Ask a Christian philosopher a question

[Chriliman]

I would agree with you.

Theists tend to base their beliefs on "needs" and "needs" can be blind to reality, because the need will often, be a priority over well evidenced reality.

Right, but the problem is we can't divorce ourselves from our need to believe in something. It's impossible to live as a human being and not believe in anything. We are built with an inherent need to believe.

 

[Chriliman]

One question we can ask is: Why are we all built with an inherent need to believe?

It's as if something beyond us, wants us to believe in it and created us in such a way that we could believe in it, but are not forced to believe in it.

 

[HitchSlap]

To me that is the problem with Atheism. Atheists will agree to not believe in God, but then continue to try and figure out reality and not understand why they can't figure it out in a way that brings all of reality together in a way that makes sense to them personally.

What makes you think I (atheists) haven't "figured it out in a way that brings all of reality together in a way that makes sense to" me personally? As a matter of fact, when I accepted the fact I was atheist, things never made more sense than they do now. Just because humans are able of conceiving a certain reality, doesn't make it reality. As an atheist, I can accept what we know, and accept what we don't. You on the other hand, are forced to accept every absurdities on "faith."

You tell me which is the intellectually honest position.

 

[Chriliman]

What makes you think I (atheists) haven't "figured it out in a way that brings all of reality together in a way that makes sense to" me personally? As a matter of fact, when I accepted the fact I was atheist, things never made more sense than they do now? Just because humans are able of conceiving a certain reality, doesn't make it reality. As an atheist, I can accept what we know, and accept what we don't. You on the other hand, are forced to accept every absurdities on "faith."

You tell me which is the intellectually honest position.

As an intellectually honest atheist, can you answer the question as to why we're all built with an inherit need to believe?

 

[Davian]

As an intellectually honest atheist, can you answer the question as to why we're all built with an inherit need to believe?

Your question is loaded, with the presumption that we are "built". Try again.

 

[Chriliman]

Your question is loaded, with the presumption that we are "built". Try again.

If you believe evolution is true then without evolution you wouldn't exist as a human being. Isn't it then safe to say that evolution built or constructed the necessary components that makes you a human being right now?

 

[Davian]

If you believe evolution is true then without evolution you wouldn't exist as a human being. Isn't it then safe to say that evolution built or constructed the necessary components that makes you a human being right now?

No, as evolution, as a term, is simply descriptive, it is not a "cause". It does not build anything.

Try again, as if semantics can poof your god into existence. lol.

 

[bhsmte]

Right, but the problem is we can't divorce ourselves from our need to believe in something. It's impossible to live as a human being and not believe in anything. We are built with an inherent need to believe.

What is built in, is the need to figure things out and come up with explanations as to why they are as they are.

Depending on one's individual psyche, this can cause them to latch onto God and or religion as the explanation for everything. Others, have a psyche that leads them down the path of rolling over every rock and seeking more objective verification to achieve explanations.

 

[HitchSlap]

As an intellectually honest atheist, can you answer the question as to why we're all built with an inherit need to believe?

I like what Dr. Dennett has to say on the subject.

 

[Chriliman]

No, as evolution, as a term, is simply descriptive, it is not a "cause". It does not build anything.

Try again, as if semantics can poof your god into existence. lol.

Now I'm perplexed. I thought evolution is believed to be the process by which all biological life developed. This process "built" the components that make us human. How else do they teach this concept in schools? Do they say the process of evolution didn't build anything? It's just magic? Cmon Davian you're being silly.

 

[Chriliman]

What is built in, is the need to figure things out and come up with explanations as to why they are as they are.

Depending on one's individual psyche, this can cause them to latch onto God and or religion as the explanation for everything. Others, have a psyche that leads them down the path of rolling over every rock and seeking more objective verification to achieve explanations.

Sure, but to what end? What if you run out of rocks to roll over? Are you going to go back and roll over the same rocks and expect different results?

 

[bhsmte]

Sure, but to what end? What if you run out of rocks to roll over? Are you going to go back and roll over the same rocks and expect different results?

You never really run out of rocks, or examining the rocks, but assuming you did, you have two choices; make something up, or say; I don't know.

Religion tends to make stuff up, because they need to have an answer for everything. Science on the other hand, has no problem saying; we don't know.

When the police investigate a murder and they have examined all of the evidence and it doesn't point to any suspect, they don't just pin the crime on someone the make up, they say they don't know and keep investigating.

 

[HitchSlap]

Religion tends to make stuff up, because they need to have an answer for everything. Science on the other hand, has no problem saying; we don't know.

This, IMO, is what scares people to death. The idea that we don't know, and may never know, answers to life's deepest questions. That's the attraction of religion, in large part, the fact that they all make up explanations to assuage those fears.

 

[Davian]

Now I'm perplexed. I thought evolution is believed to be the process by which all biological life developed. This process "built" the components that make us human. How else do they teach this concept in schools?

You tell me. Have you attended classes in evolutionary biology?

Do they say the process of evolution didn't build anything? It's just magic?

No, 'magic' is what the religionists invoke.

Cmon Davian you're being silly.

To use the term 'evolution' as having 'built' humans [falsely] implies that evolution has targets. It doesn't.

Try again. Do you really think you can semantically work your god into existence?

 

[Chriliman]

You tell me. Have you attended classes in evolutionary biology?

I've learned enough about evolution to realize it is commonly believed to be the process by which all biological life developed. So without the process of evolution, humans would not exist. So the process of evolution made us into humans who have an inherit need to believe in things.

The unanswered question is: why did the process of evolution make us with an inherit need to believe in things? Why aren't we beings that can know everything and not have to believe things? Why did the process of evolution limit us in this particular way that conveniently leaves God as a viable possibility at all times?

I fully expect intelligent high school and college students to ask such questions regarding evolution and God, if they don't then they are submitting themselves to brainwashing.

 

[HitchSlap]

I've learned enough about evolution to realize it is commonly believed to be the process by which all biological life developed. So without the process of evolution, humans would not exist. So the process of evolution made us into humans who have an inherit need to believe in things.

The unanswered question is: why did the process of evolution make us with an inherit need to believe in things? Why aren't we beings that can know everything and not have to believe things? Why did the process of evolution limit us in this particular way that conveniently leaves God as a viable possibility at all times?

I fully expect intelligent high school and college students to ask such questions regarding evolution and God, if they don't then they are submitting themselves to brainwashing.

Watch the videos I posted. Dr. Dennett answers all your questions.

 

[Chriliman]

You never really run out of rocks, or examining the rocks, but assuming you did, you have two choices; make something up, or say; I don't know.

Religion tends to make stuff up, because they need to have an answer for everything. Science on the other hand, has no problem saying; we don't know.

When the police investigate a murder and they have examined all of the evidence and it doesn't point to any suspect, they don't just pin the crime on someone the make up, they say they don't know and keep investigating.

The question then is: Why don't we know everything? What is limiting us from knowing everything? Why did the process of evolution make us in such a way that we are limited in our knowledge of reality? Why do we have an inherit need to believe in things and why is God still a viable possibility to believe? Why can we ask questions like this?

It seems obvious that we're meant to ask questions like this.

 

[Chriliman]

Watch the videos I posted. Dr. Dennett answers all your questions.

I watched it, up until he said theists don't believe in God, then I stopped it. That'd be like me saying atheists actually believe in God, but just claim they don't.

He said rely on the experts, which I find to be a great way to get brainwashed into believing something that an "expert", like Dr. Dennett, believes.

 

[bhsmte]

The question then is: Why don't we know everything? What is limiting us from knowing everything? Why did the process of evolution make us in such a way that we are limited in our knowledge of reality? Why do we have an inherit need to believe in things and why is God still a viable possibility to believe? Why can we ask questions like this?

It seems obvious that we're meant to ask questions like this.

We seem to know more and more about reality as time goes on, would you agree?

Because we don't know everything, seems to give some folks inner turmoil and they have to make stuff up, to fill that gap.

Follow the lead of Hitchslap, watch the Dennett video, and he explains the need to believe very well.

 

[Davian]

You tell me. Have you attended classes in evolutionary biology?

I've

That's a "no", then?

learned enough about evolution to realize it is commonly believed to be the process by which all biological life developed. So without the process of evolution, humans would not exist. So the process of evolution made us into humans who have an inherit need to believe in things.

Not necessarily. The critter that made tentative assumptions about things may have a slight evolutionary advantage over its competition that could not, or not as well. Selection pressure, even slight, favoured those critters. The other ones have fewer offspring, or die out, and lose the chance to become our ancestors.

The unanswered question is: why did the process of evolution make us with an inherit need to believe in things?

Evolutionarily speaking, it may have given our ancestors a slight advantage over their competition. It may be the by-product of some other evolved and inherited trait.

"Souls, spirits, ghosts, gods, demons, angels, aliens, intelligent designers, government conspirators, and all manner of invisible agents with power and intention are believed to haunt our world and control our lives. Why?"

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/skeptic-agenticity/

Why aren't we beings that can know everything and not have to believe things? Why did the process of evolution limit us in this particular way that conveniently leaves God as a viable possibility at all times?

How are "gods" a viable possibility? Explain. What is a "god"?

I fully expect intelligent high school and college students to ask such questions regarding evolution and God,

My childrens' biology class did spend a day or two on creationism, just to go over how it does not comport with science.

if they don't then they are submitting themselves to brainwashing.

Do you consider all education that you disagree with to be "brainwashing"?