Let's put aside all the asinine "counseling" and lectures about maturity. You're talking over me instead of listening to what I'm trying to say.
1 Timothy 5:1
Maturity and experience are defining qualifications... how did you come to the conclusions that you have? You're trying again to change the rules to fit yourself. Additionally, your quote "asinine counseling" shows your immaturity. Immaturity will then explain how you can't accept counseling.
I understand exactly what you are saying... You are wrong or rather... incomplete.
Have any of you noticed that I never argued against women submitting?
You have said that "women submitting" is illogical, disproportionate, and unreasonable. This would indicate that you are arguing against it.
My main objection of the verse in question is not so much that women should submit but that this verse is only asking women to submit when relationships are a team effort.
This is where you miss the point. I and many others have tried to help you understand that a woman is submissive to the man's AUTHORITY as the head of the household.
In order for a relationship to work, both partners must mutually submit to one another - to be held accountable for each other's actions.
This position, your position, which has not been denied by anybody, is a mutual submission of WILL. Does not directly have anything to do with authority. The very proof of this lies in the experiences of those who are older and have firsthand knowledge. You choose not to accept that maturity and experience are valuable to this discussion.
It's normal for marital roles to sometimes overlap or switch. Sometimes men take over jobs that are traditionally "woman's work" out of kindness and deference to their wives. Sometimes, women take jobs that are traditionally men only in order to provide for their families when their husband cannot.
No doubt. However, I'm talking about God's perfect plan not any exceptions. I do accept and agree there are exceptions...
Many of you seem to have misunderstood my point about complementary strength. There may be some ways in which women are weaker than men. There may also be some ways in which men are weaker than women. But when men and women's relative strengths and weaknesses are all added together, they come out even. Women generally don't have the strength to complete heavy construction jobs, but their bodies can withstand carrying an unborn child for nine months. Men's bodies can't carry an unborn child for nine months, but they can complete heavy construction iobs. It all evens out.
It "evens out" only in God's perfect plan... when we as men and as women are doing what God specifies. Please when you are making comparisons... make it "apples to apples." God designed man and woman. Man was not designed to have babies... there is no comparison to being physically stronger... Men are stronger because God made us that way... if we weren't who would protect and take care of women during their pregnancies... and post partum... they are very vulnerable at this time... My point being... there is no way to make that comparison. I totally understand as do most others that man and woman complement each other in their relationship, but your comparisons and conclusions are way off. Your conclusions point directly to your immaturity and inexperience. It is applicable.
That's why men and women are such a perfect fit for each other: it all balances out. Men sometimes give in their relationships, and women take. Sometimes, women may give in the relationship and men take. Where men are weak in some areas, women are strong. Where women are weak in some areas, men are strong. Both submit to one another through self-sacrifice and accountability.
They are submitting their WILL to each other. This does NOT compete or go against God's plan to have the man be the head of the household.
In other words, it's something like two men carrying a table. Both men carry an equal amount of the table's weight so that moving the table will be successful. If one man carries too much of the weight, the move doesn't work as well.
Close, I agree that the table gets moved from one point to the other with the man and woman cooperating... and the table can't move without both... HOWEVER, one or the other is carrying more of the load. In God's plan the man is to carry more of the load. (Not that is just requires more physical strength... it also requires more responsibility.)
You are still only supporting your views from a secular point of view... if this is so illogical, disproportionate, and unreasonable provide a different Biblical point of view that supports your thoughts.
