Anyone up for a chat thread?

[Naomi4Christ]

It means that the local congregation is self-governing, and not answerable to any hierarchy or denominational body in how it governs its affairs.

So they get to blackball on new members?

 

[Paidiske]

Well, they get to set the conditions for membership. Historically, they would not have accepted my daughter's baptism as valid, although in practice in more recent times they have softened on that.

 

[PloverWing]

Had a very tricky conversation today trying to navigate the reality that my daughter is a child of two churches, and right now, a communicant in one, but not the other. My husband's minister is willing to admit her but we think there will be opposition in the congregation. Sigh.

Why would she be refused communion? Is it a church that restricts communion to members of that particular denomination?

Edit: Our postings overlapped. Is it a Baptist church, then, only recognizing believer's baptism?

 

[Paidiske]

Because they practice believer's baptism, and she was baptised too young for them to see it as valid.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

Well, they get to set the conditions for membership. Historically, they would not have accepted my daughter's baptism as valid, although in practice in more recent times they have softened on that.

I thought most mainstream churches accepted a baptism in the name of the father, son and Holy Spirit as “valid” (whatever valid means)

Does this ecclesiastical community have a way of handling those who have already been baptised according to a trinitarian formula elsewhere, such as reaffirming baptismal vows? Do they baptise from scratch?

 

[Naomi4Christ]

Because they practice believer's baptism, and she was baptised too young for them to see it as valid.

Would they accept her baptism if she were confirmed?

 

[PloverWing]

In the Baptist tradition I grew up in, infant baptism is simply not recognized as a baptism. Someone who was baptized as an infant and who then wanted to join my childhood Baptist church would have to be re-baptized.

 

[Paidiske]

I thought most mainstream churches accepted a baptism in the name of the father, son and Holy Spirit as “valid” (whatever valid means)

Does this ecclesiastical community have a way of handling those who have already been baptised according to a trinitarian formula elsewhere, such as reaffirming baptismal vows? Do they baptise from scratch?

Historically, they would re-baptise those not baptised by full immersion as adults. As I said, in practice they've softened a bit in recent years, but my daughter's young enough that my husband is worried about raised eyebrows.

Would they accept her baptism if she were confirmed?

No.

 

[mama2one]

could I ask what age does your church think is ok?

my child got info from Sunday school about a class to learn about Baptism (4th and 5th graders)

 

[Paidiske]

Anglicans practice infant baptism. My daughter was five years old when we baptised her.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

Is there a significance to full immersion?

In my fellowship, we have baptistery tank.

In our confirmation services, candidates are free to dunk themselves if they have already been baptised.

Clearly, we are big fans of full immersion baptism having installed a pool.

 

[Paidiske]

Some groups only accept full immersion as a valid mode of baptism.

I like full immersion; I was baptised that way, at the beach, at the age of 22, and it was really special. And in fact we did something very close to that with my daughter, in a paddling pool (not quite full immersion but - ah - very enthusiastic affusion).

The issue here would be more her age, and that we answered for her. But as I explained to my husband's minister this morning, given her autism, she may never be able to give the kind of verbal testimony his church has traditionally required; and then what? It doesn't mean she has no faith.

 

[Naomi4Christ]

Some groups only accept full immersion as a valid mode of baptism.

I like full immersion; I was baptised that way, at the beach, at the age of 22, and it was really special. And in fact we did something very close to that with my daughter, in a paddling pool (not quite full immersion but - ah - very enthusiastic affusion).

The issue here would be more her age, and that we answered for her. But as I explained to my husband's minister this morning, given her autism, she may never be able to give the kind of verbal testimony his church has traditionally required; and then what? It doesn't mean she has no faith.

That is an interesting point about learning difficulties.

Jesus asked for all the children to come to him unhindered. This means that some are not going to make a believers’ baptism.

This notion has, at this moment, affirmed to me that believing parents can make promises on behalf of their children.

 

[gordonhooker]

In the Baptist tradition I grew up in, infant baptism is simply not recognized as a baptism. Someone who was baptized as an infant and who then wanted to join my childhood Baptist church would have to be re-baptized.

That is what happened with me as well - when I knocked around a group of people who were Baptists I was told the same thing, my infant Baptism and later Confirmation was not good enough.

 

[gordonhooker]

That is an interesting point about learning difficulties.

Jesus asked for all the children to come to him unhindered. This means that some are not going to make a believers’ baptism.

This notion has, at this moment, affirmed to me that believing parents can make promises on behalf of their children.

There were Reformation groups which were referred to as Anabaptists that believed infant baptism was not the right thing to do. The Quakers, Baptists and Mennonites are just few that required adult full immersion Baptism. I am like you I believe we can make those promises for our children as well and then let them Confirm it later in life.

 

[Shane R]

I went up to one of our missions in the deanery. This one just formed this year. The priest and I were ordained to the diaconate on the same day. His work is starting to take off. I'm moving next month so my parish needs to become accustomed to a new way and his folk have never had the experience of a service with multiple clergy (other than an episcopal visit, which is atypical) so I went up to serve with him today.

The stole I'm wearing has an interesting story. There are a number of things in the diocese that are passed along. If you look closely you can sort of make out that its got lines of black writing running down the front of it. The text is the names and dates of diaconal service of each successive holder. It is used as a sort of 'honor graduate' award to each successive class of transitional deacons to wear between the time they are accepted for priesthood and the actual date of ordination. It has been held by the Archbishop and the Archdeacon in times past and the previous holder was the Fr. I served with today. I'll only have worn it for about two months before it will be time to pass it on again.

 

[Arcangl86]

So my diocese had a new bishop ordained yesterday, and looking at pictures it was so cool. But I remember looking at it and was "Who is the random bishop in blue?" Turns out it was Barbara Harris. She can wear whatever she wants.

 

[Paidiske]

So this is just too delicious not to share. A retired priest belonging to the next parish over died recently.

The death notices in the paper run thus :

"H..., R... S.... Faithful priest in the Church of God and beloved member of xxx parish. Requiescat in Pace."

(Normal enough).

"H..., R... S..... Lovingly tolerated grandfather of Patrick, Laura and Neil. Singer of inappropriate songs and wearer of college blazers 70 years after graduating. Your wisdom and advice will always be remembered (if not always followed) for many years to come."

Then the following day...

"H..., R... S.... Dad, your grandchildren's notice yesterday omitted to mention that the blazer they referenced came from Clare College, Cambridge. So why wouldn't you choose to swan around in it for 70 years after graduating? But despite being educated at Melbourne Grammar, Melbourne University (as a resident of Trinity College), and Cambridge University, and despite being a proud member of the Huguenot Society (by the way, your connection to that French Protestant ancestor, who fled to London in the 17th century, was somewhat tenuous), you were a Labor voter. And when on election day in 1949 your father offered a lift to the polling booth to those of his children old enough to vote - provided they voted Liberal - you chose to walk. Several miles, in fact, to cast the first of your many votes for the Labor Party. We know that where you are now, 'there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain...' but we are free to infer that political discussions are not ruled out.

Farewell, your daughter, Rosalind Clare."

Seriously, who argues with family members in the death notices??

 

[Shane R]

These were taken by the organist. I'm sure the official pics will be out later today.

I was a royal mess. I was late getting to the chapel because my older daughter decided to challenge me at every step this morning. I forgot my chalice and paten but one of the other priests had one in his car that he lent me for the service.

Also memorable: a lady passed out on her way down from the rail after receiving communion. She was as prone as the three of us ordinands! I was distributing the hosts at the time. I used to be a Navy medic so I was going to go down and check her out. I finished the group that was at the rail and took the paten back to the altar. She came to and was helped back to a pew by several folks. One of the other priests grabbed me and told me to continue the distribution so I retrieved the paten and soldiered on.

 

[gordonhooker]

Congratulations Shane a memorable service an ordination