Can Creationists justify not being Flat Earthers?

[Hoghead1]

Yeppers deppers, I'm a newbie alright.

 

[Black Dog]

Pi is 3 when you round it off. Unless you round it off, it would take another Book the size of the Bible to list all the digits. Amen?

Yeah, like I said, I have no problem with that, and would never use this as an instance of biblical error. What I'm saying is that there are probably some Christians somewhere who think that we should teach that pi is exactly 3, because that's what the bible says. So, does that mean we shouldn't teach pi in public schools, or "teach the controversy", and tell students that there is a controversy, and pi might actually be exactly 3? It makes as much sense as not teaching evolution, or teaching creationism.

 

[Black Dog]

I don't see how or why the Bible should be taught in the public schools. What are the Sunday-school classes for? Who is qualified? On a university level, that is different. Most universities have a department of religion and solid college-level classes on Scripture.

I think it has a place, especially as so much literature and history relates to the bible, for instance the Dark Ages. How could you possibly examine this period of time without referencing the power and influence of the church and Christianity, and how the bible was used to effectively stop progress? My request is that the supernatural isn't taught as fact until there is sufficient evidence, and religion is not taught as science.

 

[Black Dog]

The teaching of a spherical Earth should be continued in Schools since it is TRUE of the present Earth. It is not true of Adam's Flat Earth. Read Gen 1:9-10 and see that God put water in the bottom of Adam's hollow firmament and put dry ground on top of the water. Take any container, put water in the bottom and dry ground on top of the water and you too will make a Flat Earth. Amen?

But there are Christians who say teach Flat Earth, because the bible says the earth is flat. They have every bit as much evidence to support their claim as creationists have to support theirs. If we should teach creationism because the bible says it's true, why shouldn't we teach flat earth because the bible says it's true? Do you hold some special title or place in Christianity that affords you the power to decide which supernatural biblical pronouncements should be taught as fact in public school and which shouldn't?

 

[Black Dog]

Yes, It does.

But as my pastor says, evolutionists don't want the Bible taught in school because It is so anti-evolution.No, thanks.

For every single "evolutionist" I know, your pastor is wrong.

The Muslims aren't going to teach me anything.

Muslims are for scientists.No.

Muslims had the most advanced civilization in the world, then they threw it all away by forsaking the best of learning and education, and instead made their holy book the center of education. That's why the USA can easily defeat any Muslim country because of our technological superiority, which is provided by science.. If the USA starts making the bible the center of our education system, it won't be long before we are the ones easily defeated.

But scientists have dragged this country down morally by teaching the doctrine, way, and error of Baalim.Would it matter if they did?

Virtually every single Christian that ever lived and will live believes IN THE BEGINNING, GOD.

And that means absolutely nothing to scientists.

You are correct. Science does not deal in the supernatural.

I could be 99% wrong with my theology, and scientists would still hate me.

It's not what I say that matters to them -- it's what I am.Then focus on what we do agree on and address those.Uh-huh.

Can you name some scientists who hate you? Are you sure of this? The scientists I know are far to caught up in their work, and far too nice, to hate someone like you.

All science has done is doubled something that was reduced to about a tenth of what it used to be.

I suspect you mean science has made Christianity 1/10th of what it used to be. You are correct, the God of the Gaps has fewer and fewer gaps to hide in, and as they say, "The internet is where religions come to die."

I don't see anyone living to be 1938 years old.

Nobody has ever lived that long, or 1/2 that long. The human body is too poorly designed. For instance,our back evolved from mammals whose back was parallel to the ground, but in humans our back is perpendicular to the ground, and our back breaks down quickly from supporting all that weight, the discs in the back would never last a few hundred years, let alone that long.

Speaking of doubling, what did Jesus say to the scientists of His time?

Matthew 23:15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

That's nice. When Jesus was speaking, he also said the end times would begin, and he would return, within the life time of those listening. He was wrong about that too.

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

If the chosen were full grown, that would be silly.
Animals don't eat or drink during hibernation.
The requirements were not "all animals".
Only those that walked on land. And not
all species. Only the number God decided
was needed to repopulate quickly. And HE
would know the minimum number needed
even if you can't figure it.

I know I'm talking without knowledge. I know God can do anything and he could has suspended the Arc on a chicken bone if he wanted to, but I'm just thinking out load about the vision of this in my mind. As far as hibernation Isn't that a Winter activity? How cold has it ever got in the area where the Arc was at.

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

God created "every living creature that moveth" on the 5th Day from the water. Gen 1:21 He had also created THREE firmaments/heavens BEFORE the 5th Day. He made One firmament which He called "heaven" on the 2nd Day. Gen 1:8 He made other heavenS on the 3rd Day, Gen 2:4 the SAME Day the first Earth was made. Gen 1:10 When God commanded that life come from the water, life came forth from the water on ALL three HeavenS.

Gen 1:20 ¶ And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life,

***These men who wrote The Bible were inspired by God. Are you telling me that you somehow have some special knowledge that they weren't privy to when God spoke to them and not to you.

Absolutely, and God told Daniel How to hide His Truth from ancient men.

Dan 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

God exhibits His Supreme Intelligence by hiding His Truth in plain sight. ONLY the people in the last days will be able to understand the Bible BECAUSE knowledge has increased to the point where Genesis can finally be understood.

*** What do you mean by this? God wanted you to believe sounds like you are saying that he deceived us.+

By hiding His Truth from ancient people God insured that ONLY by Faith in His Word could they be saved. It was the same with you since you believed without knowing the details of what He did in the beginning. In the last days ALL Flesh will know His Truth:

Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of My Spirit upon ALL flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

God's Truth is the Truth in every way. Amen?

Dude. I'm sorry but it seems too much like you are making this up as you go and are trying to fit The Bible into your imaginings instead of the other way around. I have a vision in my head of that which took place back then and it doesn't even come close to your explanations. I have not read your last post and will read no more of anything theocratic that you have to say, because of my image of you. I will leave the conversation with you as I came unto it, in peace. You have a good day.

 

[Aman777]

But there are Christians who say teach Flat Earth, because the bible says the earth is flat. They have every bit as much evidence to support their claim as creationists have to support theirs. If we should teach creationism because the bible says it's true, why shouldn't we teach flat earth because the bible says it's true? Do you hold some special title or place in Christianity that affords you the power to decide which supernatural biblical pronouncements should be taught as fact in public school and which shouldn't?

I have never said we should teach creationism nor a flat earth. I said to teach a spherical Earth because it agrees with the scientific Truth of today's Earth. I have NO power to tell anyone what should be taught in School, nor any special title or place in Christianity, thus my screen name. I'm just a man who reads God's Holy Word and I try to show others what it actually says, instead of what some ancient religionist says it says. Amen?

 

[Aman777]

Dude. I'm sorry but it seems too much like you are making this up as you go and are trying to fit The Bible into your imaginings instead of the other way around. I have a vision in my head of that which took place back then and it doesn't even come close to your explanations. I have not read your last post and will read no more of anything theocratic that you have to say, because of my image of you. I will leave the conversation with you as I came unto it, in peace. You have a good day.

Jesus said:

Jhn 15:20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept My saying, they will keep yours also.

 

[Black Dog]

I have never said we should teach creationism nor a flat earth.

True, I forgot to frame my questions appropriately, my bad.

You did say "...and totally destroys the False Theory of Evolution, which should be removed from the public schools."

I said to teach a spherical Earth because it agrees with the scientific Truth of today's Earth. I have NO power to tell anyone what should be taught in School, nor any special title or place in Christianity, thus my screen name. I'm just a man who reads God's Holy Word and I try to show others what it actually says, instead of what some ancient religionist says it says. Amen?

OK, but evolution is as true and provable as a spherical earth. Why do you think spherical earth should be taught, but evolution shouldn't?

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

Jesus said:

Jhn 15:20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept My saying, they will keep yours also.

Scripture posted that are unrelated to the discussion may also be taken as usage.

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

True, I forgot to frame my questions appropriately, my bad.

You did say "...and totally destroys the False Theory of Evolution, which should be removed from the public schools."



OK, but evolution is as true and provable as a spherical earth. Why do you think spherical earth should be taught, but evolution shouldn't?

Theology should not be taught in public schools. Those who are religious should be given a voucher to pay for their education in a religious school. If there is a monetary dependency between the two the religious school should suck it up, since they are getting a new adherent. At no time should any child be subject to indoctrination on any scale or be forced to learn what they reject in the first place.

What matters is a well rounded education and I hardly think the origin of man will effect much of any of the other subjects being taught.

 

[Aman777]

True, I forgot to frame my questions appropriately, my bad.

You did say "...and totally destroys the False Theory of Evolution, which should be removed from the public schools."

OK, but evolution is as true and provable as a spherical earth. Why do you think spherical earth should be taught, but evolution shouldn't?

Because there is NO evidence to support that long gradual periods of time and numerous positive mutations produces Adam's unique special intelligence, which is like God's, Gen 3:22 in prehistoric people. The ONLY way to obtain this special intelligence is to Inherit it from another Human who has it. For 99% of the time since prehistoric people diverged from Chimps, they lived in Caves just like any other animal. In less than 1% of the time since prehistoric people diverged from Chimps, Humans (descendants of Adam) have gone from Caves to the Moon and back.

SUDDENLY, exactly where and when God told us the Ark arrived, Human farmers appeared, which led to the First Human Cities, math, writing and EVERY other trait of modern Humans. These same traits were first shown by Cain's descendants in Gen 4. Conclusion, Adam's descendants are Humans and prehistoric people inherited his special intelligence when Noah's grandsons, like Cain, had NO other Humans to marry. They married and produced today's Humans with the prehistoric people (sons of God) who diverged from Chimps exactly as God told us in Gen 6:4.

This also explains WHY today's Humans also have the DNA and ERVs of the common ancestor of Apes. Amen?

 

[Black Dog]

Because there is NO evidence to support that long gradual periods of time and numerous positive mutations produces Adam's unique special intelligence, which is like God's, Gen 3:22 in prehistoric people.

I'm not sure who told you that, but they were lying. I'm not an expert on evolution, but there are some on this forum in the Creation vs. Evolution section. There are a few people there who can provide you with more evidence that you can digest in a year. The Theory of Evolution is literally one of the most evidenced theories known. Denying it is like denying the Theory of Gravity, or the Germ Theory of Disease.

The ONLY way to obtain this special intelligence is to Inherit it from another Human who has it. For 99% of the time since prehistoric people diverged from Chimps, they lived in Caves just like any other animal. In less than 1% of the time since prehistoric people diverged from Chimps, Humans (descendants of Adam) have gone from Caves to the Moon and back.

The thing is, there is absolutely no evidence for this, also we didn't evolve from chimps. It's an interesting story, but stories don't carry weight in science.

Science is what needs to be taught in science class. The material should be based on what is the latest and best of scientific theory and reasoning. If we let religions decide what should and shouldn't be taught, are we going to let every religion have a say in the science curriculum? What should we do if a religion declares that the Theory of Gravity is false and evil?

 

[Aman777]

Scripture posted that are unrelated to the discussion may also be taken as usage.

The Scripture I posted was to you since you have refused to even read my posts in spite of the Fact that you cannot refute me Scripturally, Scientifically nor Historically. Jesus said, If they have kept My saying, they will keep your's also. So, go ahead and run away since it's really hard to refute me when you don't even read my posts. God Bless you

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

The Scripture I posted was to you since you have refused to even read my posts in spite of the Fact that you cannot refute me Scripturally, Scientifically nor Historically. Jesus said, If they have kept My saying, they will keep your's also. So, go ahead and run away since it's really hard to refute me when you don't even read my posts. God Bless you

Dude I refused to read your posts because you stretched Bible scripture to fit your own ideals and that is what you did. You made up the part about how many Creatures were in the arc to cover for you and that is about as false as you can get. I'm placing you on ignore so I don't get myself banned by telling you exactly what I think of you. Farewell.

 

[Hoghead1]

Good points, BlackDog. Plus, those arguing against evolution are entertaining unsupported theories about how Scripture was supposedly written. For example, the alleged inerrancy of Scripture is simply a human-made, fallible theory or about how God is related tot he writing of Scripture. Based on the numerous contradictions in Scripture alone, it is unsupportable and should be dropped. The reason some refuse to do is that they they have made an idol out of the Bible and engaged in bibliolatry.

 

[Aman777]

I'm not sure who told you that, but they were lying. I'm not an expert on evolution, but there are some on this forum in the Creation vs. Evolution section. There are a few people there who can provide you with more evidence that you can digest in a year. The Theory of Evolution is literally one of the most evidenced theories known. Denying it is like denying the Theory of Gravity, or the Germ Theory of Disease.

Since simple evolution is nothing more than changes within His and Their kinds, I agree...BUT...changes from animal to Human (descendants of Adam) intelligence has NO evidence to support it and it CANNOT be repeated, EXCEPT in the unsupported views of men who worship at the Altar of Evolutionism. That is circular reasoning.

*** The thing is, there is absolutely no evidence for this, also we didn't evolve from chimps. It's an interesting story, but stories don't carry weight in science.

I didn't say that prehistoric people "evolved" from Chimps but that they "diverged" from Chimps some 6 Million years ago, according to Science. Go here since scientists have recently changed their view and now say it was 7 or 8 million years ago that we diverged. From the site:

>>>>The end result of the team’s research indicates that humans and chimps likely diverged some seven to eight million years ago, while the divergence of gorillas (which led to both humans and chimps) came approximately eight to nineteen million years ago.

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2012-08-genetic-humans-great-apes-diverged.html#jCp <<<

The big problem is that today's Science does not yet know that Humans came to this planet some 11k years ago according to Scripture AND History. Amen?

 

[Black Dog]

Since simple evolution is nothing more than changes within His and Their kinds, I agree...BUT...changes from animal to Human (descendants of Adam) intelligence has NO evidence to support it and it CANNOT be repeated, EXCEPT in the unsupported views of men who worship at the Altar of Evolutionism. That is circular reasoning.

Again, I'm no expert in evolution, but I can see that you clearly don't understand the theory or the evidence that supports it.

*** The thing is, there is absolutely no evidence for this, also we didn't evolve from chimps. It's an interesting story, but stories don't carry weight in science.

I didn't say that prehistoric people "evolved" from Chimps but that they "diverged" from Chimps some 6 Million years ago, according to Science. Go here since scientists have recently changed their view and now say it was 7 or 8 million years ago that we diverged. From the site:

>>>>The end result of the team’s research indicates that humans and chimps likely diverged some seven to eight million years ago, while the divergence of gorillas (which led to both humans and chimps) came approximately eight to nineteen million years ago.

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2012-08-genetic-humans-great-apes-diverged.html#jCp <<<

That's what makes science so powerful: It's self-correcting, and keeps improving theories as more and more evidence comes in.

The big problem is that today's Science does not yet know that Humans came to this planet some 11k years ago according to Scripture AND History. Amen?

The fossil record clearly shows that mankind was on earth prior to 11k years ago.

 

[Hoghead1]

That's the thing to do, AHHH, just ignore him. That's what I have been doing. He doesn't listen and he has no real knowledge of Scripture, to start with.