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If you hadn't noticed those were fairly resent rulings. You seem to have a narrow view of reality, quoting it only when your side doesn't win an issue.
you assume i was trying to win an issue lol .. i think the whole issue is ridiculous .
but i do have a narrow veiw .. it is this The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
No offense taken...the answer to your question is no. I've never had the misfortune to be in such a situation (unlike a huge number of women around the world who might).
you assume i was trying to win an issue lol .. i think the whole issue is ridiculous .
but i do have a narrow veiw .. it is this The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
How many times in your life has something happened just because you wanted it to happen? the good news you think you have is all in your mind, you hope it will happen then you tell yourself that it will then you begin to believe it.
I wanted a pony when I was young but we couldn't afford one, now that I can afford one I have no where to keep it, life can be so hard sometimes, it doesn't stop me hoping though, but that's a physical thing and it's achievable, when we come to the fantastic that's a whole different ball game.
We are nothing more than a sack of chemicals, wishing we weren't changes nothing, we are still a sack of chemicals and will remain so until we die.
BTW the 'you don't know that' argument is childish because we do know that, death happens every day every where in the world to every living thing,
but knowing that shouldn't stop you believing whatever makes you feel good, it doesn't help if you live in the real world but in LaLa land all things are possible.
you assume i was trying to win an issue lol .. i think the whole issue is ridiculous .
but i do have a narrow veiw .. it is this The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
I like how you jump around and if one thing doesn't work you try another approach, but you are still using a straw man argument. You set up this straw man that Evolution takes something away from being human and then simply assume that Evolutionist agree with that premise. Then you attack that mental image, you yourself created as the reason that Abortion is happening.
You can believe what you want but you can't make the connection between the theory of Evolution and killing babies. The culture that had the values which you aspire fell apart in the counter culture and everything changed. It wasn't free will that brought about abortion. It was free love.
Mankind wasn't diminished by Darwin It was sold out by sensationalism.
When confronting ignorance and superstition everyone should be angry, ignorance and superstition are things we should all be trying to leave behind us,
we have brains and reason to help us but some people either just don't know how to use them or they prefer not to use them,
perhaps they even prefer the nice warm feeling ignorance and superstition gives them, they do say that ignorance is bliss, reality can be a little too much for some people.
When confronting ignorance and superstition everyone should be angry, ignorance and superstition are things we should all be trying to leave behind us,
we have brains and reason to help us but some people just don't know how to use them, either that or they prefer not to use them,
perhaps they prefer the nice warm feeling ignorance and superstition gives them.
I should think that anyone with even half a brain could figure out that murdering the infant in the womb is not a great idea.
Life is not a throw-away commodity.
You don't have to be a Christian to figure that out. There are even some atheists who have advanced beyond such primitive brutality.
It isn't often you will hear me sing the praises of Mr. Christopher Hitchens, for instance...
I should think that anyone with even half a brain could figure out that murdering the infant in the womb is not a great idea.
Life is not a throw-away commodity.
You don't have to be a Christian to figure that out. There are even some atheists who have advanced beyond such primitive brutality.
It isn't often you will hear me sing the praises of Mr. Christopher Hitchens, for instance...
Life is not a throw-away commodity?? you must be joking.
America allows at least 45,000 people to die needlessly every year because they do not have access to regular medical services? no where else in the civilised world is this allowed to happen, it only happens in the Christian nation of America, life is cheaper in the US than it is in some backward African or south American countries.
When confronting ignorance and superstition everyone should be angry, ignorance and superstition are things we should all be trying to leave behind us,
we have brains and reason to help us but some people either just don't know how to use them or they prefer not to use them,
perhaps they even prefer the nice warm feeling ignorance and superstition gives them, they do say that ignorance is bliss, reality can be a little too much for some people.
People are not ignorant because they reject what you think is wisdom. The science that so many Atheists claim as their savior is nothing more than a tool to investigate how things work in the galaxy, not how they were created. Nothing shows us this and since theories abound on the creation of reality then all of them are equally valid.
If you get so frustrated that you snarl at people for voicing their opinions, then you should not do your best at denigrating them. I've never seen that work in the favor of the denigrator.
People are not ignorant because they reject what you think is wisdom. The science that so many Atheists claim as their savior is nothing more than a tool to investigate how things work in the galaxy, not how they were created. Nothing shows us this and since theories abound on the creation of reality then all of them are equally valid.
Science is nothing more than the study of reality, if it is real and exists then science can be used to study it, if it's not real but only imagined then science can play no part, yet.
Reality is what religion is against, the reality of death, our imaginations allow some of us to dispense with reality in favour of a dream world.
If you get so frustrated that you snarl at people for voicing their opinions, then you should not do your best at denigrating them. I've never seen that work in the favor of the denigrator.
I am not snarling I am merely reacting to superstitions, truth denigrates those who choose to deny it or refuse to see it that's why so many Americans choose to live in LaLa land, they are in denial of reality, reality tells us we are all going to die, unfortunately some people just can not or will not accept that and go into denial mode,
perhaps it's not their fault it might just be the way they were raised.
I never said science was all wrong. Perhaps you didn't read my post.
Science is a tool, and as such, it is a wonderful thing. I, for one, have a deep respect for science, and for what it has accomplished. I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear.
However, science does have it's limits. It is frustrating to hear, over and over again, how there is no "evidence" for God.
If you're trying to find this evidence using science, which is limited to the physical, of course, you will never find it.
So you believe in something for which you cannot provide any independently verifiable evidence. Why? I don't understand why someone would do this.
You say it "inflates your ego". I find that amusing. If your ego is so in need of "inflating" that you must come here to feel better about yourself, I feel very sorry for you. You have some pretty deep issues...
More of an personal joke, really. My old hang-out was Straight Dope Message Boards, and the intellectual discourse there is basically at such a level where every single time I went into a thread and thought, "Hey, I have something insightful and useful to offer here", someone else had already said it. So I sorta stopped posting there, because if I'm just repeating what five other people already said, what's the point? Here I feel like I actually have something to offer, because the average poster here doesn't know what alleles are, you know what I mean?
Well, ideally, using the chemical and aromatic composition thereof. This is not a good example, as it is something which can be objectively described and reproduced. The taste of any given food is not only explainable, it's something we can often distill into an artificial flavoring. Same things with smells - Arpege is a carefully manufactured assortment of designed chemicals. Your assertion that we somehow can't is simply wrong. It's like trying to demonstrate to a person born blind that color exists - you absolutely can consistently and verifiably demonstrate the phenomenon to them, even if they can never personally experience it.
It would be easier to make the person a grilled cheese sandwich to taste, or give him a sample of perfume to sniff, or to take him to the lake and let him wade in.
And then there's that, of course. Even barring all other options, we can do that. We can show people the objects, we can demonstrate it objectively and verifiably. You can't do that with God. In fact, the fact that you have to believe in the object's existence in order to discover its existence makes it impossible to distinguish from objects that don't actually exist. The human mind is exceedingly good at self-deception.
Perhaps that was true 50 years ago...but in the last several decades, our influence here in the U.S. has been waning. I'm old enough to remember when we prayed in school...a very insignificant, and highly generic little prayer, and no one was forced to participate. And I remember when the huge controversy started, because one woman did not like her daughter exposed to other children praying. And the adults around me crying "This is America! It can't happen here!!"
And then, it did.
Because it blatantly violates the first amendment. The state cannot prop up any particular religion. You're still allowed to pray at school (in fact, it's a fairly blatant violation of your first-amendment rights if they try to stop you, assuming you're not disrupting class somehow), but the school cannot lead a prayer. And it's not just about her daughter being exposed to other children praying. It's about the feeling of "otherness". About being forced into a situation where you are clearly out-of-place, where all of society stands against you in unison. It's an awful and awkward feeling that any Christian can experience if they go to, say, a Muslim event. It's not pleasant. You don't recognize this, because Christians are a massive supermajority where you live. But non-christians have to deal with it constantly.
And so it has gone. Symbols of our faith that have stood in place for generations have been torn down, lest they "offend" someone.
What, you mean like the ten commandments in courtrooms (again, a clear violation of the first amendment)?
Every Christmas, some clown starts with the "don't call it Christmas, call it a "Winter Holiday" gig. It never works, because Christians will not shop where they can't say "Merry Christmas", but someone always tries...
No, nobody does that. There's no significant push to tell people to stop saying "merry christmas". Major retailers tend to say "happy holidays", because not everyone celebrates Christmas and most religions have something going on around the winter solstice, but this is not somehow exclusionary. Rather, it's inclusive - it tells people "Christmas is a holiday, but we also respect you if you don't celebrate it". I suppose you could say that this is a case of Christians losing power - they're losing an unreasonable, unjustified privilege they had in the past.
And to the present. Our Supreme Court, which is the highest court in our land, has handed down it's decision...gay marriage is now legal in all fifty of our states. Now, given that it is the states who issue the marriage license, you'd think it would be up to them who they issued them to...and that has always been the case, more or less...other than when the Federal government passed the Civil Rights Act in 1965, making it illegal to discriminate against anyone because of their race, which many people see as being a bit different, since skin is something natural, while they don't see gay as being natural, but that's a whole other debate. We do have something called the "Full Faith and Credit Act" which states that if it was legal in the state you did it in, it's legal in all fifty...which kinda settles things, anyway, or at least you'd think so. Go figure, right?
The Full Faith and Credit Act was essentially overruled by DOMA. And yes, gay marriage is now legal. You know what? There are a lot of American Christians who support gay marriage.
And then there is abortion. A very large percentage of Christians have made it known that they do not support abortion, likening it to murder. However, it is still legal, in all fifty states.
Yeah, that secular constitution sure sucks, doesn't it?
However, every example you've brought up comes down not to popular opinion, but to the supreme court upholding the (ostensibly secular) law of the constitution. Meanwhile, when we look at what the people actually vote for, we see that legislatures are doing everything in their power to make it impossible for people to get abortions. We see states passing laws explicitly legalizing discrimination against homosexuals. Across the country, districts have to fight to get the established science of evolution taught in their classrooms, and to keep the religious dogma of creationism out. Every single advance made against Christian privilege in this country has come from the courts, who could not and should not disregard the fact that our constitution demands a separation of church and state.
I'd say that the relevant field is psychiatry, because what we are looking for is not physical.
No. You're wrong. You're completely begging the question, and ignoring the issue. Psychiatry does not deal with the source of the mind. It simply is not within its scope to tell us what the mind actually is. It can tell us all kinds of useful things about how the human mind reacts to various stimuli. It can tell us why we have certain mental disorders. What it cannot do is go beyond the software to figure out what's actually going on.
Also, you're begging the question. You're assuming from the outset that what we're looking for is not physical, in order to discount the field which establishes that it is!
What we are looking for is exactly what you said...what the nature of our minds is.
Now, of all people, I have a debt of gratitude to neurology...I used to be an epileptic, and I needed a neurologist to keep me from having grand mal seizures.
However, neurology cannot tell me why I suddenly started having seizures at 30-something, nor why those seizures stopped just as suddenly.
If we knew everything we'd stop doing science. However, the answers are almost certain to be found in the study of how the brain works. Epilepsy is and has been known for some time to be a disorder of the brain. There's nothing non-physical here, and neurology will hopefully in the future be able to answer these questions.
I actually expected the "snappy 5-second answer".
And I'm pretty sure you know that I can't answer your question, as I am not a computer tech.
I don't think it's that hard of a question. When a computer program is executed, the physical part is in the hardware. It's the electrical signals running through a massive network of tiny switches. It's not as dissimilar to the brain as you might think (although the brain is orders of magnitude more complex). And as said, the snappy 5-second answer is really a massive oversimplification that does not do the research in the field justice. I wish I could give a better answer... But it's way over my head.
That actually made me giggle. A "defective God Detector"?
Very witty...
I mean, I dunno. People keep telling me God is obvious, that they see him in a baby's laugh, or a rainbow, or a sunset, and I look at those things, and you know what I see? Just those things. I don't see any mystical supernatural entity behind it. I just see the things, and the feelings they invoke in me. And I don't know how to justify going from "I see this thing and it invokes a certain emotion in me" to "
I suppose that was an unreasonable response. But to me, it does seem obvious.
I see Him everywhere I look...in a baby's laugh, in a rainbow or a sunset, in the giraffe's silly neck, in young lover's sighs...I honestly do not understand how people miss Him...but that's just me.
However your point is well taken. If it were as obvious to others as it seems to me, everyone would be a Christian.
This is part of why I think Romans 1:20 is the most pernicious, intellectually corrupting verse in the entire bible. It implies that everyone knows God exists. It implies that everyone who disagrees - more than half the people on the planet - are lying to themselves or to everyone else. It gives Christians a way to say, "Oh, you know I'm right" without even engaging the issue. And it completely detonates any bedrock on which to have an earnest and honest exchange of ideas, because you cannot have an honest exchange of ideas if you go into the discussion assuming that your opponent is lying.
I don't think you're lying. I think you're honest and upstanding. I think you're wrong on a lot of things, but I think that, at least in theory, you have something of value to offer me in this discussion, be it a new idea, some interesting perspective, whatever. And I think that you have the potential to maybe change my mind. Otherwise, I wouldn't be discussing it with you. The people here who I know are dishonest in a discussion? I block them. I don't see the point in engaging with them if they can't be honest. But now imagine you start by assuming that everyone who disagrees with you is not only wrong, but lying, either to themselves or to everyone around them. Can you imagine having an earnest discussion with those people? I can't.
If you're referencing Darwinist evolution when you say "scientific explanation for the diversity of life", you're wrong that Darwinism is a "scientific explanation". It's not.
It doesn't matter if it's scientific or not for the purposes of this discussion. The point is it has nothing to do with morality. The fact that gravity is real does not mean that it is somehow moral for me to push you off of a building.
As far as morals, there are no morals in the Darwinist creationist system, only cold reactions from the firing of synapses.
it no offer .it a warning and your not refusing me anything and it wont go away .
The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
I like how you jump around and if one thing doesn't work you try another approach, but you are still using a straw man argument. You set up this straw man that Evolution takes something away from being human and then simply assume that Evolutionist agree with that premise. Then you attack that mental image, you yourself created as the reason that Abortion is happening.
You can believe what you want but you can't make the connection between the theory of Evolution and killing babies. The culture that had the values which you aspire fell apart in the counter culture and everything changed. It wasn't free will that brought about abortion. It was free love.
Mankind wasn't diminished by Darwin It was sold out by sensationalism.
ouh im not jumping around haha .. not after only a few posts .. im a born again Christian. which means i share the good news ..its what we do .
The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
How many times in your life has something happened just because you wanted it to happen? the good news you think you have is all in your mind, you hope it will happen then you tell yourself that it will then you begin to believe it.
I wanted a pony when I was young but we couldn't afford one, now that I can afford one I have no where to keep it, life can be so hard sometimes, it doesn't stop me hoping though, but that's a physical thing and it's achievable, when we come to the fantastic that's a whole different ball game.
We are nothing more than a sack of chemicals, wishing we weren't changes nothing, we are still a sack of chemicals and will remain so until we die.
BTW the 'you don't know that' argument is childish because we do know that, death happens every day every where in the world to every living thing,
but knowing that shouldn't stop you believing whatever makes you feel good, it doesn't help if you live in the real world but in LaLa land all things are possible.
The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
I haven't dodged your question, I've answered it repeatedly, I don't understand your latest question though. Maybe you're asking about the incompatibility of being a evolved sack of chemicals of the Darwinist evolution model as contrasted to God creating humanity? The basic contradiction is one of humanity being just another relatively meaningless/worthless life form verses humanity having inherent value beyond simply a Darwinist life form of little value. In one creationist worldview, the sack of chemicals identified as human is a construct of random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless constructs (Darwinism), in the other, humanity was planned and designed and the highest order of life in all life we observe today.
Okay, maybe I wasn't communicating the question clearly: What is a physical thing that Darwin objected to? To put it another way, can you identify a thing that can be measured by physics that Darwin denied? Another way of saying it is, of the things that Darwin thought were not real but actually are, what is one of the physical things?
ouh im not jumping around haha .. not after only a few posts .. im a born again Christian. which means i share the good news ..its what we do .
The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
it remains -The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
it is a very narrow view the narrow way that leads to eternal life .
Science is nothing more than the study of reality, if it is real and exists then science can be used to study it, if it's not real but only imagined then science can play no part, yet.
Reality is what religion is against, the reality of death, our imaginations allow some of us to dispense with reality in favour of a dream world.
What roll did science have in identifying dark matter in the 1700's?
I am not snarling I am merely reacting to superstitions, truth denigrates those who choose to deny it or refuse to see it that's why so many Americans choose to live in LaLa land, they are in denial of reality, reality tells us we are all going to die, unfortunately some people just can not or will not accept that and go into denial mode,
perhaps it's not their fault it might just be the way they were raised.
That's what I thought. I saw you last post about healthcare and the like. I thought I'd spotted the pedigree, but I wasn't sure.
You're just another dime a dozen anti-American activist, arrogantly points out what he sees as flaws in others based on what he believes as right. History is replete with modern day Moseses looking to lead everyone into his own version of a promised land and chastising them for not listening to his supposed wisdom. Every one of them, just as tyrannical as the next and just as critical of the one prior to him. Take a number and set down. When you are called stand on the numbered stomp, stretch out our fist and shack vigorously. Rinse an repeat if necessary. NEXT!
it remains -The Good news in the midst of all this is that we are more then a sack of chemicals .for in us was breathed the breath of life .
the lord Jesus said .. "this is eternal life .. that they may know you the one true living God"
the good news is .. God has Made a way for us to be reconciled unto himself that we might once more "know him" on a personal level .for from the abundance of his heart he spoke to save us and his word became flesh and his name is JESUS and who ever believes on him will not perish but have everlasting life .
