Are you scared of death?

[bhsmte]

You are the only human being on the planet without an instinct for self preservation then. Would you be afraid if you saw a hungry lion heading in your direction?

Different situation, fight or flight and the hormones take over, to create fear to help you survive.

I would think, most everyone is scared of being maimed or suffering a horrifying injury and the suffering that would go along with it, while still being alive, but when it comes to actual death that is somewhat natural, I really don't believe the same fears apply and I have seen many people die a natural death and appeared quite at peace with themselves.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Different situation, fight or flight and the hormones take over, to create fear to help you survive.

I would think, most everyone is scared of being maimed or suffering a horrifying injury and the suffering that would go along with it, while still being alive, but when it comes to actual death that is somewhat natural, I really don't believe the same fears apply and I have seen many people die a natural death and appeared quite at peace with themselves.

The reaction to death varies from person to person. Some people do die essentially kicking and screaming.

 

[bhsmte]

The instinct for self preservation wouldn't work very well if it only made you scared of death under certain specialised circumstances, such as a predator heading in your direction. It makes you scared of death under each and every circumstance.

If people didn't fear death, there wouldn't be much point in capital punishment, would there?

The pent up fear from capital punishment comes from, the person knows the exact time it will happen.

How many people know the exact moment they will die?

 

[Freodin]

-_- you don't lose it, you use it. And food can be replaced, I can't in any direct or reliable sense replace lost years on my life.

So you fear to be alive then? "Lost years"... you say. Well, yes, every year gone is a year lost... in the same sense as the meal.

But you are right: food can be replaced (though this very meal is gone, forever lost in the depths of entropy ). Some things cannot be replaced... this is why we value them more than the replacables.

And I can understand why you would fear losing something irreplacable: because then you have to go on without it, knowing what you lost and missing it.

But it is the last part that doesn't apply to life. You will not go on. You will not know and you will not miss.

Life is the one and only thing that you can loose without regretting it.

 

[Eudaimonist]

You see, I have existed, I have formed memories, a personality, a history, and I continue to do so. Death, from my perspective, will erase all that I have and ever could have been.

I see.

I don't know if this will help, but I personally found the thought of my eventual death difficult to bear when I was about your age. (I don't mean that to sound patronizing.)

I think the reason was that I knew that a great deal of my life was still ahead of me. I had so many potentials to fulfill, so much to experience, so many dreams to pursue. So much of my life would have been lost were I to die in my early twenties.

Now that I'm in my forties, I feel that I had a chance to live my life. I still have a few decades left, hopefully, but I could die without feeling cheated. I had a decent opportunity to explore being myself. I'd even be statistically old if I had lived several centuries ago.

I take some comfort as well in that nothing truly erases the past. Sure, death will mean that I won't exist in the present any more, but it will for the rest of eternity be the case that I had lived my life. The opportunity was taken and fulfilled.

Even worse, as a sentient being, I get to [...] watch those I care for one by one meet their absolute end

The death of loved ones can be difficult. I personally focus my thoughts on their lives instead of on their deaths. It is what had existed that really matters, not what fails to exist beyond the boundaries of their personal universes.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[bhsmte]

The reaction to death varies from person to person. Some people do die essentially kicking and screaming.

If they have a gunshot wound, or horrific acute injury, that may be the case and their body is reacting to the pain. In most cases (and I have been in medicine for 20 years), that is not how it happens.

 

[PsychoSarah]

So you fear to be alive then? "Lost years"... you say. Well, yes, every year gone is a year lost... in the same sense as the meal.

But you are right: food can be replaced (though this very meal is gone, forever lost in the depths of entropy ). Some things cannot be replaced... this is why we value them more than the replacables.

And I can understand why you would fear losing something irreplacable: because then you have to go on without it, knowing what you lost and missing it.

But it is the last part that doesn't apply to life. You will not go on. You will not know and you will not miss.

Life is the one and only thing that you can loose without regretting it.

That only applies to once I am actually dead. The anticipation of the loss is the source of the fear, obviously dead people don't fear death (unless somehow they aren't aware that they are dead).

 

[PsychoSarah]

If they have a gunshot wound, or horrific acute injury, that may be the case and their body is reacting to the pain. In most cases (and I have been in medicine for 20 years), that is not how it happens.

I wasn't being literal, I meant that many people, even if they are old and dying surrounded by their family, are still afraid of death even on the day they die.

 

[Freodin]

The instinct for self preservation wouldn't work very well if it only made you scared of death under certain specialised circumstances, such as a predator heading in your direction. It makes you scared of death under each and every circumstance.

If people didn't fear death, there wouldn't be much point in capital punishment, would there?

Every form of capital punishment I have ever observed is extremely unpleasent.

I would fear being shot, electrocuted, hanged, beheaded or poisoned in the same way as I would fear being eaten by a lion... it might not last long, but it is unpleasent enough to kill you.

I cannot say, naturally, whether peacefully dying in your sleep is something to be feared. None of those who suffered through this has ever reported how it feels.

Yet this is something I do not fear.

 

[Freodin]

That only applies to once I am actually dead. The anticipation of the loss is the source of the fear, obviously dead people don't fear death (unless somehow they aren't aware that they are dead).

Yes, quite correctly. But in this case, it is an unreasonable anticipation of loss.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Yes, quite correctly. But in this case, it is an unreasonable anticipation of loss.

Since when are phobias entirely reasonable? I never claimed my fear of death as being rational. Heck, it would be a lot easier on me if I wasn't afraid.

 

[Freodin]

Since when are phobias entirely reasonable? I never claimed my fear of death as being rational. Heck, it would be a lot easier on me if I wasn't afraid.

*sigh* I know. I understand. And as much as I long to help you, I cannot.

I don't think that I have come to my position in a rational way. It kind of just "came to me". At some point in my life, I realized: hey, it's this way! And everything I try to tell you here is an after-the-epiphany-rationalisation.

Perhaps you might come to see it my way - I certainly hope that it would help you. But I cannot make you.

 

[PsychoSarah]

*sigh* I know. I understand. And as much as I long to help you, I cannot.

I don't think that I have come to my position in a rational way. It kind of just "came to me". At some point in my life, I realized: hey, it's this way! And everything I try to tell you here is an after-the-epiphany-rationalisation.

Perhaps you might come to see it my way - I certainly hope that it would help you. But I cannot make you.

I cannot willfully change such a perception either, and not for a lack of trying.

 

[Davian]

.

 

[prov1810]

We are thinking about this issue from the point of view of an atomized, hyper-individuated culture. But in a culture where the family and/or nation is more real than the individual, the death of an individual wouldn't be so serious. We wouldn't take ourselves seriously if the well-being of the group is the really important thing. It seems like a kinder way to live, but we know from history that a political system that is based on this philosophy will not be kind.

 

[PsychoSarah]

We are thinking about this issue from the point of view of an atomized, hyper-individuated culture. But in a culture where the family and/or nation is more real than the individual, the death of an individual wouldn't be so serious. We wouldn't take ourselves seriously if the well-being of the group is the really important thing. It seems like a kinder way to live, but we know from history that a political system that is based on this philosophy will not be kind.

Well, depends on culture. The United States and many other countries have highly individualistic cultures which emphasize the importance of individual identities and needs. In contrast, collectivist cultures value the group over the individual very consistently, and example of a collectivist culture would be Japan, in general.

 

[Davian]

The instinct for self preservation wouldn't work very well if it only made you scared of death under certain specialised circumstances, such as a predator heading in your direction. It makes you scared of death under each and every circumstance.

If people didn't fear death, there wouldn't be much point in capital punishment, would there?

Is capital punishment, where it is used, doing its job to reduce murder rates?

 

[lesliedellow]

I cannot say, naturally, whether peacefully dying in your sleep is something to be feared. None of those who suffered through this has ever reported how it feels.

Yet this is something I do not fear.

So you are a mountain climber, you slip, and now you find yourself clinging to a rock face by your finger tips, with a 1,000 foot drop below you. You are guaranteed an almost instantaneous death when you hit the ground, so no need to worry about the process of dying, but you would still be terrified of the prospect of death itself.

 

[PsychoSarah]

So you are a mountain climber, you slip, and now you find yourself clinging to a rock face by your finger tips, with a 1,000 foot drop below you. You are guaranteed an almost instantaneous death when you hit the ground, so no need to worry about the process of dying, but you would still be terrified of the prospect of death itself.

He might just be scared from the shock of falling

 

[ThinkForYourself]

Since when are phobias entirely reasonable? I never claimed my fear of death as being rational. Heck, it would be a lot easier on me if I wasn't afraid.

For me it's come with growing older, and I think largely because I've done what I was born to do: continue the species. I'm content.