Ben Shapiro's end of the year Devil Talk

[Ana the Ist]

In the video below, rightist conservative political pundit, BEN SHAPIRO, reviews various points in C.S. Lewis' book, The Screwtape Letters.

Shapiro offers an 18 minutes analysis and describes how he thinks Lewis predicted the shape of political and social things to come where ideology, morality and religion clash in the modern marketplace of ideas. Along the way, Shapiro offers his own political and moral essay on how he thinks Lewis' claims play out now in the modern world as many people slouch toward advocacy for sheer Materialism.

Ben Shapiro - How C.S. Lewis Predicted our Culture Today (December 30, 2022)​

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...And no, I don't want to hear any claims that this thread "belongs in a Christian section of CF." No, it belongs HERE for points in Shapiro's talk that are evident.

Wow....18+ minutes of Ben's chattery high speed monotone. You're asking a lot from the thread lol.

What were you looking for exactly?

I watched the video, but I don't see any question in the OP.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Wow....18+ minutes of Ben's chattery high speed monotone. You're asking a lot from the thread lol.

What were you looking for exactly?

I watched the video, but I don't see any question in the OP.

I figure folks have enough ingenuity to generate both their own questions and comments about it. They shouldn't need me to prompt them for everything.

At the very least, maybe those engaging Shaprio's video (or the C.S. Lewis' book) can consider it to be a Public Service Announcement of sorts ... ???

I do.

But let's not let this necessarily distract us from other, more behind the scenes ethical inquiries that we all might be working on.

 

[Neutral Observer]

In the meantime, I'm going to take a hint from C.S. Lewis where he quotes Luther and Thomas More in The Screwtape Letters:

The best way to drive out the devil,​

if he will not yield to texts of Scripture,​

is to jeer and flout him, for he cannot​

bear scorn​

--- Luther​

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The devil... the prowde spirit...​

cannot endure to be mocked.​

--- Thomas More​

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And I concur. I'm not playing patty-cake.​

From my experience the devil loves being mocked and scorned, because it shows that he's gotten your attention... what he hates is being ignored. So simply accept hardships with a little faith and a smile, knowing that these things too shall pass. Don't begrudge your misfortunes, rather embrace them, for they're not meant to test your faith, they're meant to reveal it, as much to you as to God.

Don't mock and scorn the devil, that's what he wants you to do.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Don't mock and scorn the devil, that's what he wants you to do.

How does it feel about those that would deny its existence?

 

[gaara4158]

How does it feel about those that would deny its existence?

Triumphant, I would imagine. “The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn’t exist”.

 

[Neutral Observer]

How does it feel about those that would deny its existence?

I don't think it matters. I think that whenever you bemoan the things that happen to you it doesn't matter if you blame the devil, or your neighbor, or fate, or the stars, or just bad luck. Bad things will continue to happen to you simply because you've chosen to view them as such. Stop viewing things as being bad and amazingly bad things will stop happening to you.

@2PhiloVoid, seems to think that if he mocks and scorns the devil that that'll somehow stop bad things from happening. I think that the exact opposite is true, that the more you focus on bad things the more things you'll perceive as being bad, and the more you'll blame the devil. It's a vicious cycle.

So stop viewing things as being bad, and voila, bad things will stop happening, and the devil will magically disappear. But just denying that the devil exists isn't going to stop bad things from happening, you have to take the far more difficult step of realizing that a lot of the bad things really aren't all that bad. And the more that you can do that, the more you'll find that bad things stop happening.

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[2PhiloVoid]

From my experience the devil loves being mocked and scorned, because it shows that he's gotten your attention... what he hates is being ignored. So simply accept hardships with a little faith and a smile, knowing that these things too shall pass. Don't begrudge your misfortunes, rather embrace them, for they're not meant to test your faith, they're meant to reveal it, as much to you as to God.

Don't mock and scorn the devil, that's what he wants you to do.

I think you've misunderstood C.S. Lewis' intentions in citing these quotes at the beginning of his book. Otherwise, I'd agree with you.

Remember that where meaning is necessary and pertinent, it's always best to have the contexts first.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Triumphant, I would imagine. “The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn’t exist”.

Screwtape would agree with you and Charles Baudelaire. (See chapter VII)

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I don't think it matters. I think that whenever you bemoan the things that happen to you it doesn't matter if you blame the devil, or your neighbor, or fate, or the stars, or just bad luck. Bad things will continue to happen to you simply because you've chosen to view them as such. Stop viewing things as being bad and amazingly bad things will stop happening to you.

@2PhiloVoid, seems to think that if he mocks and scorns the devil that that'll somehow stop bad things from happening. I think that the exact opposite is true, that the more you focus on bad things the more things you'll perceive as being bad, and the more you'll blame the devil. It's a vicious cycle.

So stop viewing things as being bad, and voila, bad things will stop happening, and the devil will magically disappear. But just denying that the devil exists isn't going to stop bad things from happening, you have to take the far more difficult step of realizing that a lot of the bad things really aren't all that bad. And the more that you can do that, the more you'll find that bad things stop happening.

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Yeah, it sounds like you've misunderstood. Screwtape serves as a metaphor what we surmise might be true about radical evil but don't necessarily 'know' it to be so. It's an effigy of sorts that we can still knock around firmly like a papier-mâché piñata without the guilt of literally going against what Scripture advises and "cursing the darkness."

Of course, that doesn't stop me from occassionally literally cursing the Darkness that I see and believe is there. But otherwise, like you were saying, life can be generally 'ok'----if we let the evil 'be.'

 

[Hans Blaster]

Triumphant, I would imagine. “The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn’t exist”.

Ah, one of my "favorite" theological escape hatches. -- not believing in the satan is the work of the satan. smh.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Ah, one of my "favorite" theological escape hatches. -- not believing in the satan is the work of the satan. smh.

It's not really an escape hatch. Although, I will say that if folks in the world didn't work so hard to make it 'look' like Satan is real, then that'd go a long way in providing a reason to disbelieve the Bible or God.

Such as it is, I'll be believing the Bible for quite some time.

 

[Hans Blaster]

It's not really an escape hatch. Although, I will say that if folks in the world didn't work so hard to make it 'look' like Satan is real, then that'd go a long way in providing a reason to disbelieve the Bible or God.

There is nothing about "bad things" happening in the world that requires there to be a (non-human) being that makes people do "bad things". We seem perfectly capable of that all on our own. I can't say I find any case to be made that the absence of a satan character (or "absence of evidence" for it) would be all that compelling arguments against god belief.

(It may not shock you to know that I did not panic in the Satanic Panic(tm) and was shocked to find that people actually believed in demon possession, etc.)

 

[2PhiloVoid]

There is nothing about "bad things" happening in the world that requires there to be a (non-human) being that makes people do "bad things". We seem perfectly capable of that all on our own. I can't say I find any case to be made that the absence of a satan character (or "absence of evidence" for it) would be all that compelling arguments against god belief.

(It may not shock you to know that I did not panic in the Satanic Panic(tm) and was shocked to find that people actually believed in demon possession, etc.)

Right. There's no necessity that forces us to interpret the world one way or another, and I'm pretty sure I've never said there has been. In fact, if the biblical epistemology is correct in relation to it's own claims, then a lack of necessity is exactly what we all should expect to be the common experience, whether there's a literal devil, or even a metaphorical one, or neither or these

The Bible also makes the same case that you do that we can do evil all on our own, without the help of a devil. It's just that he gets credit where credit is due.

As for the so-called "Satanic Panic," I've always been skeptical of what passes for demonology in many churches, as well as in Hollywood. I think C.S. Lewis was too, and that is where I was half way in the 1980s, going from another session of Dungeons and Dragons and then, later, to my first reading of The Screwtape Letters.

 

[Hans Blaster]

As for the so-called "Satanic Panic," I've always been skeptical of what passes for demonology in many churches, as well as in Hollywood.

Never believed in "demons" myself.

I think C.S. Lewis was too.

Whatever.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Never believed in "demons" myself.

You kind of have to know what to look for ... ... and taking up a viewing of movies like, "The Exorcist," or "The Omen" isn't going to educate you on that.

 

[gaara4158]

Ah, one of my "favorite" theological escape hatches. -- not believing in the satan is the work of the satan. smh.

It’s the flip side of “If you’ve done your job right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all.” That one’s old too, but I remember it as a quote from God in Futurama. So curious that the gods and the devils each seem to operate on a maxim of hiding their own existence.

 

[Hans Blaster]

You kind of have to know what to look for ... ... and taking up a viewing of movies like, "The Exorcist," or "The Omen" isn't going to educate you on that.

1. I was a little too young for those particular films (not by much, but just enough).
2. I'm not interested in that genre
3. You do know those are *fiction*, right? The "demons" in them are "not real".

 

[2PhiloVoid]

1. I was a little too young for those particular films (not by much, but just enough).
2. I'm not interested in that genre
3. You do know those are *fiction*, right? The "demons" in them are "not real".

Now, Hans. Dear, oh dear! Give me some credit here, bud.

Your admonition is exactly my point: Those films, and others like them, aren't real and what's more, they misrepresent what we should expect to find IFf demons are real. (i.e. If and only if...)

 

[2PhiloVoid]

It’s the flip side of “If you’ve done your job right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all.” That one’s old too, but I remember it as a quote from God in Futurama. So curious that the gods and the devils each seem to operate on a maxim of hiding their own existence.

Yeah, the 'Hiddeness of God' issue is one we all have to deal with.

Satan's work, on the other hand, comes a dime a dozen and many folks seem to be more than happy to give their right hand to help him out with it.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Now, Hans. Dear, oh dear! Give me some credit here, bud.

I'll let you give you credit. I wouldn't want to interfere.

Your admonition is exactly my point: Those films, and others like them, aren't real and what's more, they misrepresent what we should expect to find IFf demons are real. (i.e. If and only if...)

Commercial fiction or otherwise still we have the absence of evidence for actual demons. (Demons = {})

(Explaining IFF. Eye roll.)