Aren't we all physically ill?

[Boidae]

Your daughter may have a bladder infection, has she seen a doctor?

We called the doctor, he told us what to do and he didn't indicate that it was a bladder infection.

He said to give his instructions 12 hours and if it doesn't improve to call the office and bring her in.

 

[Boidae]

has your daughter seen a doctor, she may have a bladder infection.

Or is she being molested by someone?

I would really look into both possibilities.

And all you have is a headache?

Unless she has been molested by my wife or I, that isn't a possibility.

As I stated in my other reply to you, we are following the doctor's instructions as we had to page him as he was out of the office. If after 12 hours there is no improvement, then we can call to bring her in tomorrow.

Oh and yes, only a headache. Which thankfully after taking an ibuprofen went away.

 

[Frogster]

Oh, that's a terrible reading of that passage. That doesn't make any sense in light of the rest of the context. According to this line of thinking, Aaron didn't have lack of spiritual understanding because he could already speak well, but the understanding of Moses was being taken away by God, and then Moses would be as "God" of Aaron and give him (who understands) the words who speaks (from who doesn't understand).

Then the anger of the Lord was kindled against Moses and he said, “Is there not Aaron, your brother, the Levite? I know that he can speak well. Behold, he is coming out to meet you, and when he sees you, he will be glad in his heart. You shall speak to him and put the words in his mouth, and I will be with your mouth and with his mouth and will teach you both what to do. He shall speak for you to the people, and he shall be your mouth, and you shall be as God to him.
Ex 4:14-17​

amen.

 

[Frogster]

Well, I stood on God's promise of healing that cover any aspect of life that needs healing... and I've been healed from poverty (healing of the wallet), healed from addiction (healing of the soul), and I've not been sick in over 25 years (physical health)

It turns out... scripture actually DOES support God's doctrine of being a good God that desires to reverse the curse for His Children!

God also says that promise heirs suffer, whatcha say to that?



Rom 8:17 and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.


so even those who have faith, are called to suffer, no??!!



Phil 1:29 For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake,

 

[Frogster]

That means He is taking away their understanding, He is speaking spiritually.
He is not the cause of our infirmity, we are. WE are deaf. dumb and blind to truth.

read the verse before, moses had a speech impediment, please prove the text is about spiritual things, as I asked already.

 

[Gospel Guy]

God also says that promise heirs suffer, whatcha say to that?

We are called to resist that which Jesus went to the Cross of Calvary to deliver us from whether it be sin, sickness, poverty, or any other darkness that Adam's union with satan brought upon mankind.

Jesus said in Mark 4:14-20 the devil will attempt to use persecution, affliction, cares of this world, lusts of other things, and deceitfulness of riches... to choke the Word out of our lives so it becomes unfruitful... causing us to be no threat to the forces of darkness.

Psalm 34:19
The righteous person may have many troubles, but the LORD delivers him from them all

Yeah, the enemy is always trying something... but the Lord always delivers us IF we submit our lives to Him, resist the devil causing him to flee (James 4:7) because the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds (2 Corinthians 10:4)

What Moses experienced is not applicable under the New Covenant because Jesus took our infirmities upon His Body, so our body could go free as our entire being is now property of the Lord... and if we submit our entire lives to Him... He'll get health to us!

That should help clear things up for you

 

[Frogster]

As far as God is concerned, the Covenant started with Abraham...

I thought you would have known that... yeah, the law came later but that's not when God gained entry into the earth thru the Covenant He made with His friend Abraham which is where it all started

excuse me, but exodus 4:11, predates the old and new cov, and you can not refute the fact, that God said what he said, can you?

 

[Frogster]

As far as God is concerned, the Covenant started with Abraham...

I thought you would have known that... yeah, the law came later but that's not when God gained entry into the earth thru the Covenant He made with His friend Abraham which is where it all started

so did God create the heavens and the earth, like he said, pre new cov?

 

[Gospel Guy]

excuse me, but exodus 4:11, predates the old and new cov, and you can not refute the fact, that God said what he said, can you?

That is not even applicable to us today... under the OT God had to kill a bunch of people for the purposes of protecting His people so He could get Jesus in to the earth to provide salvation so you and I would not go to hell.

Ya gotta look at the big picture instead of taking one quote like that and claim God and the devil are the same guy!

What Jesus said in John 10:10 takes precedence over Exodus 4:11 due to the fact we are under the New Covenant now...

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath He obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also He is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

 

[FoundInGrace]

That means He is taking away their understanding, He is speaking spiritually.
He is not the cause of our infirmity, we are. WE are deaf. dumb and blind to truth.

Romans 11:32

For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

 

[Jere209]

MOD HAT ON

This thread has undergone a minor cleaning due to rule violations. At the beginning of the thread, the OP specifically states "for discussion only". While discussion has happened, somewhere a few feet have slipped off that pathway and entered the "Do not enter" zone . Please, discuss and do not disrespect. You can do both by remembering we're all on this journey together, and we all have feelings.

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[Boidae]

has your daughter seen a doctor, she may have a bladder infection.

Or is she being molested by someone?

I would really look into both possibilities.

And all you have is a headache?

I just wanted to give an update on my daughter. She is much better this morning. So at this point the doctor has said not to bring her in.

 

[Frogster]

That is not even applicable to us today... under the OT God had to kill a bunch of people for the purposes of protecting His people so He could get Jesus in to the earth to provide salvation so you and I would not go to hell.

Ya gotta look at the big picture instead of taking one quote like that and claim God and the devil are the same guy!

What Jesus said in John 10:10 takes precedence over Exodus 4:11 due to the fact we are under the New Covenant now...

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath He obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also He is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

Your hebrews citation does not really fit in here.ummmmmm....


so did God create the heavens and the earth, like he said, pre new cov?



Did God say it in 4:11, or not?






Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

 

[Jere209]

Reminder once again. I'd hate to see this thread be shut down .

MOD HAT ON

This thread has undergone a minor cleaning due to rule violations. At the beginning of the thread, the OP specifically states "for discussion only". While discussion has happened, somewhere a few feet have slipped off that pathway and entered the "Do not enter" zone . Please, discuss and do not disrespect. You can do both by remembering we're all on this journey together, and we all have feelings.

● Do not insult, belittle, mock, goad, personally attack, threaten, harass, or use derogatory nicknames in reference to other members or groups of members. Address the context of the post, not the poster.

MOD HAT OFF
​

 

[Gospel Guy]

Your hebrews citation does not really fit in here.ummmmmm....

It reveals that we are under a New Covenant now... based on better promises such as revelation of what Jesus did for us at the Cross and revelation of what is actually going on in the spirit.

None of this was available under the OT and yes I understand and realize that some today cling to the OT and no little of what it means to be a New Covenant believer.

 

[Always in His Presence]

For the sake of the discussion, Jim, could you please clarify what you mean by the title off this thread please.

Are you saying that everyone is sick. And if so, what leads you to such a conclusion?

Thank you in advance for your response.

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

I have been blessed by this thread. A lot of truth has come forth in these pages.

One scripture that has been on my heart lately is:

Mathew 17
14 And when they had come to the multitude, a man came to Him, kneeling down to Him and saying, 15 “Lord, have mercy on my son, for he is an epileptic and suffers severely; for he often falls into the fire and often into the water. 16 So I brought him to Your disciples, but they could not cure him.”
17 Then Jesus answered and said, “O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? How long shall I bear with you? Bring him here to Me.” 18 And Jesus rebuked the demon, and it came out of him; and the child was cured from that very hour.
19 Then the disciples came to Jesus privately and said, “Why could we not cast it out?”
20 So Jesus said to them, “Because of your unbelief; for assuredly, I say to you, if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible for you. 21 However, this kind does not go out except by prayer and fasting.”




Regarding healing:

The part that's often intrigued me is the "prayer and fasting" part Jesus talked about in this passage. I don't hear many messages on this type of fasting.



Any comments on this type of fasting and healing/deliverance?

 

[Yitzchak]

I have been blessed by this thread. A lot of truth has come forth in these pages.

One scripture that has been on my heart lately is:

Mathew 17
14 And when they had come to the multitude, a man came to Him, kneeling down to Him and saying, 15 “Lord, have mercy on my son, for he is an epileptic and suffers severely; for he often falls into the fire and often into the water. 16 So I brought him to Your disciples, but they could not cure him.”
17 Then Jesus answered and said, “O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? How long shall I bear with you? Bring him here to Me.” 18 And Jesus rebuked the demon, and it came out of him; and the child was cured from that very hour.
19 Then the disciples came to Jesus privately and said, “Why could we not cast it out?”
20 So Jesus said to them, “Because of your unbelief; for assuredly, I say to you, if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible for you. 21 However, this kind does not go out except by prayer and fasting.”




Regarding healing:

The part that's often intrigued me is the "prayer and fasting" part Jesus talked about in this passage. I don't hear many messages on this type of fasting.



Any comments on this type of fasting and healing/deliverance?

I have heard a few sermons on the passage about fasting. one of the churches that used to attend had a prayer team who worked to altar calls at the end of the services and it was their practice to fast on Saturdays. They often talked about the verse that says this kind goeth forth only by prayer and fasting. They did have a very successful and anointed prayer time every week.

 

[JimB]

I have heard a few sermons on the passage about fasting. one of the churches that used to attend had a prayer team who worked to altar calls at the end of the services and it was their practice to fast on Saturdays. They often talked about the verse that says this kind goeth forth only by prayer and fasting. They did have a very successful and anointed prayer time every week.

Actually Matt. 17.21 is one of those missing verses in every reputable modern translations of the Bible (ESV, NIV, NLT, GNT, ERV, CJB, etc. see here) and is relegated to a footnote to explain why it is a dubious inclusion into the original. In my opinion, based on this, Jesus NEVER said “This kind goes not out without prayer and fasting.” Personally, through the years, I have cast out many demons and have yet to fast in order to accomplish the feat. I simply exercised the authority of Jesus’ name. Otherwise, there is nothing I have done or could ever do to subjugate a demon to my will.

 

[Frogster]

It reveals that we are under a New Covenant now... based on better promises such as revelation of what Jesus did for us at the Cross and revelation of what is actually going on in the spirit.

None of this was available under the OT and yes I understand and realize that some today cling to the OT and no little of what it means to be a New Covenant believer.

Ummmm, (red above) Abe was just under the OT....

believe me, i am pro grace, and NT, but friend, Jesus is the same yesterday, and today, and God said ex 4:11, so we can't just chuck out everything said. He said he did it, no?

What about all the other things he said, did he make the heavens and the earth?

Did he not allow David to live, when his old cov demanded death? See Heb 10:28, and 2:2, died without mercy, demanded retribution, as per the law, yet what did God do? Let David live in spite of his own law, God is sovereign.

See? Is God not allowed to do as he sees fit?

In other words, you can't just hang your whole argument one idea, you must go by the whole of the logos.

Did he not say he did it in Ex 4:11? Is Jesus not the same yesterday and today?

be blessed bro...


I guess God did not make the heavens and the earth, after all, chuck out Genesis, we can't listen to God.