Calvinism and Evangelism

[Gabriel]

Ambassador's pet..........

ROTFL! He figured you out Phil.

 

[Rolf Ernst]

Well, to inaugurate this subforum. Let me ask a question that is theological and practical.

Q: Doesn't Calvinism's doctrine of Election and Predestination stiffle one's motivation and diligence in doing evangelism? Afterall, if they are predestined they'll get saved and if they are not, they won't... so why get all worked up about it when we can't make a difference?

Can you really believe that unless you yourself are the one making the difference in who goes where that it is not worth your interest? Not interested in being His ambassador or your members being used as instruments of righteousness? Not interested in being obedient to the great commission? The Bible teaches that God uses men as instruments in His work. Are you saying that unless it is your own work you are not interested? The certainty that Christ will build His church is based upon the fact that He will have those who are willing to labor in His vineyard, and the Holy Spirit will bless their efforts.

 

[seekingpurity047]

We could ask this question in the same instance... I like John Piper's dialogue about this... it's quite interesting, actually.

Taken from: http://www.desiringgod.org/library/topics/prayer/prayer_pred.html
Prayer and Predestination

A Conversation Between Prayerful and Prayerless

February 14, 1996

Prayerless: I understand that you believe in the providence of God. Is that right?

Prayerful: Yes.

Prayerless: Does that mean you believe, like the Heidelberg Catechism says, that nothing comes about by chance but only by God's design and plan?

Prayerful: Yes, I believe that's what the Bible teaches.

Prayerless: Then why do you pray?

Prayerful: I don't see the problem. Why shouldn't we pray?

Prayerless: Well, if God ordains and controls everything, then what he plans from of old will come to pass, right?

Prayerful: Yes.

Prayerless: So it's going to come to pass whether you pray or not, right.

Prayerful: That depends on whether God ordained for it to come to pass in answer to prayer. If God predestined that something happen in answer to prayer, it won't happen without prayer.

Prayerless: Wait a minute, this is confusing. Are you saying that every answer to prayer is predestined or not?

Prayerful: Yes, it is. It's predestined as an answer to prayer.

Prayerless: So if the prayer doesn't happen, the answer doesn't happen?

Prayerful: That's right.

Prayerless: So the event is contingent on our praying for it to happen?

Prayerful: Yes. I take it that by contingent you mean prayer is a real reason that the event happens, and without the prayer the event would not happen.

Prayerless: Yes that's what I mean. But how can an event be contingent on my prayer and still be eternally fixed and predestined by God?

Prayerful: Because your prayer is as fixed as the predestined answer.

Prayerless: Explain.

Prayerful: It's not complicated. God providentially ordains all events. God never ordains an event without a cause. The cause is also an event. Therefore, the cause is also foreordained. So you cannot say that the event will happen if the cause doesn't because God has ordained otherwise. The event will happen if the cause happens.

Prayerless: So what you are saying is that answers to prayer are always ordained as effects of prayer which is one of the causes, and that God predestined the answer only as an effect of the cause.

Prayerful: That's right. And since both the cause and the effect are ordained together you can't say that the effect will happen even if the cause doesn't because God doesn't ordain effects without causes.

Prayerless: Can you give some illustrations?

Prayerful: Sure. If God predestines that I die of a bullet wound, then I will not die if no bullet is fired. If God predestines that I be healed by surgery, then if there is no surgery, I will not be healed. If God predestines heat to fill my home by fire in the furnace, then if there is no fire, there will be no heat. Would you say, "Since God predestines that the sun be bright, it will be bright whether there is fire in the sun or not"?

Prayerless: No.

Prayerful: I agree. Why not?

Prayerless: Because the brightness of the sun comes from the fire.

Prayerful: Right. That's the way I think about the answers to prayer. They are the brightness, and prayer is the fire. God has established the universe so that in larger measure it runs by prayer, the same way he has established brightness so that in larger measure it happens by fire. Doesn't that make sense?

Prayerless: I think it does.

Prayerful: Then let's stop thinking up problems and go with what the Scriptures say. Ask and you will receive. You have not because you ask not.

Sincerely,
Randy

 

[michaelmonfre]

Believing In Election And Predestination Does Not Stifle Evangelism.
God Has Ordained The Means And The Ends And Works Through Our Obediance.
Fatalism On The Other Hand Stifles Evangelism.

Jonathan Edwards And Whitfield And David Brainard Were All Calvinists And Yet They Preached To The Lost.

 

[michaelmonfre]

The Methodology Of Reaching The Lost Is Different For A Calvinist.

Calvinists Do No Believe In The Altar Call.
I Have Read Much Literature Written By Calvinists.
The Altar Call Is Associated With Charles Finney. In Those Days It Was Called The Mourners Bench. Finney Was A Congregationalist. I Do Know That He Influenced Mass Evangelism Today. I Don't Believe Calvinists Use This Method To Reach The Lost. I Use To Go To A Southern Baptist Church That Used The Altar Call And The Sinners Prayer And Know I Go To An Assembly Of God But No Altar Call.

Is The Altar Call And Sinners Prayer Scriptural In Calvinist Belief?
If No, Then How Do Preachers In The Calvinist Churchs Win The Lost?
What Is The Difference Between Lordship Salvation And Non-lordship Salvation And How Does This Effect Evangelism?

 

[michaelmonfre]

Charles Spurgeon Lived In The Time Of Charles Finney And Never Used An Altar Call Yet Was Effective In Winning Souls. He Would Preach His Sermon And Would Invite People Into An Inquiry Room At The End Of The Service.

Finney, Moody, Billy Graham Were Not Calvinists But Used Similiar Methods In Mass Evangelism. Why No Calvinists For Mass Evangelism?

 

[michaelmonfre]

Norman Geisler Wrote A Book On Man's Free Will And God's Sovereignty But A Dude Named James White "potters Freedom" Refuted Mr. Geisler.
John 6:44 Is A Killer Verse

 

[swilson4000]

No Calvinist for Mass Evangelism? Are you kidding me? Ever hear of Whitefield? Spurgeon?
The reality is that I am a Reformist, and evangelize all the time. Not becuase I feel that souls will go to hell if I don't, but because my Lord has commanded that I do it - and I obey. God gives the increase, I just plant the seeds.
If you have a problem with predestination, read Romans 9. In fact, read Romans 8,9,10 - but speacial attention to 9.
If Arminianism was correct, there would be a possibility of Christianity fading away from the world due to lack of interest during the first century church since man has the free will to accept Christ, or reject Him - this is absurd.



[/QUOTE]Finney, Moody, Billy Graham Were Not Calvinists But Used Similiar Methods In Mass Evangelism. Why No Calvinists For Mass Evangelism?[/QUOTE]

 

[swilson4000]

By the way....Finney was a heretic.

 

[GrinningDwarf]

Norman Geisler Wrote A Book On Man's Free Will And God's Sovereignty But A Dude Named James White "potters Freedom" Refuted Mr. Geisler.
John 6:44 Is A Killer Verse

I don't know that I would recommend White's book as an antidote to Geisler's Chosen But Free. If the reader already agrees with Geisler's point of view, White book will probably come across as a shrill ad himonen attack on Geisler. I know because I was there. IMO, a better choice would be to go back to RC Sproul's Chosen By God. Much of Geisler's book is a rebuttal to Sproul's, and if Sproul is read with an objective mind, anybody can see how Geisler misrepresents Sproul's points. A key thing for an Armenian or semi-Pelagian to keep in mind is that if you think Calvinism means God drags some people kicking and screaming against their will to heaven while shutting out others who might desperately want to go...you don't understand Calvinism.

After I became convinced of the Reformed position, I went back and reread The Potter's Freedom and now can at least agree with his points. I still think White's tone leaves something to be desired, though now I understand it a little better since I've learned how much effort White has put into communicating Reformed truths to those who absolutely refuse to understand and continue to deliberately misrepresent our position on wide-spread public forums.

 

[Rolf Ernst]

Believing In Election And Predestination Does Not Stifle Evangelism.
God Has Ordained The Means And The Ends And Works Through Our Obediance.
Fatalism On The Other Hand Stifles Evangelism.

Jonathan Edwards And Whitfield And David Brainard Were All Calvinists And Yet They Preached To The Lost.

Not to mention Calvinist William Carey, respected among those who know the truth, as the father of the missionary movement. Oh yeah! and what about the Calvinists Adoniram Judson, Hudson Taylor, and the China Inland Missionaries.

 

[NotACalvinistThankGod]

Calvinists promoting witnessing to the lost? Very confusing, to say the least!

The doctrine of Election, as it is taught, and practiced by Calvinist believers is without a doubt a doctrine of exclusion, implying that God prefers ONLY certain exclusive ones to be saved thereby making God a respector of persons, contrary to the truth of Gods word.

Very, Very, Confusing, VERY, VERY confusing, Why, would those who believe the doctrine of exclusion, ever desire to witness to the lost?

IF it is true that God has already predetermined who will be saved, and who will not be saved, why is it then neccessary for any human to do His work for him?

I admit I am a dummy so maybe someone who of course is a lot smarter than I am could, in a more inteligent manner, enlighten a foolish old dummy like myself as to the true knowledge, and understanding of Gods will, if possible, using a sufficient amount of Biblical evidence to support the teaching if you please.

Thank you.

 

[Reformationist]

Calvinists promoting witnessing to the lost? Very confusing, to say the least!

The doctrine of Election, as it is taught, and practiced by Calvinist believers is without a doubt a doctrine of exclusion, implying that God prefers ONLY certain exclusive ones to be saved thereby making God a respector of persons, contrary to the truth of Gods word.

Very, Very, Confusing, VERY, VERY confusing, Why, would those who believe the doctrine of exclusion, ever desire to witness to the lost?

IF it is true that God has already predetermined who will be saved, and who will not be saved, why is it then neccessary for any human to do His work for him?

I admit I am a dummy so maybe someone who of course is a lot smarter than I am could, in a more inteligent manner, enlighten a foolish old dummy like myself as to the true knowledge, and understanding of Gods will, if possible, using a sufficient amount of Biblical evidence to support the teaching if you please.

Thank you.

I thought you mentioned that you used to be a Calvinist. Were you simply ignorant of the doctrines which you claim to have forsaken?

We evangelize because, although God has ordained who will respond in faith, He has not revealed who the elect are and has decreed that His servant's work of sharing the Gospel is the means by which He gathers His flock.

That help?

God bless

 

[CCWoody]

IF it is true that God has already predetermined who will be saved, and who will not be saved, why is it then neccessary for any human to do His work for him?

I see, so see, I'm still seeing
That my pal, my bud, best bud
PentecostalEvangelist, PentecostalProphet, PentecostalTroll, Bane of Calvinism who is so thankful he is not a Calvinist

Is back.

Any time you want to finish our mail conversation and work out your anger issues, I'll be here.

To answer your question, it is not necessary for any human to do God's work for him. Salvation is of the Lord and His blessing is on His people. Of course, being the heralds of the kingdom of God, i.e. the Gospel, is not the work of the King, but of the servants of the King.

 

[JJB]

Calvinists promoting witnessing to the lost? Very confusing, to say the least!

The doctrine of Election, as it is taught, and practiced by Calvinist believers is without a doubt a doctrine of exclusion, implying that God prefers ONLY certain exclusive ones to be saved thereby making God a respector of persons, contrary to the truth of Gods word.

Very, Very, Confusing, VERY, VERY confusing, Why, would those who believe the doctrine of exclusion, ever desire to witness to the lost?

IF it is true that God has already predetermined who will be saved, and who will not be saved, why is it then neccessary for any human to do His work for him?

I admit I am a dummy so maybe someone who of course is a lot smarter than I am could, in a more inteligent manner, enlighten a foolish old dummy like myself as to the true knowledge, and understanding of Gods will, if possible, using a sufficient amount of Biblical evidence to support the teaching if you please.

Thank you.

Peek-a-boo! Hello, friend.

 

[Rolf Ernst]

When arminians say that if God has already determined who will be saved, there is no point in them working, that reveals certain things about their mindset.

1. If these things are not under their control, they see no point in becoming involved as a mere servant working in the vinyard of Him who is the Determiner.

2. They believe that salvation finally turns upon themselves and what they do. God has already done all He can and now it is up to them. Oh, yes! and it is up to men who cannot know the things of the Spirit of God. And though no man can come unto the Father but in the name of Christ the Mediator, (whom they do not yet know because supposedly, as dead men, they are approaching Him) it is their part in choosing Christ that must preceed their regeneration. They don't need any miraculous, life-changing regeneration by the Holy Spirit to create new creatures.

3. That finally issues in a belief that it is therefore dependent upon their persuasiveness, emotionalism, and the content of their message. That is not exactly prostrate, lying with your face in the dust dependence upon the Holy Spirit who wields the two-edged sword. Neither is it laboring in the name of the Lord. It is depending upon the arm of flesh. Does the prayer, "come from the four winds, O Breath, and breathe upon these slain that they may live" ever rise within their heart as they deliver His word?

4. They are dependent also upon the attention and the sensibilities of listeners to react properly to their message, even though the Bible says that the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God, neither can he know them.

5. If the listener is not moved by their presentation of the gospel, the fault can only be found in either themselves or the listeners. The outcome cannot be the will of God, because He wants everyone to repent. Either way, they see enough blame to go around. The preacher might believe that the people were disrepectful toward the preached word. Since he believed it was up to him to properly persuade, he must take it personal that no one reacted. they rejected his message or else they are incorrigibly hard hearted and irreverent. But in the end it was his message to whch they did not respond. But when they do respond it is because of his message. Great job. preacher!

6. This attitude of the outcome being dependent upon the preacher and the listeners leads to a conclusion: it is the fault of one or both that there were no conversions.

Where is the spirit of Moses in all this? The Exodus of the children out of Egpt was a type of salvation wherein the children are released from their bondage to the world, but where is the Moses who cast himself upon the LORD, lifted his rod across the Red Sea and proclaimed, "Stand still and see the salvation of your God!"?

 

[drstevej]

Where is the spirit of Moses in all this? The Exodus of the children out of Egpt was a type of salvation wherein the children are released from their bondage to the world, but where is the Moses who cast himself upon the LORD, lifted his rod across the Red Sea and proclaimed, "Stand still and see the salvation of your God!"?

great post, Rolf

 

[NotACalvinistThankGod]

When arminians say that if God has already determined who will be saved, there is no point in them working, that reveals certain things about their mindset.

1. If these things are not under their control, they see no point in becoming involved.

2. They believe that salvation finally turns upon themselves and what they do.

3. That finally issues in a belief that it is therefore dependent upon (1.) them--they therefore are depending upon their persuasiveness, and the content of their message.

4. They are dependent also upon the attention and the sensibilities of listeners to react properly to their message.

5. If the listener is not moved by their presentation of the gospel, the fault can only be found in either themselves or the listeners. The outcome cannot be the will of God, because He wants everyone to repent. Either way, they see enough blame to go around. The preacher might believe that the people were disrepectful toward the preached word. Since he believed it was up to him to properly persuade, he must take it personal that no one reacted. they rejected his message or else they are incorrigibly hard hearted and irreverent. But in the end it was his message to whch they did not respond.

6. This attitude of the outcome being dependent upon the preacher and the listeners, it is the fault of one or both that there were no conversions.

Where is the spirit of Moses in all this? The Exodus of the children out of Egpt was a type of salvation wherein the children are released from their bondage to the world, but where is the Moses who cast himself upon the LORD, lifted his rod across the Red Sea and proclaimed, "Stand still and see the salvation of your God!"?

LOL! Mind Boggling assumptions! Entirely incorrect though, but that is a matter for much further, and much deeper contemplation on your part.

OK here's some hard questions for the learned amongst us (Of Which, of course, I certainly am NOT a member)

IF God didn't mean whosoever, when he said whosoever, then why did he say whoseover, when he said whosoever, and what did he really mean to say, instead of whosoever, when he said whosever?

IF God didn't mean all when he said all, then why did he say all, at all, and what did he mean to say instead of all, if he didn't mean to say all, in the first place?

AND finally, do you believe that is NOT Gods will that any person who is lost should be witnessed to, and thus given an equal opportunity, through that witness, to be born again by grace, through faith?

See here's the deal, election, as it commonly presented, insinuates that God does not desire that all be saved, and election as it is commonly presented also insinuates that there are those who should (according to Gods will) never be afforded an opportunity to hear the Gospel of Jesus Christ preached to them since they are not amomgh those God predestined to receive the gift of salvation.

Now listen, I know there are those among you who hate me, and I can live with that (Your loss not mine ) BUT leave me entirely out of the equation, alrighty, there are many unsaved who I am sure come to these forums from time to time to read what all of us put here, and well, I can't see where someone who just be on the verge of surrendering their life to Jesus would really still want to do that IF they read about election and predestination as it is presented.

IF I were a lost person, (almost went back) and if I read the comments posted here in these forums concerning predestination, and election, well I'd be most miserably uncertain if God had any intention of loving me at all.

Bottom line (ban me now if you want) there are millions of lost people who are miserably miserable, who are hurtinmg in the worst kind of ways none of us can even begin to imagine, who REALLY need a Saviour, and when we present a doctrine that only promises election for a few, and excludes the rest, there is not sure hope being offered to anyone, truth is, by the uncertainty of the doctrine of election even we cannot be altogether certain if we are the elect, or we are not.

I'm not here to cause anyone trouble, I just think it's important to answer the questions:

Does God really love everyone? AND Is It Really Gods Desire that anyone, and everyone, anywhere, and everywhere, have an equal opportunity to hear the Gospel and decide for themselves if they want to become a Christian or not?

WE all had to make that choice for ourselves, God didn't make it for us...

OK I'm through blabbering, I'll not cause anymore heartaches for you.....

 

[NotACalvinistThankGod]

I see, so see, I'm still seeing
That my pal, my bud, best bud
PentecostalEvangelist, PentecostalProphet, PentecostalTroll, Bane of Calvinism who is so thankful he is not a Calvinist

Is back.

Best BUD? You sure Coulda fooled me!

Any time you want to finish our mail conversation and work out your anger issues, I'll be here.

Anger is something WE ALL have to deal with, they are certainly not an uncommon trait amongst the human race now are they?

To answer your question, it is not necessary for any human to do God's work for him. Salvation is of the Lord and His blessing is on His people. Of course, being the heralds of the kingdom of God, i.e. the Gospel, is not the work of the King, but of the servants of the King.

Now there's a confusing conglomaration of confusion if ever Ihave ever read one!

Exactly where is the answer to my question in that CC?

What you are saying to me is, we are human, so it is not neccessary for us to do Gods work for him, if this were really true, then why do we have churches, why do we have Pastors, whwy do we have Sunday School teachers, why do we have seminaries, and Bible colleges, and why are we here at all?

No offense intended CC, I just be smartly (should I say stupidly) confarseded by your comments!

 

[seekingpurity047]

1. IF God didn't mean whosoever, when he said whosoever, then why did he say whoseover, when he said whosoever, and what did he really mean to say, instead of whosoever, when he said whosever?

2. IF God didn't mean all when he said all, then why did he say all, at all, and what did he mean to say instead of all, if he didn't mean to say all, in the first place?

3. AND finally, do you believe that is NOT Gods will that any person who is lost should be witnessed to, and thus given an equal opportunity, through that witness, to be born again by grace, through faith?

4. Does God really love everyone? AND Is It Really Gods Desire that anyone, and everyone, anywhere, and everywhere, have an equal opportunity to hear the Gospel and decide for themselves if they want to become a Christian or not?

Hey NotACalvinistThankGod, I have edited your posts just a little bit (adding numbers to the questions) that way i can answer them in order, and so that i do not ramble on as you did yourself.

1. The answer to this question is plain and simple. You ask "Why would God say whosoever if He didn't actually mean whosoever?" Let me clarify this for you. God means whosoever when He means whosoever. What you fail to recognize is that the word "whosoever" does NOT imply the freedom of the will. Let's look at the verse in context, shall we?

John 3:16-18

16"For God so loved the world,[a] that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. 18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

OK. Whoever/whosoever does not imply freedom of the will or volition, as the pros like to call it . Basically, the simplest of explanations of your problem with this is that whosoever believes on the Son IS the elect. For... it says in verse 18 that "whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned ALREADY, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God." Funny how he puts already... very interesting. NEXT!

2. "Why did God say all when He didn't mean all?" Typical question... and yes, there is a lot of speculation in this. Let's look at a particular verse, shall we?

1 Tim. 2:3-7

3This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 5For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man[a] Christ Jesus, 6who gave himself as a ransom for all, which is the testimony given at the proper time. 7For this I was appointed a preacher and an apostle (I am telling the truth, I am not lying), a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth.

Take note of verse seven right now, and I will get back at it as it is crucial contextually. To begin, Timothy was a half-jew and half-greek. And, also, Timothy was raised practically as a jew, very well learned in the hebrew scriptures, etc. So... i think it's safe to say that he was pretty much a jew. Circumcized, etc etc. Now... Paul is writing to him, this we know for sure. Now, back to verse seven "For this I was appointed a preacher and an apostle... a teacher of the GENTILES in faith and truth." It's interesting that Paul should mention this, because we can bring it back to verses 4 and 6. All people, because paul is writing to a jew and preaches and teaches to the gentiles, means both gentiles and jews. NOT every single person on the face of the earth. NEXT!

3. What's the question? Gosh.. either im illiterate, or your grammar's really bad (sorry... it's true though.... i don't mean to make fun, i just don't know what you are asking.) I'm going to assume that you are asking whether or not it is God's will that we witness to the lost that they may have the opportunity to be born again, hence receiving grace, etc etc. I think that's what you are asking. Well... I have a question in response to that one. What's God's will? The question is merely rhetorical, and YES there is an answer. His will is that everyone may know that HE is the LORD! That He may be glorified and known all over the world. Knowledge of God does NOT always imply salvation. You can know that Jesus is the Saviour, and still not be saved, for you don't trust Him, yadyadyada. Ya know waht i mean. You must be asking "Well... where does he get this?" Easy. Here come the verses.

Exodus 7:1-5

1And the LORD said to Moses, "See, I have made you like God to Pharaoh, and your brother Aaron shall be your prophet. 2You shall speak all that I command you, and your brother Aaron shall tell Pharaoh to let the people of Israel go out of his land. 3But I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and though I multiply my signs and wonders in the land of Egypt, 4Pharaoh will not listen to you. Then I will lay my hand on Egypt and bring my hosts, my people the children of Israel, out of the land of Egypt by great acts of judgment. 5The Egyptians shall know that I am the LORD, when I stretch out my hand against Egypt and bring out the people of Israel from among them."

Interesting... before any plagues were put out against egypt, God said that He's going to do it, no matter what. He is going to harden Pharaoh's heart, thus making him not listen to Moses. God does things in the same manner today. Why do we have hurricanes? Why do we have earthquakes? Why is there such thing as evil? Why? God allowed it that He may be known to the ends of the earth.

So where does this come into your question? Well... if it is God's will that people may know that He is the Lord, then what better way to do it than to have people spreading the gospel all over the world? Hey! Somebody believes, there must be something extraordinary going on! God does everything for His glory, and for no other reason. God is a self-exalting Being. That is the answer to everything. God glorifies Himself. You disagree? Then you deny Holy Scripture. For instance.

Psalm 19:1

1The heavens declare the glory of God,
and the sky above[a] proclaims his handiwork.

God did NOT create the universe for us, because if that were true, then it would be a big waste of space (Thank you John Piper). Then what about the cross? What was that for? Once again, His glory. For Jesus Christ bears our curse (sin), Jesus Christ provides our righteousness, and God had a view to His glory when He put His Son on the cross. God vindicates His glory in the cross! Amen!

I know what you are probably saying.... "That's pretty selfish of Him to do that..." Heh... let me tell you, it's more loving for God to show His glory than to spare us suffering. Scripture?

John 11:1-4

1Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2It was Mary who anointed the Lord with ointment and wiped his feet with her hair, whose brother Lazarus was ill. 3So the sisters sent to him, saying, "Lord, he whom you love is ill." 4But when Jesus heard it he said, "This illness does not lead to death. It is for the glory of God, so that the Son of God may be glorified through it."

Jesus says that a sickness is for the glory of God that the Son mght be glorified! WHA!?!!?!?!!?! THAT''S AMAZING Praise God! You should know this chapter. It's where Jesus ALLOWS for Lazarus to die by this sickness, THEN He raises him from the dead. Say wha!?! Jesus could have simply healed him and went on with it. But it was for His glory. Funny..... notice also that Jesus stayed at the place for 2 days... allowing Lazarus to suffer, in order that Christ may be glorified. Glory to Him alone! Amen.

4. Does God really love everyone? Yes, however... there is a difference. He loves some in one way (Agape) and some in another (Eros). Now Agape love is that unconditional love kind of like a mother to a child, that no matter what, He will always be there for them. Eros love, on the other hand, is brotherly love. The reason why I bring this up is because it is crucial to understanding the love of God. God does NOT love everyone in the same way, taht's what my argument is. Let me give you an analogy.

If you are married, you should better understand this. Do you love your wife in the same way that you love every other woman on the face of the earth? If not... then you have a serious dilemma on your hands, because then why would you even bother marrying? Your wife is of no greater value then some woman 5000 miles away from you taht you do not even know. I hope that this is NOT the case.

God does the same for the Church. God loves (agape) the church in a different way that he loves (eros) the ones who will never believe. Verses....

Eph. 5:25-27

25Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.

Embolded the important words hehe..... This verse is pretty clear that Christ loves the church MORE than the unbelievers. You are aware of what the Church is, right? I hope and pray that you are aware that it is the BODY OF BELIEVERS and NOT every single person on the face of the earth.

Now, since your questions have been answered in a scriptural fashion, I will now make a little comment on your name. NotACalvinistThankGod. Hmm... if you are an arminian.... why should you be thanking God that you aren't a calvinist, if you believe that you are more sovereign than God? Anyways... that's another issue for another day. I close with a comment by Coffee Swirls.

I'm a christian by the grace of God, and a calvinist because I read my bible.

To the glory of God do I write these theological truths,

Randy