Atheism (3)

[Dave Ellis]

You say that every time, but if this is not about the Bible then why are you on a christian forum?

This is about evidence. And we also happen to be on a thread titled "Atheism".

And if you know I say that every time, why do you continue using bible quotes to prove your point? You may as well be quoting Captain Kirk until you can demonstrate the Bible is truthful and correct.

 

[Dave Ellis]

then have your God thor send lightening down and destroy my Bible right now! If He can't then He is not God!

Have your God, or even Jesus show up in my kitchen and cook me up some french fries.

If they can't, they're not God's either.

 

[createdtoworship]

Have your God, or even Jesus show up in my kitchen and cook me up some french fries.

If they can't, they're not God's either.

God already proved that He can cook

remember the story...

25 Now Elijah said to the prophets of Baal, “Choose one bull for yourselves and prepare it first, for you are many; and call on the name of your god, but put no fire under it.”

26 So they took the bull which was given them, and they prepared it, and called on the name of Baal from morning even till noon, saying, “O Baal, hear us!” But there was no voice; no one answered. Then they leaped about the altar which they had made.

27 And so it was, at noon, that Elijah mocked them and said, “Cry aloud, for he is a god; either he is meditating, or he is busy, or he is on a journey, or perhaps he is sleeping and must be awakened.” 28 So they cried aloud, and cut themselves, as was their custom, with knives and lances, until the blood gushed out on them. 29 And when midday was past, they prophesied until the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice. But there was no voice; no one answered, no one paid attention.

30 Then Elijah said to all the people, “Come near to me.” So all the people came near to him. And he repaired the altar of the Lord that was broken down. 31 And Elijah took twelve stones, according to the number of the tribes of the sons of Jacob, to whom the word of the Lord had come, saying, “Israel shall be your name.” 32 Then with the stones he built an altar in the name of the Lord; and he made a trench around the altar large enough to hold two seahs of seed. 33 And he put the wood in order, cut the bull in pieces, and laid it on the wood, and said, “Fill four waterpots with water, and pour it on the burnt sacrifice and on the wood.” 34 Then he said, “Do it a second time,” and they did it a second time; and he said, “Do it a third time,” and they did it a third time. 35 So the water ran all around the altar; and he also filled the trench with water.

36 And it came to pass, at the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice, that Elijah the prophet came near and said, “Lord God of Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, let it be known this day that You are God in Israel and I am Your servant, and that I have done all these things at Your word. 37 Hear me, O Lord, hear me, that this people may know that You are the Lord God, and that You have turned their hearts back to You again.”

38 Then the fire of the Lord fell and consumed the burnt sacrifice, and the wood and the stones and the dust, and it licked up the water that was in the trench. 39 Now when all the people saw it, they fell on their faces; and they said, “The Lord, He is God! The Lord, He is God!”

40 And Elijah said to them, “Seize the prophets of Baal! Do not let one of them escape!” So they seized them; and Elijah brought them down to the Brook Kishon and executed them there.

1 Kings 18:25-40

 

[createdtoworship]

This is about evidence. And we also happen to be on a thread titled "Atheism".

And if you know I say that every time, why do you continue using bible quotes to prove your point? You may as well be quoting Captain Kirk until you can demonstrate the Bible is truthful and correct.

well we do beam each other up, it's called the rapture.

 

[Dave Ellis]

God already proved that He can cook

remember the story...

25 Now Elijah said to the prophets of Baal, “Choose one bull for yourselves and prepare it first, for you are many; and call on the name of your god, but put no fire under it.”

26 So they took the bull which was given them, and they prepared it, and called on the name of Baal from morning even till noon, saying, “O Baal, hear us!” But there was no voice; no one answered. Then they leaped about the altar which they had made.

27 And so it was, at noon, that Elijah mocked them and said, “Cry aloud, for he is a god; either he is meditating, or he is busy, or he is on a journey, or perhaps he is sleeping and must be awakened.” 28 So they cried aloud, and cut themselves, as was their custom, with knives and lances, until the blood gushed out on them. 29 And when midday was past, they prophesied until the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice. But there was no voice; no one answered, no one paid attention.

30 Then Elijah said to all the people, “Come near to me.” So all the people came near to him. And he repaired the altar of the Lord that was broken down. 31 And Elijah took twelve stones, according to the number of the tribes of the sons of Jacob, to whom the word of the Lord had come, saying, “Israel shall be your name.” 32 Then with the stones he built an altar in the name of the Lord; and he made a trench around the altar large enough to hold two seahs of seed. 33 And he put the wood in order, cut the bull in pieces, and laid it on the wood, and said, “Fill four waterpots with water, and pour it on the burnt sacrifice and on the wood.” 34 Then he said, “Do it a second time,” and they did it a second time; and he said, “Do it a third time,” and they did it a third time. 35 So the water ran all around the altar; and he also filled the trench with water.

36 And it came to pass, at the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice, that Elijah the prophet came near and said, “Lord God of Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, let it be known this day that You are God in Israel and I am Your servant, and that I have done all these things at Your word. 37 Hear me, O Lord, hear me, that this people may know that You are the Lord God, and that You have turned their hearts back to You again.”

38 Then the fire of the Lord fell and consumed the burnt sacrifice, and the wood and the stones and the dust, and it licked up the water that was in the trench. 39 Now when all the people saw it, they fell on their faces; and they said, “The Lord, He is God! The Lord, He is God!”

40 And Elijah said to them, “Seize the prophets of Baal! Do not let one of them escape!” So they seized them; and Elijah brought them down to the Brook Kishon and executed them there.

1 Kings 18:25-40

So prove it happened.

And I don't notice my kitchen anywhere in that text. I'm still waiting for my fries.

 

[Dave Ellis]

well we do beam each other up, it's called the rapture.

I see, well... prove that too?

 

[createdtoworship]

So prove it happened.

And I don't notice my kitchen anywhere in that text. I'm still waiting for my fries.

there are four facts that have been proven by history about the book of 1 kings in the bible. Solomon was rich proved by his stables being discovered by the oriental institute. Also in 1852 a quarry was found where costly stones were escavated for solomons walls. Secondly no one knew of "omri King of the israelites" that is mentioned in 1 kings 16 until the moabite stone was found that also mentions it. Also the balck obelist of shalmeneser III and an inscription of adadnirari both mention omri. Also baal worship ( a pagan religion according to the Bible in 1 Kings) has been confirmed only in the Bible and at Megiddo where the ruins of a temple of ashtoreth was found near samaria.


any other questions?

Now prove the story didn't happen?

 

[createdtoworship]

I see, well... prove that too?

first I will prove the verse:

1 Thess 4:17 ESV
Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

secondly the stories of the new testament have several archaelogical findings:

the enrollment of quirinius (Luke 2:2) Papri have been found with this enrollment

synagog of capernaum (mark 1:21; Luke 7:1, 5) found

the tomb of Jesus (John 19:41) found in Israel.

Now prove those stories did not happen!

I have a bunch more where that came from

 

[quatona]

You say that every time, but if this is not about the Bible then why are you on a christian forum?

Whenever this question pops up in the midst of a discussion I can´t help but reading "I have run out of arguments."

 

[createdtoworship]

Whenever this question pops up in the midst of a discussion I can´t help but reading "I have run out of arguments."

prove it

 

[Danyc]

there are four facts that have been proven by history about the book of 1 kings in the bible. Solomon was rich proved by his stables being discovered by the oriental institute. Also in 1852 a quarry was found where costly stones were escavated for solomons walls. Secondly no one knew of "omri King of the israelites" that is mentioned in 1 kings 16 until the moabite stone was found that also mentions it. Also the balck obelist of shalmeneser III and an inscription of adadnirari both mention omri. Also baal worship ( a pagan religion according to the Bible in 1 Kings) has been confirmed only in the Bible and at Megiddo where the ruins of a temple of ashtoreth was found near samaria.


any other questions?

Now prove the story didn't happen?

Citations please.

 

[createdtoworship]

Citations please.

I will do you one better, I will get you photographs of them.....

here is solomons stables:

bored of posting pictures here is rest

Archaeological Proofs the History in the Bible is true and unchanged

 

[Eudaimonist]

then have your God thor send lightening down and destroy my Bible right now! If He can't then He is not God!

"Have your God destroy my collection of atheist books right now. If He can't then He is not God!"

You really should think through your replies.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Dave Ellis]

there are four facts that have been proven by history about the book of 1 kings in the bible. Solomon was rich proved by his stables being discovered by the oriental institute. Also in 1852 a quarry was found where costly stones were escavated for solomons walls. Secondly no one knew of "omri King of the israelites" that is mentioned in 1 kings 16 until the moabite stone was found that also mentions it. Also the balck obelist of shalmeneser III and an inscription of adadnirari both mention omri. Also baal worship ( a pagan religion according to the Bible in 1 Kings) has been confirmed only in the Bible and at Megiddo where the ruins of a temple of ashtoreth was found near samaria.


any other questions?

Now prove the story didn't happen?

I have no reason to doubt that, however archaeological findings in no way prove the important parts in the bible (i.e. Miracle Claims, Divinity of Jesus etc). It makes total sense they'd use real cities and places to set their stories.

For example, if 2,000 years from now they dig up a spiderman comic, they'll read it was set in New York City. Does that mean if they then find the ruins of New York that Spiderman is true?

Fictional stories are often set in real locations. The Bible is no different.

 

[Dave Ellis]

first I will prove the verse:

1 Thess 4:17 ESV
Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

secondly the stories of the new testament have several archaelogical findings:

the enrollment of quirinius (Luke 2:2) Papri have been found with this enrollment

synagog of capernaum (mark 1:21; Luke 7:1, 5) found

the tomb of Jesus (John 19:41) found in Israel.

Now prove those stories did not happen!

I have a bunch more where that came from

See my above reply.... Archaeological findings don't prove anything as far as supernatural miracle claims go.

 

[Dave Ellis]

prove it

Well, I think it's pretty obvious as your arguments are getting weaker and weaker.

 

[Elioenai26]

Well, I think it's pretty obvious as your arguments are getting weaker and weaker.

Actually, his arguements are pretty strong.

No archaeological find has ever disproven any event recorded in the Bible.

In fact, every archaeological find that has any bearing and anything to do with the events and locations in the Bible has only served to prove that what the Bible records is true!

If the bible is rubbish and full of myths as so many claim, then it seems to me that there would be plenty of evidence from archaeology to prove this.

It is also important to remember that if one does not want to admit that archaeology strengthens the case for Christianity, they need only dismiss the findings as irrelevant, just as you have done.

 

[Dave Ellis]

Actually, his arguements are pretty strong.

No archaeological find has ever disproven any event recorded in the Bible.

In fact, every archaeological find that has any bearing and anything to do with the events and locations in the Bible has only served to prove that what the Bible records is true!

If the bible is rubbish and full of myths as so many claim, then it seems to me that there would be plenty of evidence from archaeology to prove this.

It is also important to remember that if one does not want to admit that archaeology strengthens the case for Christianity, they need only dismiss the findings as irrelevant, just as you have done.

Off the top of my head I can think of a big one.... Nazareth wasn't founded until roughly 70AD.

Either way, as I said before, the archaeological evidence doesn't matter. Using places that exist in real life to set a fictional story is very commonplace. Even if every piece of archaeological data turned out to be right.... that doesn't prove anything as far as the existence of God, Jesus, or any supernatural claims.

 

[quatona]

Actually, his arguements are pretty strong.

No archaeological find has ever disproven any event recorded in the Bible.

Let´s for a moment assume this were true. Now, how do we get from "geographically accurate" to "correct when it comes to claims about the divine?

In fact, every archaeological find that has any bearing and anything to do with the events and locations in the Bible has only served to prove that what the Bible records is true!

Let´s for a moment assume this were true. Are geographical fact that which you find particularly important about the bible? If not so, how does geographic accuracy point to accuracy on the accuracy of the stories being told? I know plenty of fictional books that are highly accurate when it comes to geography, locations, politics and time lines.

If the bible is rubbish and full of myths as so many claim, then it seems to me that there would be plenty of evidence from archaeology to prove this.

Ok, again: Let´s say the bible must be accepted as a geography/politics/society textbook of the Middle East. How are you getting from this to the idea that it must be therefore correct when it comes to its ideas about the divine and supernatural?

 

[Elioenai26]

Off the top of my head I can think of a big one.... Nazareth wasn't founded until roughly 70AD.

Either way, as I said before, the archaeological evidence doesn't matter. Using places that exist in real life to set a fictional story is very commonplace. Even if every piece of archaeological data turned out to be right.... that doesn't prove anything as far as the existence of God, Jesus, or any supernatural claims.

It proves that the Bible as a historical document can be trusted because it accurately records data that is subject to verification by those who seek to understand the cultures, locations, and times it speaks about.

With regards to your statement on Nazareth being founded in 70AD, suffice it to say this is simply not true, nor do I know how you came up with that number.

Nazareth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia