At Crossroads -- Cf's Vision Discussion Thread - Please Vote in Poll Thread

[sparklecat]

The poll being discussed in this thread may be found here:
http://www.christianforums.com/t5787680-at-crossroads-cfs-vision.html


Please post only in this thread so that the related poll is not automatically closed when the thread hits 1000 posts.


Here is Erwin's first post from the poll thread:

Hi members

This poll, started by drstevej, was PMed to me recently. I think that it does make a good point and I wanted it moved out of the Conservative Christians forum to the Announcement forum to gather input from other members as well.

The issue here is whether CF's name should be changed and its vision modified to reflect its current framework.

This site at the moment is at a cross-roads, and can go either way. It can either become:

1. A safe social community site with a heavy and strong Christian influence (with the vision being to offer a safe online community, and a secondary vision being to allow Christians to outreach to non-Christians) - which will allow for a name change;

OR

2. Return to a more restricted Christians-only site with a heavy emphasis on uniting mainstream Christians only with a less emphasis on outreach, in which case we keep the name.

Bear in mind that options 1 and 2 are both valid - there is a place for either forums.

I think that at this moment members are frustrated because CF is halfway between options 1 and 2, so members are confused as we have a vision that belongs to option 2 but a setup that is more like option 1.

Therefore, I think we need to make a decision.

I'm going to leave this up to the community. I've extended the above poll to 3rd of August.

I will listen to the members here, and will defer to the final decision.

Please feel free to discuss this issue in this thread.

 

[drstevej]

Cool new place to discuss.

 

[GreenMunchkin]

Subscribing

 

[Timothy]

Unfortunately, when Erwin worded these options, I think he intended to poison option number 2.

Shame it's been polling between 10-15 percent ahead for a while now then, ain't it? If you take socks out of it, I think we'll find its quite a bit higher.

 

[Hentenza]

How long is the poll going to remain open?

 

[Debi1967]

To the extent that those of us who come here do ask for changes they are more in tune with things like that. What we have argued is points of fairness and specific procedures. We haven't asked CF to change its mission or to stop being a Christian forum. The sweeping changes have come from Erwin; the denial that this should be considered a Christian forum has largely come from conservative members on the forum.

Yes you are asking CF to change it's mission and it has already been reflected by the rules that I have already posted. and if you look above it is not ONLY Conservatives that feel this way..... so please stop blaming all of this on us as though we are the only ones that are at fault and putting up some sort of barrier when we are only doing as we are taught to do in defending God to begin with.

 

[KerrMetric]

I suggest when they count the final totals they do an IP search and make it one vote per IP address.

 

[thereselittleflower]

Well said... but I feel the two are intertwined.

Unity and understanding ARE intertwined, absolutely!

But to acheive the unity of all christianis is impossible at this or any other web site. This is just reality. And we need to face that reality before we can move forward.

Before one can even dream of having unity, one has to strive for understanding.

Understanding IS attainable, IS realistic and IS a workable, doable goal.

So, I propose that we focus on seeking understanding, and not the unattainable goal of uniting all christians in one body.

.

 

[Debi1967]

subscribing

 

[intricatic]

< empty post here >

 

[Beastt]

2, because if this is a CHRISTIAN site, it should be proud to be that...and have it as that.

The problem seems to be that different people have different ideas about what it means to be a "Christian site". Does that mean a site run by Christians or does it just mean a site which adheres to Christian values?

The way CF was, it may have been run by Christians but it didn't reflect or operate on Christian values. The standards of operation were closer to that of The Inquisition or the Crusades than of the values we generally see promoted as "Christian values".

People seem to be missing the point that to be a "Christian site", the values of Christianity need to be first and foremost. Those values include tolerance, kindness, caring and equality. We saw very little of that under the old "Dark curtain" version of CF. It operated more on principles of zero-tolerance, a complete division of classes between Christians and non-Christians with atheists and agnostics serving the position of voiceless peasants, and kindness and caring which went no further than the list of rules which were engineered to perpetuate the class-driven dogma of the forum.

Moving back to the older CF is a move away from being a Christian site. Keeping it on the present course moves it more closely into alignment with the values Christians promote as Christian values. It seems that when it comes to Christian values, there are a great many who want to talk the talk. Ask them to walk the walk, especially if you remove them from positions of exclusive control over others, and they begin screaming that asking them to practice Christian values rather than just talking about them makes the site something other than Christian.

If the site reverts back, it should be a requirement that the word "community" be removed from every page. You can't have a true community when only certain members are represented.

 

[CaDan]

May I again propose that the REAL issue that needs to be decided FIRST is:

What is the VISION of CF?​

The current vision is undoable, unworkable and sets us up for failure. We cannot acheive the original vision as stated . . .it is not possible for this iste to unite all Christians in one body. It is a lofty dream, nothing more.

In order to determine between option 1 or 2 or 3 or any other option, we need a doable, workable, acheivable vision to reach for.


SO, I propose that the VISION of CF needs to change.


Instead of trying to do the impossible, unite all christians in one body, we should try to achieve something real.


I propose that we start with something more along these lines:

Proposed Vision:

Promote understanding, fellowship, and ministry among Christians to each other and to the world​

Once we have a realistic vision, then we can come up with a realistic way to move forward at this site.


.

I'm on the same side as TLF.

Be afraid. Be very afraid.

Oh, and the dollar store had a whole bunch of dried apricots. My bike ride was a stunning success.

 

[HadessahRose]

Perhaps you could invite Him to weigh in on this thread, then.

THIS is the kind of thing I am talking about...athesits being rude to Christians! NOT right NOR fair. Personally I don't think athesist should be in mod/leader positions. HOW can they weigh in on say...Nazerene doctrine etc. IF THEY DON"T KNOW IT? They don't believe in God or want anything to do with Him..SO why??? WHY?? ERWIN? WHY?

 

[JolieHeart]

Unity and understanding ARE intertwined, absolutely!

But to acheive the unity of all christianis is impossible at this or any other web site. This is just reality. And we need to face that reality before we can move forward.

Before one can even dream of having unity, one has to strive for understanding.

Understanding IS attainable, IS realistic and IS a workable, doable goal.

So, I propose that we focus on seeking understanding, and not the unattainable goal of uniting all christians in one body.

.

** Applause **
I hope your post gets re-quoted many times over, so more can see it

*Edit: sorry I did not see the mod's post before I posted this, my apologies.

 

[Lisa0315]

The problem seems to be that different people have different ideas about what it means to be a "Christian site". Does that mean a site run by Christians or does it just mean a site which adheres to Christian values?

The way CF was, it may have been run by Christians but it didn't reflect or operate on Christian values. The standards of operation were closer to that of The Inquisition or the Crusades than of the values we generally see promoted as "Christian values".

People seem to be missing the point that to be a "Christian site", the values of Christianity need to be first and foremost. Those values include tolerance, kindness, caring and equality. We saw very little of that under the old "Dark curtain" version of CF. It operated more on principles of zero-tolerance, a complete division of classes between Christians and non-Christians with atheists and agnostics serving the position of voiceless peasants, and kindness and caring which went no further than the list of rules which were engineered to perpetuate the class-driven dogma of the forum.

Moving back to the older CF is a move away from being a Christian site. Keeping it on the present course moves it more closely into alignment with the values Christians promote as Christian values. It seems that when it comes to Christian values, there are a great many who want to talk the talk. Ask them to walk the walk, especially if you remove them from positions of exclusive control over others, and they begin screaming that asking them to practice Christian values rather than just talking about them makes the site something other than Christian.

This is why we need to inclusive of non-Christians! They, who are apart from us, can sometimes see us more clearly than we can see ourselves!



Lisa

 

[intricatic]

The problem seems to be that different people have different ideas about what it means to be a "Christian site". Does that mean a site run by Christians or does it just mean a site which adheres to Christian values?

The way CF was, it may have been run by Christians but it didn't reflect or operate on Christian values. The standards of operation were closer to that of The Inquisition or the Crusades than of the values we generally see promoted as "Christian values".

Please cite your sources to express the values you presuppose as Christian. Thanks. Also cite examples of how those values are to be utilized in context of this discussion.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

sorry didnt see your mod hat till too late, you can delete this, I posted in other thread

 

[ALiberalTeen]

THIS is the kind of thing I am talking about...athesits being rude to Christians! NOT right NOR fair. Personally I don't think athesist should be in mod/leader positions. HOW can they weigh in on say...Nazerene doctrine etc. IF THEY DON"T KNOW IT? They don't believe in God or want anything to do with Him..SO why??? WHY?? ERWIN? WHY?

Over dramatic are we?

We already have non-Christian mods, and you know what? their doing a better job then 3/4 of the Christian mods

 

[CaDan]

Nah, dialectic is for communists.

And German theologians.

 

[Debi1967]

I suggest when they count the final totals they do an IP search and make it one vote per IP address.

I second this