Border rancher: 'We’ve found prayer rugs out here. It’s unreal'

[Halbhh]

people have lost loved ones to illegal immigrants, lawless politicians setting up sanctuary zones and cities harboring criminals

Are illegal immigrants more, the same, or less dangerous than native born American citizens is a good question, and some meaningful facts are available that are very suggestive. Here's what I found --

A careful analysis includes:

Between 1990 and 2013, the foreign-born share of the U.S. population increased from 7.9 percent to 13.1 percent, and the number of unauthorized immigrants went up from 3.5 million to 11.2 million. At the same time, the violent crime rate (murder, rape and aggravated assault) decreased 48 percent and property crime rate fell 41 percent, the report said, citing FBI data.
Are undocumented immigrants less likely to commit crime?

More clear though:
The low illegal immigrant incarceration rate is consistent with other research that finds more targeting of immigrants does not reduce the crime rate, which would occur if they were more crime prone than natives.
Incarcerated Immigrants in 2016: Their Numbers, Demographics, and Countries of Origin

This means that if you personally visited many areas in poorer parts of a few cities and suburbs,

and managed to meet face to face 1000 native born Americans one week,

and then another week 1000 illegal immigrants,

the odds are that the native born Americans would be more likely than the illegal immigrants to assault you.

See? The blanket characterization of illegals as dangerous isn't...true as a blanket characterization, or an average.

It's not true in the way people take it, as if illegal immigrants are more dangerous than people we grew up knowing in large public schools, etc. I'd feel safer in Austin around a large group of illegal immigrants than I would just on the road meeting native born Americans in rest stops.

 

[Halbhh]

Do you support ones that enter the country illegally?

Probably won't get a straight answer.

M-Bob

By 'support' do you mean love? Yes, some I've personally met and know. But if you mean something else by 'support', you'd have to ask that more clearly. (worst case is someone says 'yes', and someone else takes it to mean some very out-there meaning like throwing rocks, which I consider criminal assault).

 

[Mountainmanbob]

By 'support' do you mean love? Yes, some I've personally met and know. But if you mean something else by 'support', you'd have to ask that more clearly.

Would you like to let them all in so as to stay permanently? Even though most do not qualify under the set laws?

What do we have now three Caravans heading this way? It truly is getting hard to keep count?

M-Bob

 

[Halbhh]

Would you like to let them all in so as to stay permanently? Even though most do not qualify under the set laws?

What do we have now three Caravans heading this way? It truly is getting hard to keep count?

M-Bob

Personally knowing these human beings, I could not ask for them to be treated less well than native born Americans.

Instead, to be treated equally. This way:

Leviticus 19:34 You must treat the foreigner living among you as native-born and love him as yourself, for you were foreigners in the land of Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

I know that God hasn't changed about what is right. It's still what is right, and it's an instance of Matthew 7:12, and of 'love your neighbor as yourself' (Mark 12:31 The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' No other commandment is greater than these.").

I'm aware this applies to me, and that if I went against it, it would clearly be sin for me personally, knowing them personally, and not having any excuse not to love them.

So if I advocated these neighbors be deported, that would be clearly against God's will, since I'm aware Christ is instructing us in how to live here and now.

 

[redleghunter]

The article discusses pretty much only prayer rugs with a dash of cartel retaliation.

Actually the article spends more time on speaking of non_Mexican immigrants using the US-Mexico border to enter the country illegally. Yet most just read a title and respond.

 

[EpiscipalMe]

Actually the article spends more time on speaking of non_Mexican immigrants using the US-Mexico border to enter the country illegally. Yet most just read a title and respond.

Yeah - the scary Muslims and their prayer rugs.

It is an incredibly slanted article that offers little in the way of evidence.

No doubt there are Mexicans, other central and South Americans, and people from other countries trying to come in via the southern border. However, the article is clearly written to make the Trump base say “Yeah, it isn’t only the dangerous Hispanic people, it’s the terrorist Muslims too!”

 

[Servant of Yeshua]

Nice try. We're not talking about Muslim countries, we're talking about the United States.

I came on this site to get a more respectful platform. Sadly I know too many people around the globe who are experiencing serious persecution by Muslims. My friends in Nigeria cannot even get jobs and live in fear because they are Christian. They said that homosexuals live in even worse fear. My friend is a US citizen, her husband with a perfect clean record has been on a waiting list for 11 yrs waiting to legally come here to the US to escape the Muslim persecution. The US said that she must prove that she can support him. The immigration lawyers charge more than you can afford. There is no help for people there. You cannot even mail anything to them without it being stolen. But they wait on the Lord because they know the reward will be in heaven. Willingly breaking a countries law is a sin. God does not need us to break the law in order to get what we want. Blessings to you.

 

[JosephZ]

My friend is a US citizen, her husband with a perfect clean record has been on a waiting list for 11 yrs waiting to legally come here to the US to escape the Muslim persecution. The US said that she must prove that she can support him. The immigration lawyers charge more than you can afford.

Tell your friend that there is no need to hire an immigration attorney to petition for her husband to come to the US. All the forms and instructions can be found online. If your friend can show she has lived in Nigeria for six months, she can petition her husband by Direct Counselor Filing. This process is much faster than going through the process of using an immigration attorney and/or filing in the US. It takes less than six months to go through the whole process on average. As for proving she can support him, she only needs to have an annual income of around $20,575. If her income is not sufficient, she can have a relative or friend file as a joint sponsor by filling out an affidavit of support.

 

[expos4ever]

Do you support ones that enter the country illegally?

Probably won't get a straight answer.

M-Bob

There is no contradiction at all in:

1. Correctly identifying fear-mongering about immigration;

2. Supporting enforcement of legal immigration.

However, it obviously suits the narrative of the red ball cap crowd to suggest otherwise.

 

[tulc]

Would you like to let them all in so as to stay permanently? Even though most do not qualify under the set laws?

...which laws, specifically, are you talking about? I know it's a chore having to find actual facts about the laws. So much easier to say "THEY DON'T MEET THE LAW REQUIREMENTS!!" at which point the echo chamber kicks in with "yep that's right! they don't!!" but when someone asks "which of the laws requirements don't they meet?" you usually just get a blank stare. So, I'm hoping M-bob can list which laws he feels are not being met. While he's doing that let's look at this article and see how the law works in some peoples lives:
The Bogus Reasons ICE Uses to Lock Up Asylum Seekers

But let’s look at some of the government’s so-called “determinations.”

Take Mr. Abelardo Asensio Callol, who came to the U.S. fleeing persecution by the Cuban government. ICE denied his parole request because he allegedly had not shown an “ongoing relationship” with the person he would live with outside of detention while he awaits a decision in his asylum case.

The catch? Mr. Callol’s sponsor was his own mother, a green card holder. If Mr. Callol’s parents can’t vouch for him, who can?

What about H.A.Y.? She came to this country with her husband after they received death threats from an armed wing of a criminal cartel in Mexico. The government’s reason for denying her release is that she is a “recent entrant.” Literally everyone who comes to the U.S. border seeking asylum is, by definition, a “recent entrant.”

And then there’s Mr. Ansly Damus, the lead plaintiff of the lawsuit, who has been locked up for more than a year and a half — and counting. An ethics teacher from Grande-Rivière-du-Nord, Haiti, Mr. Damus criticized a local official for corruption in one of his seminars. Afterwards, an armed gang who supports that official brutally attacked him before setting his motorcycle on fire and threatening to kill him. Mr. Damus fled to the United States, where he presented himself to immigration authorities and applied for asylum. A judge granted him asylum — not once, but twice. He has not committed any crimes and has shown ICE that he had a safe place to live after he was released.

ICE’s reason for denying him parole was that he didn’t have “sufficient ties” to the United States. For one thing, that’s not even true – Mr. Damus showed that he had a friend with lawful status whom he could live with, as well as letters of support from other community members.

Second, every asylum seeker who comes to the border, again, by definition does not have “ties” to this country. And if they’re never released from detention, they will never get the chance to build those “ties.”

How's it going with those laws M-Bob?

What do we have now three Caravans heading this way? It truly is getting hard to keep count?
M-Bob

Wow...Republican fears for 2020 must be growing by leaps and bounds. They're so worried their base is going to figure out the government shut down is a wholly Republican stunt so they want to keep everyone of their base quivering in fear about "THE CARAVANS OF EVIL!!!" (tm).
tulc(guesses they really REALLY hate/fear all the new House members)

 

[Foxfyre]

what kind of a question is that, people from the Middle East would most likely fly here. You can get here by foot but from what I've heard the journey is treacherous.

While rumors that ISIS is crossing the U.S. southern border have all been rated unconfirmed and/or blatantly false, even the leftwing media acknowledges that some of the illegal migrants are from countries other than Mexico, Central and South America, including some from the Middle East.
Is ISIS crossing the U.S.-Mexico border?

I used Politifact who, being a left leaning organization, almost certainly is downplaying the information. But the fact that they acknowledge that illegal migrants are coming from many places other than North or South America is pretty good evidence that it is happening.

 

[Servant of Yeshua]

Tell your friend that there is no need to hire an immigration attorney to petition for her husband to come to the US. All the forms and instructions can be found online. If your friend can show she has lived in Nigeria for six months, she can petition her husband by Direct Counselor Filing. This process is much faster than going through the process of using an immigration attorney and/or filing in the US. It takes less than six months to go through the whole process on average. As for proving she can support him, she only needs to have an annual income of around $20,575. If her income is not sufficient, she can have a relative or friend file as a joint sponsor by filling out an affidavit of support.

THank you for this info. I am going to share it with her. She is so miserable there. THanks!

 

[redleghunter]

Are illegal immigrants more, the same, or less dangerous than native born American citizens is a good question, and some meaningful facts are available that are very suggestive. Here's what I found --

Wouldn’t it be ZERO percent if they did not enter illegally?

Crime by citizens and legal residents is expected as they are supposed to be here.

Crime from people who should not be here should not be expected.

The logic defeats the statistical data.

 

[Queller]

A vast right wing conspiracy of Ranchers buying prayer rugs and placing them in rancher lands and cabins?

Nope a relatively small group of people CLAIMING that they found prayer rugs yet providing NO EVIDENCE of said rugs.

 

[redleghunter]

Nope a relatively small group of people CLAIMING that they found prayer rugs yet providing NO EVIDENCE of said rugs.

The no evidence thing. Lot of that going around.

 

[Queller]

The no evidence thing. Lot of that going around.

Shouldn't the onus to provide be on the ones claiming to have seen these prayer rugs rather than on those who don't believe them?

 

[ViaCrucis]

I found a prayer rug on my fence the other day. It looked a lot like a zip-up hoodie that a teen probably just threw on the fence, but pretty sure it's actually a prayer rug. We need to wall up that Canadian border, because there are some very dangerous hombres bringing their caravan prayer rugs south of the border here into the Pacific Northwest. Just look at these dangerous people:

-CryptoLutheran

 

[The Barbarian]

I know of a guy who keeps finding bigfoot traces in a nearby national forest. He's presented the same sort of evidence that rancher presented.

For the same reasons, I expect.

 

[Halbhh]

Wouldn’t it be ZERO percent if they did not enter illegally?

Crime by citizens and legal residents is expected as they are supposed to be here.

Crime from people who should not be here should not be expected.

The logic defeats the statistical data.

That's logical, but not safe for you or me, since we are not perfect ourselves: Matthew 7:2 For with the same judgment you pronounce, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

We ourselves cannot meet a standard of perfection (never broke any little law ever, not even little speeding ticket, etc.), so we cannot require it of other people, lest perfection be required of us on the Day that actually matters (because we required it of others), after this life.

Or at least I won't risk (an none should) losing an infinite value (eternal life) for a very small gain today of whatever temporary value here, such as not having a higher number of immigrants as neighbors, with a slight risk one of them might steal or such (even though apparently few of them do).