one of obedience. They hate their imperfections and do not want them, however, they cannot obey the letter perfectly, no one can, so they will commit sin of some form or another inevitably.
    2)There is living a lifestyle of sin and not being bothered about it.
    Two very different things, hence 1John1:8&1John3:9
     
  9. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    Come to think of it, the issue isn't or shouldn't be, can a Believer in Christ be sinless, but rather, Can a Believer in Christ SIN?
     
  10. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes, those who have the Holy Spirit guiding them are naturally sinless, as they are doing what comes naturally to their new nature.
     
  11. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    Speaking of Gal ch2:
    But if, in seeking to be justified in Christ, we Jews find ourselves also among the sinners, doesn’t that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18 If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a law-breaker. verses17&18

    If you are in Christ you are born again.
     
  12. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    Love is the first casualty of this thinking
     
  13. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    You need to understand that 1 john 3 was written AFTER 1 John 1 and them reconcile the two or you have caused 1 John 1 to Contradict 1 John 3.

    It isn't two differing types of sin because, Jesus paid the price for all sin.

    If Gods' Holy Spirit resides in the Heart of the Born Again Believer, he (the Believer) cannot sin.

    Anyone who does sin is not a child of God but a child of the Devil.
    Whose child are you?
     
  14. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    They are not hard to reconcile. In 1John1:8 John is speaking in the present tense and including himself in the we
    If you asked the vast majority of Christians if you had to be sinless in order to be saved, they would respond 'No!' For they know no one is perfect in the flesh (1John1:8)
    If you asked the vast majority of Christians if you can be a Christian if you live a sinfull lifestyle, they would also respond No(1John3:9)
     
  15. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Do you really believe that Jesus didn't fully free us from sin? Do you believe He just freed us from the law, and gave us no power of the Spirit to make us righteous and acceptable to God? Do you even know how powerful the Spirit is?
     
  16. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    I believe it is pointless to debate with anyone who can so casually lie without conscience whilst claiming sinlessness. Matt23 comes to mind
     
  17. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    That is because the Reformation started a false doctrine that has infiltrated the whole church since then. That's 500 years! Here is what Jesus said of the age of the Reformation. This is probably new to you.

    ‘These things says He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars: “I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. (Martin Luther and John Calvin) 2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die, for I have not found your works perfect before God. 3 Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you. 4 You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. (Jacob Arminus and John Wesley) 5 He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
     
  18. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Another accusation of lying? It is just implausible to you, that's all. I forgive you.
     
  19. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    Would you explain verses 17,18 for me?

    You haven't reconciled them you have misinterpreted them.

    No one is saying, you have to be sinless in order to be saved, I would also respond NO to that question.

    The answer NO to the second question is correct also.

    The problem we are having seems to be that where I say, "I cannot sin" you are saying "you can and do sin" on a regular basis.
     
  20. not under law

    not under law Active Member

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    Now I am confused, if you do not have to be sinless to be saved, and if you are saved you are born again, I do not see how this equates with you stating born again Christians cannot or do not sin
     
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