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Bernie Sanders: Comparing My Socialism to Venezuelan Dictator’s is ‘Extremely Unfair’

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by NightHawkeye, Sep 13, 2019.

  1. NightHawkeye

    NightHawkeye Work-in-progress Supporter

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    From the "Maduro loves Bernie", files: Bernie Sanders: Comparing My Socialism to Venezuelan Dictator’s is ‘Extremely Unfair’

    Sanders was responding to a question from moderator Jorge Ramos, known for his vocal opposition to Maduro’s oppressive regime. Ramos and his five-person crew were arrested and detained for hours in Venezuela in February for asking the country’s dictator uncomfortable questions. They were then kicked out of the country and had their equipment confiscated.
    ...
    “You admit that Venezuela does not have free elections, but still, you refuse to call Nicolás Maduro a dictator,” Ramos asked. “Can you explain why? And what are the main differences between your kind of socialism and the one being imposed in Venezuela, Cuba, and Nicaragua?”

    Sanders began by saying that “anybody who does what Maduro does is a vicious tyrant,” adding that he would back an international campaign to help organize free elections in the distressed country.

    He then rejected any implication that his policies might take the United States down the same path as Venezuela, marked as it has been by economic desolation, food and medicine shortages, and general social and political chaos.

    “To equate what goes on in Venezuela to what I believe is extremely unfair,” Sanders said.
    ...
    Maduro has in the past praised the Vermont Senator ... “Bernie Sanders, our revolutionary friend, ought to win in the United States,” Maduro said during an hours-long televised broadcast in 2016
    .​
     
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  2. Speedwell

    Speedwell Well-Known Member

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    I listened to the debates last night but I didn't hear anybody advocate for the government takeover of the means of production. In fact, I remember several of the "socialist" candidates talking about improving the business climate and strengthening the manufacturing sector.
     
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  3. JohnAshton

    JohnAshton Well-Known Member

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    Capitalism is easily corrupted: look at American history.

    So is socialism.
     
  4. NightHawkeye

    NightHawkeye Work-in-progress Supporter

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    Capitalism allows for competing power structures; socialism, but one.

    It makes all the difference in outcome ... and why capitalism has consistently outperformed socialism, time after time. It's why capitalism has consistently pulled people out of poverty whereas socialism consistently puts people into poverty and misery.
     
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  5. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    Forget unfair. It's a deliberately misleading to imply social programs in the United States are somehow comparable with socialism in Venezuela.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
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  6. NightHawkeye

    NightHawkeye Work-in-progress Supporter

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    Oh please. That wasn't the question.

    Bernie Sanders is a radical, self-declared socialist. Bernie wants to pursue many policies similar to those which were pursued in Venzuela. I give Ramos credit for calling Bernie out on it.
     
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  7. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    Similar policies such as?

    And what are the main differences between your kind of socialism and the one being imposed in Venezuela, Cuba, and Nicaragua?”

    Seems to me Ramos provided Sanders an opportunity to reject the ridiculous comparison.
     
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  8. mothcorrupteth

    mothcorrupteth Old Whig Monarchist, Classically Realpolitik

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    Comparing Trump's nationalism to ethno-nationalism is extremely unfair. Boo hoo.
     
  9. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup A saved wolf among sheep. Supporter

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    I am very thankful for the Canadian healthcare system.

    That must mean I'm a leftist, socialist, communist, anti-American Antichrist who wants to take away your guns and freedom and enslave you to the state!
     
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  10. NightHawkeye

    NightHawkeye Work-in-progress Supporter

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    What was ridiculous about it?
     
  11. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    Right, soon Canada will be like Venezuela!
     
  12. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    Which policies are similar?
     
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  13. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup A saved wolf among sheep. Supporter

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    A shortage of poutine, maple syrup, and Molsen Canadian beer! Oh noes!
     
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  14. NightHawkeye

    NightHawkeye Work-in-progress Supporter

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    You're the one calling it "ridiculous". I'm attempting to understand why.
     
  15. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    Answer a question with a question? Sorry, I'm not playing.
     
  16. super animator

    super animator Dreamer

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    Bernie Sanders is a social democrat.
     
  17. Nithavela

    Nithavela confused

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  18. JohnAshton

    JohnAshton Well-Known Member

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    Night hawk, no it has not, and saying that it does is meaningless.
     
  19. JohnAshton

    JohnAshton Well-Known Member

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    If anyone dos want to use the term "socialism" as a universal opprobrium, then one must either 1) provide a definition of "socialism" that includes things like universal access to health care and free college but excludes things like universal access to roads and free high school; or 2) admit that one is against roads and high schools too and is not so much of a capitalist as an anarchist.

    If one does want to say that "socialism" is the same thing as, or inherently leads to, "communism," then one must delete the Facebook account, take three upper division philosophy courses, read a history of economics book (Robert L. Heilbroner's "The Worldly Philosophers" would be a good start), and stop trying to have adult conversations until one does have at least some minimal idea of what is socialism.
     
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  20. JohnAshton

    JohnAshton Well-Known Member

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    What really amazes me is the GOP doesn't understand that this mislabeling of socialism is what has led to a majority of our young people viewing socialism as a good thing.

    They have paved the way for actual socialists to gain ground in America.
     
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