are you 'saved' at your baptism?

[PurpleRabbit187]

My priest mentioned that 'you were already saved at your baptism'. Is this correct? I'm not very informed about Anglican theology, please help me out. I don't find the BCP to be very clear about this. I don't really understand what being 'saved' is. When my friends describe it to me, the closest thing I can think of is my confirmation . Was I saved at my confirmation???

 

[Albion]

My priest mentioned that 'you were already saved at your baptism'. Is this correct? I'm not very informed about Anglican theology, please help me out. I don't find the BCP to be very clear about this. I don't really understand what being 'saved' is. When my friends describe it to me, the closest thing I can think of is my confirmation . Was I saved at my confirmation???

As is also the case with the Roman Catholic Church, we'd say "yes, you are saved at your baptism." HOWEVER, that's said in a very technical way.

IF you were to die instantly, a moment after having your sins forgiven by baptism, yes, you'd be saved (going to heaven). You'd have fulfilled all that is needed--an act of conversion, renunciation of Satan and sin, a profession of Christ as your Lord and personal Savior, and a declaration of your intent to live a life for Christ.

BUT if you don't die shortly and instead live on, you will probably (shall we say?) commit sins.

We all sin. That being the case, your Baptism ceases to be sufficient in itself to guarantee salvation, even though it remains of great importance in many ways.

 

[everbecoming2007]

I agree with the above and would add that salvation is not just a one time thing, but a process of sanctification, a continual flowering in God's grace, becoming more like Christ, and I believe this process will continue in heaven forever.

The scriptures say that "baptism doth now also save you." All sins are remitted. For those who don't die immediately after baptism, the Eucharist renews our vows and the graces bestowed in baptism. Salvation involves "enduring unto the end."

In many ways grace is already working in our life before we come to the font for baptism. Grace is working in the community and the parents or guardians who bring the infant to baptism. The same is true for an adult coming into the church, but an adult can speak for himself. For an adult, faith has already been stirred up through the Word and many other ways, and Christ is already drawing that person through his graces, which leads to baptism. The Church historically has tended to recognize that a person desiring baptism would still be saved even if death occurred before the baptism could be completed. Thus I would say the process of salvation begins before baptism, is sealed in baptism, continues to flower through participation in the liturgy and the Eucharist and the process of sanctification, and transformation will even continue in heaven when we shall "see him as he is."

Now our catechism and prayer book is pretty straightforward about this stuff -- the basics of it are that the sacraments are generally necessary to salvation, and the graces of salvation are truly bestowed in baptism and nourished in the Eucharist. We don't officially go into that much detail as there is no need to, and Anglicans may differ on some of the non-essential details. But the above is how I understand it based on my reflections of the basic teachings.

 

[RileyG]

As is also the case with the Roman Catholic Church, we'd say "yes, you are saved at your baptism." HOWEVER, that's said in a very technical way.

IF you were to die instantly, a moment after having your sins forgiven by baptism, yes, you'd be saved (going to heaven). You'd have fulfilled all that is needed--an act of conversion, renunciation of Satan and sin, a profession of Christ as your Lord and personal Savior, and a declaration of your intent to live a life for Christ.

BUT if you don't die shortly and instead live on, you will probably (shall we say?) commit sins.

We all sin. That being the case, your Baptism ceases to be sufficient in itself to guarantee salvation, even though it remains of great importance in many ways.

Huh? I'm confused. How do you believe one's sins forgiven then? If I'm reading it correctly Baptism isn't important anymore after one sins? I'm very confused.

 

[PaladinValer]

My priest mentioned that 'you were already saved at your baptism'. Is this correct? I'm not very informed about Anglican theology, please help me out. I don't find the BCP to be very clear about this. I don't really understand what being 'saved' is. When my friends describe it to me, the closest thing I can think of is my confirmation . Was I saved at my confirmation???

We are saved in our baptism.

We are being saved in our baptism

We hope to be saved by our baptism.

All three are true.

In Anglicanism, it is doctrinal belief that all who are baptized are regenerated, initiated into the Church, and it is their moment of salvation and acceptance by faith of Christ.

 

[Targaryen]

We are saved in our baptism.

We are being saved in our baptism

We hope to be saved by our baptism.

All three are true.

In Anglicanism, it is doctrinal belief that all who are baptized are regenerated, initiated into the Church, and it is their moment of salvation and acceptance by faith of Christ.

 

[Albion]

Huh? I'm confused. How do you believe one's sins forgiven then? If I'm reading it correctly Baptism isn't important anymore after one sins? I'm very confused.

Riley, surely you don't mean to say that you really do think Baptism is a guarantee that you'll be saved. It removes all sin UP TO THAT POINT IN TIME, makes you a member of Christ's church, and grants Grace for spiritual growth. Even though it doesn't immunize you in some way against ever committing a sin in later life, we certainly do consider the foregoing to be important. As for sins committed after Baptism, repentance and the confession of one's sins at any time will be received by God and there is also the General Confession that's part of the liturgy, as well as private confession if that's needed.

 

[PurpleRabbit187]

Thank you guys for your input I really appreciate it.So, then am I correct from what I gather that salvation is more like a process rather than a straightforward thing?. Albion, I assume then that 'once saved always saved' is not part of what we believe?

 

[Liberasit]

My priest mentioned that 'you were already saved at your baptism'. Is this correct? I'm not very informed about Anglican theology, please help me out. I don't find the BCP to be very clear about this. I don't really understand what being 'saved' is. When my friends describe it to me, the closest thing I can think of is my confirmation . Was I saved at my confirmation???

When you take yourself to baptism, you do so in faith. You have already made the decision to follow Christ before you are actually baptised. It is the realisation of this that leads you to ask for baptism.

If you were baptised as a baby, it's your parents' faith that preceded the baptism. If your own personal faith results over time, then the public declaration of this is when you bring yourself to confirmation.

 

[Albion]

Thank you guys for your input I really appreciate it.So, then am I correct from what I gather that salvation is more like a process rather than a straightforward thing?. Albion, I assume then that 'once saved always saved' is not part of what we believe?

For some Anglicans, it is. For others, it is not. The term itself (OSAS) is something of a slur, or at least slang, you know. Supporters are more likely to refer to it as Eternal Security.

The most "official" Anglican statement would be the Article (of the Thirty-nine Articles) on Predestination. Although it is the longest of the Articles and possibly the most controversial, it does not actually take a definite stance on the whole matter of Predestination.

 

[PaladinValer]

Thank you guys for your input I really appreciate it.So, then am I correct from what I gather that salvation is more like a process rather than a straightforward thing?.

It is a moment and a process. The moment is justification; the process is a sanctification. Salvation is a race, that we are given grace to run in faith, but which we must cooperate with that grace given. We can always choose to stop running, and we will always be called by grace to run again. All things by God's grace, which we must cooperate. God needn't cooperate anything, but we with Him.

It is God's work; not ours. The race we run is only due to God; we're a copilot whose hands turn when His does. It is His grace working in us always. No amount of what we do in and of itself is enough, and though good works are vital visible proof, it is God's work in those works, not our own, that bring healing to our souls.

Albion, I assume then that 'once saved always saved' is not part of what we believe?

I'm not Albion, but official Anglican theology does not believe in it.

 

[RileyG]

Riley, surely you don't mean to say that you really do think Baptism is a guarantee that you'll be saved. It removes all sin UP TO THAT POINT IN TIME, makes you a member of Christ's church, and grants Grace for spiritual growth. Even though it doesn't immunize you in some way against ever committing a sin in later life, we certainly do consider the foregoing to be important. As for sins committed after Baptism, repentance and the confession of one's sins at any time will be received by God and there is also the General Confession that's part of the liturgy, as well as private confession if that's needed.

Thank You.

 

[MKJ]

Thank you guys for your input I really appreciate it.So, then am I correct from what I gather that salvation is more like a process rather than a straightforward thing?. Albion, I assume then that 'once saved always saved' is not part of what we believe?

Anglicans tend to believe that we have real free will. So from our point of view as creatures in time, we can't actually say we are saved in a final sense until we've died. It is always possible that some time in the future we could really choose to reject the salvation which Christ has accomplished. At which point, if we are saved, we are saved.

From God's perspective of course he sees the whole thing, so he always knows if we are saved or not. It's a bit like it all happens in a moment.

I tend to think that doctrines like OSAS or even Eternal Security, when people believe in free will, tend to really under-emphasize the reality of our existence in time, as if because it isn't God's perspective, it isn't real. It also ignores that God is able not only to see things from his own perspective, but from ours.

Now, if you don't believe in free will it is straightforward - God makes you saved or unsaved because he wants to, and he doesn't change his mind - but I think that is a difficult position for an Anglican to maintain.

 

[Liberasit]

Thank you guys for your input I really appreciate it.So, then am I correct from what I gather that salvation is more like a process rather than a straightforward thing?. Albion, I assume then that 'once saved always saved' is not part of what we believe?

Common sense says that one interaction does not necessarily mean a transformed life.

The Parable of the Sower is a wonderful piece of scripture that describes different kinds of converts. We all know people in each category.

I don't understand all the pithy statements, such as OSAS. I tend to steer away from these syndrome. I like to think that if you are "saved" or "regenerate" that there will be some kind of clinical sign of transformation (by your fruits you shall know them).

I would like to think that OSAS is true but I worry that this misleads those who are mistaken and determine that they can go on to lead a shoddy life without risk. It makes no common sense for them. For outwardly regenerate people, a Godly life is much more straightforward. Declaring that you are "saved" without clinical evidence does not contribute to OSAS. This is not salvation by works, btw.

 

[luckyfredsdad]

My priest mentioned that 'you were already saved at your baptism'. Is this correct? I'm not very informed about Anglican theology, please help me out. I don't find the BCP to be very clear about this. I don't really understand what being 'saved' is. When my friends describe it to me, the closest thing I can think of is my confirmation . Was I saved at my confirmation???

At your baptism you are made a member of Christ and a Child of God, also you stand in line as it were to inherit the Kingdom of Heaven, or your place in it! But the baptism has usually to be of Water and Word, that is you have to have a knowledge of Christ's Revelation entered in to Scripture and these to have been interpreted and taught by the Bishops of the Church, through the guidance of the Holy Ghost! With this knowledge you will be accepted by the Bishop and you then become a member of the One, Holy Catholic and Apostolic church.
The ,'Water,' will wash away your sins and the ,'Words', the Gospel of Christ as taught by the Apostles, will be your entrance to the Christian Society. This is what is known as the Apostolic Succession!