BEWARE OF UNIVERSAL RECONCILIATION

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zoidar

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Dear Zoidar: Over 62 years ago our glorious Father touched my life for the first time. As the years have fast progressed, His breast has been One I have leaned on in every trial and tribulation. You may have not found the same Father yet, but you shall. If people get what they deserve, FineLinen stands in abject poverty!

The entire idea of One who can ultimately bring every last rotten sinner home to Himself is just obnoxious. We good guys who have made excellent choices & worked so tirelessly on His behalf & paid terrible costs to be His disciple will not stand for such folly.

NOT by any works we have done but according to His mercy

My friend Finelinen,

I was born again in June of 2010. I got to know Christ. If we don't know Christ, we don't know the Father. It's not about if our ideas sound good or not, it's about what is truth. We are allowed to believe whatever we want, but truth is still truth, and what we believe won't change that.
 
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FineLinen

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My friend Finelinen,

I was born again in June of 2010. I got to know Christ. It's not about if our ideas sound good or not, it's about what is truth. We are allowed to believe whatever we want, but truth is still truth, and what we believe won't change that.

My brother: coming to know Him is in progressive stages of the present tense. Just when one thinks he or she has finally nailed down His movements, additional stars of His vast heavens cascades into more and more and more.

May His exceedingly vast and glorious love that you began to experience in 6/2010 reach degrees you cannot imagine yet. And yes, my friend, I am praying for you in your journey into the outer laminar spheres of where He dwells.
 
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BEWARE OF UNIVERSAL RECONCILIATION
As Christians who preach Christ crucified we can be assured that the wisdom found in the gospel of our salvation is not from man but from God. And through this wisdom we know that "IN CHRIST" is our DEFENSE! IN CHRIST is our hope, IN CHRIST is our redemption, IN CHRIST is our forgiveness, sanctification, deliverance, freedom, life, love, joy, peace, etc… Because IN CHRIST is OUR SALVATION FROM SIN!! There is no salvation from sin apart from IN CHRIST! The very reason the enemy is always striving to remove sin from the salvation message. A false spirit surely knows that if they leave out the word 'sin' enough people will start believing that “salvation” means something other than "salvation from sin". Is there really any other salvation but salvation from sin? Is it not SIN that separates us from God? Is it not sin that brings God’s wrath? Is it not sin that brings condemnation, judgement, and death? So if sin is the problem and Christ is the cure, than JESUS is our ONLY VICTORY OVER SIN!!

And the only way to be IN CHRIST is to DIE TO THE LAW THROUGH THE BODY OF CHRIST!! The law brings wrath, but where there is no LAW there is no transgression, and Christ is the END OF THE LAW!! A person must first DIE WITH CHRIST to be married to another, and that is only by FAITH in the one who died for our sins! Our old man (body ruled by sin) had to die. A person is only made righteous and Holy in the Father’s eyes AFTER they have been reconciled IN THE BODY OF HIS FLESH THROUGH DEATH!!

Colossians 1:21-22
And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled *in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight

So to all those who embrace UR (Universal Reconciliation) and all their no sin doctrines, including the teaching that a person who rejects Christ to the end only dies in their “one sin of unbelief” PLEASE! Show me the scriptures! And I’ll show you the scriptures that prove that those who reject Christ are still under GOD’S WRATH and the condemnation of sin, and if they die without HIM they will surely DIE IN THEIR SINS!! Not just in the one sin of unbelief. A teaching that many have embraced in these last days. A teaching that contradicts the only place where there is no sin... IN CHRIST! There is no “sin free realm” outside of Christ or apart from Christ in ANY WAY! Our old man was never fit to polished, overhauled, or freed from sin. He was only fit to be crucified with Christ! Therefore, if a person rejects Jesus Christ, than they have never crossed over from DEATH to LIFE!

1 John 3:5
And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and IN HIM there is no sin.
What was He manifested to do if not take away our sins? Is there something hidden in this verse? NO! Jesus is salvation from sin! No Jesus, No salvation from sin!

They embrace this UR teaching because they have strayed from the simplicity that is IN CHRIST. Explain to me where this “sin free zone” is outside of Christ? Tell me how these people who reject Christ are translated into the Kingdom of His Son without dying with Christ and being washed from their sins in His blood? How do they enter the Holiest without going through a veil that was torn, HIS FLESH? How are all these people who reject Christ freed from sin without dying to the law? Everyone ever born in this world, apart from Christ, was born a sinner, and there is no way to be BORN AGAIN unless they first DIE IN THE BODY OF HIS FLESH THROUGH DEATH. If we accept that Jesus is the resurrection and the life, we must also accept that HE AS THE SACRIFICE!

And yes, I am aware of the rebuttals of those who take things from IN CHRIST. You preach “you have no sin”, and you preach “limited atonement’ NO, I preach that if we walk in our standing before God (His Grace) we will not be ruled by sin! We still have this corrupted sinful hull that encapsulates us until the day of redemption, but this is NOT OUR STANDING BEFORE GOD!! We are WASHED, REDEEMED, SANCTIFIED, JUSTIFIED, and made ALIVE through JESUS CHRIST AND HIM CRUCIFIED!! The more we see the value of His blood, and how the Father sees us through the precious blood of His dear Son, the more we will SHOUT THE PRAISES OF OUR KING! As far as the accusations of “limited atonement”? What are my accusers preaching if not “limited Christ”? Is it not Christ who is the ATONEMENT FOR ALL SIN, and that is why redemption through His blood is only IN CHRIST! But if we accept the teachings that remove things from IN CHRIST, than we have already SHIPWRECKED OUR FAITH!!

JESUS CHRIST is our ONLY SALVATION FROM SIN, because HE IS REDEMPTION (the act of being saved from sin) And ONLY IN HM do we have redemption through His blood THE FORGIVENESS OF SINS. There is no “sin free zone” apart from our position IN CHRIST. Because only IN HIM has the OLD PASSED AWAY and ALL THINGS BECOME NEW!!

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore, if anyone is IN CHRIST, he is a new creation; OLD THINGS have passed away; behold, all things have become new.

Galatians 6:15
For IN CHRIST JESUS neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but a NEW CREATION.*

If we defend IN CHRIST than we defend all that is IN HIM, if we stray from IN CHRIST than we SET ASIDE THE GRACE that has been poured out for us through HIS BODY AND BLOOD!! But we are not of those who take things from IN CHRIST and hand them to the flesh! ABSOLUTELY NOT!! We are the REDEEMED OF THE LORD, WASHED IN THE PRECIOUS BLOOD OF THE LAMB!! A PEOPLE OF GOD’S OWN POSSESSION, A HOLY NATION, A ROYAL PRIESTHOOD who still carry around with us that OLD TREE, and who still preach that simple old old love story to a lonely heart in need of RESCUE! That PRECIOUS STORY of an UNCONDITIONAL LOVE AND MERCY demonstrated by a KING WHO TOOK IT ALL AND GAVE IT ALL on a LONELY HILL CALLED CALVARY!!

Grace and Peace…

Beware of strawman arguments.

Yahushua means 'God's Salvation'. God's salvation is the alpha and omega. Salvation is how the age ends. Not damnation, not annihilation, but salvation.

The gospel is good news for all mankind. Damnation and annihilation are not good news. Salvation is good news.

So let's bring it together shall we?

Good news: Jesus saves all mankind.

Ah, the total victory of Christ. The most beautiful truth.
 
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Skidder

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Beware of strawman arguments.

Yahushua means 'God's Salvation'. God's salvation is the alpha and omega. Salvation is how the age ends. Not damnation, not annihilation, but salvation.

The gospel is good news for all mankind. Damnation and annihilation are not good news. Salvation is good news.

So let's bring it together shall we?

Good news: Jesus saves all mankind.

Ah, the total victory of Christ. The most beautiful truth.
"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved". Saved from what? Is it not sin that separates us from God? Is it not sin that brings God's wrath? Is it not sin that brings condemnation, judgement, and death? So if sin is the PROBLEM... CHRIST IS THE CURE! And without FAITH IN CHRIST they will SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS and remain under the WRATH OF GOD!

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
 
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Lazarus Short

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"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved". Saved from what? Is it not sin that separates us from God? Is it not sin that brings God's wrath? Is it not sin that brings condemnation, judgement, and death? So if sin is the PROBLEM... CHRIST IS THE CURE! And without FAITH IN CHRIST they will SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS and remain under the WRATH OF GOD!

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Saved from what - you need ask? From sin, our sin nature, from death. Death is annihilation, so why would God revive the wicked only to annihilate them again? It makes no sense. Sure enough, I found little, very little, evidence in the Scriptures which could be used to support annihilation. For that matter, why would God revive the annihilated wicked just to do them worse in Hell?

God already has told us that His ways are higher than our ways, and His thoughts higher than our thoughts. If we look at the Law He gave to Moses, we see that the punishments for violations of that Law fit the crimes. The very worst punishment is be put to death, and there is never a hint of any punishment beyond that.

So, does God follow His Own Law? I found that Hell is unmentioned in His Law. It is absent from the Creation account. John 1:3 states that if God did make a thing, then no one else did. That is the foundation of my rejection of Hell as a myth. Oh, btw, Hell is also absent from the Hebrew and Greek originals - the word comes from another source. If you remove the word, the concept is gone too: poof.

Poof, how? The Scriptures speak of Jesus the Christ doing away with "all rule and all authority and power." There's that pesky "all" again. Does Jesus also do in Hell, even if it existed? First Corinthians 15 goes on: "The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." Don't you need to be dead to go to Hell? Yes, that is the understanding, so by simple logic, if death is destroyed, then no one, NO ONE, can still be dead and/or in Hell. Hell advocates cannot seem to grasp this simple point.

Back to First Corinthians 15:22 - "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." NOT: All who are in Christ shall be made alive. It's a simple difference in wording, but a vast difference in meaning.
 
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FineLinen

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"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved". Saved from what? Is it not sin that separates us from God? Is it not sin that brings God's wrath? Is it not sin that brings condemnation, judgement, and death? So if sin is the PROBLEM... CHRIST IS THE CURE! And without FAITH IN CHRIST they will SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS and remain under the WRATH OF GOD!

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Dear Skidder: "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved>>>

And your household."

Assuming you grasp the significance of the rest of the verse, please disclose what it means?

The vast segments of our species die in their sins, not just their sins but in the sin nature.

Adam1 = the many "made sinners">>>Last Adam = the many "made righteous"
 
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Lazarus Short

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Rebecca4Christ, I think your Biblical quote and "He left 99 to come and bring me back home!" are in conflict. The narrow way is into the sheepfold, and there you are safe. The wide way is the way of the world, but if you are there (as you said) then the Shepherd comes and gets you. He loses nothing.
 
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Skidder

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Saved from what - you need ask? From sin, our sin nature, from death. Death is annihilation, so why would God revive the wicked only to annihilate them again? It makes no sense. Sure enough, I found little, very little, evidence in the Scriptures which could be used to support annihilation. For that matter, why would God revive the annihilated wicked just to do them worse in Hell?

God already has told us that His ways are higher than our ways, and His thoughts higher than our thoughts. If we look at the Law He gave to Moses, we see that the punishments for violations of that Law fit the crimes. The very worst punishment is be put to death, and there is never a hint of any punishment beyond that.

So, does God follow His Own Law? I found that Hell is unmentioned in His Law. It is absent from the Creation account. John 1:3 states that if God did make a thing, then no one else did. That is the foundation of my rejection of Hell as a myth. Oh, btw, Hell is also absent from the Hebrew and Greek originals - the word comes from another source. If you remove the word, the concept is gone too: poof.

Poof, how? The Scriptures speak of Jesus the Christ doing away with "all rule and all authority and power." There's that pesky "all" again. Does Jesus also do in Hell, even if it existed? First Corinthians 15 goes on: "The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." Don't you need to be dead to go to Hell? Yes, that is the understanding, so by simple logic, if death is destroyed, then no one, NO ONE, can still be dead and/or in Hell. Hell advocates cannot seem to grasp this simple point.

Back to First Corinthians 15:22 - "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." NOT: All who are in Christ shall be made alive. It's a simple difference in wording, but a vast difference in meaning.
I will repeat this again, only IN CHRIST is there redemption through His blood the forgiveness of sins. Not outside of Christ in any way. You have to be IN CHRIST to have forgiveness of sins. There is not "sin free zone" outside of Christ, HE IS our all in all....

Ephesians 1:7
IN HIM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14
IN WHOM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore, if anyone is IN CHRIST, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.

If we defend IN CHRIST than we defend all that is IN HIM, if we stray from IN CHRIST than we SET ASIDE THE GRACE that has been poured out for us through his body and blood!! But we are not of those who take things from IN CHRIST and hand them to the flesh! Everyone has a choice to accept or reject the sacrifice for sins... WHO IS CHRIST! The payment is not separate from Christ, and if they REJECT the payment because their sin is more precious to them than the free gift of life, THEY WILL SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS!!

What part of UNDER GOD'S WRATH and DIE IN YOUR SINS don't you understand? Only by FAITH IN CHRIST are we IN CHRIST, and only there do we receive a FULL PARDON FOR OUR SINS through His blood.

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Ephesians 1:7
IN HIM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace
 
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FineLinen

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"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved". Saved from what? Is it not sin that separates us from God? Is it not sin that brings God's wrath? Is it not sin that brings condemnation, judgement, and death? So if sin is the PROBLEM... CHRIST IS THE CURE! And without FAITH IN CHRIST they will SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS and remain under the WRATH OF GOD!

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

The punishment of the Father of all fathers is not merely correction: it is correction that improves, changes, transforms for the better.

Our God punishes with an objective in view, not as an end in itself!

There are dual aspects to our Father’s Realm as shown in the following…

Tamiym/ 'ymt means to be consumed, destroyed, exhausted and spent, but also to be finished and made sound.

Kalal has the same meaning, linking destruction, being spent, exhausted, as well as to be finished and made sound.

Tamam, the root word of Tamiym means to be finished, complete, summed up, made whole: linked with to be consumed, exhausted, spent and destroyed.

Shalam/ ~IX, another expression of destruction, has the scope of being finished and ended, made good or whole, & being made sound, coupled with to be restored.

Shebar, rooted in Shabar, means breakout, and being brought to birth; and underlying new birth and breakout? To be crushed and broken. Again there is dual meaning in our Lord’s words of destruction and re-creation.

Chalowph

The destructive Hebrew word Chalowph is rooted in being altered, renewed, changed, and to sprout again. It should also be noted that this is not just change, but change for the better.

In the Christian story God descends to reascend. He comes down;… down to the very roots and sea-bed of the Nature He has created. But He goes down to come up again and bring the whole ruined world up with Him. -C.S. Lewis
 
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Lazarus Short

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I will repeat this again, only IN CHRIST is there redemption through His blood the forgiveness of sins. Not outside of Christ in any way. You have to be IN CHRIST to have forgiveness of sins. There is not "sin free zone" outside of Christ, HE IS our all in all....

Ephesians 1:7
IN HIM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14
IN WHOM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore, if anyone is IN CHRIST, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.

If we defend IN CHRIST than we defend all that is IN HIM, if we stray from IN CHRIST than we SET ASIDE THE GRACE that has been poured out for us through his body and blood!! But we are not of those who take things from IN CHRIST and hand them to the flesh! Everyone has a choice to accept or reject the sacrifice for sins... WHO IS CHRIST! The payment is not separate from Christ, and if they REJECT the payment because their sin is more precious to them than the free gift of life, THEY SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS!!

What part of UNDER GOD'S WRATH and DIE IN YOUR SINS don't you understand? Only by FAITH IN CHRIST are we IN CHRIST and only there do we receive a FULL PARDON FOR OUR SINS through His blood.

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Ephesians 1:7
IN HIM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Understood and understood. We are only saying that since Jesus the Christ will put all enemies under His feet, then all men must be reconciled to Him, even if eternal contempt, at some level, is involved.

I note that each side prefers different proof texts. How to get on the same page?
 
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Skidder

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The punishment of the Father of all fathers is not merely correction: it is correction that improves, changes, transforms for the better.

Our God punishes with an objective in view, not as an end in itself!

There are dual aspects to our Father’s Realm as shown in the following…

Tamiym/ 'ymt means to be consumed, destroyed, exhausted and spent, but also to be finished and made sound.

Kalal has the same meaning, linking destruction, being spent, exhausted, as well as to be finished and made sound.

Tamam, the root word of Tamiym means to be finished, complete, summed up, made whole: linked with to be consumed, exhausted, spent and destroyed.

Shalam/ ~IX, another expression of destruction, has the scope of being finished and ended, made good or whole, & being made sound, coupled with to be restored.

Shebar, rooted in Shabar, means breakout, and being brought to birth; and underlying new birth and breakout? To be crushed and broken. Again there is dual meaning in our Lord’s words of destruction and re-creation.

Chalowph

The destructive Hebrew word Chalowph is rooted in being altered, renewed, changed, and to sprout again. It should also be noted that this is not just change, but change for the better.

In the Christian story God descends to reascend. He comes down;… down to the very roots and sea-bed of the Nature He has created. But He goes down to come up again and bring the whole ruined world up with Him. -C.S. Lewis
Twisting the Old Testament does not cancel The New Testament...

I will repeat this again, only IN CHRIST is there redemption through His blood the forgiveness of sins. Not outside of Christ in any way. You have to be IN CHRIST to have forgiveness of sins. There is not "sin free zone" outside of Christ, HE IS our all in all....

Ephesians 1:7
IN HIM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14
IN WHOM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore, if anyone is IN CHRIST, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.

If we defend IN CHRIST than we defend all that is IN HIM, if we stray from IN CHRIST than we SET ASIDE THE GRACE that has been poured out for us through his body and blood!! But we are not of those who take things from IN CHRIST and hand them to the flesh! Everyone has a choice to accept or reject the sacrifice for sins... WHO IS CHRIST! The payment is not separate from Christ, and if they REJECT the payment because their sin is more precious to them than the free gift of life, THEY WILL SURELY DIE IN THEIR SINS!!

What part of UNDER GOD'S WRATH and DIE IN YOUR SINS don't you understand? Only by FAITH IN CHRIST are we IN CHRIST, and only there do we receive a FULL PARDON FOR OUR SINS through His blood.

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Ephesians 1:7
IN HIM we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace
 
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Lazarus Short

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Back to First Corinthians 15:22 - "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." NOT: All who are in Christ shall be made alive.

It's a simple difference in wording, but a vast difference in meaning.
 
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I will repeat this again, only IN CHRIST is there redemption through His blood the forgiveness of sins. Not outside of Christ in any way.

Dear Skidder: There is no redemption outside of Christ! NONE: NADA!

Do you know what it means to be in Christ? Of course you do! Laz and I do too. Now follow the bouncing ball>>>>

"IN/EN the Name of Jesus EVERY knee shall bow & tongue confess YOU ARE LORD"
 
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Dear Skidder: There is no redemption outside of Christ! NONE: NADA!

Do you know what it means to be in Christ? Of course you do! Laz and I do too. Now follow the bouncing ball>>>>

"IN/EN the Name of Jesus EVERY knee shall bow & tongue confess YOU ARE LORD"
Do you know what it means to be under GOD'S WRATH and DIE IN YOUR SINS... follow the bouncing ball... Let me help you out. Rejecting Christ brings both...

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
 
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FineLinen

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Twisting the Old Testament does not cancel The New Testament...

Dear Skidder: The Old Covenant and New Covenent are two sides of an amazing expression of our Father. There is no need to "twist" anything.

Our God expresses Himself in both Covenants, it is not an either or!

The middle Name of Jesus Christ is Lesous
 
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Lazarus Short

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Do you know what it means to be under GOD'S WRATH and DIE IN YOUR SINS... follow the bouncing ball... Let me help you out. Rejecting Christ brings both...

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

The wrath of God on them - so into the Lake of Fire they go...but even the KJV dares not ID it as Hell. Tell me, what is the LoF for? Second Death?? The KJV says, "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death." (Rev. 20:14) Yet, in Rev. 21:4, just a few verses later, we are told, "...there shall be no more death...". No death? That MUST mean that on one is still dead and/or in Hell. Please don't insult me by saying that those in Hell are excluded from the pronouncement, for that is twisting.

Tell me, could the casting of death and hell into the LoF be the death of death/grave/hades/hell? I think so.
 
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