Can A Christian Have a Demon In Them?

[bithiah2]

i was teaching the teens this week about the full armor of God. i agree that either a person is posessed by God, or posessed by the devil. they cannot be both. but---if we don't try read the Word, pray, obey God, walk with the Gospel of Peace, do what is right, live as a Christian then we will not be able to know when the devil is leading us the wrong way and talking to us...pretty soon we will listen and start to do and act like a person who is full of the devil. then we can act like a person with a devil, mean, hateful, full of envy, lust, jealousy, and all kinds of other things like that.
whatever we fill ourselves with is what will come out of us according to Matthew 12:33-35 and 15:11-20,
so if we are constantly looking at violence, killing, sex, cursing and foolishness, that is what will manifest in our lives. it does not make us posessed but we are very open to be used by the devil for his purposes. the way to get delivered from that is to repent, pray, get prayer and stay focused on God and His ways and most of all read the Word and do what is right.
that is what i understand about being "oppressed" by the devil.
blessings
bithiah2

 

[oneshot012]

That is an argument from silence and therefore is not valid. Just because the Bible does not mention little green men from Mars does that mean they exist too? That is an argument from silence. However, I have offered some Scriptures that expressly say that God is in the believer not demons.

What is John Wimbers authority on Greek compared to the two I offered along with every english translation of the Bible that does not even acknowledge "demonize" as a biblical word?

I was not making an arguement from silence I was merely pointing out a fact. Therefore leaving open the possiblilty. Now I was suggesting nothing in terms of John Wimber having some great authority in greek you just asked me where I got my information from so don't go attacking me. Seriously buddy you need to back off. Furthermore I must stand corrected because I can not find a piece of information to back up the statement about demonization. So Wimber is flawed because he provides no footnote.

But can a bliever be possessed no I think I agreed with you on that and if I haven't I do agree with you on that. I do believe though that believers can be harassed by demons and clearly we are all not completly surrender to God. As we have our areas that we have not yet fully given over to him. Hence Andrew Murray writing a book called the surrendered life. It is a process. So that which we don't give over to God is able to be attacked by the devil. Look my point in making an issue on the occasion from scripture was more in lines of this. Because scripture doesn't talk about it we can not be dogmatic about that which it does not talk about. We can only be dogamatic on that which it does talk about from there we use church tradition to help formulate our opinions or at least I do. Well hope this expresses my point clearly enough. God Bless.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

I was not making an arguement from silence I was merely pointing out a fact. Therefore leaving open the possiblilty. Now I was suggesting nothing in terms of John Wimber having some great authority in greek you just asked me where I got my information from so don't go attacking me. Seriously buddy you need to back off. Furthermore I must stand corrected because I can not find a piece of information to back up the statement about demonization. So Wimber is flawed because he provides no footnote.

But can a bliever be possessed no I think I agreed with you on that and if I haven't I do agree with you on that. I do believe though that believers can be harassed by demons and clearly we are all not completly surrender to God. As we have our areas that we have not yet fully given over to him. Hence Andrew Murray writing a book called the surrendered life. It is a process. So that which we don't give over to God is able to be attacked by the devil. Look my point in making an issue on the occasion from scripture was more in lines of this. Because scripture doesn't talk about it we can not be dogmatic about that which it does not talk about. We can only be dogamatic on that which it does talk about from there we use church tradition to help formulate our opinions or at least I do. Well hope this expresses my point clearly enough. God Bless.

You did not point out "a fact". A fact is "a thing that is really true" - Webster. An argument from silence is not "a fact". As I illustrated, little green men from Mars is not a fact just because they are not mentioned in the Bible. You cannot have a Christian doctrine on information that does not exist in the Bible. Therefore, the "demonized Christian" doctrine is not Scriptural. Do not take this as an attack on you personally. I have only attacked the lack of Biblical authority for the "demonized Christian" heresy.

Don't you think that if the demons inside of Christians was a problem in the first century, as huge as people make it sound today, that Jesus or the Apostles would have dealt with that issue? Instead, what they did deal with was how to battle THE FLESH or SINFUL NATURE in believers, not devils. This whole "Demonized Christistian" wind of doctrine is wrong teaching concerning the sanctification of the believer. Instead of people taking responsibility to mortify their own flesh (Rom 8:13; Col 3:5) it is much easier to claim "the devil makes me do it so pray over me to make me instantly moral".

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Ok well i'm going to stay out of this topic now, because i don't know enough about it. I don't study demon possession. I do feel though that too many Christians become obsessed with demons opening themselves up for attacks or even being lead to a darker patch on the road.

But like I said in my first post this is just my opinion, and until I meet Jesus and get to ask him face to face I'll never know the correct answer.

If you are a disciple of Jesus you will study His Word so that you can know the answers.

Joshua 1:8 (NLT)
Study this Book of the Law continually. Meditate on it day and night so you may be sure to obey all that is written in it. Only then will you succeed.

2 Tim. 2:15 (NLT)
Work hard so God can approve you. Be a good worker, one who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly explains the word of truth.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

i was teaching the teens this week about the full armor of God. i agree that either a person is posessed by God, or posessed by the devil. they cannot be both. but---if we don't try read the Word, pray, obey God, walk with the Gospel of Peace, do what is right, live as a Christian then we will not be able to know when the devil is leading us the wrong way and talking to us...pretty soon we will listen and start to do and act like a person who is full of the devil. then we can act like a person with a devil, mean, hateful, full of envy, lust, jealousy, and all kinds of other things like that.
whatever we fill ourselves with is what will come out of us according to Matthew 12:33-35 and 15:11-20,
so if we are constantly looking at violence, killing, sex, cursing and foolishness, that is what will manifest in our lives. it does not make us posessed but we are very open to be used by the devil for his purposes. the way to get delivered from that is to repent, pray, get prayer and stay focused on God and His ways and most of all read the Word and do what is right.
that is what i understand about being "oppressed" by the devil.
blessings
bithiah2

Your list of bad behaviors in a believer is not due to demons but to the believers own flesh (Gal 5:19-21). The Bible never teaches of a believer in need of deliverance from devils in order to overcome these immoral behaviors.

These next paragraphs are from Power Encounter: A Pentecostal Perspective by Opal L. Reddin. It comes from Central Bible College Press of the Assemblies of God.

Arndt-Gingrich says, to "oppress" katadunasteuo is to "control, dominate, exploit, exercise tyrannical rule". Of the three times it occurs in the New Testament only once is it referring to Satan's direct activity. In two other occurrences it refers to physical bondage. Egypt oppressed Isreal until God delivered them (Acts 7:6). The rich oppress the poor and drag them into court" (James 2:6). These are graphic descriptions of being under the control of enemies.

Acts 10:38 (NLT)
"And no doubt you know that God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. Then Jesus went around doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the Devil, for God was with him." Note this verse describing Jesus' ministry prior to Calvary, The Resurrection and Pentecost. Also note Jesus healed all who were oppressed. Most likely this refers to those diseases that were caused by demons.

Should believers claim to be oppressed by Satan? Are they "controled, dominated, exploited, under the tyrannical rule" of Satan? No, no, no The history of the Israelites is the example for our Christian living (1 Cor 10:11) In Egypt they were oppressed (Acts 7:6) but God delivered them. Once they crossed the Red Sea, they were free! Not perfect, with battles yet to fight, but no longer oppressed.

 

[JEBrady]

You did not point out "a fact". A fact is "a thing that is really true" - Webster. An argument from silence is not "a fact". As I illustrated, little green men from Mars is not a fact just because they are not mentioned in the Bible. You cannot have a Christian doctrine on information that does not exist in the Bible. Therefore, the "demonized Christian" doctrine is not Scriptural. Do not take this as an attack on you personally. I have only attacked the lack of Biblical authority for the "demonized Christian" heresy.

Don't you think that if the demons inside of Christians was a problem in the first century, as huge as people make it sound today, that Jesus or the Apostles would have dealt with that issue? Instead, what they did deal with was how to battle THE FLESH or SINFUL NATURE in believers, not devils. This whole "Demonized Christistian" wind of doctrine is wrong teaching concerning the sanctification of the believer. Instead of people taking responsibility to mortify their own flesh (Rom 8:13; Col 3:5) it is much easier to claim "the devil makes me do it so pray over me to make me instantly moral".

Your definition of the Gk. posted in #14 appears to be accurate. Vine's and Strong's, at least, appear to agree with it, and one of them primarily states the word means "to be under the control of a demon". I tend to understand that control is by degrees.

There's plenty of scripture that speaks to this. The Word says Christians can be taken captive by Satan to do his will. We are told not to give the devil place in our lives. Strongholds do definitely exist in Christians' lives, so if you are stating the only thing we have to deal with is our flesh, I'd have to say you're categorically wrong according to scripture. We get darted, oppressed, temped. We are told by the Lord to pray and ask God to keep us from the tempter.

I'm not really sure what your views on this are, but it goes farther than just the definition of the word daimonidzomai. We need to look at more than that to understand the NT teaching regarding the work of demons in the lives of Christians, and not just restrict the concept to the definition of this one word. We definitely have to know biblically how to deal with the enemy, and not just our flesh.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Your definition of the Gk. posted in #14 appears to be accurate. Vine's and Strong's, at least, appear to agree with it, and one of them primarily states the word means "to be under the control of a demon". I tend to understand that control is by degrees



There's plenty of scripture that speaks to this. The Word says Christians can be taken captive by Satan to do his will. We are told not to give the devil place in our lives. Strongholds do definitely exist in Christians' lives, so if you are stating the only thing we have to deal with is our flesh, I'd have to say you're categorically wrong according to scripture. We get darted, oppressed, temped. We are told by the Lord to pray and ask God to keep us from the tempter.

I'm not really sure what your views on this are, but it goes farther than just the definition of the word daimonidzomai. We need to look at more than that to understand the NT teaching regarding the work of demons in the lives of Christians, and not just restrict the concept to the definition of this one word. We definitely have to know biblically how to deal with the enemy, and not just our flesh.

But you will never find diamonidzomai used in the context of the Bible in connection with a believer. Words need to be defined by their context. Therefore, diamonidzomai cannot be used in those Scriptures you reference to Christians being "taken captive", "giving place", "strongholds", "darted", "oppressed" and "tempted". If you want to do an exegetical study of these references...I'm game.

 

[JEBrady]

But you will never find diamonidzomai used in the context of the Bible in connection with a believer. Words need to be defined by their context. Therefore, diamonidzomai cannot be used in those Scriptures you reference to Christians being "taken captive", "giving place", "strongholds", "darted", "oppressed" and "tempted". If you want to do an exegetical study of these references...I'm game.

I haven't run an exhaustive search for every occasion of the word daimonidzomai, but I'd be surprised if it was ever used in reference to anyone who was a Christian in the Bible. Not only that, but in the case of every example I gave in my post of demonic influence in a Christian's life, not one of them qualifies as a description of daimonidzomai when compared to the people who were described that way. The statement I really disagree with is that flesh is all we as Christians have to deal with.

Opening the door to a demon through disobedience, though, is pretty dangerous. The "taken captive" passage I was referring to is found in 2 Ti 2:26, and indicates pretty clearly the condition of a Christian that is being controlled by a demon, which is a definition of the word daimonidzomai, even though that word is not used. I also don't believe the controlling is to the degree daimonidzomai indicates. People in this condition usually only lose control in specific circumstances, and seem OK most of the time.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

I haven't run an exhaustive search for every occasion of the word daimonidzomai, but I'd be surprised if it was ever used in reference to anyone who was a Christian in the Bible. Not only that, but in the case of every example I gave in my post of demonic influence in a Christian's life, not one of them qualifies as a description of daimonidzomai when compared to the people who were described that way. The statement I really disagree with is that flesh is all we as Christians have to deal with.

Opening the door to a demon through disobedience, though, is pretty dangerous. The "taken captive" passage I was referring to is found in 2 Ti 2:26, and indicates pretty clearly the condition of a Christian that is being controlled by a demon, which is a definition of the word daimonidzomai, even though that word is not used. I also don't believe the controlling is to the degree daimonidzomai indicates. People in this condition usually only lose control in specific circumstances, and seem OK most of the time.

I agree with you in that we also have to deal with the world and the devil along with our flesh. But I was just being specific concerning the idea of demons in a Christian for this thread.

2 Ti 2:26 is not about Christians who are disobedient but about those who "have been delivered over to Satan" by Paul 1 Ti 1:19,20; 2 Ti 2:17-18 because they have shipwrecked thier own faith and the faith of others. They are no longer believers. The believer is referred to as "the Lords servants" in v24. The reference of those "taken captive" is to those who teach false doctrine and engage in angry fights to defend their lies. You have to say that Hymenaeus and Philetus are Christians in order for you to claim your statement as Biblical.

 

[Tcelt12]

interesting thread-i agree with rev.kidd's remarks.i do not believe that The Holy Spirit and a demon spirit can occupy the same space.however,christians can be demonically oppressed.i and anyone else who has chosen to step out for Our Lord in effective ministry will be a target of oppression.The enemy of my soul attempts everyday to gain entrance to my soul through oppresive,fear based thoughts.once he is able to occupy the soul of a believer,he will be set for spiritual possession. we believers allow the satanic foothold through our words and meditations(worry).

what does The Bible mean when it instructs us to 'gird up the loins of our minds'? Tc12.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

interesting thread-i agree with rev.kidd's remarks.i do not believe that The Holy Spirit and a demon spirit can occupy the same space.however,christians can be demonically oppressed.i and anyone else who has chosen to step out for Our Lord in effective ministry will be a target of oppression.The enemy of my soul attempts everyday to gain entrance to my soul through oppresive,fear based thoughts.once he is able to occupy the soul of a believer,he will be set for spiritual possession. we believers allow the satanic foothold through our words and meditations(worry).

what does The Bible mean when it instructs us to 'gird up the loins of our minds'? Tc12.

Demon oppression of a Christian is not in the Bible.
These next paragraphs are from Power Encounter: A Pentecostal Perspective by Opal L. Reddin. It comes from Central Bible College Press of the Assemblies of God.

Arndt-Gingrich says, to "oppress" katadunasteuo is to "control, dominate, exploit, exercise tyrannical rule". Of the three times it occurs in the New Testament only once is it referring to Satan's direct activity. In two other occurrences it refers to physical bondage. Egypt oppressed Isreal until God delivered them (Acts 7:6). The rich oppress the poor and drag them into court" (James 2:6). These are graphic descriptions of being under the control of enemies.

Acts 10:38 (NLT)
"And no doubt you know that God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. Then Jesus went around doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the Devil, for God was with him." Note this verse describing Jesus' ministry prior to Calvary, The Resurrection and Pentecost. Also note Jesus healed all who were oppressed. Most likely this refers to those diseases that were caused by demons.

Should believers claim to be oppressed by Satan? Are they "controled, dominated, exploited, under the tyrannical rule" of Satan? No, no, no The history of the Israelites is the example for our Christian living (1 Cor 10:11) In Egypt they were oppressed (Acts 7:6) but God delivered them. Once they crossed the Red Sea, they were free! Not perfect, with battles yet to fight, but no longer oppressed.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

The enemy of my soul attempts everyday to gain entrance to my soul through oppresive,fear based thoughts.once he is able to occupy the soul of a believer,he will be set for spiritual possession.

A man cannot say, "my soul is demon possessed but I am not demon possessed". The condition of the mind is the condition of the spirit. 1 Cor. 2:11 (NLT)
No one can know what anyone else is really thinking except that person alone, and no one can know God's thoughts except God's own Spirit.
The Holy Spirit, not demons, is in the body and soul of a Christian 1 Cor. 6:19 (NLT)
Or don't you know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, who lives in you and was given to you by God? You do not belong to yourself,

You cannot find the Bible teach that a Christian can have demons dwelling in their soul!

 

[Tcelt12]

let me get my nit picker out, then..o.k.
the soul is not a dwelling place for demons or angels or God,it is a repository for thought processes,the will,and emotions.i do not say a christian can be possessed there.the mind is the gateway to The heart.after jesus ascended,paul tells us he himself was having trouble with demonically inspired sinful thoughts.he said the things he did not want to do,he ended up doing.just like anybody else,he dwelt on the thought(temptation)until he finally acted on it.
lets say the soul is the outer wall around the spirit.satan doesn't want to sit on the wall,he wants to blow holes in it until he has enough space to move through. it's about oppression in the soul realm,not possession.i regularly plead the blood of Jesus over my soul.this is part of the renewal process we are instructed to carry out.

 

[Tcelt12]

another thought-if the Holy Spirit is occupying the soul of a christian constantly,how would we ever even be tempted?to occupy means to control a given area.if The Holy Spirit has that kind of control over our soul why would we make wrong choices which are contrary to Gods will??

 

[DevotiontoBible]

let me get my nit picker out, then..o.k.
the soul is not a dwelling place for demons or angels or God,it is a repository for thought processes,the will,and emotions.i do not say a christian can be possessed there.the mind is the gateway to The heart.after jesus ascended,paul tells us he himself was having trouble with demonically inspired sinful thoughts.he said the things he did not want to do,he ended up doing.just like anybody else,he dwelt on the thought(temptation)until he finally acted on it.
lets say the soul is the outer wall around the spirit.satan doesn't want to sit on the wall,he wants to blow holes in it until he has enough space to move through. it's about oppression in the soul realm,not possession.i regularly plead the blood of Jesus over my soul.this is part of the renewal process we are instructed to carry out.

It is sarcasm to say the Word of God "nit pics". There is a reason why God has inspired this detail to be in His Word so you shouldn't treat His Word with sarcasm.

The Bible says a man is one being, not three. You cannot divide a man into three seperate parts of spirit, soul, and body. As I have shown, by Scripture, God inhabits the whole man body soul and spirit, not part of Him. Like I said earlier "a man cannot say I have a demon in my soul but I don't have a demon in me".

I have also shown, by Scripture, there is no such thing as oppression by the devil in the believer.

It is evident you do not value the Word of God for your authority on this subject since you call it "nit pic".

 

[DevotiontoBible]

another thought-if the Holy Spirit is occupying the soul of a christian constantly,how would we ever even be tempted?to occupy means to control a given area.if The Holy Spirit has that kind of control over our soul why would we make wrong choices which are contrary to Gods will??

Was not Jesus also tempted? Just because God is living in a believer does not mean he will not be tempted. Also, just because God is living in a believer does not mean it is not possible for him to make wrong choices. Why would Paul tell Christians to not make the wrong choice of practicing sexual immorality if it where not possible just because God was living in them?
1 Cor. 6:18-20 (NLT)
Run away from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body. [19] Or don't you know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, who lives in you and was given to you by God? You do not belong to yourself, [20] for God bought you with a high price. So you must honor God with your body.

 

[Tcelt12]

oh,but i do value the word of God...and i thank God for the simplicity of His word.you have not proven anything to me on this subject,unfortunately(for you).but you have made my point rather well.JESUS HIMSELF WAS TEMPTED through his soul by the devil.no Holy Spirit occupation there as you tried to assert earlier.

also,man is one being in three parts-spirit,soul,and body.paul appearantly believed that,and so do i and many others.

do you regularly attempt to belittle people who disagree with your interpretation of scripture,or are you just having a bad day?

 

[DevotiontoBible]

.i regularly plead the blood of Jesus over my soul.this is part of the renewal process we are instructed to carry out.

Where are we instructed to "regularly plead the blood of Jesus over our soul as part of the renewal process"?

 

[DevotiontoBible]

oh,but i do value the word of God...and i thank God for the simplicity of His word.you have not proven anything to me on this subject,unfortunately(for you).but you have made my point rather well.JESUS HIMSELF WAS TEMPTED through his soul by the devil.no Holy Spirit occupation there as you tried to assert earlier.

also,man is one being in three parts-spirit,soul,and body.paul appearantly believed that,and so do i and many others.

do you regularly attempt to belittle people who disagree with your interpretation of scripture,or are you just having a bad day?

I am not belittling you but your authority that supports your doctrine. The criticism leveled against the Word of Faith movement by the majority of Evangelicals is that the WOF tends to teach unbiblical errors. You have reinforced that notion in this thread.

You have also an unbiblical Christology to say that Jesus did not have the Holy Spirit but the devil in His soul when He was tempted of the devil. The Bible says differently in that Col. 2:9 (NLT)
For in Christ the fullness of God lives in a human body,
You are blaspheming to claim that Jesus was demon possessed in His soul just like the Pharisees did Mark 3:22 (NLT)
But the teachers of religious law who had arrived from Jerusalem said, "He's possessed by Satan, the prince of demons. That's where he gets the power to cast out demons." ...Mark 3:28-30 (NLT)
"I assure you that any sin can be forgiven, including blasphemy; [29] but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven. It is an eternal sin." [30] He told them this because they were saying he had an evil spirit.


I have already addressed your unbiblical trichotomy of man.

 

[BroGinder]

Greetings, I will chime in but only for a moment.

I think alot of people get worked up over symantics. When the Devil comes against a child of God as he did Job, he has to have permission from God.

I also believe as has been stated here numerous times that if you have the Holy Ghost then you CAN NOT be possessed. I think the best way top described or illustrate is the cartoons you have seen with an angle on one shoulder and a devil on another. The devil on the shoulder would be something similiar to being oppressed. It would be allowing the devil to whisper things to you and you believe them.

There is a song by Casting Crowns called the Voice of Truth. The devil is in constant battle to gain you back to his control. I do not believe that once you are saved you are always saved. Hence the scripture that says not to allow another man to steal your crown.

Anyway, oppression is not possession, its not even close. It is a controlling factor if we allow it. It kind of rides on your back or shoulder if you will, until we address it and cast it away on our own.

Its like a pity party when you are feeling bad for yourself because of this or because of that. That would be being oppressed. Lack of Joy, Happiness, Liberty..etc..

Jesus was tempted. Lets keep this real simple. The Jesus that was seen was the vessel used to carry God (Jesus) around. No man has seen God. The vessel was tempted and passed the temptation. Not by the strength of his own, but by the strength given to him by God (Jesus).

No one can learn the word of God it must be revealed to you. Calling it simplistic I feel may be a little disrespectful. I am sure that was not your intention, and it may just be me and nothing to it. Please I am not trying to start anything only stating that the Word of God is perfect, complete and it mus tbe revealed to you. If you find it simplistic, you are truly blessed and I implore you to continue your journey of seeking a greater understaning all together.

Jesus was tempted and he knows how we feel. He feels each and every pain we have. The pain we go through I believe is minimal compared to the agony and shame that was felt by the Almighty Jesus that blessed day.

One quick thing, no where in the bible doo I find where the Bible teaches any principle about the trinity. Everywhere I read I find ONE (1) God. I would be interested in hearing where I may be missing this principle though. I am truly interested in seeking ALL Truth as the Word of God says, "The Spirit of Truth will lead you into All Truth.