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democrats complained about it like it was the end of all things important to stop travel from China as if COVID was really that big a deal as compared to Jan/Feb impeachment items.
I don't understood why you keep saying this, because frankly, I don't think it's making what ever point you're trying to make.I believe that too - and I also believe quite a number of them were Democrats - not just Republicans. So the idea that they all were loyal to Trump and got some marching orders from Trump wrong... does not make sense to me. (snip)
That was said early to reserve masks for health care workers.That explains why Faucci said no masks needed?
Trump didn't ban travel from China, ... only travel by Chinese nationals. The virus made its way into the country by way of American travelers coming home, ... and from travelers from Europe.And explains why Biden said it was wrong to ban travel from China?
That sounds completely in line with Trump's ongoing policy. For what it's worth, Pelosi changed her position early on in the crisis. Unfortunately, Trump never did ...And explains why Pelosi wanted everyone to join her without a mask and no social distancing... in Chinatown?
Trump didn't ban travel from China, ... only travel by Chinese nationals. .
tulc said: ↑
What I believe is there's over 500,000 people who've died of Coronavirus
I believe that too - and I also believe quite a number of them were Democrats - not just Republicans. So the idea that they all were loyal to Trump and got some marching orders from Trump wrong... does not make sense to me.
.
I don't understood why you keep saying this,
because frankly, I don't think it's making what ever point you're trying to make.
" now one of the country's leading experts on the illness, Dr. Anthony Fauci, says the president's travel restriction likely prevented a humanitarian crisis in the United States on the scale of the one that Italy is facing."
================quote
Dr. Fauci responds to question about differences between U.S. and Italy, says
stopping travel very early from China has gone a long way " in the fight against coronavirus "Unfortunately, Italy did not do that. They had an open border."
"
No, it really isn't. No, what I believe is you seem to think you made a good point when you say that and you're actually not.That's the only way to blame the President for all 500K deaths like you just did - claiming it is because those people were devotees of Trump.
What I believe is he waited is he had to be dragged kicking and screaming into doing any of the above long after the science had said it needed to be done. And pretty much long after the horse had already left the stable.You really think they all believed that his shutting down the economy, shutting down travel, placing industry on war-time-footing re-tool to fight the virus - was just an odd way of saying "the whole COVID virus thing is a hoax - don't take any precautions it is harmless" as if he were biologist in chief ?? even the democrats???
I am ok with you not getting that point aboveuhmmm...I understand the point you think you're making with that claim, the problem is it really isn't making it.
thank you, I appreciate that.- you are free to ignore any details you like -
And you as well.you have free will.
tulc(has to get up early tomorrow and roast more coffee)
No, it really isn't. No, what I believe is you seem to think you made a good point when you say that and you're actually not.
What I believe is he waited is he had to be dragged kicking and screaming into doing any of the above long after the science had said it needed to be done. And pretty much long after the horse had already left the stable.
Not to mention the continual pressure applied to governors that did conduct shutdowns, to open up.
Trump Encourages Protest Against Governors Who Have Imposed Virus Restrictions
Then when the state of Florida opened up Disney, there was an abrupt spike in covid deaths amounting to some 10,000 fatalities. But Donald Trump didn't seem to have a problem with that.
You missed this ... from January 27, 2020 ...Since this is a thread about Biden's history of handling pandemics --
======================== quote
from; Correcting MSM and Team Biden's CoronaVirus Lies-Two Feb. 2020 Weeks In COVID History - The Lid
- February 1 – Biden tweets about the CoronaVirus, accusing President Trump of ignoring the science, and acting based on “hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering.”
- February 1 – Speaking at a campaign town hall in Iowa, Biden brought up the CoronaVirus and says, “we don’t know exactly where it’s going to go yet.” He again implicitly criticized President Trump’s restrictions on travel from China by saying, “Disease has no borders.”
- February 4: President Trump vowed in his State of the Union Address to “take all necessary steps” to protect Americans from the CoronaVirus–Nancy Pelosi must have hated that promise because she ripped up her copy.
- February 5: The end of the first annual Democratic Party Impeachment hoax. The Senate votes to acquit President Trump.
- February 6: Biden Public Health Advisory Committee member Dr. Irwin Redlener said, “Yes, there is uncertainty, and the headlines are dramatic. But right now, the chances of any of us or anyone we know ever getting a severe, potentially lethal form of the Wuhan virus is negligible.”
- February 7: Biden Public Health Advisory Committee member Lisa Monaco wrote, “The good news thus far is that the CoronaVirus appears to be less lethal than its viral cousin SARS was in 2002 and far less lethal than Ebola was in 2014.”
- February 7:President Trump tells Bob Woodward, This is Dangerous Stuff.” And the President’ was focusing on the virus. Trump told Woodward that the night before, he’d spoken to Chinese President Xi Jinping about the virus. Woodward quotes Trump as saying, “We’ve got a little bit of an interesting setback with the virus going in China.” “It goes through the air,” Trump said. “That’s always tougher than the touch. You don’t have to touch things. Right? But the air, you just breathe the air, and that’s how it’s passed. And so that’s a very tricky one. That’s a very delicate one. It’s also more deadly than even your strenuous flus.”
- February 11: The Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) announces an expanded partnership with Janssen Research & Development to “expedite the development” of a CoronaVirus vaccine.
- February 11 – Top Biden advisor, now WH Cheif of Staff, Ron Klain said, “A serious epidemic – now, the CoronaVirus may be that, it may not be that. The evidence suggests it’s probably not that.”
- February 11 – Top Biden advisor Ron Klain spoke about the Trump team’s reaction to the virus saying, “Obviously the administration can’t do nothing. Indeed, they are far from doing nothing.”
- February 13 – Top Biden advisor Ron Klain said, “We don’t have a COVID-19 epidemic in the U.S., but we are starting to see a fear epidemic. Kudos to [Mayor Bill de Blasio] (and others) for standing against that.” He was encouraging people to go shopping or out to eat in Chinatown.
That is a good point to use as comparison.
Although actual scientists said - " Dr. Anthony Fauci, says the president's travel restriction likely prevented a humanitarian crisis in the United States on the scale of the one that Italy is facing." Biden was merely complaining that the President took that initiative.. wow that shows "leadership"!!
==========================
While the actual president at the time did this --
- shut down the travel from China ,
- tell Americans to shelter in place,
- temporarily shut down the economy to just essential workers,
- put industry on war-time footing so it would re-tool for PPE production
- and make massive advancements in vaccine technology
- Create new therapeutics like the poly-clonal antibodies etc
- Follow guidelines for zinc, vitamin D etc.
Biden's undeniable record showed this:
===============================
Biden has fought a pandemic before. It did not go smoothly.
“It is purely a fortuity that this isn’t one of the great mass casualty events in American history,” Ron Klain, who was Biden’s chief of staff at the time, said of H1N1 in 2019. “It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. If anyone thinks that this can’t happen again, they don’t have to go back to 1918, they just have to go back to 2009, 2010 and imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
CDC estimated that 151,700-575,400 people worldwide died from (H1N1)pdm09 virus infection during the first year the virus circulated
Klain said “we did everything possible – wrong” – 60 million Americans contracted H1N1 in that period of time.
2009 H1N1 Swine Flu Pandemic: We Did Every Possible Thing Wrong
============ transcript and discussion
Levin: 60 Million Americans Got Swine Flu, Obama and Biden Stopped Testing
Ron Klain: I just have a couple things, I was in the White House in 2009-2010. I was working for Vice President Biden, I wasn’t involved directly in the H1N1 response, but I lived through it as a White House staffer. And what I will say about it is -- a bunch of really talented, really good people working on it and we did every possible thing wrong and 60 million Americans got H1N1 in that period of time.
Klain: “And it's just purely a fortuity that this isn't one of the great mass casualty events in American history. It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. And so if anyone thinks that this can't happen again, they don't have to go back to 1918. They just have to go back to 2009, 2010. Imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
“In late July,” so I repeat, “in late July 2009, the CDC abruptly advised states to stop testing for the H1N1 flu and stop counting individual cases.”
That was Sharyl Attkisson for CBS News, reported in 2009.
“The rationale given for the CDC guidance to forego testing and tracking individual cases was 'why waste resources testing for the swine flu when the government has already confirmed that there is an epidemic?'” Sharyl Attkinson reported, ”some public health officials privately disagreed with the decision to stop testing and counting, telling CBS that continued tracking of this new and possibly changing virus was important because H1N1 has a different epidemiology, affects younger people more than seasonal flu, and has been shown to have a higher case fatality rate than other flu virus strains.”
But Obama, Biden said no more testing, therefore no more reporting on the consequences
=====================
No wonder then Biden considers that such a comparison shows him to be the better leader. And no wonder a few people respond with skepticism on that point.
irrefutable.
Got a link for that? Because my impression was more along these lines:That is a good point to use as comparison.
Although actual scientists said - " Dr. Anthony Fauci, says the president's travel restriction likely prevented a humanitarian crisis in the United States on the scale of the one that Italy (snip)
tulc(will be interested in seeing that link)The US "could have saved lives" if it had introduced measures to stop Covid-19 earlier, a top health official says.
"If we had, right from the beginning, shut everything down, it may have been a little bit different," Dr Anthony Fauci told CNN, but added that making that decision had been complicated.
Is this the Dr. Irwin Redlener that is referred to here :From Columbia University studies:
“130,000 – 210,000 AVOIDABLE COVID-19 DEATHS – AND COUNTING – IN THE U.S.”By Irwin Redlener, MD; Jeffrey D. Sachs, PhD; Sean Hansen, MPA; Nathaniel Hupert, MD, MPHOctober 21, 2020
Why are U.S. deaths disproportionately high?Understanding why the COVID-19 mortality rate is significantly higher in the U.S. than nearly all high-income allies is challenging, primarily because it is a confluence of factors, stemming from delayed responses, to missed opportunities, to inadequate guidance, coordination, and leadership. Each action – or inaction – had a substantial role in distinguishing the U.S. response from the nations discussed above.Insufficient testing capacity.
https://ncdp.columbia.edu/custom-content/uploads/2020/10/Avoidable-COVID-19-Deaths-US-NCDP.pdf
There is room to criticize Trump in his handling of the virus. It seems like a lot of left wing oppositional rhetoric to me done by a bunch of Monday morning quarterbacks; but this guy was responsible for assuring that New York City had adequate disease preparedness.
President Biden's undeniable record:
===============================
Some folks apparently do not like the fact that Biden lets immigrants in without being tested for COVID:
Tucker Carlson: Under Biden, you need a negative COVID test to enter US -- unless you're an illegal alien
Well one explanation might be -- "because that is exactly how he handled SWINE Flu"
Biden has fought a pandemic before. It did not go smoothly.
“It is purely a fortuity that this isn’t one of the great mass casualty events in American history,” Ron Klain, who was Biden’s chief of staff at the time, said of H1N1 in 2019. “It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. If anyone thinks that this can’t happen again, they don’t have to go back to 1918, they just have to go back to 2009, 2010 and imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
CDC estimated that 151,700-575,400 people worldwide died from (H1N1)pdm09 virus infection during the first year the virus circulated
Klain said “we did everything possible – wrong” – 60 million Americans contracted H1N1 in that period of time.
2009 H1N1 Swine Flu Pandemic: We Did Every Possible Thing Wrong
============ transcript and discussion
Levin: 60 Million Americans Got Swine Flu, Obama and Biden Stopped Testing
Ron Klain: I just have a couple things, I was in the White House in 2009-2010. I was working for Vice President Biden, I wasn’t involved directly in the H1N1 response, but I lived through it as a White House staffer. And what I will say about it is -- a bunch of really talented, really good people working on it and we did every possible thing wrong and 60 million Americans got H1N1 in that period of time.
Klain: “And it's just purely a fortuity that this isn't one of the great mass casualty events in American history. It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. And so if anyone thinks that this can't happen again, they don't have to go back to 1918. They just have to go back to 2009, 2010. Imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
So Biden says in effect "see!! I know what I am doing -- let me take the wheel"... after Trump worked with industry to get vaccines out in absolute world-record-time as well as shutting down the country to a great extent to protect against the pandemic. Hint "I don't remember wearing masks during the Obama Biden Admin"
... more from that link above..
“In late July,” so I repeat, “in late July, the CDC abruptly advised states to stop testing for the H1N1 flu and stop counting individual cases.”
That was Sharyl Attkisson for CBS News, reported in 2009.
“The rationale given for the CDC guidance to forego testing and tracking individual cases was 'why waste resources testing for the swine flu when the government has already confirmed that there is an epidemic?'” Sharyl Attkinson reported, ”some public health officials privately disagreed with the decision to stop testing and counting, telling CBS that continued tracking of this new and possibly changing virus was important because H1N1 has a different epidemiology, affects younger people more than seasonal flu, and has been shown to have a higher case fatality rate than other flu virus strains.”
But Obama, Biden said no more testing, therefore no more reporting on the consequences
=============================
By contrast President Trump's 2020 plan included
- shut down the travel from China ,
- tell Americans to shelter in place,
- temporarily shut down the economy to just essential workers,
- put industry on war-time footing so it would re-tool for PPE production
- and make massive advancements in vaccine technology
- Create new therapeutics like the polyclonal antibodies etc
- Follow guidelines for zinc, vitamin D etc.
February 7:President Trump tells Bob Woodward, This is Dangerous Stuff.” And the President’ was focusing on the virus. Trump told Woodward that the night before, he’d spoken to Chinese President Xi Jinping about the virus. Woodward quotes Trump as saying, “We’ve got a little bit of an interesting setback with the virus going in China.” “It goes through the air,” Trump said. “That’s always tougher than the touch. You don’t have to touch things. Right? But the air, you just breathe the air, and that’s how it’s passed. And so that’s a very tricky one. That’s a very delicate one. It’s also more deadly than even your strenuous flus.”
================ timeline
Jan 31 - President Trump bans/restricts travel from China (democrats complain).
Feb 2 - first Covid death outside of China reported.
Feb 24 - Pelosi without a mask , and no social distancing - saying 'come to china town'
Feb 29 - first death of a US COVID patient
March 15 - CDC recommends no large gatherings. so 15 or less allowed.
March/April States issue shelter in place orders
Jan 22, 2020 - Democrats in congress stay focused on impeachment.
https: // www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-01-22/more-sparring-likely-before-house-makes-case-impeachment-update
=========================================
Feb 2020 - impeachment was too important to be bothered with COVID concerns.
"Back then, the potentially catastrophic nature of the outbreak was still not widely understood. On Jan. 24, at the urging of Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.), administration officials held a briefing for the full Senate. But the classified session was sparsely attended, two Senate aides said, because it was put together at the last minute and was held on the same day as a deadline for senators to submit their impeachment questions. Only about 14 of them showed up.
“The initial thought from the Dems, I think, is that we were trying to distract from impeachment,” a GOP Senate aide said. A White House official recalled feeling surprised at the “incredibly” poor attendance, noting that it came “even though the amount of concern expressed then was rather intense.”
From distraction to disaster: How coronavirus crept up on Washington
BobRyan said: ↑
That is a good point to use as comparison.
Although actual scientists said - " Dr. Anthony Fauci, says the president's travel restriction likely prevented a humanitarian crisis in the United States on the scale of the one that Italy is facing." Biden was merely complaining that the President took that initiative.. wow that shows "leadership"!!
==========================
While the actual president at the time did this --
- shut down the travel from China ,
- tell Americans to shelter in place,
- temporarily shut down the economy to just essential workers,
- put industry on war-time footing so it would re-tool for PPE production
- and make massive advancements in vaccine technology
- Create new therapeutics like the poly-clonal antibodies etc
- Follow guidelines for zinc, vitamin D etc.
Biden's undeniable record showed this:
===============================
Biden has fought a pandemic before. It did not go smoothly.
“It is purely a fortuity that this isn’t one of the great mass casualty events in American history,” Ron Klain, who was Biden’s chief of staff at the time, said of H1N1 in 2019. “It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. If anyone thinks that this can’t happen again, they don’t have to go back to 1918, they just have to go back to 2009, 2010 and imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
CDC estimated that 151,700-575,400 people worldwide died from (H1N1)pdm09 virus infection during the first year the virus circulated
Klain said “we did everything possible – wrong” – 60 million Americans contracted H1N1 in that period of time.
2009 H1N1 Swine Flu Pandemic: We Did Every Possible Thing Wrong
============ transcript and discussion
Levin: 60 Million Americans Got Swine Flu, Obama and Biden Stopped Testing
Ron Klain: I just have a couple things, I was in the White House in 2009-2010. I was working for Vice President Biden, I wasn’t involved directly in the H1N1 response, but I lived through it as a White House staffer. And what I will say about it is -- a bunch of really talented, really good people working on it and we did every possible thing wrong and 60 million Americans got H1N1 in that period of time.
Klain: “And it's just purely a fortuity that this isn't one of the great mass casualty events in American history. It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. And so if anyone thinks that this can't happen again, they don't have to go back to 1918. They just have to go back to 2009, 2010. Imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
“In late July,” so I repeat, “in late July 2009, the CDC abruptly advised states to stop testing for the H1N1 flu and stop counting individual cases.”
That was Sharyl Attkisson for CBS News, reported in 2009.
“The rationale given for the CDC guidance to forego testing and tracking individual cases was 'why waste resources testing for the swine flu when the government has already confirmed that there is an epidemic?'” Sharyl Attkinson reported, ”some public health officials privately disagreed with the decision to stop testing and counting, telling CBS that continued tracking of this new and possibly changing virus was important because H1N1 has a different epidemiology, affects younger people more than seasonal flu, and has been shown to have a higher case fatality rate than other flu virus strains.”
But Obama, Biden said no more testing, therefore no more reporting on the consequences
=====================
No wonder then Biden considers that such a comparison shows him to be the better leader. And no wonder a few people respond with skepticism on that point.
irrefutable.
Looks like more deflection. Trying to downplay Donald Trump's failures by pointing at other people.
BobRyan said: ↑
President Biden's undeniable record:
===============================
Some folks apparently do not like the fact that Biden lets immigrants in without being tested for COVID:
Tucker Carlson: Under Biden, you need a negative COVID test to enter US -- unless you're an illegal alien
Well one explanation might be -- "because that is exactly how he handled SWINE Flu"
Biden has fought a pandemic before. It did not go smoothly.
“It is purely a fortuity that this isn’t one of the great mass casualty events in American history,” Ron Klain, who was Biden’s chief of staff at the time, said of H1N1 in 2019. “It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. If anyone thinks that this can’t happen again, they don’t have to go back to 1918, they just have to go back to 2009, 2010 and imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
CDC estimated that 151,700-575,400 people worldwide died from (H1N1)pdm09 virus infection during the first year the virus circulated
Klain said “we did everything possible – wrong” – 60 million Americans contracted H1N1 in that period of time.
2009 H1N1 Swine Flu Pandemic: We Did Every Possible Thing Wrong
============ transcript and discussion
Levin: 60 Million Americans Got Swine Flu, Obama and Biden Stopped Testing
Ron Klain: I just have a couple things, I was in the White House in 2009-2010. I was working for Vice President Biden, I wasn’t involved directly in the H1N1 response, but I lived through it as a White House staffer. And what I will say about it is -- a bunch of really talented, really good people working on it and we did every possible thing wrong and 60 million Americans got H1N1 in that period of time.
Klain: “And it's just purely a fortuity that this isn't one of the great mass casualty events in American history. It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck. And so if anyone thinks that this can't happen again, they don't have to go back to 1918. They just have to go back to 2009, 2010. Imagine a virus with a different lethality, and you can just do the math on that.”
So Biden says in effect "see!! I know what I am doing -- let me take the wheel"... after Trump worked with industry to get vaccines out in absolute world-record-time as well as shutting down the country to a great extent to protect against the pandemic. Hint "I don't remember wearing masks during the Obama Biden Admin"
... more from that link above..
“In late July,” so I repeat, “in late July, the CDC abruptly advised states to stop testing for the H1N1 flu and stop counting individual cases.”
That was Sharyl Attkisson for CBS News, reported in 2009.
“The rationale given for the CDC guidance to forego testing and tracking individual cases was 'why waste resources testing for the swine flu when the government has already confirmed that there is an epidemic?'” Sharyl Attkinson reported, ”some public health officials privately disagreed with the decision to stop testing and counting, telling CBS that continued tracking of this new and possibly changing virus was important because H1N1 has a different epidemiology, affects younger people more than seasonal flu, and has been shown to have a higher case fatality rate than other flu virus strains.”
But Obama, Biden said no more testing, therefore no more reporting on the consequences
=============================
By contrast President Trump's 2020 plan included
- shut down the travel from China ,
- tell Americans to shelter in place,
- temporarily shut down the economy to just essential workers,
- put industry on war-time footing so it would re-tool for PPE production
- and make massive advancements in vaccine technology
- Create new therapeutics like the polyclonal antibodies etc
- Follow guidelines for zinc, vitamin D etc.
February 7:President Trump tells Bob Woodward, This is Dangerous Stuff.” And the President’ was focusing on the virus. Trump told Woodward that the night before, he’d spoken to Chinese President Xi Jinping about the virus. Woodward quotes Trump as saying, “We’ve got a little bit of an interesting setback with the virus going in China.” “It goes through the air,” Trump said. “That’s always tougher than the touch. You don’t have to touch things. Right? But the air, you just breathe the air, and that’s how it’s passed. And so that’s a very tricky one. That’s a very delicate one. It’s also more deadly than even your strenuous flus.”
================ timeline
Jan 31 - President Trump bans/restricts travel from China (democrats complain).
Feb 2 - first Covid death outside of China reported.
Feb 24 - Pelosi without a mask , and no social distancing - saying 'come to china town'
Feb 29 - first death of a US COVID patient
March 15 - CDC recommends no large gatherings. so 15 or less allowed.
March/April States issue shelter in place orders
Jan 22, 2020 - Democrats in congress stay focused on impeachment.
https: // www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-01-22/more-sparring-likely-before-house-makes-case-impeachment-update
=========================================
Feb 2020 - impeachment was too important to be bothered with COVID concerns.
"Back then, the potentially catastrophic nature of the outbreak was still not widely understood. On Jan. 24, at the urging of Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.), administration officials held a briefing for the full Senate. But the classified session was sparsely attended, two Senate aides said, because it was put together at the last minute and was held on the same day as a deadline for senators to submit their impeachment questions. Only about 14 of them showed up.
“The initial thought from the Dems, I think, is that we were trying to distract from impeachment,” a GOP Senate aide said. A White House official recalled feeling surprised at the “incredibly” poor attendance, noting that it came “even though the amount of concern expressed then was rather intense.”
From distraction to disaster: How coronavirus crept up on Washington
Fox's lawyers: The "'general tenor' of the show should then inform a viewer that [Carlson] is not 'stating actual facts' about the topics he discusses and is instead engaging in 'exaggeration' and 'non-literal commentary.' "
You Literally Can't Believe The Facts Tucker Carlson Tells You. So Say Fox's Lawyers
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