Bridegroom Matins

[Big Drew]

I noticed on the local Orthodox Church's calendar that they have a Bridegroom Matins service tomorrow morning at 8 AM...would this be a good service for the first time visiting? If I go what can I expect? This is me going under the assumption that I'll wake up early enough lol.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Hmmmmm. Interesting. Ours is always in the evening.

It's such a unique service to this season. Low key, quiet, lots of repeated prayers, some hymns, Scripture readings. Unless they have books to lend out, they may not have anything for you to follow. That service is in the Holy Week book.

You can get a good sense of the atmosphere of the parish, maybe get to meet some folks in a relaxed atmosphere if they have coffee afterwards. The priest may well be super-busy. It won't be very much like the Divine Liturgy, but you can get something of a taste.

If you can only choose one or two services, some of the others are much more profound. But also much more demonstrative, if you like quiet. This is a very emotional week too, btw ...


I hope that helps a little?

 

[Big Drew]

Hmmmmm. Interesting. Ours is always in the evening.

It's such a unique service to this season. Low key, quiet, lots of repeated prayers, some hymns, Scripture readings. Unless they have books to lend out, they may not have anything for you to follow. That service is in the Holy Week book.

You can get a good sense of the atmosphere of the parish, maybe get to meet some folks in a relaxed atmosphere if they have coffee afterwards. The priest may well be super-busy. It won't be very much like the Divine Liturgy, but you can get something of a taste.

If you can only choose one or two services, some of the others are much more profound. But also much more demonstrative, if you like quiet. This is a very emotional week too, btw ...


I hope that helps a little?

It does, thanks. I may try to go, if not tomorrow then one other day this week...I'm so interested, and know I really won't KNOW until I've been.

The local parish is Russian, so maybe that makes a difference in the service times?

 

[~Anastasia~]

It does, thanks. I may try to go, if not tomorrow then one other day this week...I'm so interested, and know I really won't KNOW until I've been.

The local parish is Russian, so maybe that makes a difference in the service times?

I can't comment much on service times between jurisdictions, and have the least experience with Russians.

But if the services are in Church Slavonic, and they don't have a book or translations, you might have trouble. You can at least get the atmosphere.

They may read in English or a language you know, or a combination of languages. They might have books or printouts.

I will say a couple of things ... even if the Holy Week services are near-impossible to follow, the Divine Liturgy is something that can be learned and recognized, and it's easy to get that text in English. There are things that happen predictably, so that even if you don't understand the language, you can know what they are saying and what's happening within a couple of months or less, probably without the book, even if it's in another language.

The other thing is that some of the other services are much more profound and moving. The service for Pascha at the top of that list (ours is 11:15 pm on Saturday), and probably Lamenations, Friday evening, second. Thursday night's service with all the Gospels about the crucifixion, and the unnailing service, if they have it (ours is Friday afternoon) also let you enter into very important events.

My experiences are limited - I think this is my fourth Pascha - but I hope that helps.

 

[Ioustinos]

I noticed on the local Orthodox Church's calendar that they have a Bridegroom Matins service tomorrow morning at 8 AM...would this be a good service for the first time visiting? If I go what can I expect? This is me going under the assumption that I'll wake up early enough lol.

Here is a link to the text of the Bridegroom Matins service (and some others). That way you can get a glimpse of what will be going on.

Holy Week Texts

 

[FenderTL5]

For what it's worth: one of the first Orthodox services I attended was the evening service on Holy Thursday with the 12 gospel readings (notorious for its length). When I mention this to some of my fellow parishioners, they often reply, "and you came back?"


Holy Week services will be different. Matins is done in the evening, with pre-sanctified liturgies in the morning - every thing is topsy-turvy this week.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Please let us know what you think if you were able to go!

 

[ArmyMatt]

and if he is not too busy or tired, try to talk to Father about the service, and let him know about the journey you have been on if he does not already know.

 

[Big Drew]

Went to the service this morning...it was so different from anything I've ever been to. I understand now what you all have said about not really understanding until you're involved in a service. It's so interactive. The liturgy, sign of the cross, kissing the icons, falling to your knees and bowing (I wasn't expecting that)...it was awesome...and not in the common meaning of the word, like I was literally in awe the entire time...these folks wanted nothing more than to worship God...no distractions.

And after service they were very nice and welcoming. One of the readers actually looked at me puzzled and said, "You picked a strange service to be your first one." lol...the priest and I spoke for about 15 minutes after, really nice guy...he was actually a Baptist pastor for about ten years before converting, so he understands the world I'm in. He showed me some icons of certain Saints we had discussed in our chat...made it a point to explain to me why he spent most of the service on the other side of the doors.

All in all, it was a wonderful experience...but a lot to process as well. I have much to consider, even more so now...

Father Basil was pleased to hear that I had a good group of folks (y'all) that were helping me to understand Orthodoxy.

And, I stand corrected...he said that they have roots in the Russian Church, but they are part of the OCA. The entire service was in English.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Went to the service this morning...it was so different from anything I've ever been to. I understand now what you all have said about not really understanding until you're involved in a service. It's so interactive. The liturgy, sign of the cross, kissing the icons, falling to your knees and bowing (I wasn't expecting that)...it was awesome...and not in the common meaning of the word, like I was literally in awe the entire time...these folks wanted nothing more than to worship God...no distractions.

And after service they were very nice and welcoming. One of the readers actually looked at me puzzled and said, "You picked a strange service to be your first one." lol...the priest and I spoke for about 15 minutes after, really nice guy...he was actually a Baptist pastor for about ten years before converting, so he understands the world I'm in. He showed me some icons of certain Saints we had discussed in our chat...made it a point to explain to me why he spent most of the service on the other side of the doors.

All in all, it was a wonderful experience...but a lot to process as well. I have much to consider, even more so now...

Father Basil was pleased to hear that I had a good group of folks (y'all) that were helping me to understand Orthodoxy.

And, I stand corrected...he said that they have roots in the Russian Church, but they are part of the OCA. The entire service was in English.

Ah, how wonderful! I'm glad you could understand and I'm glad it was a good experience for you.

Yes, it truly must be experienced.

It's kind of ironic to me that some who are from very different traditions will assume that "Liturgy" means "dead or passive" worship. As you said, it's very interactive and engaged. Even if we are not shouting or jumping. (and at times we DO shout - Pascha is coming!)

Glory to God!

I do understand that it's a lot to process. I think Baptists and similar have mostly theological hurdles to overcome, though, while Pentecostals tend to have more "feel of the Liturgy" to overcome.

It's a blessing to hear someone's first impression though. It brings tears to my eyes, remembering how the sacredness of the service impacted me when I first encountered it. Thank you.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Went to the service this morning...it was so different from anything I've ever been to. I understand now what you all have said about not really understanding until you're involved in a service. It's so interactive. The liturgy, sign of the cross, kissing the icons, falling to your knees and bowing (I wasn't expecting that)...it was awesome...and not in the common meaning of the word, like I was literally in awe the entire time...these folks wanted nothing more than to worship God...no distractions.

And after service they were very nice and welcoming. One of the readers actually looked at me puzzled and said, "You picked a strange service to be your first one." lol...the priest and I spoke for about 15 minutes after, really nice guy...he was actually a Baptist pastor for about ten years before converting, so he understands the world I'm in. He showed me some icons of certain Saints we had discussed in our chat...made it a point to explain to me why he spent most of the service on the other side of the doors.

All in all, it was a wonderful experience...but a lot to process as well. I have much to consider, even more so now...

Father Basil was pleased to hear that I had a good group of folks (y'all) that were helping me to understand Orthodoxy.

And, I stand corrected...he said that they have roots in the Russian Church, but they are part of the OCA. The entire service was in English.

glad you had a great experience! God bless you on your journey!

 

[Big Drew]

Ah, how wonderful! I'm glad you could understand and I'm glad it was a good experience for you.

Yes, it truly must be experienced.

It's kind of ironic to me that some who are from very different traditions will assume that "Liturgy" means "dead or passive" worship. As you said, it's very interactive and engaged. Even if we are not shouting or jumping. (and at times we DO shout - Pascha is coming!)

Glory to God!

I do understand that it's a lot to process. I think Baptists and similar have mostly theological hurdles to overcome, though, while Pentecostals tend to have more "feel of the Liturgy" to overcome.

It's a blessing to hear someone's first impression though. It brings tears to my eyes, remembering how the sacredness of the service impacted me when I first encountered it. Thank you.

I would agree with that. Baptists and those in the Reformed camp I think have a lot of trouble with the idea of Theosis. But, in that regard it's easier for someone like me...I spent about 6 years in the Pentecostal Holiness Church and was studying to be a licensed minister with them...and they place a strong emphasis on Sanctification, based on the teachings of John Wesley on Christian Perfection...which is very close to Theosis.

It's like NT Wright said, there is a place for Justification, but that's just the beginning of the journey.

 

[All4Christ]

I would agree with that. Baptists and those in the Reformed camp I think have a lot of trouble with the idea of Theosis. But, in that regard it's easier for someone like me...I spent about 6 years in the Pentecostal Holiness Church and was studying to be a licensed minister with them...and they place a strong emphasis on Sanctification, based on the teachings of John Wesley on Christian Perfection...which is very close to Theosis.

It's like NT Wright said, there is a place for Justification, but that's just the beginning of the journey.

Reaching back to the Holiness roots of Pentecostalism was my first step towards Orthodoxy . (I was Assemblies of God)

 

[Big Drew]

Reaching back to the Holiness roots of Pentecostalism was my first step towards Orthodoxy . (I was Assemblies of God)

Wesley seemed to have much in common with the East...maybe even more than he had with the West, at least in regards to salvation, sanctification, etc...I've read that he was influenced by an Orthodox priest, but I don't know how true that is.

 

[All4Christ]

Wesley seemed to have much in common with the East...maybe even more than he had with the West, at least in regards to salvation, sanctification, etc...I've read that he was influenced by an Orthodox priest, but I don't know how true that is.

It's been awhile since I read about it. If you find a resource about it - I'd love to brush up on my history

Somewhere upstairs I have a massive compendium of Pentecostal history, but it didn't touch too much on what influenced Wesley.

 

[Big Drew]

It's been awhile since I read about it. If you find a resource about it - I'd love to brush up on my history

Somewhere upstairs I have a massive compendium of Pentecostal history, but it didn't touch too much on what influenced Wesley.

I'll be happy to share if I come across something.

I got really into Pentecostal history whenever I was studying for the ministry...which lead me to Wesley, and his writings were truly eye opening for me. Out of all the reformer types he's my favorite...though I don't know that he really qualifies in the strictest sense of the word.

 

[All4Christ]

I'll be happy to share if I come across something.

I got really into Pentecostal history whenever I was studying for the ministry...which lead me to Wesley, and his writings were truly eye opening for me. Out of all the reformer types he's my favorite...though I don't know that he really qualifies in the strictest sense of the word.

My church history teacher was Orthodox. I had taken a Pentecostal history course earlier and wanted to find the origins of where we came from. I found that the Holiness movement had many similarities to Orthodoxy, so I talked with my professor about the similarities and differences, and got suggestions on additional books to read. (I also took some of the reformation history courses and read up on that as well.) I read and read and read (and periodically posted here on TAW)...and 5 years later stepped into my first service during Lent. I loved it from the first time I experienced it.

It's pretty cool - my professor's wife saw my post here asking for a recommended church. She contacted me, not knowing that I knew her husband, inviting me to my current parish

 

[Big Drew]

My church history teacher was Orthodox. I had taken a Pentecostal history course earlier and wanted to find the origins of where we came from. I found that the Holiness movement had many similarities to Orthodoxy, so I talked with my professor about the similarities and differences, and got suggestions on additional books to read. (I also took some of the reformation history courses and read up on that as well.) I read and read and read (and periodically posted here on TAW)...and 5 years later stepped into my first service during Lent. I loved it from the first time I experienced it.

It's pretty cool - my professor's wife saw my post here asking for a recommended church. She contacted me, not knowing that I knew her husband, inviting me to my current parish

Oh wow, how cool is that?

I'm only at the beginning of my journey in regards to Orthodoxy...there's a lot I'll have to reconcile...I've noticed like your story, for many it seems to take several years of consideration...it's not something you can do overnight...I've been able to move in and out of different Pentecostal churches with ease, Methodists, and currently in a nondenom...but Orthodoxy is like a completely different world from what I'm use to...so I want to know that I know that I know...ya know? lol I think the biggest thing for me at this point is learning how to get out of my western mindset.

 

[All4Christ]

Oh wow, how cool is that?

I'm only at the beginning of my journey in regards to Orthodoxy...there's a lot I'll have to reconcile...I've noticed like your story, for many it seems to take several years of consideration...it's not something you can do overnight...I've been able to move in and out of different Pentecostal churches with ease, Methodists, and currently in a nondenom...but Orthodoxy is like a completely different world from what I'm use to...so I want to know that I know that I know...ya know? lol I think the biggest thing for me at this point is learning how to get out of my western mindset.

I understand completely It's not a process that can be rushed, nor should it! That's actually why we have the period of time as a catechumen.

It is a completely different mindset, but it is a beautiful journey learning about it! Granted, I'm still on that journey even almost 10 years after being chrismated!!

 

[All4Christ]

I highly recommend checking out Pascha. That was one of my favorite experiences when I was an inquirer. I stayed for nocturnes up to the start of the liturgy. Absolutely beautiful

It's a long service, so it isn't a common "first (or second) service", but it is beautiful.

Literally, the joy is tangible....it's beyond description.