Assisted Suicide...

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
Look up Maria Schiavo Schindler. I can see a zillion loop-holes in this amigo.

Schiavo's case, IMO, was more straightforward. She could never have lived so what was the point of keeping her technically 'alive' but brain dead any longer?

Whoa there soldier. Are you familiar with the case? If so, to what degree? Where did you get your information?

*eyes widen incredulously*

 

[stan1980]

Look up Theresa Marie Schindler Schiavo. I can see a zillion loop-holes in this amigo.

I had a quick look at the case on wikipedia, could you tell me where you see the loopholes, just so we're clear on what we're about to discuss. Thanks!

 

[Psudopod]

Whoa there soldier. Are you familiar with the case? If so, to what degree? Where did you get your information?

*eyes widen incredulously*

The fundamental difference with that case and this one is that Terri could not give concent, whether she wanted to or not. The case mentioned in the op was fully mental funtioning and this was his choice.

The water does get a lot murkier when a person cannot give concent at the time. Living wills are one thing, but until one has lived with a condition, you cannot access how you are going to deal with it.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

Whoa there soldier. Are you familiar with the case? If so, to what degree? Where did you get your information?

*eyes widen incredulously*

I'm fairly familiar with it and got my information from wikipedia, the BBC, The Guardian and sites linked to from CF at the time.
When I say the case was straightforward I'm not including insane right-wing nuts..so I realise there was controversy, but it was between common sense and idiots.

 

[brinny]

Whoa there soldier. Are you familiar with the case? If so, to what degree? Where did you get your information?

*eyes widen incredulously*

The fundamental difference with that case and this one is that Terri could not give concent, whether she wanted to or not. The case mentioned in the op was fully mental funtioning and this was his choice.

The water does get a lot murkier when a person cannot give concent at the time. Living wills are one thing, but until one has lived with a condition, you cannot access how you are going to deal with it.

well now, that's my point exactly...

not always so light n' breezy....

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
Whoa there soldier. Are you familiar with the case? If so, to what degree? Where did you get your information?

*eyes widen incredulously*

I'm fairly familiar with it and got my information from wikipedia, the BBC, The Guardian and sites linked to from CF at the time.
When I say the case was straightforward I'm not including insane right-wing nuts..so I realise there was controversy, but it was between common sense and idiots.

You do not have enough information. Before coming to any conclusions i suggest you do more research.

 

[stan1980]

I think I might carry a note in my wallet saying something along the lines of:

"In the event that I am in an accident, and my quality of life is so low and I am not able to communicate I'd like to be killed. This includes and is not restricted to severe brain or spinal injuries. If there is doubt or a mixed consensus over whether I would 'want to live' then that should confirm I would definitely want to die!"

Trouble is, I haven't really got any family I'm on speaking terms with, so the note will likely get ignored by the doctors, unless there are changes in the law.

 

[brinny]

I think I might carry a note in my wallet saying something along the lines of:

"In the event that I am in an accident, and my quality of life is so low and I am not able to communicate I'd like to be killed. This includes and is not restricted to severe brain or spinal injuries. If there is doubt or a mixed consensus over whether I would 'want to live' then that should confirm I would definitely want to die!"

Trouble is, I haven't really got any family I'm on speaking terms with, so the note will likely get ignored by the doctors, unless there are changes in the law.

good for you. how sweet to have that privelege to actually agree with those that carry out your wishes.

yet there is another side. Look a little further than your comfort zone.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

You do not have enough information. Before coming to any conclusions i suggest you do more research.

Given that I've already researched from a number of sources, could you recommend anywhere else I should look?

 

[stan1980]

good for you. how sweet to have that privelege to actually agree with those that carry out your wishes.

yet there is another side. Look a little further than your comfort zone.

Erm, you're sounding a little cryptic, care to elaborate? And what do you mean "agree with those that carry out your wishes", as far as I'm aware, and as the law stands, they wont be able to carry out my wishes.

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
good for you. how sweet to have that privelege to actually agree with those that carry out your wishes.

yet there is another side. Look a little further than your comfort zone.

Erm, you're sounding a little cryptic, care to elaborate.

you can't possibly be that naive.....

the loopholes amigo, the loopholes.....in your wildest of imaginings, can you see...waaaay outta your comfort zone, outta your reality how there can be loopholes to use this assisted suicide in a dastardly twist of not-nice-ness?

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

good for you. how sweet to have that privelege to actually agree with those that carry out your wishes.

yet there is another side. Look a little further than your comfort zone.

Do you write horoscopes and predictions in Chinese crackers for a living?

 

[stan1980]

you can't possibly be that naive.....

the loopholes amigo, the loopholes.....in your wildest of imaginings, can you see...waaaay outta your comfort zone, outta your reality how there can be loopholes to use this assisted suicide in a dastardly twist of not-nice-ness?

Oh, you mean someone might use it as an excuse to bump me off? Thing is, if someone wants to kill me, they can do anyway, perhaps this will make it a little easier for them, but who cares, I wont be around to care if that was to happen.

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
you can't possibly be that naive.....

the loopholes amigo, the loopholes.....in your wildest of imaginings, can you see...waaaay outta your comfort zone, outta your reality how there can be loopholes to use this assisted suicide in a dastardly twist of not-nice-ness?

Oh, you mean someone might use it as an excuse to bump me off? Thing is, if someone wants to kill me, they can do anyway, perhaps this will make it a little easier for them, but who cares, I wont be around to care if that was to happen.

Well we all love you stan...and how nice of you to share about you once more....but surely you know i mean those that are more vulnerable.....

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
good for you. how sweet to have that privelege to actually agree with those that carry out your wishes.

yet there is another side. Look a little further than your comfort zone.

Do you write horoscopes and predictions in Chinese crackers for a living?

why? you got some pointers?

 

[stan1980]

Well we all love you stan...and how nice of you to share about you once more....but surely you know i mean those that are more vulnerable.....

I have faith, maybe I'm naive, that common sense will prevail. If we have a system in place similar to donor cards, that should help ensure doctors don't kill people who wouldn't have wanted to be killed.

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
Well we all love you stan...and how nice of you to share about you once more....but surely you know i mean those that are more vulnerable.....

I have faith, maybe I'm naive, that common sense will prevail. If we have a system in place similar to donor cards, that should help ensure doctors don't kill people who wouldn't have wanted to be killed.

that all ya' got...?

where do you live amigo?

*looks at screen incredulously*

 

[stan1980]

that all ya' got...?

where do you live amigo?

*looks at screen incredulously*

Well lets hear it then, what have you got?

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
that all ya' got...?

where do you live amigo?

*looks at screen incredulously*

Well lets hear it then, what have you got?

well back a ways i posted a name. this one:

Marie Schindler Schiavo. Did you check it out? And if so, just how deep did you dig?

 

[Psudopod]

well now, that's my point exactly...

not always so light n' breezy....

You bought up a case that is very different. Yes, there are different situations, but we were speaking of a specific case. Some cases are more complicated than others, so lets focus on the ones that aren't first.

Personally, what I want is a change in the law that allows any adult of sound mental ability who is fully aware of the specifics of their condition, if they coose to be allowed access to life terminating drugs at a time of their choosing and proffessional help to administer them if the patient is unable to do it themselves.

I do not want an end to pallative care, I do not want the elderly or sick to made to feel a burden and I do not want termiation in every case. I just want people who are in the position to make that decision to have the right to have thier wishes carried out.

I'm not sure how I feel about living wills. I think the decision should have nothing to do with the family, and can certainly understand and respect someone's wishes when they say they do not want to live in that sort of state, I still feel it's a bit less cut and dry than the situations where the patient can say firmly "I am not happy with my quality of life and my prospects, I would like to die now."