ARE ALL THE 10 COMMANDMENTS IN THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT?

SabbathBlessings · Jul 2, 2025

Canuckster said:
again... stop your copy/paste text flooding which only takes you a short amount of time relative to those that have to take the time to properly respond. Show some respect for people's time. Many people have jobs, chores, look after relatives or the infirmed, or even have ailments themselves to deal with.... on top of all the other posts they'd like to review. They can't spend hours for each one of your posts looking up 30 - 40 scriptures and effectively responding to each one, only to have you reply with a copy/paste of another 30 - 40 scriptures to look up and reply to. If you can't share your truth with a couple of scriptures and 2 or 3 paragraphs of explanation it's because you don't have any truth and deploy the tactic of exhausting your opponents with text flooding... a sinister practice that's not included in your 10 commandments.

No text was copied/pasted so no idea what you're speaking of and if you are looking for just soundbite answers, I am not the one to keep posting to. I am not interested in soundbites, I am interested in what the Bible teaches and the Bible is a big book for a reason.

Be well.

Canuckster · Jul 2, 2025

SabbathBlessings said:
No text was copied so no idea what you're speaking of and if you are looking for just soundbite answers, I am not the one to keep posting to. I am not interested in soundbites, I am interested in what the Bible teaches and the Bible is a big book for a reason.

Be well.

You call posts that don't text flood "sound bites". No.... it's because truth doesn't require text flooding and posting 40 scriptures to exhaust your opponents.... but pushing a false narrative certainly does.

Canuckster · Jul 2, 2025

SabbathBlessings said:
I do not look at it like opponents, sorry you do.

When you post a Scripture with you its not enough proof, so posting more Scriptures than its too much, you have yet to present a biblical argument on any Scriptures that were presented, so I guess it just easier to just make accusations.

You say you don't look at it like opponents and yet you text flood to "present a biblical argument".... When you argue/debate it's against an opponent. You don't respect people's time....you know very well if anyone properly looked up and reviewed your 30 to 40 scriptures and replied to each one it would take them hours. Biblical truth does not require 30 to 40 scriptures.... It can be done with just one or two supported by a clear explanation. Then people can take the time to thoroughly review the one or two scriptures and your explanation and properly reply. But you can't do that because your argument is too weak to be supported by one or two scriptures and a clear explanation.

FredVB · Jul 24, 2025

Obedience is not how we would have salvation. It is through Christ. But faith is with repentance, and it would lead to obedience, at least for us to change in some ways.

HIM · Jul 26, 2025

Canuckster said:
again... stop your copy/paste text flooding which only takes you a short amount of time relative to those that have to take the time to properly respond. Show some respect for people's time. Many people have jobs, chores, look after relatives or the infirmed, or even have ailments themselves to deal with.... on top of all the other posts they'd like to review. They can't spend hours for each one of your posts looking up 30 - 40 scriptures and effectively responding to each one, only to have you reply with a copy/paste of another 30 - 40 scriptures to look up and reply to. If you can't share your truth with a couple of scriptures and 2 or 3 paragraphs of explanation it's because you don't have any truth and deploy the tactic of exhausting your opponents with text flooding... a sinister practice that's not included in your 10 commandments.

Well then, they should choose their discussions to suit their time or answer in the time they have. The question you asked should be against board rules. One is not allowed to tell someone they will suffer damnation if they do not keep the Sabbath on this board. Just like one is not allowed to tell someone they are not saved.

If one is not allowed to answer what they think or know, then one should not be allowed to ask such a baiting question. AS IF ONE IS TRYING TO GET ANOTHER BANNED.

SDA teach using the Bible that if you willingly sin, break a commandment like the Sabbath and do not repent you are lost. Other denominations teach this also. And yet others do so but exclude the Sabbath. I am pretty sure you know this already, so why ask?

Jan001 · Jul 28, 2025

The Sabbath was for the Israelites and the converts to Judaism under the first covenant. It was given to them to set them apart from other nations.

Exodus 31:13
You must also tell the Israelites: Keep my sabbaths, for that is to be the sign between you and me throughout the generations, to show that it is I, the Lord, who make you holy.

Under the New Covenant, there is no distinction between nations or peoples, so there isn't any need for this Sabbath sign.

Romans 10:12
For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; the same Lord is Lord of all, enriching all who call upon him.

Acts 15:9
He made no distinction between us and them, for by faith he purified their hearts.

Jesus taught his apostles and disciples to gather together to worship on Sundays and to rest on Sundays because his resurrection from the dead on Sunday (the first day of the week) signified a new spiritual beginning for God's creation. The OT Sabbath practices were but a shadow of the Sunday worship practices of his NT church, and therefore these OT practices were made obsolete by Jesus' death on the cross and his New Covenant worship practices. Hebrews 8:13

Colossians 2:9-16
For in him dwells the whole fullness of the deity[a] bodily, 10 and you share in this fullness in him, who is the head of every principality and power. 11 In him[b] you were also circumcised with a circumcision not administered by hand, by stripping off the carnal body, with the circumcision of Christ. 12 You were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And even when you were dead [in] transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he brought you to life along with him, having forgiven us all our transgressions; 14 [c]obliterating the bond against us, with its legal claims, which was opposed to us, he also removed it from our midst, nailing it to the cross; 15 despoiling the principalities and the powers, he made a public spectacle of them, leading them away in triumph by it.[d] Practices of the first covenant which are contrary to the Christian Faith: 16 Let no one, then, pass judgment on you in matters of food and drink or with regard to a festival or new moon or sabbath.[e]

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians

Justin Martyr FIRST APOLOGY, circa 153-155 A.D., CHAPTER LXVII -- WEEKLY WORSHIP OF THE CHRISTIANS.

And we afterwards continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Ghost. And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying Amen; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. And they who are well to do, and willing, give what each thinks fit; and what is collected is deposited with the president, who succours the orphans and widows and those who, through sickness or any other cause, are in want, and those who are in bonds and the strangers sojourning among us, and in a word takes care of all who are in need. But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things,

Justin Martyr states that Jesus Christ personally taught his Church's apostles to worship God on Sunday.

Acts 20:7, 1 Corinthians 16:2

The Bible does not include all of Jesus' teachings and practices. The authors of the Scriptures never intended for their Scriptures to contain all of them. John 21:25

Jesus commanded his Church's leaders to preach his gospel in person. He never commanded them to write a book. His Church's leaders wrote their Scriptures to use as a tool to help explain their oral teachings. Mark 3:14

The apostles expected their church members to obey both their oral and written commands. 2 Thessalonians 2:15, 2 Thessalonians 3:6

Scripture is not sufficient in itself to explain the gospel of Jesus Christ. Christ's church is the pillar and foundation of the truth of Jesus' gospel. 1 Timothy 3:15

pastorwaris · Jul 28, 2025

LoveGodsWord said:
10 COMMANDMENTS IN THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT (Continued)

OUR MORAL DUTY TOWARDS OUR NEIGHBOR; TABLE 2

MATTHEW 22:38-40
[39], And the second is like to it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
[40], ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS (LOVE TO GOD AND LOVE TO YOUR NEIGHBOR) HANG ALL THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS.

from...

LEVITICUS 19:18 [18], You shall not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of your people, but YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF;: I am the LORD.

* JESUS says; On these two great commandments of LOVE; Hang ALL the LAW and the prophets.

...............

5. HONOR PARENTS

OLD TESTAMENT REFERENCE: "Honor thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee." (Exodus 20:12)

NEW TESTAMENT REFERENCES: Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death." (Mt15:3,4/Mk 7:10) "Honour thy father and thy mother (Matthew 19:19; Mark 10:19; Luke 18:20)

"Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them." (Romans 1:29-32)

"Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise), that it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth." (Ephesians 6:1-3)

"Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord." (Colossians 3:20)

"But if any widow have children or nephews, let them learn first to shew piety at home, and to requite their parents: for that is good and acceptable before God." (1 Timothy 5:4)

...............

6. DO NOT MURDER

OLD TESTAMENT REFERENCE: "Thou shalt not kill (murder)." (Exodus 20:13)

NEW TESTAMENT REFERENCES: "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment." (Matthew 5:21,22 - see 1 John 2:9) [Jesus says unjustified anger is equal to murder] Do not kill" (Mark 10:19) Thou shalt not kill" (Romans 13:9)

"For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law." (James 2:11)

"But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters." (1 Peter 4:15)

We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him." (1 John 3:14,15)

...............

7. DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY

OLD TESTAMENT REFERENCE: Thou shalt not commit adultery (Exodus 20:14)

NEW TESTAMENT REFERENCES: "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." (Matthew 5:27-28) [Lustful fantasies are equal to adultery]

I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery." (Matthew 5:32)

Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery (Matthew 19:18; Mark 10:19; Luke 18:20)

Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. (Mark 10:11,12)

"Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery." (Luke 16:18 )

this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act Jesus said unto her, go, and sin no more. (John 8:4-11)

So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress" (Romans 7:3)

"Thou shalt not commit adultery (Romans 13:9)

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." (1 Corinthians 6:9,10)

Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body." (1 Corinthians 6:18)

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galations 5:19-21)

For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication" (1 Thesselonians 4:3)

Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge." (Hebrews 13:4)

"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire." (Jude 1:7)

"And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds." (Revelation 2:21,22)

...............

8. DO NOT STEAL

OLD TESTAMENT REFERENCE: Thou shalt not steal. (Exodus 20:15)

NEW TESTAMENT REFERENCES: Thou shalt not steal (Matthew 19:18; Romans 13:9)

Do not steal (Mark 10:19; Luke 18:20)

thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." (1 Corinthians 6:10)

Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth. (Ephesians 4:28)

But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. (1 Peter 4:15)

Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts. (Revelation 9:21)

...............

9. DO NOT LIE

OLD TESTAMENT REFERENCE: Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor. (Exodus 20:16)

NEW TESTAMENT REFERENCES: every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned." (Matthew 12:36,37)

For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: These are the things which defile a man. (Matthew 15:19,20)

Thou shalt not bear false witness (Matthew 19:18; Romans 13:9)

Do not bear false witness (Mark 10:19; Luke 18:20)

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. (John 8:44)

"But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty (2 Corinthians 4:2)

Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour. (Ephesians 4:25)

Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds (Colossians 3:9)

Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things. (1 Timothy 3:11)

speak evil of no man (Titus 3:2)

But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (Revelation 21:8)

For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie." (Revelation 22:14-15)

...............

10. DO NOT COVET/LUST

OLD TESTAMENT REFERENCE: Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor anything that is thy neighbour's. (Exodus 20:17)

NEW TESTAMENT REFERENCES: And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth. (Luke 12:15)

What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet." (Romans 7:7)

Thou shalt not covet (Romans 13:9)

"But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;" (Ephesians 5:3)

For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows." (1 Timothy 6:10)

Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee." (Hebrews 13:5)

...............

Yep seems like EVERONE of God's 10 Commandments are repeated in the NEW TESTAMENT.

................

God's 10 Commandments give us a KNOWLEDGE of what sin is. SIN is the breaking of God's Commandments (James 2:9-11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4) Those who CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN.

................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

In times of ignorance God winks at but now ,<when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth has come> calls all men everywhere to REPENT (FOLLOW) (Acts 17:30-31).

Grace and peace to you in the mighty name of our Lord Jesus Christ,

Dear Brother in Christ, what a powerful and Spirit-led exposition you've shared!
Thank you for rightly dividing the Word of Truth and boldly declaring that God's commandments still stand not as a burden, but as a mirror revealing sin and pointing us to the Savior. (Romans 7:7, Galatians 3:24)

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS: STILL HOLY, STILL JUST, STILL GOOD

As you’ve shown so well, the moral law of God is affirmed throughout the New Testament. Every single commandment is not only mentioned but intensified by Jesus and the apostles. Why? Because the Law reflects God's character, and God doesn't change (Malachi 3:6; Hebrews 13:8).

Paul said, "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.” (Romans 3:31)

THE COMMANDMENTS THAT LOVE BUILT

Jesus taught us that on two great commandments loving God and loving our neighbor hang ALL the Law and the Prophets (Matthew 22:37–40). That doesn’t cancel the Ten Commandments it summarizes them. The first four teach us how to love God. The last six, how to love others.

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT

Now this is where your comment brought a much-needed light. The Sabbath is not some dusty relic from ancient Israel. It's one of the Ten not nine commandments. And nowhere in Scripture is it abolished, changed, or transferred to Sunday.

Jesus didn’t say “I’m the Lord of Sunday.” He said, “The Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.” (Mark 2:28)

As you rightly stated, Sunday worship is a tradition of man, and Jesus warned against replacing God’s commandments with man-made traditions (Matthew 15:3–9). This is not about legalism it’s about honoring what God has called holy (Exodus 20:8-11; Isaiah 58:13-14).

LAW AND GRACE: A HOLY BALANCE

We are not saved by the law but we are not saved to ignore it either. As Paul said, "The law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.” (Romans 7:12)

When the adulterous woman was brought before Jesus, He didn’t say, “The law doesn’t matter.” He said, “Go and sin no more.” (John 8:11) That’s grace and truth hand in hand (John 1:17).

ACCOUNTABILITY AFTER KNOWLEDGE

You powerfully quoted Acts 17:30 – "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent." Once truth is revealed, we are no longer in ignorance, we are in accountability. And the Spirit is calling the Church to repent from compromise and return to the full counsel of God (Acts 20:27).

TRUTH IN LOVE

Let us never forget: the commandments don’t save us, Jesus does.
But those who love Jesus will keep His commandments (John 14:15).
Not to earn salvation, but as proof of our transformation.
Not in fear, but out of love and reverence for our Holy God.

Thank you again for sharing this truth so clearly and boldly. May the Lord continue to use your voice to awaken hearts, challenge tradition, and restore His Word as the final authority above all opinions, creeds, or customs.

Let us be like David, who said:

"Oh how I love thy law! it is my meditation all the day." (Psalm 119:97)

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,
Pastor Waris,

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."

SabbathBlessings · Jul 28, 2025

pastorwaris said:
Grace and peace to you in the mighty name of our Lord Jesus Christ,

Dear Brother in Christ, what a powerful and Spirit-led exposition you've shared!
Thank you for rightly dividing the Word of Truth and boldly declaring that God's commandments still stand not as a burden, but as a mirror revealing sin and pointing us to the Savior. (Romans 7:7, Galatians 3:24)

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS: STILL HOLY, STILL JUST, STILL GOOD
As you’ve shown so well, the moral law of God is affirmed throughout the New Testament. Every single commandment is not only mentioned but intensified by Jesus and the apostles. Why? Because the Law reflects God's character, and God doesn't change (Malachi 3:6; Hebrews 13:8).

Paul said, "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.” (Romans 3:31)

THE COMMANDMENTS THAT LOVE BUILT
Jesus taught us that on two great commandments loving God and loving our neighbor hang ALL the Law and the Prophets (Matthew 22:37–40). That doesn’t cancel the Ten Commandments it summarizes them. The first four teach us how to love God. The last six, how to love others.

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT
Now this is where your comment brought a much-needed light. The Sabbath is not some dusty relic from ancient Israel. It's one of the Ten not nine commandments. And nowhere in Scripture is it abolished, changed, or transferred to Sunday.

As you rightly stated, Sunday worship is a tradition of man, and Jesus warned against replacing God’s commandments with man-made traditions (Matthew 15:3–9). This is not about legalism it’s about honoring what God has called holy (Exodus 20:8-11; Isaiah 58:13-14).

LAW AND GRACE: A HOLY BALANCE
We are not saved by the law but we are not saved to ignore it either. As Paul said, "The law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.” (Romans 7:12)

When the adulterous woman was brought before Jesus, He didn’t say, “The law doesn’t matter.” He said, “Go and sin no more.” (John 8:11) That’s grace and truth hand in hand (John 1:17).

ACCOUNTABILITY AFTER KNOWLEDGE
You powerfully quoted Acts 17:30 – "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent." Once truth is revealed, we are no longer in ignorance, we are in accountability. And the Spirit is calling the Church to repent from compromise and return to the full counsel of God (Acts 20:27).

TRUTH IN LOVE
Let us never forget: the commandments don’t save us, Jesus does.
But those who love Jesus will keep His commandments (John 14:15).
Not to earn salvation, but as proof of our transformation.
Not in fear, but out of love and reverence for our Holy God.

Thank you again for sharing this truth so clearly and boldly. May the Lord continue to use your voice to awaken hearts, challenge tradition, and restore His Word as the final authority above all opinions, creeds, or customs.

Let us be like David, who said:

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,
Pastor Waris,
"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."

Thank you for a great post!

God bless!

Jan001 · Jul 29, 2025

pastorwaris said:
Grace and peace to you in the mighty name of our Lord Jesus Christ,

.................................

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT
Now this is where your comment brought a much-needed light. The Sabbath is not some dusty relic from ancient Israel. It's one of the Ten not nine commandments. And nowhere in Scripture is it abolished, changed, or transferred to Sunday.
................................

Thank you again for sharing this truth so clearly and boldly. May the Lord continue to use your voice to awaken hearts, challenge tradition, and restore His Word as the final authority above all opinions, creeds, or customs.

Let us be like David, who said:

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,
Pastor Waris,
"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."

People who claim to be Christians today should obey all of Jesus' teaching. He taught his apostles to assemble his people together to worship God on Sunday. Christians have been worshiping God on Sunday every Sunday since the Sunday of Jesus' resurrection. This is 2000 years of unbroken obedience to Jesus' command. Sunday is the Christian's formal worship and rest day.

An early church writing explains why the early Christians worshiped God on Sunday. They did this because Jesus personally taught his apostles to do this.

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians

Justin Martyr FIRST APOLOGY, circa 153-155 A.D., CHAPTER LXVII -- WEEKLY WORSHIP OF THE CHRISTIANS.

And we afterwards continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Ghost. And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying Amen; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. And they who are well to do, and willing, give what each thinks fit; and what is collected is deposited with the president, who succours the orphans and widows and those who, through sickness or any other cause, are in want, and those who are in bonds and the strangers sojourning among us, and in a word takes care of all who are in need. But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things,

The Bible does not include all of Jesus' teachings and practices. The authors of the Scriptures never intended for their Scriptures to contain all of them. John 21:25

Jesus commanded his Church's leaders to preach his gospel in person. He never commanded them to write a book. His Church's leaders wrote their Scriptures to use as a tool to help explain their oral teachings. Mark 3:14

The apostles expected their church members to obey both their oral and written commands. 2 Thessalonians 2:15, 2 Thessalonians 3:6

Scripture is not sufficient in itself to explain the gospel of Jesus Christ. Christ's church is the pillar and foundation of the truth of Jesus' gospel. 1 Timothy 3:15

The SDA's dogma of "Scripture alone" is not biblical. James 3:1

pastorwaris · Jul 29, 2025

Jan001 said:
People who claim to be Christians today should obey all of Jesus' teaching. He taught his apostles to assemble his people together to worship God on Sunday. Christians have been worshiping God on Sunday every Sunday since the Sunday of Jesus' resurrection. This is 2000 years of unbroken obedience to Jesus' command. Sunday is the Christian's formal worship and rest day.

An early church writing explains why the early Christians worshiped God on Sunday. They did this because Jesus personally taught his apostles to do this.

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians
Justin Martyr FIRST APOLOGY, circa 153-155 A.D., CHAPTER LXVII -- WEEKLY WORSHIP OF THE CHRISTIANS.

And we afterwards continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Ghost. And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying Amen; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. And they who are well to do, and willing, give what each thinks fit; and what is collected is deposited with the president, who succours the orphans and widows and those who, through sickness or any other cause, are in want, and those who are in bonds and the strangers sojourning among us, and in a word takes care of all who are in need. But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things,

The Bible does not include all of Jesus' teachings and practices. The authors of the Scriptures never intended for their Scriptures to contain all of them. John 21:25

Jesus commanded his Church's leaders to preach his gospel in person. He never commanded them to write a book. His Church's leaders wrote their Scriptures to use as a tool to help explain their oral teachings. Mark 3:14

The apostles expected their church members to obey both their oral and written commands. 2 Thessalonians 2:15, 2 Thessalonians 3:6

Scripture is not sufficient in itself to explain the gospel of Jesus Christ. Christ's church is the pillar and foundation of the truth of Jesus' gospel. 1 Timothy 3:15

The SDA's dogma of "Scripture alone" is not biblical. James 3:1

Grace and peace to you in the name of our risen Lord Jesus Christ,

Dear Sister in Christ, thank you for sharing your perspective, and for referencing the practices of the early church as recorded by Justin Martyr. It’s clear you hold a sincere love for the Lord Jesus and desire to see His teachings honored. I deeply respect that. But I also believe we must take this conversation beyond tradition and early church writings and into the final authority: the Holy Scriptures the inspired Word of God.

THE TRUE FOUNDATION: SCRIPTURE FIRST, NOT TRADITION

You referenced 1 Timothy 3:15 to say the Church is the pillar of truth, and I agree but let’s be clear: the Church is the pillar that upholds the truth, not one that invents or alters it. The truth it upholds is found in God-breathed Scripture (2 Timothy 3:16–17), not in uninspired writings or evolving traditions even if those traditions are ancient.

You mentioned John 21:25, stating that not everything Jesus said or did is written down. That’s true! But what is written down was written so that we may believe and have life in His name (John 20:31). God in His sovereignty chose to preserve exactly what we need for salvation, doctrine, and godly living. Anything not in Scripture cannot override what is in Scripture.

JESUS NEVER COMMANDED A CHANGE TO SUNDAY

Let’s be very clear: nowhere in Scripture does Jesus command or even suggest changing the seventh-day Sabbath (Saturday) to Sunday. Not before the cross, not after the resurrection, not through the apostles. In fact, the Bible consistently shows that both Jesus and His followers kept the Sabbath (Luke 4:16; Acts 13:42-44; Acts 17:2; Acts 18:4).

Yes, Jesus rose on Sunday. But resurrection does not cancel creation. Honoring His resurrection is good we do that every day of our lives! But using that as a basis to override one of God’s Ten Commandments specifically the 4th Commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) is not just unbiblical, it's dangerous. Jesus said, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law..." (Matthew 5:17).

JUSTIN MARTYR VS. JESUS CHRIST

You cited Justin Martyr, a 2nd-century church father, who explained why Christians in his time worshiped on Sunday. But respectfully, Justin was not a prophet, apostle, or inspired writer. He was a man of his time, influenced by growing anti-Jewish sentiment and Roman culture. His writings reflect early church practice, not biblical command.

Let’s not forget: Jesus warned about “teaching for doctrines the commandments of men” (Matthew 15:9). If we follow the example of man over the Word of God, we make ourselves vulnerable to deception even if that tradition is 2,000 years old.

Longevity does not equal legitimacy.
The only thing that gives doctrine authority is the Word of God itself.

SUNDAY WORSHIP: AN EARLY SHIFT, NOT A DIVINE DECREE

Historical evidence shows that Sunday worship gradually became popular due to Roman influence, convenience, and the empire’s desire to separate from anything "Jewish" including the Sabbath. Constantine, in A.D. 321, even issued a law enforcing rest on "the venerable day of the sun."
But ask yourself: Is a Roman emperor’s decree a higher authority than God’s voice from Mount Sinai?

God said, "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy." (Exodus 20:8)
He blessed the seventh day, not the first.
He sanctified it at creation, not after the resurrection.

ORAL TRADITION AND THE WRITTEN WORD

You mentioned 2 Thessalonians 2:15, where Paul told the church to hold fast to what they had received “whether by word or epistle.” Yes, oral teachings existed. But here's the key: Paul’s oral teachings never contradicted his written ones and both were subject to the authority of Christ.

That’s why Paul praised the Bereans for testing even his teachings against Scripture (Acts 17:11). Imagine that! Paul a chosen apostle was not above examination. That tells us something very important: No teacher, no tradition, no church council, and no ancient writing can ever override the written Word of God.

A DANGEROUS STATEMENT

One final concern: you wrote, “Scripture is not sufficient in itself to explain the gospel.” My dear sister, that is not only incorrect—it is dangerous. The Holy Spirit, working through the Scriptures, is more than sufficient:

“All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training in righteousness...” (2 Timothy 3:16)

“The gospel... is the power of God unto salvation...” (Romans 1:16)

We are warned not to add to or take away from the Word (Deuteronomy 4:2, Revelation 22:18–19). We don’t need “more than Scripture” we need to return to Scripture.
Remember,
Worshiping God on any day is good. But replacing the Seventh-day Sabbath (Saturday) with Sunday as God's holy day of rest and worship is unbiblical.
There is no command from Jesus or His apostles to change or replace the Sabbath. The Bible, in both Hebrew and Greek, confirms this.

THE POINT IS, WHO WILL YOU FOLLOW?

Friend, I lovingly urge you to consider this:
Will you follow tradition, even if it’s 2,000 years old?
Or will you follow the eternal Word of God, which is forever settled in heaven (Psalm 119:89)?

God’s commandments are not a burden (1 John 5:3), they are a blessing.
And the Sabbath is not a Jewish burden, it’s a gift to all mankind (Mark 2:27).

Jesus never said to replace the Sabbath with Sunday. He said, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.” (John 14:15)

Let us not honor Him with our lips while our hearts follow the traditions of men. Let us return to the whole counsel of God, the law and the testimony (Isaiah 8:20), and worship the Lord in Spirit and in truth (John 4:24).

With all love and boldness in Christ,
Pastor Waris
“Teaching the truth, not tradition. Standing on Scripture alone.”

SabbathBlessings · Jul 29, 2025

Jan001 said:
Christians have been worshiping God on Sunday every Sunday since the Sunday of Jesus' resurrection.

Christians should worship God 365 24/7 but that would also include keeping God's commandments. If you are claiming that Christians kept every first day of the week for formal rest and worship in lieu of God's 4th commandment, one would have to go outside of Scripture to make this case which is something we are warned against.

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Jan001 said:
This is 2000 years of unbroken obedience to Jesus' command. Sunday is the Christian's formal worship and rest day.

Paul predicted that there would be a falling away after his death Act 20:29 Sunday-keeping is nothing more than mans traditions that have led people away from obedience to God and His commandments.

At the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, the Sabbath was still being kept by the disciples and close followers of Jesus Christ.

Luke 23:56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.

If there would have been a change in one of God's personally written commandments, the one that is holy, sanctified and blessed by God and He said to Remember, Jesus would have told someone, but an augment from silence is not a good one. Especially when it goes against God's written and spoken word and personal Testimony

When Paul preached on the Sabbath as he kept every Sabbath, he preached on Christ resurrection, did he teach that after the resurrection the Sabbath commandment ended and there was a new day of worship, lets look. . .

Acts 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day and sat down

16: Then Paul stood up, and motioning with his hand said, “Men of Israel, and you who fear God, listen:

27 For those who dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they did not know Him, nor even the voices of the Prophets which are read every Sabbath, have fulfilled them in condemning Him. 28 And though they found no cause for death in Him, they asked Pilate that He should be put to death. 29 Now when they had fulfilled all that was written concerning Him, they took Him down from the tree and laid Him in a tomb. 30 But God raised Him from the dead. 31 He was seen for many days by those who came up with Him from Galilee to Jerusalem, who are His witnesses to the people. 32 And we declare to you glad tidings—that promise which was made to the fathers. 33 God has fulfilled this for us their children, in that He has raised up Jesus. As it is also written in the second Psalm:

‘You are My Son,
Today I have begotten You.’
34 And that He raised Him from the dead, no more to return to [i]corruption, He has spoken thus:

‘I will give you the sure [j]mercies of David.’
35 Therefore He also says in another Psalm:

‘You will not allow Your Holy One to see corruption.’

Acts 13:42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath.

If Sunday was so prevalent in the first church as claimed, Paul would have said yes, we will preach to the Gentiles the gospel message tomorrow (Sunday) after Paul just preached on the resurrection of Jesus Christ that happened some 20+ years earlier, that is the new day of worship and we now all meet and worship on every day 1.

Did that happen?

Acts 13: 44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God.

Of course not, they kept every Sabbath along with the Gentiles because God’s faithful keep God’s commandments (His version, not mans) Rev 14:12 Rev 22:14

Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.

The counterfeit always comes after the original and first church was faithful to God and His commandments, just as we are called to be, even if its not popular, just like it wasn't during the time of Jesus and the apostles.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Jesus predicted He would have a faithful people that would keep the Sabbath some 40 years after the Cross
Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

Sunday keeping is nothing more than a tradition of man leading people away from obeying one of God's commandments. Jesus said this about doing so.

Mar 7:7 AND IN VAIN THEY WORSHIP ME, TEACHING AS DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENTS OF MEN.'
Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men

These are all choices we will all have to make, who do we obey, Whoever we obey is who we serve Rom 6:16

Jos 24:15 And if it seems evil to you to serve the Lord, choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of [a]the River, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.”

We need to be careful of those who are teaching not to keep God's commandments Mat 5:19- God's own personal Testimony Exo 31:18 as if man has more authority than God. It’s a deception that has never worked out well for anyone in the Bible. We need to be faithful to God and what He asks, not anyone else. Even if the whole world is against one for doing so. Rev 12:17

SabbathBlessings · Jul 29, 2025

Jan001 said:
Colossians 2:9-16
For in him dwells the whole fullness of the deity[a] bodily, 10 and you share in this fullness in him, who is the head of every principality and power. 11 In him[b] you were also circumcised with a circumcision not administered by hand, by stripping off the carnal body, with the circumcision of Christ. 12 You were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And even when you were dead [in] transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he brought you to life along with him, having forgiven us all our transgressions; 14 [c]obliterating the bond against us, with its legal claims, which was opposed to us, he also removed it from our midst, nailing it to the cross; 15 despoiling the principalities and the powers, he made a public spectacle of them, leading them away in triumph by it.[d] Practices of the first covenant which are contrary to the Christian Faith: 16 Let no one, then, pass judgment on you in matters of food and drink or with regard to a festival or new moon or sabbath.[e]

Lets look at more context to this passage

Paul is speaking about.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
This verse sets up the following verses and gives us a lot more context.
Paul is giving us the context as to what he is speaking about

handwritten
ordinances
against and contrary to us

1. Was the Sabbath commandment "handwritten" ?

Lets look at what the Bible says
Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Context doesn't fit- the Ten Commandments including the Sabbath commandment was written by the finger of God not "handwritten" which is what Moses wrote with his hand 2 Chr 33:8 Deut 31:24-26

2. ordinances

Lets look at the Testimony of God
Right in the Ten Commandments God wrote this about the Ten Commandments:
Exo 20:6 Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Context doesn't fit

3. Is the Sabbath commandment against and contrary to us

Lets look at what Jesus said:
Mat 2:27 The Sabbath was made for man
The Sabbath was made for man, what God makes for man is not against us as Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath certainly not against man. The Sabbath is blessed and sanctified by God, it’s not the definition of contrary and against. To try to make this passage fit to the weekly Sabbath that started at Creation, when everything was according to God's perfect plan that the Sabbath that is holy and blessed that God made to be "contrary and against mankind" is really an attack on the character of God. Calling something that is blessed and sanctified by God that is a sign we are God's people Eze 20:20 and a sign of His sanctification Eze 20:12 is "contrary and against" we have a warning about this very thing Isa 5:20

Context doesn't fit

So looking at the immediate context shows clearly Paul is not speaking of the Sabbath commandment. Nor does Paul have the authority to change God's written and spoken Testimony Exo 31:18 the words of the covenant Exo 34:28 that God promised He would not alter Psa 89:34 they went from written on tables of stone to written on tablets of the heart 2 Cor 3:3 Heb 8:10 because God keeps His promises.

Right here is enough to know Paul is not referring to the Sabbath commandment, but lets keep going.

This is what Paul is quoting the laws he is referring to is from

Deu 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
Deu 31:25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,
Deu 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

The laws that were beside the ark of the Covenant handwritten by Moses, there as a witness against, the context of Col 2:14

But lets look at this verse closer

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
The Greek word for sabbath here is plural not singular. So its not speaking of "The" Sabbath day Exo 20:10-11 "The" holy day of the Lord Is 58:13 as already seen in the context.

Paul is quoting Ezekiel all of the sacrifices and offerings. Some of the annual feast days were also sabbaths, not to be confused with the weekly Sabbath commandment that started before the fall, the sabbath feast ordinances were given after the fall written by hand, in the law of Moses.

Eze 45:17 And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

What was predicted would end when Jesus came?

Dan 9:27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; But in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate, Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate."

So this is not about any of the Ten Commandments but about the food and drink offerings, feast days that some were also sabbath(s) that were handwritten by Moses placed besides the ark of the covenant that came after the fall of man. The Sabbath started at Creation before sin Exo 20:11 so can't be a "shadow" of anything as it is part of God's perfect plan before sin took over and a need for a plan of salvation.

Why if you look at the next verse it clearly shows what it is referring to which works in perfect harmony with the context

Col 2:17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

Heb 10:1 For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect.
Heb 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. (contrary and against)
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said: "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU DID NOT DESIRE, BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME.
Heb 10:6 IN BURNT OFFERINGS AND SACRIFICES FOR SIN YOU HAD NO PLEASURE.
Heb 10:7 THEN I SAID, 'BEHOLD, I HAVE COME—IN THE VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME—TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD.' "
Heb 10:8 Previously saying, "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING, BURNT OFFERINGS, AND OFFERINGS FOR SIN YOU DID NOT DESIRE, NOR HAD PLEASURE IN THEM" (which are offered according to the law),
Heb 10:9 then He said, "BEHOLD, I HAVE COME TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD." He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Exo 12:17 43 So the Lord said to Moses and Aaron: This is the ordinance of the Passover:
1Co 5:7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us.

There is so much more evidence I could provide like comparing what Jesus said which in using Col 2:14-16 against the Sabbath commandment and contradicts His teachings. Hopefully this will be looked at in prayer as I know this is a popular teaching, but the context does not fit the Sabbath commandment written by the finger of God that is part of God's holy and eternal law Mat 5:18-19 Isa 66:23 that God promised not to alter Psa89:34 not a jot or tittle Mat 5:18-19.

Jan001 · Monday at 11:51 AM

pastorwaris said:
THE POINT IS, WHO WILL YOU FOLLOW?
Friend, I lovingly urge you to consider this:
Will you follow tradition, even if it’s 2,000 years old?
Or will you follow the eternal Word of God, which is forever settled in heaven (Psalm 119:89)?

Jesus never said to replace the Sabbath with Sunday. He said, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.” (John 14:15)

Let us not honor Him with our lips while our hearts follow the traditions of men. Let us return to the whole counsel of God, the law and the testimony (Isaiah 8:20), and worship the Lord in Spirit and in truth (John 4:24).

With all love and boldness in Christ,
Pastor Waris
“Teaching the truth, not tradition. Standing on Scripture alone.”

Grace and Peace to you, Pastor Waris.

Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?
(Please don't quote 2 Timothy 3:16. It states that Scripture is useful, not that it has any authority in itself.)

Which came first, the Church or the NT Scriptures?

Which received God's authority to preach/teach Jesus Christ's gospel to the world, the church, or the book it authored?

SabbathBlessings · Monday at 12:22 PM

Jan001 said:
Grace and Peace to you, Pastor Waris.

Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?

God's Word, not traditions of man is to be the light to our path

Psa 119:105 Your word is a lamp to my feet
And a light to my path.

Going outside of God's Word there is no light

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Jan001 said:
(Please don't quote 2 Timothy 3:16. It states that Scripture is useful, not that it has any authority in itself.)

Which came first, the Church or the NT Scriptures?

The NT church is the one who wrote the Scriptures. So its a strange question as if the apostle were working against the inspired word of God. And no I do not beleive Peter started the Catholic church. That would go under Isa 8:20

Jan001 said:
Which received God's authority to preach/teach Jesus Christ's gospel to the world, the church, or the book it authored?

Jesus commissioned the apostles to teach the gospel message who wrote the inspired NT and we are also spread the gospel message which is found in God's holy word.

There is no Scripture that says we are to throw out Scripture and follow man-made traditions and teachings, Its what Jesus warned against when it goes against His word. Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 as His word is the light to our path Psa 119:105

Jan001 · Monday at 12:42 PM

SabbathBlessings said:
Lets look at more context to this passage

Paul is speaking about.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
This verse sets up the following verses and gives us a lot more context.
Paul is giving us the context as to what he is speaking about

handwritten

ordinances

against and contrary to us

1. Was the Sabbath commandment "handwritten" ?

Lets look at what the Bible says
Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Context doesn't fit- the Ten Commandments including the Sabbath commandment was written by the finger of God not "handwritten" which is what Moses wrote with his hand 2 Chr 33:8 Deut 31:24-26

2. ordinances

Lets look at the Testimony of God
Right in the Ten Commandments God wrote this about the Ten Commandments:
Exo 20:6 Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Context doesn't fit

3. Is the Sabbath commandment against and contrary to us

Lets look at what Jesus said:
Mat 2:27 The Sabbath was made for man
The Sabbath was made for man, what God makes for man is not against us as Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath certainly not against man. The Sabbath is blessed and sanctified by God, it’s not the definition of contrary and against. To try to make this passage fit to the weekly Sabbath that started at Creation, when everything was according to God's perfect plan that the Sabbath that is holy and blessed that God made to be "contrary and against mankind" is really an attack on the character of God. Calling something that is blessed and sanctified by God that is a sign we are God's people Eze 20:20 and a sign of His sanctification Eze 20:12 is "contrary and against" we have a warning about this very thing Isa 5:20

Context doesn't fit

So looking at the immediate context shows clearly Paul is not speaking of the Sabbath commandment. Nor does Paul have the authority to change God's written and spoken Testimony Exo 31:18 the words of the covenant Exo 34:28 that God promised He would not alter Psa 89:34 they went from written on tables of stone to written on tablets of the heart 2 Cor 3:3 Heb 8:10 because God keeps His promises.

Right here is enough to know Paul is not referring to the Sabbath commandment, but lets keep going.

This is what Paul is quoting the laws he is referring to is from

Deu 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
Deu 31:25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,
Deu 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

The laws that were beside the ark of the Covenant handwritten by Moses, there as a witness against, the context of Col 2:14

But lets look at this verse closer

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
The Greek word for sabbath here is plural not singular. So its not speaking of "The" Sabbath day Exo 20:10-11 "The" holy day of the Lord Is 58:13 as already seen in the context.

Paul is quoting Ezekiel all of the sacrifices and offerings. Some of the annual feast days were also sabbaths, not to be confused with the weekly Sabbath commandment that started before the fall, the sabbath feast ordinances were given after the fall written by hand, in the law of Moses.

Eze 45:17 And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

What was predicted would end when Jesus came?

Dan 9:27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; But in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate, Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate."

So this is not about any of the Ten Commandments but about the food and drink offerings, feast days that some were also sabbath(s) that were handwritten by Moses placed besides the ark of the covenant that came after the fall of man. The Sabbath started at Creation before sin Exo 20:11 so can't be a "shadow" of anything as it is part of God's perfect plan before sin took over and a need for a plan of salvation.

Why if you look at the next verse it clearly shows what it is referring to which works in perfect harmony with the context

Col 2:17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

Heb 10:1 For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect.
Heb 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. (contrary and against)
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said: "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU DID NOT DESIRE, BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME.
Heb 10:6 IN BURNT OFFERINGS AND SACRIFICES FOR SIN YOU HAD NO PLEASURE.
Heb 10:7 THEN I SAID, 'BEHOLD, I HAVE COME—IN THE VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME—TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD.' "
Heb 10:8 Previously saying, "SACRIFICE AND OFFERING, BURNT OFFERINGS, AND OFFERINGS FOR SIN YOU DID NOT DESIRE, NOR HAD PLEASURE IN THEM" (which are offered according to the law),
Heb 10:9 then He said, "BEHOLD, I HAVE COME TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD." He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Exo 12:17 43 So the Lord said to Moses and Aaron: This is the ordinance of the Passover:
1Co 5:7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us.

There is so much more evidence I could provide like comparing what Jesus said which in using Col 2:14-16 against the Sabbath commandment and contradicts His teachings. Hopefully this will be looked at in prayer as I know this is a popular teaching, but the context does not fit the Sabbath commandment written by the finger of God that is part of God's holy and eternal law Mat 5:18-19 Isa 66:23 that God promised not to alter Psa89:34 not a jot or tittle Mat 5:18-19.

Which commandments did Jesus publicly state were necessary to obey in order to inherit eternal life in his kingdom?

The Sabbath of the Jews? No, and that is because Jesus' new covenant Church is for both Jew and non-Jew. Only Israelites/Jews and converts to Judaism under the first covenant were ever commanded to keep the Sabbath.

The Law of Moses: Exodus 31:13 “Say to the children of Israel, ‘You shall observe my Sabbaths, for the Sabbath is a sign between me and you for all your generations, so that you may know that I am the Lord, who makes you holy.

When did God stop making a distinction between the Jew and the Gentile generations? When Jesus Christ sacrificially died on the cross, he fulfilled the first covenant (Law of Moses) with the Jews (thereby ending their Sabbaths and new moon and dietary obligations), and he made his new covenant with all people, regardless of nationality. Jesus' sacrifice made the first covenant/Law of Moses Sabbath laws obsolete. Hebrews 8:13, Matthew 28:18-20, Colossians 2:13-17, Romans 10:12, Galatians 3:28

Paul had to contend with many Judaizers in his day. Judaizers insisted that Gentile converts to Christianity were obligated to become circumcised and to keep the Law of Moses with its Sabbaths, new moons, and dietary obligations. Paul declared that he wished these troublesome Judaizers would castrate themselves. Galatians 5:1-13

Jesus Christ is Lord of the Sabbath. Did he command that his followers keep the Sabbath of the Jews?

Mark 10:17-19 As Jesus was starting out on a journey, a man came running up to him, knelt down, and asked him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” 18 Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘Do not kill. Do not commit adultery. Do not steal. Do not bear false witness. Do not defraud. Honor your father and your mother.’”

Matthew 19:16-19 Then a man came forward and asked him, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to achieve eternal life?” 17 He said to him, “Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one who is good. But if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 He said, “Which ones?” And Jesus answered, “You shall not kill. You shall not commit adultery. You shall not steal. You shall not bear false witness. 19 Honor your father and your mother. Love your neighbor as yourself.”

Christians, regardless of nationality, worship God on Sundays, in remembrance and thanksgiving of the day of Jesus Christ's resurrection from the dead, giving all of us hope of eternal life. Jesus Christ taught them to do this before he ascended into heaven and his church has been doing this for about 2000 years so far. 2 Thessalonians 2:15

Jan001 · Monday at 12:42 PM

SabbathBlessings said:
God's Word, not traditions of man is to be the light to our path

Psa 119:105 Your word is a lamp to my feet
And a light to my path.

Going outside of God's Word there is no light

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

The NT church is the one who wrote the Scriptures. So its a strange question as if the apostle were working against the inspired word of God. And no I do not beleive Peter started the Catholic church. That would go under Isa 8:20

Jesus commissioned the apostles to teach the gospel message who wrote the inspired NT and we are also spread the gospel message which is found in God's holy word.

There is no Scripture that says we are to throw out Scripture and follow man-made traditions and teachings, Its what Jesus warned against when it goes against His word. Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 as His word is the light to our path Psa 119:105

2 Thessalonians 2:15

SabbathBlessings · Monday at 1:23 PM

Jan001 said:
2 Thessalonians 2:15

There is nothing wrong with traditions as long as they are not going against God's word.

Mark 7:6 But their heart is far from Me.
7 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men—[d]the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do.”

9 He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 11 But you say, ‘If a man says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is Corban”—’ (that is, a gift to God), 12 then you no longer let him do anything for his father or his mother, 13 making the word of God of no effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many such things you do.”

pastorwaris · Monday at 1:34 PM

Jan001 said:
Grace and Peace to you, Pastor Waris.

Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?
(Please don't quote 2 Timothy 3:16. It states that Scripture is useful, not that it has any authority in itself.)

Which came first, the Church or the NT Scriptures?

Which received God's authority to preach/teach Jesus Christ's gospel to the world, the church, or the book it authored?

Grace and peace to you as well, Dear Sister in Christ!

Thank you for your thoughtful and sincere questions. They go right to the heart of a vital issue facing the Church today: What is the final authority for faith and practice Scripture or the Church?

Let’s walk through each of your points together, like Bereans (Acts 17:11), testing everything by the Word of God with reverence and humility.

1. “Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?”

While the phrase “Scripture alone” isn’t used explicitly, neither is the word “Trinity”yet the truth of both is thoroughly biblical. The principle of Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) is taught not by a single verse, but by the total testimony of the Bible itself.

Let’s examine what the Word of God says:

Book of Psalm: 119:160

"The entirety of Your word is truth, and every one of Your righteous judgments endures forever."

Not tradition. Not oral sayings. Your Word is truth.

Gospel of John: 17:17

"Sanctify them by the truth; Your word is truth."

When Jesus prayed for His disciples, He didn't say “The church is truth,” but “Your Word is truth.”

Book of Isaiah: 8:20

"To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them."

That’s a powerful standard: everything and everyone must be tested by the written Word, not the other way around.

Acts of Apostles : 17:11

"These were more noble... in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the Scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Even the Apostle Paul, a chosen instrument of Christ was tested by the Scriptures! If Paul was not above the Word, no church or leader is.

2 Timothy 3:16–17 (You asked not to use it, but let’s look closely)

"All Scripture is God-breathed and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work."

"Complete" and "thoroughly equipped" means nothing more is needed. If Scripture equips you for every good work, what else must be added?

This is not just "useful." It is sufficient and authoritative—because it is God-breathed (Greek: theopneustos).

2. “Which came first, the Church or the New Testament?”

Absolutely! the Church came first chronologically. No disagreement there. The Holy Spirit birthed the Church at Pentecost (Acts 2) before the New Testament was written.

But here’s the key: the Church was never given authority to create truth. It was called to preserve, proclaim, and protect it.

Paul said to the elders: "I commend you to God and to the word of His grace, which is able to build you up and give you an inheritance among those who are sanctified." (Acts 20:32)

Even after years of apostolic ministry, Paul did not commend them to the Church’s hierarchy or oral traditions but to the Word of God.

3. “Which received God's authority to preach Jesus Christ’s gospel to the world, the Church, or the Book it authored?”

Another fantastic question. The answer is: God gave His authority to the apostles and prophets, who wrote the Scriptures under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. (2 Peter 1:21)

The gospel does not come from the Church, it comes from God.

Galatians 1:11–12
"But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ."

Yes, the Church has the calling to preach, but not the authority to override, replace, or add to the Word.
The church is not the source of truth. It is the steward of truth (1 Corinthians 4:1–2).

4. THE CHURCH IS NOT ABOVE SCRIPTURE

1 Timothy 3:15 says the Church is the “pillar and ground of the truth.”
But what is that truth? Jesus tells us plainly: “Your Word is truth.” (John 17:17)

A pillar holds something up, it doesn’t create it. The Church upholds the Scriptures, not substitutes them with councils, creeds, or customs.

Jesus rebuked the Pharisees saying:

"You nullify the Word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that." Mark 7:13

Let’s not repeat their mistake.

DEAR SISTER, "THE TRUE AUTHORITY IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORD",

In the last days, deception will increase not by denying Jesus, but by distorting His gospel through tradition, extra-biblical authority, and man-made doctrines.

Paul warned: "Do not go beyond what is written." 1 Corinthians 4:6

So, to my Dear Sister,
I believe in the Church. I love the Body of Christ.
But I trust the Word of God as the final, infallible, God-breathed authority in all matters of doctrine and practice.

Let us not be divided between "Scripture or Church."
Let the Church return to Scripture as her source of truth, and let the Scriptures judge every Church teaching by the light of God’s eternal Word.

"The Bible is not just useful... it is final."
“Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall not pass away.” Matthew 24:35

Blessings to you and your family!

SabbathBlessings · Monday at 1:57 PM

Jan001 said:
Which commandments did Jesus publicly state were necessary to obey in order to inherit eternal life in his kingdom?

Jesus quoted from the Ten Commandments Mat 19:17-19 saying not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19-30 but tells us to keep and teach others to keep.

Jan001 said:
Only Israelites/Jews and converts to Judaism under the first covenant were ever commanded to keep the Sabbath.

Not so, what did God say?

Isa 56:1 Thus says the LORD: "Keep justice, and do righteousness, For My salvation is about to come, And My righteousness to be revealed.
Isa 56:2 Blessed is the man who does this, And the son of man who lays hold on it; Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath, And keeps his hand from doing any evil."
Isa 56:3 Do not let the son of the foreigner Who has joined himself to the LORD Speak, saying, "The LORD has utterly separated me from His people"; Nor let the eunuch say, "Here I am, a dry tree."
Isa 56:4 For thus says the LORD: "To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths, And choose what pleases Me, And hold fast My covenant,
Isa 56:5 Even to them I will give in My house And within My walls a place and a name Better than that of sons and daughters; I will give them an everlasting name That shall not be cut off.
Isa 56:6 "Also the sons of the foreigner Who join themselves to the LORD, to serve Him, And to love the name of the LORD, to be His servants—Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath, And holds fast My covenant—
Isa 56:7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain, And make them joyful in My house of prayer. Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices Will be accepted on My altar; For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations."

Jan001 said:
The Law of Moses: Exodus 31:13 “Say to the children of Israel, ‘You shall observe my Sabbaths, for the Sabbath is a sign between me and you for all your generations, so that you may know that I am the Lord, who makes you holy.

And the New Covenant is still written to Israel, still has God's laws, now written on a better surface, our hearts if we allow Him to Isa 8:10 and not rebel Heb 3:7-19

Heb 8:10 FOR THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS IN THEIR MIND AND WRITE THEM ON THEIR HEARTS; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

Jan001 said:
When did God stop making a distinction between the Jew and the Gentile generations? When Jesus Christ sacrificially died on the cross, he fulfilled the first covenant (Law of Moses) with the Jews (thereby ending their Sabbaths and new moon and dietary obligations), and he made his new covenant with all people, regardless of nationality. Jesus' sacrifice made the first covenant/Law of Moses Sabbath laws obsolete. Hebrews 8:13, Matthew 28:18-20, Colossians 2:13-17, Romans 10:12, Galatians 3:28

None of these verses say what your claiming. I already shown in context the annual sabbath(s) Paul was referring to in context about food, drink offerings etc that has nothing to do with the weekly Sabbath commandment You never responded to my post, just went on to another argument.

Jan001 said:
Paul had to contend with many Judaizers in his day. Judaizers insisted that Gentile converts to Christianity were obligated to become circumcised and to keep the Law of Moses with its Sabbaths, new moons, and dietary obligations. Paul declared that he wished these troublesome Judaizers would castrate themselves. Galatians 5:1-13

Can you point out one verse that says the Ten Commandments is the law of Moses? God claimed the Ten Commandments which includes the Sabbath as His, not Moses

Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments
Deu 4:13 So He (God) declared to you His (God) covenant which He (God) commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He (God) wrote them on two tablets of stone.
Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

We should stick with the Testimony of God over what man teaches.Where does Scripture tell us not to keep the Testimony of God Himself- it warns about not doing this very thing Isa 8:20

The Sabbath continued in the NC kept by Jesus Himself who is our example to follow 1 John 2:6 1 Peter 2:21-22 and the apostles Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 18:4 Acts 15:21 and His faithful disciples Luke 23:56.

Sadly most follow what man changed that God warned us would happen Dan 7:25

But God does have a remnant who is faithful Rev 12:17 Rev 14:12 I guess its a matter of which voice we hear, beleive and follow.

Jan001 said:
Jesus Christ is Lord of the Sabbath. Did he command that his followers keep the Sabbath of the Jews?

There is not one verse that says the Sabbath is the Sabbath of the Jews. Jesus claimed the Sabbath as His- My holy day.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, as it it His holy day that one He claimed as His in His own Words

Exo 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God.
Isa 58:13 "If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath, From doing your pleasure on My holy day, And call the Sabbath a delight, The holy day of the LORD honorable, And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways, Nor finding your own pleasure, Nor speaking your own words,
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath."

God spoke, no greater Authority than He. The counterfeit always comes after the original.

Jan001 said:
Mark 10:17-19 As Jesus was starting out on a journey, a man came running up to him, knelt down, and asked him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” 18 Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘Do not kill. Do not commit adultery. Do not steal. Do not bear false witness. Do not defraud. Honor your father and your mother.’”

Matthew 19:16-19 Then a man came forward and asked him, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to achieve eternal life?” 17 He said to him, “Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one who is good. But if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 He said, “Which ones?” And Jesus answered, “You shall not kill. You shall not commit adultery. You shall not steal. You shall not bear false witness. 19 Honor your father and your mother. Love your neighbor as yourself.”

So are you saying because Jesus never quoted the greatest commandment to love Him with all our heart we don't have to keep either? Or the commandment to only worship Him the very first commandment? Jesus quoted from the Ten Commandments, saying not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19 as breaking one we break them all James 2:11

Jan001 said:
Christians, regardless of nationality, worship God on Sundays, in remembrance and thanksgiving of the day of Jesus Christ's resurrection from the dead, giving all of us hope of eternal life. Jesus Christ taught themto do this before he ascended into heaven and his church has been doing this for about 2000 years so far. 2 Thessalonians 2:15

Where did Jesus ever teach to not keep the Sabbath commandment and instead remember Him on every first day in lieu of the Sabbath commandment. I do not see a quote from Jesus even though you claim He taught this, only your words.

Man-made traditions Jesus warned us about over obeying the commandment of God Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13

The seventh day is the Sabbath and it is written by the finger of God. and it is a commandment of God Sunday is nothing more than a day to do our works and labors Exo 20:9 Man tried to sanctify it over what God sanctified and blessed. Man can't sanctify, your church can't sanctify despite what they teach only God has that power.

Isa 66:17 "Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves, To go to the gardens After an idol in the midst, Eating swine's flesh and the abomination and the mouse, Shall be consumed together," says the LORD.

I prefer to have God's sanctification and only He can sanctify us and only He can sanctify a day and both are connected to the Sabbath.

Gen 2:3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
Eze 20:12 Moreover I also gave them My Sabbaths, to be a sign between them and Me, that they might know that I am the LORD who sanctifies them.

Jan001 · Monday at 4:46 PM

pastorwaris said:
Grace and peace to you as well, Dear Sister in Christ!

Thank you for your thoughtful and sincere questions. They go right to the heart of a vital issue facing the Church today: What is the final authority for faith and practice Scripture or the Church?

Let’s walk through each of your points together, like Bereans (Acts 17:11), testing everything by the Word of God with reverence and humility.

1. “Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?”
While the phrase “Scripture alone” isn’t used explicitly, neither is the word “Trinity”yet the truth of both is thoroughly biblical. The principle of Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) is taught not by a single verse, but by the total testimony of the Bible itself.

Let’s examine what the Word of God says:

Book of Psalm: 119:160

Not tradition. Not oral sayings. Your Word is truth.

Gospel of John: 17:17

When Jesus prayed for His disciples, He didn't say “The church is truth,” but “Your Word is truth.”

Book of Isaiah: 8:20

That’s a powerful standard: everything and everyone must be tested by the written Word, not the other way around.

Acts of Apostles : 17:11

Even the Apostle Paul, a chosen instrument of Christ was tested by the Scriptures! If Paul was not above the Word, no church or leader is.

2 Timothy 3:16–17 (You asked not to use it, but let’s look closely)

"Complete" and "thoroughly equipped" means nothing more is needed. If Scripture equips you for every good work, what else must be added?

This is not just "useful." It is sufficient and authoritative—because it is God-breathed (Greek: theopneustos).

2. “Which came first, the Church or the New Testament?”
Absolutely! the Church came first chronologically. No disagreement there. The Holy Spirit birthed the Church at Pentecost (Acts 2) before the New Testament was written.

But here’s the key: the Church was never given authority to create truth. It was called to preserve, proclaim, and protect it.

Even after years of apostolic ministry, Paul did not commend them to the Church’s hierarchy or oral traditions but to the Word of God.

3. “Which received God's authority to preach Jesus Christ’s gospel to the world, the Church, or the Book it authored?”

Another fantastic question. The answer is: God gave His authority to the apostles and prophets, who wrote the Scriptures under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. (2 Peter 1:21)

The gospel does not come from the Church, it comes from God.

Yes, the Church has the calling to preach, but not the authority to override, replace, or add to the Word.
The church is not the source of truth. It is the steward of truth (1 Corinthians 4:1–2).

4. THE CHURCH IS NOT ABOVE SCRIPTURE

A pillar holds something up, it doesn’t create it. The Church upholds the Scriptures, not substitutes them with councils, creeds, or customs.

Jesus rebuked the Pharisees saying:

Let’s not repeat their mistake.

DEAR SISTER, "THE TRUE AUTHORITY IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORD",

In the last days, deception will increase not by denying Jesus, but by distorting His gospel through tradition, extra-biblical authority, and man-made doctrines.

So, to my Dear Sister,
I believe in the Church. I love the Body of Christ.
But I trust the Word of God as the final, infallible, God-breathed authority in all matters of doctrine and practice.

Let us not be divided between "Scripture or Church."
Let the Church return to Scripture as her source of truth, and let the Scriptures judge every Church teaching by the light of God’s eternal Word.

"The Bible is not just useful... it is final."
“Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall not pass away.” Matthew 24:35

Blessings to you and your family!

Brother Waris,

It seems to me that it is you who are relying on your own man-made tradition of Scripture alone. It seems to me that you are making the claim that all Jesus taught is contained in the book you call the Bible. Scripture does not support your claims. It refutes them.

The Church is both the foundation and the pillar/support of the truth. We are commanded to obey both the oral and written traditions of Jesus' Church. Scripture is not the foundation and pillar of Jesus' gospel. Scripture is a useful tool that the Church uses to explain its teachings.

John 21:25
Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written.

1 Timothy 3:15
if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God’s household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.

When Scripture is interpreted correctly, it backs up the teachings of the one Church he founded upon Peter and his apostles and prophets. Matthew 16:17-19, Ephesians 2:19-21, Matthew 18:15-19

Jesus' words will never pass away. They are alive in his Church in both her written and oral traditions.

2 Thessalonians 2:15
Therefore, stand firm, brethren, and hold fast to the traditions that you have been taught, whether by word of mouth or by a letter of ours.

ARE ALL THE 10 COMMANDMENTS IN THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT?

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Regular Member

Friend

Striving to win the prize...

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians​

The Smallest Servant of God

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS: STILL HOLY, STILL JUST, STILL GOOD​

THE COMMANDMENTS THAT LOVE BUILT​

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT​

LAW AND GRACE: A HOLY BALANCE​

ACCOUNTABILITY AFTER KNOWLEDGE​

TRUTH IN LOVE​

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love, Pastor Waris,​

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."​

Well-Known Member

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS: STILL HOLY, STILL JUST, STILL GOOD​

THE COMMANDMENTS THAT LOVE BUILT​

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT​

LAW AND GRACE: A HOLY BALANCE​

ACCOUNTABILITY AFTER KNOWLEDGE​

TRUTH IN LOVE​

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,​

Pastor Waris,​

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."​

Striving to win the prize...

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT​

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,​

Pastor Waris,​

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."​

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians​

The Smallest Servant of God

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians​

THE TRUE FOUNDATION: SCRIPTURE FIRST, NOT TRADITION​

JESUS NEVER COMMANDED A CHANGE TO SUNDAY​

JUSTIN MARTYR VS. JESUS CHRIST​

​

SUNDAY WORSHIP: AN EARLY SHIFT, NOT A DIVINE DECREE​

ORAL TRADITION AND THE WRITTEN WORD​

A DANGEROUS STATEMENT​

THE POINT IS, WHO WILL YOU FOLLOW?​

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

​

Striving to win the prize...

THE POINT IS, WHO WILL YOU FOLLOW?​

Well-Known Member

Striving to win the prize...

Striving to win the prize...

Well-Known Member

The Smallest Servant of God

1. “Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?”​

Book of Psalm: 119:160​

Gospel of John: 17:17​

Book of Isaiah: 8:20​

Acts of Apostles : 17:11​

2 Timothy 3:16–17 (You asked not to use it, but let’s look closely)​

2. “Which came first, the Church or the New Testament?”​

3. “Which received God's authority to preach Jesus Christ’s gospel to the world, the Church, or the Book it authored?”​

4. THE CHURCH IS NOT ABOVE SCRIPTURE​

DEAR SISTER, "THE TRUE AUTHORITY IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORD",​

Well-Known Member

Striving to win the prize...

1. “Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?”​

Book of Psalm: 119:160​

Gospel of John: 17:17​

Book of Isaiah: 8:20​

Acts of Apostles : 17:11​

2 Timothy 3:16–17 (You asked not to use it, but let’s look closely)​

2. “Which came first, the Church or the New Testament?”​

3. “Which received God's authority to preach Jesus Christ’s gospel to the world, the Church, or the Book it authored?”​

4. THE CHURCH IS NOT ABOVE SCRIPTURE​

DEAR SISTER, "THE TRUE AUTHORITY IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORD",​

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS: STILL HOLY, STILL JUST, STILL GOOD

THE COMMANDMENTS THAT LOVE BUILT

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT

LAW AND GRACE: A HOLY BALANCE

ACCOUNTABILITY AFTER KNOWLEDGE

TRUTH IN LOVE

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,
Pastor Waris,

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS: STILL HOLY, STILL JUST, STILL GOOD

THE COMMANDMENTS THAT LOVE BUILT

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT

LAW AND GRACE: A HOLY BALANCE

ACCOUNTABILITY AFTER KNOWLEDGE

TRUTH IN LOVE

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,

Pastor Waris,

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."

A NEEDED WAKE-UP CALL: THE 4TH COMMANDMENT

Standing with you in truth, grace, and love,

Pastor Waris,

"Teaching the Word, obeying the Lord, and following the Lamb wherever He goes."

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians

Justin Martyr Explains the Sunday Worship Practices of the Early Christians

THE TRUE FOUNDATION: SCRIPTURE FIRST, NOT TRADITION

JESUS NEVER COMMANDED A CHANGE TO SUNDAY

JUSTIN MARTYR VS. JESUS CHRIST

SUNDAY WORSHIP: AN EARLY SHIFT, NOT A DIVINE DECREE

ORAL TRADITION AND THE WRITTEN WORD

A DANGEROUS STATEMENT

THE POINT IS, WHO WILL YOU FOLLOW?

THE POINT IS, WHO WILL YOU FOLLOW?

1. “Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?”

Book of Psalm: 119:160

Gospel of John: 17:17

Book of Isaiah: 8:20

Acts of Apostles : 17:11

2 Timothy 3:16–17 (You asked not to use it, but let’s look closely)

2. “Which came first, the Church or the New Testament?”

3. “Which received God's authority to preach Jesus Christ’s gospel to the world, the Church, or the Book it authored?”

4. THE CHURCH IS NOT ABOVE SCRIPTURE

DEAR SISTER, "THE TRUE AUTHORITY IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORD",

1. “Which Scripture verse claims that Scripture alone is the foundation of the truth?”

Book of Psalm: 119:160

Gospel of John: 17:17

Book of Isaiah: 8:20

Acts of Apostles : 17:11

2 Timothy 3:16–17 (You asked not to use it, but let’s look closely)

2. “Which came first, the Church or the New Testament?”

3. “Which received God's authority to preach Jesus Christ’s gospel to the world, the Church, or the Book it authored?”

4. THE CHURCH IS NOT ABOVE SCRIPTURE

DEAR SISTER, "THE TRUE AUTHORITY IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORD",