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Pleased to meet youcajunhillbilly said:Hi there.I am an Anglican Calvinist. So is J I Packer. It is true that many evangelical Anglicans tend to be Arminian, but that is not surprising since the majority of evangelicals tend to be Arminian since that's all they know.
What church are you a member of now?Street Preacher said:I was a calvinist Anglican...before I left that church.
I attend a Baptist Church, but I still have a place in my heart for the Canadian BCP...cajunhillbilly said:What church are you a member of now?
God glorifies Himself because there is no-one more worthy.skeptic7 said:Sorry, this question was touched a little bit earlier, but...
What is the point to all of this if God ultimately decides who goes to heaven? If the answer is to glorify god, is it really glorifying God if you don't even choose it on your own will, or is it just the fact that he created that and that is why its glorifying to him? If So why would God want to be glorified? Is he lacking something? If so, then that obviously can't be God.
This is pretty much a simplified version of a series of questions, but i think the point is brought across, so i would appreciate it if people clear up my "misconsceptions".
thanks,
-Kyle
seems kinda logical,if He did things for "anothers Glory" that would mean something is higher than Himself.............impossible.skeptic7 said:seems kinda self-centered, for a loving god
skeptic7 said:I'm not saying he does things for anothers glory, but i'm saying if he creates us so he can glorify himself, it seems self centered/point less. What i am saying is, what I believe is God created us so that we could share in his glory, because god is generous and loving.
You do choose it on your own will, Kyle. However, your will is both extensionally limited and inescapably related to your nature. The unregenerate sinner can no more will to exercise faith in God than I can will to breathe in the vacuum of space. But first, God says, "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh." The blind cannot see until their sight has been restored; and, once restored, they are seeing on their own God is not doing their seeing for them.skeptic7 said:Sorry, this question was touched a little bit earlier, but... What is the point to all of this if God ultimately decides who goes to heaven? If the answer is to glorify god, is it really glorifying God if you don't even choose it on your own will, or is it just the fact that he created that and that is why its glorifying to him?
Romans 10:13-15 "for, 'Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.' How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? And how can they preach unless they are sent? As it is written, 'How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!'"Carly said:Okay, but I think our question is more of why does God want the Gospel proclaimed if it doesn't matter in regards to people's salvation or lack thereof?
Very good question. Even Arminianist must answers this one. I say because God wants someting more--to express the full exent of his Glory. Non Calvinists say that He does not want to vioate "free will".Qoheleth said:Well, Im confused. If we as Christians define God as pure Love first (yes he demonstrates justice and mercy) then why wouldnt God choose (as pure love would) to save everybody not just a few or even a large number but all.
Do you burn with wrath towards your children?Likewise, if my three children were lost, would I, out of our limited human love only try to find (save) one and not the others. Of course not, my children are equals in my heart and I would save them all. Isnt Gods love far more pure and complete than mine??
So you think that God is going to save all people, no matter what? You believe that God is willing to comprimise with sin? That he will tolerate sin? God does not teach this in his word, The Bible.Qoheleth said:Whether or not we are enemies (due to sin-separation) and His glory must be expressed as you say, Love as we have seen, may conquer all of this by a relationship of volition.
You emphasize his love, but overlook his justice. Because we are slaves to our own nature, God must choose who he will draw to himself, because no man seeks God by thier own power.Qoheleth said:I Most certainly do not believe in universal salvation. No, the Father does not compromise with sin and neither will he tolerate its ultimate end. He has sent his son to effectively reverse the sin of Adam in creation. Though he has tolerated it (sin) for some time now, he will not allow it to ultimately destroy his creations.
But, again, as the Trinity is a relationship of love and thence created man in its image Genesis 1: 26-27, a relationship of love, creating a relationship (humans/Trinity) in love, and this condition of love is demonstarted throughout history as the Father is seen to initiate the healing, calling, guiding, reproving, disciplining, scolding and yet, always because of love and the intrisic qualities of love that he alone holds as described in 1 Corinthians 13 to a degree that we can not begin to achieve.
Since your not Calvinist, you can't argue here. I've answered your question. God must chose who he will save because we are totally depraved (Spiritually dead). Since all people are not saved, then we know that it is because God did not save.Quheleth said:I agree that God must exercise justice. But if His foremost attribute was Justice, then He must temper justice with mercy and because of pure love, he must have mercy on us all equally or the scripture is false concerning 1 Corinthians 13.
Did God create out of justice, mercy or Love. What does Jesus describe the greatest virtue to be...Love
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