Can you be Christian and believe in evolution?

[trophy33]

Alluding to some great point that you twice failed to produce is worthless.

Its not a secret, you do not need me to "prove it". Even Augustine wrote about it in his books (The City of God). But you probably never read Augustine, either.

A Comparison of the Text of Genesis in Three Traditions: Masoretic Text, Samaritan Pentateuch, Septuagint

This paper was published in The Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society (2021). Presented here is a catalog of every textual variant in Genesis among the Masoretic Text (MT), the Samaritan Pentateuch (SP) and the Septuagint (LXX). Updated

www.academia.edu

Edit: direct link without google or email:

https://etsjets.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/files_JETS-PDFs_64_64-1_JETS_64.1_25-43_Steinmann.pdf

 

[sfs]

He did not create me the same week He made the stars. Nor did He fashion me like a Potter fashions a vessel from materials that came from earth. Nor did He cause me to sleep deeply and take a bone from me from which the first woman was created.

Did he create you?

 

[truthpls]

Its not a secret, you do not need me to "prove it". Even Augustine wrote about it in his books (The City of God). But you probably never read Augustine, either.

Of course not. However you made a claim and I asked for an example. You failed to give one. Your claim is of no value so far.

A Comparison of the Text of Genesis in Three Traditions: Masoretic Text, Samaritan Pentateuch, Septuagint

This paper was published in The Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society (2021). Presented here is a catalog of every textual variant in Genesis among the Masoretic Text (MT), the Samaritan Pentateuch (SP) and the Septuagint (LXX). Updated

www.academia.edu

Have you a quote or point from the link, or did you just feel in a spamming mood?

 

[trophy33]

Of course not. However you made a claim and I asked for an example. You failed to give one. Your claim is of no value so far.

I did not make a claim. I asked you if you know about it.

Have you a quote or point from the link, or did you just feel in a spamming mood?

Dont be lazy to click.

 

[truthpls]

Did he create you?

Not in the way Adam was created. The way He does it now is childbirth. So that does not change anything in Genesis. Adam was formed directly by God. His sons and daughters were born of a woman. So one could not say that Adam was a result of animals being born and modified.

 

[truthpls]

Sigh, you are just trolling at this point.

You failing to post support for a claim is the only issue here. I understand though, it probably is weak

 

[expos4ever]

No, we just read what it says.

You are doing what is called "begging the question" - assuming what you need to make a case for. Here, you simply declare that scripture is to be taken literally. Where is your supporting argument?

To be frank, simply claiming that all Scripture must be taken literally is a very weak position that will not convince anybody.

 

[trophy33]

You failing to post support for a claim is the only issue here. I understand though, it probably is weak

For what claim?

 

[truthpls]

You are doing what is called "begging the question" - assuming what you need to make a case for. Here, you simply declare that scripture is to be taken literally. Where is your supporting argument?

Jesus said so. He talked of the beginning. Other books also did. Pretending that we can wave whatever we do not like away and call it not literal is unbelief. You are just playing with words.

To be frank, simply claiming that all Scripture must be taken literally is a very weak position that will not convince anybody.

We were talking about the record of Genesis. Not dreams someone had later. Not parables. Not every horn in Revelation or Daniel. Tell us why we can dismiss the record that Abraham lived 175 years?

 

[truthpls]

For what claim?

You said this "Also, do you know these "precise" years are different in different textual families?"
So do explain why a year is not a year?

 

[trophy33]

You said this "Also, do you know these "precise" years are different in different textual families?"

Its a question, not a claim. What do you want me to do? I gave you link where you can see the differences in a table.

Or, if you like to see it for yourself, open the Septuagint, open the Masoretic text and compare them. Its not a rocket science, both are online.

Genesis 5 NIV

biblehub.com

Genesis 5 Brenton's Septuagint Translation

biblehub.com

 

[sfs]

Not in the way Adam was created. The way He does it now is childbirth. So that does not change anything in Genesis. Adam was formed directly by God. His sons and daughters were born of a woman. So one could not say that Adam was a result of animals being born and modified.

Did God create you? You're writing a lot but not answering the question.

 

[sfs]

To be frank, simply claiming that all Scripture must be taken literally is a very weak position that will not convince anybody.

It's also unbiblical. Paul treats the Old Testament allegorically and he explicitly rules out the literal meaning of an OT text in I Cor. 9:8-10.

 

[truthpls]

Its a question, not a claim. What do you want me to do? I gave you link where you can see the differences in a table.

Or, if you like to see it for yourself, open the Septuagint, open the Masoretic text and compare them. Its not a rocket science, both are online.

Genesis 5 NIV

biblehub.com

Genesis 5 Brenton's Septuagint Translation

biblehub.com

So what is the example exactly?

 

[truthpls]

It's also unbiblical. Paul treats the Old Testament allegorically and he explicitly rules out the literal meaning of an OT text in I Cor. 9:8-10.

Ox really do plow. So, using that as a real example, he applies that to man. There is no literal issue here.

 

[truthpls]

Did God create you? You're writing a lot but not answering the question.

Not the way He created Eve or Adam. Not in the creation days. So it is irrelevant. If you claim it is relevant then show how

 

[trophy33]

So what is the example exactly?

Are you afraid of links or something?

1This is the written account of Adam’s family line.

When God created mankind, he made them in the likeness of God. 2He created them male and female and blessed them. And he named them “Mankind” a when they were created.

3When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. 4After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters. 5Altogether, Adam lived a total of 930 years, and then he died.

6When Seth had lived 105 years, he became the father b of Enosh. 7After he became the father of Enosh, Seth lived 807 years and had other sons and daughters. 8Altogether, Seth lived a total of 912 years, and then he died.

9When Enosh had lived 90 years, he became the father of Kenan. 10After he became the father of Kenan, Enosh lived 815 years and had other sons and daughters. 11Altogether, Enosh lived a total of 905 years, and then he died.

12When Kenan had lived 70 years, he became the father of Mahalalel. 13After he became the father of Mahalalel, Kenan lived 840 years and had other sons and daughters. 14Altogether, Kenan lived a total of 910 years, and then he died.

------

1This is the genealogy of men in the day in which God made Adam; in the image of God he made him: 2male and female he made them, and blessed them; and he called his name Adam, in the day in which he made them.

3And Adam lived two hundred and thirty years, and begot a son after his own form, and after his own image, and he called his name Seth. 4And the days of Adam, which he lived after his begetting Seth, were seven hundred years; and he begot sons and daughters. 5And all the days of Adam which he lived were nine hundred and thirty years, and he died.

6Now Seth lived two hundred and five years, and begot Enos. 7And Seth lived after his begetting Enos, seven hundred and seven years, and he begot sons and daughters. 8And all the days of Seth were nine hundred and twelve years, and he died.

9And Enos lived an hundred and ninety years, and begot Cainan. 10And Enos lived after his begetting Cainan, seven hundred and fifteen years, and he begot sons and daughters. 11And all the days of Enos were nine hundred and five years, and he died.

12And Cainan lived an hundred and seventy years, and he begot Maleleel. 13And Cainan lived after his begetting Maleleel, seven hundred and forty years, and he begot sons and daughters. 14And all the days of Cainan were nine hundred and ten years, and he died.


Etc.

 

[trophy33]

And if constant 100 years differences are boring to you, for example in Genesis 11 we have this:

24When Nahor had lived 29 years, he became the father of Terah. 25And after he became the father of Terah, Nahor lived 119 years and had other sons and daughters.

24And Nachor lived a hundred and seventy-nine years, and begot Tharrha. 25And Nachor lived after he had begotten Tharrha, an hundred and twenty-five years, and begot sons and daughters, and he died.

 

[sfs]

Not the way He created Eve or Adam. Not in the creation days. So it is irrelevant. If you claim it is relevant then show how

I want to know whether you believe the historic Christian doctrine that God is the creator of all that is, seen and unseen. You sound like you believe that unless God formed a human out of the dirt in a single day, he didn't create him. I'm trying to find out whether that impression is correct or not.

 

[sfs]

Ox really do plow. So, using that as a real example, he applies that to man. There is no literal issue here.

The Law had a literal commandment about how to literally treat literal oxen. What Paul says is, "Is it for oxen that God is concerned? Or does he not speak entirely for our sake?" -- and then throws out the literal meaning of the commandment in favor of an allegorical meaning. Presumably you think Paul was a nonbeliever, too.