Can Pastors Live Too Extravagantly?

[GregoryTurner]

that is, of course, an exception in the world of ministry. most pastors make a average wage, the pastor at the church i currently attend actually works a second job. I believe a pastor should be paid for their work, and how can a man stay focused on his ministry when he still has to go out and earn a wage outside of his church duties?

Amen.

Just a note or thought from me. I like Jesse Duplantis. I like his teaching, jokes, etc... but, they like to shop Sac's fifth avenue, even did a sermon about how a guy treated him, bascially saying that if the guy knew he had money Jesse would have been treated differently... Lemme correct my first statement, I used to enjoy Jesse Duplantis. That is just one example.

 

[seekthetruth909]

What about these scriptures:

1 Tim. 5:17-18 -- "Let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in the word and doctrine. For the Scripture says, 'You shall not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain,' and 'The laborer is worthy of his wages.'"

1 Cor. 9 -- 3This is my defense to those who sit in judgment on me. 4Don't we have the right to food and drink? 5Don't we have the right to take a believing wife along with us, as do the other apostles and the Lord's brothers and Cephas[a]? 6Or is it only I and Barnabas who must work for a living?

7Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat of its grapes? Who tends a flock and does not drink of the milk? 8Do I say this merely from a human point of view? Doesn't the Law say the same thing? 9For it is written in the Law of Moses: "Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain."[b] Is it about oxen that God is concerned? 10Surely he says this for us, doesn't he? Yes, this was written for us, because when the plowman plows and the thresher threshes, they ought to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest. 11If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you? 12If others have this right of support from you, shouldn't we have it all the more? But we did not use this right. On the contrary, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ. 13Don't you know that those who work in the temple get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in what is offered on the altar? 14In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.

It's pretty clear from Scripture that ministers should make their living from what the church pays. I think the amount given should reflect the amount of responsibility, time away from his family, preaching/teaching skills, etc;

Go Cards!

What were the examples of the first preachers,Paul and the rest of the apostles chosen by God?

1 Corinthians 9
17 If I preach voluntarily, I have a reward; if not voluntarily, I am simply discharging the trust committed to me. 18 What then is my reward? Just this: that in preaching the gospel I may offer it free of charge, and so not make use of my rights in preaching it.
2 Corinthians 2 17Unlike so many, we do not peddle the word of God for profit. On the contrary, in Christ we speak before God with sincerity, like men sentfrom God.

Acts 20
33 I have not coveted anyone's silver or gold or clothing. 34 You yourselves know that these hands of mine have supplied my own needs and the needs of my companions. 35In everything I did, I showed you that by this kind of hard work we must help the weak, remembering the words the Lord Jesus himself said: 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.'

1 Thessalonians 2
As apostles of Christ we could have been a burden to you, 7 but we were gentle among you, like a mother caring for her little children. 8 We loved you so much that we were delighted to share with you not only the gospel of God but our lives as well, because you had become so dear to us. 9 Surely you remember, brothers, our toil and hardship; we worked night and day in order not to be a burden to anyone while we preached the gospel of God to you.

2 Corinthians 12
14 Now I am ready to visit you for the third time, and I will not be a burden to you, because what I want is not your possessions but you. After all, children should not have to save up for their parents, but parents for their children. 15 So I will very gladly spend for you everything I have and expend myself as well. If I love you more, will you love me less?

2 Thessalonians 3
6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching[a] you received from us. 7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow our example. We were not idle when we were with you, 8nor did we eat anyone's food without paying for it. On the contrary, we worked night and day, laboring and toiling so that we would not be a burden to any of you. 9 We did this, not because we do not have the right to such help, but in order to make ourselves a model for you to follow. 10For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: "If a man will not work, he shall not eat."


1 Corinthians 9
11 If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you? 12 If others have this right of support from you, shouldn't we have it all the more? But we did not use this right. On the contrary, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ.

Acts 18
1 After this, Paul left Athens and went to Corinth. 2 There he met a Jew named Aquila, a native of Pontus, who had recently come from Italy with his wife Priscilla, because Claudius had ordered all the Jews to leave Rome. Paul went to see them, 3and because he was a tentmaker as they were, he stayed and worked with them.

2 Corinthians 11
7 Was it a sin for me to lower myself in order to elevate you by preaching the gospel of God to you free of charge? 8 I robbed other churches by receiving support from them so as to serve you. 9 And when I was with you and needed something, I was not a burden to anyone, for the brothers who came from Macedonia supplied what I needed. I have kept myself from being a burden to you in any way, and will continue to do so.

1 Corinthians 4
8 Already you have all you want! Already you have become rich! You have become kings-and that without us! How I wish that you really had become kings so that we might be kings with you! 9 For it seems to me that God has put us apostles on display at the end of the procession, like men condemned to die in the arena. We have been made a spectacle to the whole universe, to angels as well as to men. 10 We are fools for Christ, but you are so wise in Christ! We are weak, but you are strong! You are honored, we are dishonored! 11 To this very hour we go hungry and thirsty, we are in rags, we are brutally treated, we are homeless. 12 We work hard with our own hands. When we are cursed, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure it; 13 when we are slandered, we answer kindly. Up to this moment we have become the scum of the earth, the refuse of the world.

 

[seekthetruth909]

this is a quote that Angel4Truth Made and the message that follows this quote (the one that's in black is my message) is directed toward her.

Most people work 40 hours a week. A decent pastor works 24 hours a day and often neglects their own family for theirt congregation. Im shocked that so many begrudge them compensation commensurate to their worth while they would demand adequate pay for themselves.

Your perspective is really unrealistic and selfish in and of itself in my opinion.

There are loads of people who are stuck living from paycheck-to-paycheck yet they work just as hard to earn a living for their family. The cost-of-living in the United States has become so ridiculous via inflation that most people are struggling by just to cover the cost of basics (food, clothing, bills, mortgage, etc.) Why is it so exclusive to pastors that they get indulgences here and there but for the rest of the majority of the congregation (which are middle class and the working class) should just deal with being underpaid and overworked, yet the pastor should be treated like God? ! How on earth is that fair? That's playing favorites and completely biased!!!

You're making the assumption that everybody in this post has said that the pastor should be working at his job just to serve God in ministry just for charity. That the gifts of pleasing God via obedience and sharing the love and message of the gospel should keep them satisfied. That in order to scrounge together a living for themselves they should find another source of income by means of taking on another job and that in their pastoral line of work they should just be destitute and not receive "fruits of their labor" as it were in exchange (a.k.a. some sort of compensation). The general consensus I've received by skimming through this post is that a pastor and the members in their congregation should be treated as equals, so that the pastor can ACTUALLY RELATE (truly and personally based on experiences in his life)
to the people in his congregation. Why? So that his sermons are genuine and that he's not just talking the talk but not walking the walk (actions speak louder then words in my opinion). If you say one thing but then act another way it's mixed messages that completely contradict one another and leave people confused and more often then not divided against one another.

Plenty of people have done a lovely job of assuming that the pastor who is the head of church is the only one that ministers. That the people in the congregation do absolutely nothing to serve God via ministry. There are tons of people IN THE CONGREGATION who sacrifice of themselves in many ways; by giving their time and energy and by choosing to serve God. Why? Not because they feel obligated to do so. However they do so cause they care and love people and want to help them. That unlike many Christians I've encountered they're not serving God just to gloat and get in the limelight but are actually doing so with pure motives; these motives are is that they're actually willing to interact with non-Christians step out of their comfort zone and do stuff to help others even if it's involves something they don't want to hear. or do on a personal level.

I agree. In a large church a pastor has to be paid because so much time is needed. But then again, there is much evidence to suggest that large churches are a failure. As one well known Christian author put it. "Large churches are great at making good church members who serve their church, but bad at making disciples of Christ who serve the kingdom." In a small church of say 20 or 30 members, it is easier to encourage and support one another to become disciples of Christ.
In a small church there is no need to pay a pastor. All members should equally volunteer their time. All resources should be spent on missionaries who should receive pay because they are traveling and it would be impractical for them to find work.
Apostle Paul worked as a tent maker to support himself. He said leaders should be more like parents willing to spend on their children. He did not want to be a burden to others. He said that although those who preach the gospel have a right to make a living, his advice was to not make use of this right, but instead to preach the gospel free of charge. He said that by being paid, a preacher would just be doing his duty and would forfeit a spiritual reward. It was clear that apostle Paul said that preachers have a right to pay, but his recommendation was to waive this right in order to not hinder the gospel. [see previous post for scriptural reference]
It is ironic that many rich preachers are seen as anointed by their followers but the preachers who take a modest salary, or no salary at all, are probably truly the anointed ones.